TDEE + interesting questions

**tobias7912** · 09-14-2009, 05:40 PM

I have calculated my TDEE many times through different methods.
I usually get about the same value

My TDEE is 3746cals / day.

How low do I need to go for weight loss?

I need to create a deficit, correct?

I just need to clear this up Ive been away for a while

And another question more of a theory
Is it possible to lose weight AND gain mass since the fat you burn is energy and could be created into energy that fuels muscle growth?

Just wondering

**jamyjamjr** · 09-14-2009, 07:17 PM

there are two ways to lose weight imo...

one, drop your daily intake 500 calories under your tdee...

two, keep yourself at your tdee and do a bunch of cardio (this is the better one imo, but that's also predicated on your stats and goals)

losing weight and gaining muscle is harder then just losing weight or just gaining muscle..

i believe it's based upon your genetics.. because i have gained lean body mass at maint level...

but remember, a thing that works for one may not work for the other...

i hope this helps..

**tobias7912** · 09-14-2009, 09:00 PM

Thanks
any1 else?

**tobias7912** · 09-15-2009, 07:13 AM

bump

**Klimax** · 09-15-2009, 08:36 AM

I think that beginners in lifting and/or healthy diet could at first gaining muscles while loosing fat, if they have an high bg (>20%). And of course age and genetics are crucial factors.

**jadsgame** · 09-15-2009, 12:05 PM

post a pic or two bro, that would help us give you a more precise suggestion. of course you can build muscle and loose fat at the same time.

Simple rules that WILL help,

1) Restrict fast digesting carbs to just two times a day, as soon as you get up in the morning and after your workouts. apart from that its just going to slow digestion carbs ( complex carbs)

2)increase your protein intake,and your diet for example 1.5 grams of protein/ pound of body weight, 2 grams of carbs ( mostly complex) and 0.5 grams of fat ( healthy fat) so with that say if you are 200 pounder, that is 300 grms of protein 400 grams of carbs and 100 grms of fat per day

The calorie count will be

300 x 4 = 1200
400 x 4 = 1600
100 x 9 = 900
------------
3300

so this would be your daily caloric intake, so you are approximately having a deficite of around 400 calories, even though this is not a lot, since your caloric intake has come from protein , mostly complex carbs and good fat, it will make a lot of difference.

Along with a good training routine, you will for sure drop body fat and build muscle at the same time.

one more thing, your metabolism gets used to this diet, so what you can do is, in a week for a day or two you can drop you carb to 1 gram/ pound of body this will confuse you metabolism and will help you burn more fat.

when it comes to cardio, the best time is after weight training, thats because ,after weight training the glycogen stores in the muscle are depleted, so cardio done now will dig deep into the fat stores for energy...

hope this helps, all the best...

jads

**MaGiCJNG** · 09-15-2009, 12:41 PM

If this is the case, when would you drink your PWO shake? Right after weight lifting or after cardio?

**jadsgame** · 09-15-2009, 01:27 PM

after cardio... since the goal here is primarilly fat loss... ( even though he wants to build muscle simultaneously)

after your weight training you quickly do your cardio, i would suggest 20-30 mins moderate to high intensity... upon finishing you can down your protein shake along with 20-40 grams of fast digesting carbs...

**jamyjamjr** · 09-15-2009, 04:37 PM

Originally Posted by jadsgame

post a pic or two bro, that would help us give you a more precise suggestion. of course you can build muscle and loose fat at the same time.

Simple rules that WILL help,

1) Restrict fast digesting carbs to just two times a day, as soon as you get up in the morning and after your workouts. apart from that its just going to slow digestion carbs ( complex carbs)

2)increase your protein intake,and your diet for example 1.5 grams of protein/ pound of body weight, 2 grams of carbs ( mostly complex) and 0.5 grams of fat ( healthy fat) so with that say if you are 200 pounder, that is 300 grms of protein 400 grams of carbs and 100 grms of fat per day

The calorie count will be

300 x 4 = 1200
400 x 4 = 1600
100 x 9 = 900
------------
3300

so this would be your daily caloric intake, so you are approximately having a deficite of around 400 calories, even though this is not a lot, since your caloric intake has come from protein , mostly complex carbs and good fat, it will make a lot of difference.

Along with a good training routine, you will for sure drop body fat and build muscle at the same time.

one more thing, your metabolism gets used to this diet, so what you can do is, in a week for a day or two you can drop you carb to 1 gram/ pound of body this will confuse you metabolism and will help you burn more fat.

when it comes to cardio, the best time is after weight training, thats because ,after weight training the glycogen stores in the muscle are depleted, so cardio done now will dig deep into the fat stores for energy...

hope this helps, all the best...

jads

i disagree completely

**tobias7912** · 09-15-2009, 05:10 PM

Books can be written on this stuff, as you can tell from all the different opinions.
You'll just have to try to see what works.

Jamyjamjr, why would you disagree with that, I"m curious.
If asked the question as to why, I would say to give energy upon waking. But only if after cardio.

Am I correct

?

**jamyjamjr** · 09-15-2009, 05:53 PM

simple sugars before your workout leaves you starving for energy within your workout due to the fast digestion..

a complex carb before workout is more benefitical... something starchy... sweet potato

**jadsgame** · 09-15-2009, 09:39 PM

Originally Posted by jamyjamjr

simple sugars before your workout leaves you starving for energy within your workout due to the fast digestion..

a complex carb before workout is more benefitical... something starchy... sweet potato

when did i ever say to consume simple carbs before workout??? i said as soon as you as you wake up in the morning and after workouts... thats all for simple sugars...

any other disagreement mate?

**jamyjamjr** · 09-16-2009, 12:05 AM

Originally Posted by jadsgame

when did i ever say to consume simple carbs before workout??? i said as soon as you as you wake up in the morning and after workouts... thats all for simple sugars...

any other disagreement mate?

haha, i see i mixed it up...

i ment a simple carb in the morning makes no sense to me... why would u want to cause an insulin spike in the morning like that?? complex carbs are the way to go unless it's pwo imo...

**jamyjamjr** · 09-16-2009, 12:07 AM

also i dont like the idea of giving someone a standardized diet without finding a bmr/tdee

everyone has their own customizable needs...

**jadsgame** · 09-16-2009, 05:04 AM

Originally Posted by jamyjamjr

haha, i see i mixed it up...

i ment a simple carb in the morning makes no sense to me... why would u want to cause an insulin spike in the morning like that?? complex carbs are the way to go unless it's pwo imo...

Simple sugars in the morning ( not for breakfast ) makes no sense to you???? why??? and whats wrong with the insulin spike in the morning???
Only in order to spike the insulin, you are asked to take simple sugar as soon as you wake up along with you protein shake . thats one of the golden rules in bodybuilding when it comes to muscle building.

the reason,

your body is on a 8 hour fast due to the overnight sleep, because of that the muscle glycogen store are going to be so depleted, fast digesting protein (whey) along with fast digesting carbs are the way to go, as this would stop the catabolic mode that your body is in and would replenish glycogen and the amino acid pool.

so thats that for the insulin spike. if you are still not convinced i can send you various links that supports my argument.

cheers
jads

and also, a standard diet was just a guideline, a high protein n quality carb and low fat diet works just for anyone especially if they are getting started. its like sayin to someone to go to the gym to reduce body fat and build up muscle, thats acceptable rite? and also i asked him to send a few pics of his if he could at the the begining of my post, so that we could assess his body type (whether an ecto, meso or endomorph) n help him out more precisely....

yeah so thats all...

**Klimax** · 09-16-2009, 09:13 AM

Complex carbs in the morning will refuel your glycogen too, but without the risk to feed your adypocities.
You may add few sugars (milk or a fruit), but most of the carbs should be slow.

**jamyjamjr** · 09-16-2009, 10:29 AM

Originally Posted by jadsgame

Simple sugars in the morning ( not for breakfast ) makes no sense to you???? why??? and whats wrong with the insulin spike in the morning???
Only in order to spike the insulin, you are asked to take simple sugar as soon as you wake up along with you protein shake . thats one of the golden rules in bodybuilding when it comes to muscle building.

the reason,

your body is on a 8 hour fast due to the overnight sleep, because of that the muscle glycogen store are going to be so depleted, fast digesting protein (whey) along with fast digesting carbs are the way to go, as this would stop the catabolic mode that your body is in and would replenish glycogen and the amino acid pool.

so thats that for the insulin spike. if you are still not convinced i can send you various links that supports my argument.

cheers
jads

and also, a standard diet was just a guideline, a high protein n quality carb and low fat diet works just for anyone especially if they are getting started. its like sayin to someone to go to the gym to reduce body fat and build up muscle, thats acceptable rite? and also i asked him to send a few pics of his if he could at the the begining of my post, so that we could assess his body type (whether an ecto, meso or endomorph) n help him out more precisely....

yeah so thats all...

the standard philosophy we follow her is to do complex in the morning.. i know what your saying about glycogen stores and volumization, but i believe it should be saved for pwo...