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12-04-2011, 12:52 AM #201
You guys go ahead, this is all a learning thread and everyone has their opinion regarding the same issues whether is cardio, diet, suplements, etc i respect them all equally, i just go with i believe is the best for me or whatever has or i think will work for me. So no offense taken. Both of you have been supportive, have great advices and opinions, they are certainly appreciated here
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12-04-2011, 07:14 AM #202
this is pretty good here pap i tell u what im wondering (and let me say theres no way in hell id even consider not doing cardio) but according to my elliptical machine i burn approx 16 cals/minute for 45 mins = 720cals burned.. i do this 5-6 days/week which equals 3600-4320 cals/week roughly.. what im wondering is how many lbs of lbm i would have to increase from where im at to duplicate these 3500-4000cals and would i be able to continually increase that amt of lbm at a pace that would rival the xtra 3600-4320cals/week im burning due to my cardio? i wouldnt think so and even if i could if i continued to do the cardio it would just be more cals burned per week on top of that burned by accumulation of lbm...
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12-04-2011, 08:21 AM #203
I believe that is way over-simplification. Obviously we all wish we could just add lean body-mass to burn more calories and keep our bodyfat low. Muscle has a metabolic rate of approx. 15 cals per day at rest, but obviously if you are active you would burn even more. I have read anywhere from 6 - 37 cals mentioned in recent articles. I have even read articles that argue that gaining muscle is not a significant why to burn calories to burn fat. Calorie restriction and cardio have reportedly produced better results. I have always been of the opinion that if you were to change only one thing (diet/cardio/lift) to make a difference in your body composition, but you were to do it absolutely correctly that weight lifting makes the most dramatic short and long term difference in your appearance and your health. Diet would be the second most impactful and cardio last, again, this is just in my opinion. I absolutely believe that having all three dialed in makes the absolute most impact the quickest.
I am even going to be performing cardio myself to test the theory over the next few months, along with a strong lifting program and strict diet.
Both of you boys are making great progress and I wouldn't suggest you stop what is working for you at all!
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12-04-2011, 08:59 AM #204Other than some stronger than necessary language and overtly personal attacks towards my personage
I personally know people who have substantially more muscle than I do with single digit bodyfat that do even less cardio than I do
I wouldn't think I lack self discipline. I respect your opinion and most all of your posts, I am hurt by the weak minded reference and don't know (other than our disagreement over this topic) what would earn me this ire in your eyes. Please accept my apologies for presenting my opinion in an incomplete manner or in a way that seemed as if I believed it to be the only viewpoint with any validity.
The reason your post irritated me so much is b/c when I see you post these anti-cardio ideas it seems as though the point in posting them is not necessarily to help the OP but rather to persuade people to agree with the whole anti-cardio opinion. It seems that you're just trying to make a point and convince others of the validity of these ideas. Hopefully I'm wrong as I know that you have helped and continue to try to help many people on this board but that's the feeling I got from reading your post. Pap is having great success from his diet and cardio program and it is so easy to start doubting what you are doing, especially when it is so difficult to keep up consistently, the last thing he needs is hear that his efforts are counter-productive. He's a smart guy though and obviously has formed his own opinions and knows what works for him to reach his goals.
End of hijack - if you want to talk about it more just PM me and we'll get this thread back on track.
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12-04-2011, 09:38 AM #205
TB, are you trying to argue that increasing LBM to reduce bodyfat percentage (as total weight increases while Fst weight remains the same) is a more effective way of getting leaner than defecate calories and cardio?
I cant work out your point..... Kind of confused
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12-04-2011, 09:49 AM #206
I want to chime in here for a sec since Papi suggested he was up for discussion.
Cardio: from what all I have read here it seems that to lose muscle you would have to do an extreme amount of high intensity cardio over a long period of time.
On on a side note: Ss far as lifting being the fun part? opposite for me. I can do cardio everyday and love it! And I swear by it to lose the BF. And for me to really take off the BF? 2x's a day in shorter sessions.
My .02Life is too short, so kiss slowly, laugh insanely, love truly and forgive quickly.Author Unknown
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12-04-2011, 10:27 AM #207Originally Posted by SlimmerMe
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12-04-2011, 11:13 AM #208
Base, I love the way you spell deficit. PMP every time.
Pap, over time you will learn what works best for YOUR body. After you've cut 2-3 times you will become exceptionally aware of what macro split, what weights routine, what cardio (type, intensity and length) and times of day to eat/perform are right for you. You'll also know how your body reacts to single cheat meals per week as opposed to none for a month or even what a cheat weekend will do to you.
What you have been doing is a relatively basic approach that you are already adapting and changing slightly to suit your lifestyle and requirements. That is what you need to continue doing. Hijacks are all very well and good, but your results are there and, as Tbody says, if it ain't broke don't fix it.
To everybody - choose your cardio wisely. Do a discipline that you dislike least. Get fitter and better - set yourself challenges. Don't worry so much about it destroying muscle, it can actually help with your lifting regime. Even if you don't start to enjoy it you'll find it alot more bearable. It's good for your heart too, you know!
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12-04-2011, 11:44 AM #209
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12-04-2011, 11:51 AM #210
Thanks SteM !! That's why i ask a lot of questions and like hearing everyone's opinion, that way i can choose whatever i think will best serve me, sometimes doesnt work but this is all trial and error until you find what really works for you, like you said. Well put Master Yoda!!
Just finished my fastes cardio, went awesome, didnt take the BCAA's and i didnt feel a thing, (SteM what are the consequences if i dont take bcaa pre fastes) like i said i ramped the intensity on everything, it felt hard but i pushed through! Feeling good today
Happy Sunday everyone
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12-04-2011, 01:14 PM #211
Consequences of no BCAA's pre fasted cardio, especially when doing interval training, is that you will burn more energy from muscle than you would if you took them. Bottom line - TAKE THEM BEFORE YOUR FASTED CARDIO.
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12-04-2011, 01:18 PM #212
Sgt. Hartman: I am coming around to a broader thought process on this, thanks for taking the time to respond, I do respect and appreciate you and your views.
Base: I think you have something here, the defacator's weight loss guide, curious as to what that meal plan would look like, hay and bark???
Stem: I love the way you put it, post #208 was a fantastic, non-biased, accurate assessment of our discussion, thank you for being level headed and articulating our issue with balance!
Slim: I love you for being you, but still love a girl with muscle tone not just simple lack of fat! Keep lifting!
Papi: Great thread, great progress, thanks for letting us in on all you are going through on the way to where you are going.
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12-04-2011, 01:47 PM #213
Wow... A lot has transpired... and I'm late to the party.
There's really nothing I can add that hasn't already been discussed. Most of you already know my thoughts re: cardio. I do cardio, lots of it. Upping my cardio game helped me catapult past a slump that I wallowed in for nearly a year. It rounds out any training routine IMHO.
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12-04-2011, 04:46 PM #214
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12-04-2011, 04:51 PM #215
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12-04-2011, 04:53 PM #216
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12-05-2011, 04:18 AM #217
Well Happy Monday to everyone, just got to the gym to do whatever leg exercises i can and the rest will be cardio!
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12-05-2011, 05:50 AM #218Originally Posted by Papiriqui;5823***
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12-05-2011, 06:25 AM #219
hey pap as far as the bcaas go i use body mortar and it has a lemonish flavor and its not bad at all.. actually kind of good .. i mix 1 scoop in a bottle with about 12 oz of water..shake for 60 secs and chug... easy .. i would have thought the nausea would have been more associated with the caffeine than the bcaa..
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12-05-2011, 06:57 AM #220Originally Posted by --->>405<<---
I have to look that up 405, where do you get that?? Regular grocery store??
SteM we do have juice concentrates but i dont believe is the same, i looked it up and it gave me how to make it. I'll try looking for both of what you guys recommended if not i'll add like 3oz of the most natural orange juice i can find and some water.
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12-05-2011, 08:10 AM #221
no i got it from a health food store here in savannah ga.. the guy who owns it used to be a competitive bodybuilder.. i got the body mortar for like 40bucks rite when i started and i take 1 scoop before fastd cardio and i bet i still have 2 or 3 weeks left ..so thats like 15$/month or so...check it out..they can prob mail it to u
Last edited by --->>405<<---; 12-05-2011 at 08:14 AM. Reason: oops messd up
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12-05-2011, 08:13 AM #222
sry this is the rite one.. u may have to call.. im not very internet smart
Last edited by --->>405<<---; 12-05-2011 at 08:18 AM.
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12-05-2011, 08:36 AM #223
i sent u a PM PAP lemme know if u get it.. im not great with computers
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12-05-2011, 08:47 AM #224
- GAL -->
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12-05-2011, 09:10 AM #225
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12-05-2011, 09:14 AM #226Originally Posted by gbrice75
I got it bud, thanks!Originally Posted by --->>405<<---
Im opening the laptop now to look into it, price wise i dont know, the bcaa i use from infinite labs is not cheap and the container is reaaaaaally small, so it might not be much of a damage.Originally Posted by gbrice75
Yeah i can get it for $50.99 with 90 servings, not bad. The 1 i buy has 20 servin for 20.00 so is about the aame price. Purple wrath i'll take it just this 2 weeks and on weekends when i do fastes cardio, normally i dont so it will last me for quite sometime!
I am LIFTING! and lifting and lifting and appreciate reminding me to lift more Tbody~
X 2 on picking Purple
And adding to the list: Macro Greens and Miracle Reds? They are great too....
Life is too short, so kiss slowly, laugh insanely, love truly and forgive quickly.Author Unknown
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