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  1. #1
    jl39's Avatar
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    bulker

    5'11 185lb, extreme hardgainer
    6:00am
    1 1/2 scoops whey, 12 oz milk and 1 1/2 cups of oats blended together
    (calories,carbs,protein,fat) (825,81,36,24)
    8:00 am
    5 whole eggs, 4 strips bacon, slice wheat toast with tbsp jelly, 1/4 cup cheese for eggs (585,30,42,45)
    11:00am pre workout meal
    6oz chicken breast, 1 cup brown rice (450,68,40,0)
    12:30 pre snack
    scoop whey, banana (200,25,24,0)
    1:00-2:15 workout
    2:30 post 2 scoops whey, perfect storm post workout creatine mix with gatorade for extra carbs (500,35,48,0)
    4:00pm 8oz hamburger, slice cheese, baked chips , buns
    700,46,40,42)
    6:30pm scoop casien 8 oz milk cant eat at work so this is my best option (230,7,24,8)
    8:00pm 6 oz chicken breast, sauteed mixed veggies, baked potato with butter 2 rolls (400,55,40,20)
    10:30 scoop casien ,8oz milk, pack of oats (380,25,24,8)

    ANY ADVICE WOULD BE MUCH APPRECHIATED

  2. #2
    jl39's Avatar
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    sorry guys forgot to give u totals the total calories, carbs, protein , fat are ( 4270, 372,318,147,)
    thought about changing the 4:00 meal to 6oz tuna 2 slices wheat bread and an apple this would bring the fat down to about 105grams and calories down to about 3800 how does that sound?

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    I don't like the milk, its too much sugar and lactose. but the rest looks good. Please tell us your age and bf%.

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    bout to turn 21 and bout 10 percent

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    and i know it is alot of milk but i hate the taste of it without i dont mix with milk around workout times is the milk really that bad since im not really worried about anything

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    try lactose free at least.

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    A lot of empty calories and saturated fat in that diet. You'd be less of an "extreme hardgainer" if you replaced the empty calories with good complex carbs and more lean meat/fish. Less whole eggs, more egg whites. Less cheese and bacon, more lean meat. Less buns, chips, bullshit and more oats, brown rice, sweet potatoes. Less whole milk, more 1% or skim. You're getting no quality mono/polyunsatured fats and all the wrong stuff. No EFAs.

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    thanks damian what would u do to change my diet ? iv been told i need alot of fat and stuff to bulk and i cant get any fat from all lean foods....maybe iv been led the wrong way.....what would u change?

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    http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...ead&highlight=

    READ!!

    Once you have: calories 500 above TDEE. 100% of total calories broken down by 35/55/15 pro/carb/fat. Fats would be least important. Protein is key but once you've achieved 1.7-2.0g per lb. of LBM, it's carbs that will allow said protein intake to work magic. Follow my guidelines and acceptable foods.

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    ok so lets figure something out here damian.....my tdee is 3380 calories approx (1961 Bmr x 1.725 ) so i shoot for 500 above that correct? what are the best times to have these foods i want to workout at 12:00 or 12:30 and ill add tuna chicken maybe some tilapia and salmon into my diet and bake some sweet potatoes and ill repost a new diet im not real sure about how many carbs and protein and fat i should shoot for

  11. #11
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    never mind didnt fully read it ill post a new diet tomorrow and see what u think about it

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    ok damian so i dont have any macros yet but i was thinking about going with one or two eggs and 5 or 6 egg whites and 50g oats at 6am then scoop whey and apple or banana at 730workout from 8 to 930 50g whey at 930 with my post workout creatine carb mix and maybe a small bagel with jelly....11am 40-50g lean protien 60g sweet potato and salad with evoo....130pm maybe 40-50g salmon or fish with 60g brown rice ? for fat need help.....4:00 40-50g lean protein whats a good soure here to change it up 50g complex carb and fat need help wit these?
    600casein cause at work all i can have maybe blend some oats in with it
    800 50g protein 30g carb some fat not sure what kind thou
    1030 casein shake please help with the not sure about items thanks damian

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by jl39 View Post
    ok damian so i dont have any macros yet but i was thinking about going with
    Meal 1: one or two eggs and 5 or 6 egg whites and 50g oats at 6am OK, this is fine. Just 1 whole egg and 6-8 whites is perfect usually for a standard ~40g complete protein. 1 dry measured cup of oats is 58g carbs, go with that.

    Meal 2: then scoop whey and apple or banana at 730 Fruit won't do anything for sustained energy pre-workout as compared to more oats or another complex carb. I also don't like a shake pre-workout because it's too fast. Replace the fruit with 1/2 cup of oats and swap this with "meal 1" - Have a scoop of whey and the reduced portion of oats as a pre-breakfast as soon as you get out of bed and then do your eggs/oats as a real pre-workout meal.

    PWO: workout from 8 to 930 50g whey at 930 with my post workout creatine carb mix and maybe a small bagel with jelly.... Whey, 5g creatine monohydrate, and a bagel is fine. No jelly. For those who like simple carbs PWO - a bagel is one of the best choices in terms of a "fast carb" - avoid gatorades, jelly, and sugary creatine blends, stick to glucose/whey.

    Meal 3: 11am 40-50g lean protien 60g sweet potato and salad with evoo....\ Good meal but no need for the EVOO - you already have plenty of complex carbs via the sweet potato (1 cup mashed is gonna be about 55g carbs similar to 1.5 medium sized potatoes. Remember, fats and carbs are both energy but carbs are your body's go-to fuel and taking in both macronutrients in one meal is usually remiss.

    Meal 4: 130pm maybe 40-50g salmon or fish with 60g brown rice ? for fat need help..... Good meal. 1 cup cooked brown rice is about 50g carbs just to clarify. Add some green veggies.

    Meal 5: 4:00 40-50g lean protein whats a good soure here to change it up 50g complex carb and fat need help wit these? Again, I'd not bother with fats, you'll get plenty in your last two meals which I'd prefer be pro/fat only, plus what's in your fish/meat, plus supplementing with Omega-3 caps from fish oil/flax. For now, let's focus on lean meat and unprocessed carbs. Example: 6 oz. tilapia (same macros as chciken breast basically) and 1 cup brown rice (or quinoa, or oats, or 1.5 medium sweet potatoes, or 1.5 cups french lentils). Veggies.

    Meal 6: 600casein cause at work all i can have maybe blend some oats in with it Mix 1/2 whey, 1/2 casein for such meal replacement shakes. 1/2 cup oats blended in sounds good to me.

    Meal 7: 800 50g protein 30g carb some fat not sure what kind thou pro/fat now - Maybe a red meat meal - either 6 oz. flank steak or 93/7 lean ground with 1 tbs EVOO and veggies. Other options are 1 oz. of nuts, or any of the oils I've mentioned in the info.

    Meal 8:1030 casein shake please help with the not sure about items thanks damian Add 15-20g healthy fat for energy source to spare the protein and further slow digestion as this is the last meal before a long fast - no more protein for many hours. 2 tbs of natural PB is delicious but any fat source is good. Supplement with 12g omega 3 fish oil or 3/6/9 pills throughout the day,
    Critiques in BOLD but need macros. For example, you could eat all the right foods but if the macros don't meet your needs, you could still fail at the intended goal.

    On second thought, have a shake with a banana and/or apple as meal 1 and then the oats/eggs pre-workout. I like to see at least some natural, low GI sugars in a bulking diet.
    Last edited by Damienm05; 03-12-2011 at 05:08 PM.

  14. #14
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    Thanks man big help ill try to get to the grocery store and get and better laid out plan for u with some macros and if it's not what I need to hit we'll go from there thanks alot

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    NP dude - good to see you're dedicated to doing it right.

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    ok last question before i post up a new diet.....which meals or how often should i supplement these omega 3/6/9 and flax caps... can u give me a brief breakdown on what you're talking about not very educated on these what should i buy and when should i use them

  17. #17
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    Go for Udo's 3/6/9 blend or cod liver oil ideally - just flax is inferior despite being a cheaper source of Omega-3. Anyway, these are your essential fatty acids, not to be confused with just regular old "healthy" fats found in extra virgin oils and nuts. It's important that you get enough for joint, heart, CNS, hormone, and muscle support but they're not needed as a main energy source. With that said, I don't supplement with them as energy in big quantities like I would say a serving of peanut butter in a shake but rather split up 15-20 pills over the course of the day. For your macros, 2g with each meal is fine but I suppose if you just wanted to do them as your final fat source in your PM/before-bed meal, that's fine too.

  18. #18
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    what would be a good replacement for jelly or anything on a bagel? like cream cheese? lox spread?

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    Cream cheese: pure saturated fat.

    Lox spread: cream cheese with salmon pureed in, basically the same macros with more sodium.

    My recommendation: some dijon mustard, black pepper, a few slices of smoked salmon, capers, tomatoes, sliced red onions. Delicious. I'm originally from Montreal; I know bagels.

  20. #20
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    alright damian im working on setting this up
    for meal one 6:00am i got scoop whey, 5g creatine, 1/2 cup oats banana and 8oz skim milk
    7:00am i got one whole egg 6 egg whites cup oats
    8:30-9:30 workout
    9:45 50g whey 5g creatine and a bagel
    11:00 6oz tilapia cup brown rice
    1:30 6oz salmon cup brown rice, cup brocoli
    ok so heres the question...im done with all my pro/carb meals and im only around 250 carbs i thought i needed much more than this i feel really uneducated setting up this diet lol im sorry i keep asking shit i wish i could just get it done.....and im def not seeing how im gonna get close to 3800cals outta this

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    4:006oz chicken breast,sweet potato fries in recipe section, cup brocoli
    6:30 1/2scoop whey 1/2 scoop casein 8 oz skim milk 1/2cup oats 2tbsp almondbutter
    800 8oz chicken vegetable medley cup brocoli, almonds
    10:30 scoop casein , 2 tbsps almond butter, some more almonds

    hows this look for a good rough draft....also could i throw maybe 1tbsp almond butter in my first shake of the day for some extra fat and how does the rest look thanks

  22. #22
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    one more thing i forgot to add my 4:00 and 6:00 meals in the carb count sittin around 330 it looks like............... if im going for a 30/55/15 split i would need more carbs than that right? cause im gonna be at 300g protein.... im lost who knew a healthy diet could be such a pain in the ass lol

  23. #23
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    I didn't go through all the replies, but you're in good hands with Damien. Not sure about your last few questions. You should post your current/revised diet for the full day and we can help you refine it even more if need be.

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    I think your carbs are actually higher than that considering there are carbs in nuts and quite a bit in milk. I really need you to lay the diet out better with full macros from Fitday.com or another similar site if you want to take this further. The layout is nice and the food choices are good but I need to see the numbers for your stats and those of the diet to tweak things beyond where we've already gotten and say things like, "yes, raise carbs by 20 in X meal."

    Also, don't say you're lost, you're doing well.

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    alright dam, here we go
    6:00am scoop whey 1/2cup oats 8oz skim 5g creatine
    (cal,carb,pro,fat) (415,59,24,3)
    7:00am 1 whole eg 7 whites cup oats (44,54,40,12)
    9:45 whey and bagel, 5g creatine (450,55,50,0)
    11:00am 6oz tilapia cup brown rice 430,50,40,4)
    1:30pm 6oz salmon (490,55,40,6)
    4:00pm 6oz chicken breast sweet potato fries from the recipe section, cup of broccoli (480,55,452)
    6:30 1/2 scoop whey, 1/2 sccop casein, 8 oz skim milk, 1tbsp almond butter, 1/2 cup oats (440,37,24,12)
    8:00 6 oz chicken or flank steak sauteed vegies ,cup brocoli, 1oz almonds
    (530,10,45,27)
    10:30pm scoop casein, 2tbsp almond butter, 1/2 oz almonds (405,5,24,22)

    DAILY TOTAL4080cal, 368 carbs, 332gprotein, 98g fat does this look right?

  26. #26
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    cal count on meal 2 is 440 not 44 lol

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    gbrice thanks for your advice as well u and damien and fireguy have helped me alot on this website, feel free to blast away as well i want to get it perfect

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    just went and bought some stuff gonna change the salmon to tilapia 2 a day salmon is to expensive...and changing the skim milk to almond milk

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by jl39 View Post
    alright dam, here we go

    6:00am scoop whey 1/2cup oats 8oz skim 5g creatine Good.
    (cal,carb,pro,fat) (415,59,24,3)

    7:00am 1 whole eg 7 whites cup oats (44,54,40,12) Good

    9:45 whey and bagel, 5g creatine (450,55,50,0) Good. Add an apple or banana.

    11:00am 6oz tilapia cup brown rice 430,50,40,4) Good.

    1:30pm 6oz salmon (490,55,40,6) I'm guessing you left out some carb source in your write-up here? Just let me know what that is, macros look good.

    4:00pm 6oz chicken breast sweet potato fries from the recipe section, cup of broccoli (480,55,452) Good.

    6:30 1/2 scoop whey, 1/2 sccop casein, 8 oz skim milk, 1tbsp almond butter, 1/2 cup oats (440,37,24,12) No need for the almond butter here, especially since you're having another meal in 90 minutes - slowing digestion isn't a concern.

    8:00 6 oz chicken or flank steak sauteed vegies ,cup brocoli, 1oz almonds Which is it? Chicken or Flank? One has 60 calories from fat per 4 oz. (steak) and the other has 10 (chicken breast). The steak would be better but yeah, gotta be really precise in order to gain muscle without adding body fat. Good meal though, good meal.
    (530,10,45,27)

    10:30pm scoop casein, 2tbsp almond butter, 1/2 oz almonds (405,5,24,22) Too much fat imo, just the almond butter should be about 17g and that's fine.

    DAILY TOTAL4080cal, 368 carbs, 332gprotein, 98g fat does this look right?
    It's good. Carbs to 375, fats to 75 with changes. Calories seem way high for your stats even after lowering fat a bit. Contrary to popular belief , we're gonna change that by reducing protein - it's excessive for someone of your current size. Let's take protein to 250 by simply reducing meat/fish protein portions in every meal to 4 oz. That will give us ~ 3200. Run it and see how you're responding after 2 weeks. I'd do cardio to ensure you're not gaining body fat and help keep that water weight off - after 2 weeks, based on results, we can add some more fruit and another bagel PWO if you need to step up the calories. If they need to be lowered, we'll reduce carbs.

  30. #30
    Damienm05's Avatar
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    I know you wanna really pound the calories and gain big right away but it's not worth getting fat. Like I said, if we have to go back to 4000 calories, we will but I'm pretty sure you're gonna be happy with what happens.

  31. #31
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    ya meal at 11:00am i left out a cup of brown rice....i did the macros at 8:00 pm with an 8oz chicken brest ill take out the almond butter from the shake and the almonds from the last meal after doing all that and replacing the skim with almond milk adding the banana post workout the totals are 3825cal, 332g protein, 400g carbs, 80g fat hows that look?

  32. #32
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    Bring protein down still to 250. Trust me. If we wanna go up in a couple weeks we can but I eat 3800 cals to grow on cycle and my LBM is close to 200

  33. #33
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    how old are u damien ?

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    I'm 25

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    Quote Originally Posted by Damienm05 View Post
    Cream cheese: pure saturated fat.

    Lox spread: cream cheese with salmon pureed in, basically the same macros with more sodium.

    My recommendation: some dijon mustard, black pepper, a few slices of smoked salmon, capers, tomatoes, sliced red onions. Delicious. I'm originally from Montreal; I know bagels.
    wait all of that on there? or those are examples

  36. #36
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    damian, i got a couple bottles of test prop and bout 125 10 mg dbols idk if im gonna use it yet but the price was too good to pass up compared to other people iv been around what would be a good cycle?

  37. #37
    Damienm05's Avatar
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    Take that to the AAS section bud, I'm a pretty novice/casual steroid user and don't plan on running another cycle for years.

    My only advice now is, hang on to that gear for a while. Stick to a diet like we've got planned out for at least a year - I have no doubt at your age and stats you can add 30 quality pounds in no time. Once you've done that, you'll be putting your gear to better use and have the diet knowledge needed to run a perfect cycle.

  38. #38
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    And is that Sylvester Stallone in your AVI? God damn, if it is.

  39. #39
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    no dude thats frank zane come on man!!!

  40. #40
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    its either him or justin bieber i cant remember which one i decided

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