Keto question

**alluprbdy** · 09-26-2010, 02:54 PM

I'm starting Keto tommorow never been on one before. I workout at 5:30am, now my question is, is it essential to the diet to eat before I workout? Or can I go on an empty stomach?

***D7M*** · 09-26-2010, 02:57 PM

If by "work out" you mean train (weights), I would eat first.

That's not just for a keto diet, though.

I wouldn't want to train empty stomach ever.

**alluprbdy** · 09-26-2010, 03:03 PM

okay ya usually when I cut I dont eat before I hit the gym, howeer I guess I'll start doin that

**alluprbdy** · 09-26-2010, 04:07 PM

Got another keto question, I'm going for a CKD keto, and with doint the math I need roughly 2080 cals, ab 140g pro, ab 170 fat, 0 carb in a perfect world. My diet plan written out is 2098 cals (im okay with that close enough), 177 pro (should I decrease?), 138 fat (up this?), 21 carbs. Do I need to up the fat count to get the results? Its hard adding fat without adding protien.

**oker** · 09-27-2010, 07:27 AM

Originally Posted by D7M

If by "work out" you mean train (weights), I would eat first.

That's not just for a keto diet, though.

I wouldn't want to train empty stomach ever.

Agreed re weight training, but if you're talking about cardio and cutting (and your objective is losing BF%) then empty stomach in the AM.

**oker** · 09-27-2010, 07:30 AM

Originally Posted by alluprbdy

Got another keto question, I'm going for a CKD keto, and with doint the math I need roughly 2080 cals, ab 140g pro, ab 170 fat, 0 carb in a perfect world. My diet plan written out is 2098 cals (im okay with that close enough), 177 pro (should I decrease?), 138 fat (up this?), 21 carbs. Do I need to up the fat count to get the results? Its hard adding fat without adding protien.

You'll need to post your diet with macro's in order to get an answer to this question

**alluprbdy** · 09-27-2010, 10:53 AM

k well I'll have to try an post it tonite, however in the meantime if someone could answer it I'd apprectiate it. Pretty simple question do I need to up my fat and dec protien? As I said above the ideal situation would b 170f 140p the fact that its off a little will that keep me from ketosis? Don't see why I need to list a diet for that.

**Failure** · 09-27-2010, 04:17 PM

It depends on what percents you are going for. There are different variations of Keto diets that work differently for different people. I am on 33/64/3. Your 'perfect world' percents are 27/73/0. It depeds on what you want to be on and what works best for you. It is the amount of carbs that puts you into/out of Ketosis.

**gbrice75** · 09-28-2010, 06:17 PM

Originally Posted by D7M

If by "work out" you mean train (weights), I would eat first.

That's not just for a keto diet, though.

I wouldn't want to train empty stomach ever.

Agreed.

Originally Posted by alluprbdy

Got another keto question, I'm going for a CKD keto, and with doint the math I need roughly 2080 cals, ab 140g pro, ab 170 fat, 0 carb in a perfect world. My diet plan written out is 2098 cals (im okay with that close enough), 177 pro (should I decrease?), 138 fat (up this?), 21 carbs. Do I need to up the fat count to get the results? Its hard adding fat without adding protien.

For some basic ratios, look at this: A CKD (cyclic ketogenic diet) is typically 35/65 protein/fat. Dave Palumbo's keto diet is the exact opposite at 65/35 protein/fat. I wouldn't even factor in carbs as a percentage. Carbs should generally be kept below 20g, so they're not even worth factoring in IMO.

**oker** · 09-29-2010, 05:37 AM

Originally Posted by gbrice75

Agreed.

For some basic ratios, look at this: A CKD (cyclic ketogenic diet) is typically 35/65 protein/fat. Dave Palumbo's keto diet is the exact opposite at 65/35 protein/fat. I wouldn't even factor in carbs as a percentage. Carbs should generally be kept below 20g, so they're not even worth factoring in IMO.

I think I pretty much said this in another post, more or less. The point is that DP's diet theory is based on a lean bulk, not a keto IMO.

**musclestack** · 09-29-2010, 05:46 AM

Oker-How can this be based on a lean BULK if you are still in a calorie deficit? And if the only thing that constitutes being in ketosis is the lack of carbs, then would this not fit the bill of a ketogenic diet?

**oker** · 09-29-2010, 06:23 AM

Originally Posted by musclestack

Oker-How can this be based on a lean BULK if you are still in a calorie deficit? And if the only thing that constitutes being in ketosis is the lack of carbs, then would this not fit the bill of a ketogenic diet?

You're right bro in essence, DP is suggesting dropping carbs in order to reach ketosis… agreed. The cal deficit is beside the point because ultimately DP’s diet is still a lean bulk and furthermore it advocates building muscle while on that diet, hence the word “bulk”. ckd does not advocate the same thing but suggests maintaining LBM - I think it’s quite clear. It's not the same diet as it achieves something entirely different in terms of your objectives as a BB. Do some research on both diets and then come back and tell me if they're the same.

**gbrice75** · 09-29-2010, 07:33 AM

I don't think anybody's saying they're the same. Ultimately they're both keto diets, with the ultimate goal of acheiving lower bodyfat. However, Oker is correct in that the best you can hope for with CKD is maintaining LBM (which I failed to do), whereas with Palumbo's diet there is more opportunity to actually build muscle while still running a keto type diet.

**alluprbdy** · 09-29-2010, 01:56 PM

Originally Posted by gbrice75

Agreed.

For some basic ratios, look at this: A CKD (cyclic ketogenic diet) is typically 35/65 protein/fat. Dave Palumbo's keto diet is the exact opposite at 65/35 protein/fat. I wouldn't even factor in carbs as a percentage. Carbs should generally be kept below 20g, so they're not even worth factoring in IMO.

Thanks guess I was pretty close to a polumbo keto than ckd keto, now I was able to add fat but now I'm not close to either version I'm ab 152f, 150p, 16c. More or less a 50/50. Think I should go back to how I started which was ab 55/45 more p than fat. Just nervous I'm not gonna get the results I want bc I did it wrong.

**oker** · 09-29-2010, 07:55 PM

Originally Posted by gbrice75

I don't think anybody's saying they're the same. Ultimately they're both keto diets, with the ultimate goal of acheiving lower bodyfat. However, Oker is correct in that the best you can hope for with CKD is maintaining LBM (which I failed to do), whereas with Palumbo's diet there is more opportunity to actually build muscle while still running a keto type diet.

MS asked "how this can be based on a lean bulk", so I wanted to clarify the difference between the lean bulk and the ckd. Not to disagree with you GB, but I think it's important to define the difference for those that are new to the board or new to dieting in general so there’s no confusion - hope your cutting progress is going well bro.