organic foods

[kalspic]

im sure this topic has been beaten pretty good, but i havnt seen one in awhile so ill post a little on it.

this is all based off of my own personal opinion, i work with organic produce and some protiens everyday so i have a little experiance with them. i've come to these conclusions through tasting and conversation with fellow cooks and chefs.

im going to break it down into different groups and describe what i notice about organic over non-organic produce and proteins.

fruits i think out of all the catergories ill list this one has the biggest different in flavor and texture between organic and non-organic. organic produce is more intensly flavored
- the best peaches and oranges i've ever had were organic. if you can find cara-cara or valencia organes get them, the best varieties i've ever tasted.
- As far as melons go, i havnt really noticed a difference. its very hit or miss no matter what. we will get good ones some days and bland ones other days.
- organic bananas are the way to go for sure, another big difference

Vegetables this doesnt have quite as big a difference as fruits but some vegetables do.
-tomatos have the biggest difference in this catergory. the stuff you buy in the store have nothing on farmers market or hierloom tomatos. if you can, get them local and fresh. look for heirloom or san marzono tomatos
-spinach tastes a little better organic than non-organic.
-organic arugala has a very peppery bite, almost like your eating straight pepper...not my favorite, so i prefer non-organic.
- carrots also are a hit or miss like melons. havnt noticed any difference between organic or non-organic.
-everything else i havnt noticed too much of a difference.

starches this includes potatos and grains. no real difference at all. but some quality products come from Anson mills out of columbia SC.

land animals this includes cows, lamb pork etc. a good majority of organic animals are grass feed. im not sure but there might be some organic corn feed.
-i find that grass feed beef is less flavorful than corn feed. many quality farms will finish
- quality pork farms will finish their live stock on nuts or certain feed which is supposed to change the flavor off the meat. i havnt noticed too much of a difference, but there is a different succulance when finish on nuts.
- lamb can be pretty gamey depending on which farm it comes from. i havnt been able to sample any organic lamb so i cant comment too much on it.

fish/shellfish the best fish i have is wild caught. there is a big difference between farm raised salmon and wild caught salmon, same with trout.
-i guess you could consider all shellfish are wild considering they dont feed them, although they do farm them. more research is needed on my part.

avian i have only had organic chicken in this category unfortunatley, so i cant elaborate further on it. but the organic chicken had a better taste than the non-organic.

* although i find certain types of protien to taste better non-organic than organic i still buy the organic. i support responsible farming and care for the product.

*good farming practices= good food

* i support local farms and try to buy and use as much local produce at home and at the restaurant i work at.

*all this takes into account cooking the product properly.

*if you havnt check out the documentry FOOD.INC do it, pretty informitive. although i still am skeptical about some parts.

[Times Roman]

this is something i've ranted about before.

the label "organic" is highly misleading. most people think that no chemicals are introduced, no pesticides/fungicides used. and this was the way it was supposed to be in the beginning. but the farmers complained and said it would take them a few years to get it to such a stringent standard, so to bridge this "transition" period, the USDA shortlisted certain chemicals that were OK to use until the farmers couuld figure out the alternative.
The problem is, the list is growing, not going away!

Did you know that....
...organic foods containing the label only need to be 70% organic?
...you are allowed to petition a chemical substance for inclusion on the list?
...synthetic substances are allowed, so long as they (cause no harm, in essence). but here's the problem, the british were thinking thalidamide was a useful fertility agent and caused no harm, but whoa nelly! LOOK AT ALL THE DAMAGE IT CAUSED. by the way, this is an exercerpt from the list: (not very fukkin organic, now is it??)

§ 205.601 Synthetic substances allowed for use in organic crop production.
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In accordance with restrictions specified in this section, the following synthetic substances may be used in organic crop production: Provided, That, use of such substances do not contribute to contamination of crops, soil, or water. Substances allowed by this section, except disinfectants and sanitizers in paragraph (a) and those substances in paragraphs (c), (j), (k), and (l) of this section, may only be used when the provisions set forth in §205.206(a) through (d) prove insufficient to prevent or control the target pest.

(a) As algicide, disinfectants, and sanitizer, including irrigation system cleaning systems.

(1) Alcohols.

(i) Ethanol.

(ii) Isopropanol.

(2) Chlorine materials—For pre-harvest use, residual chlorine levels in the water in direct crop contact or as water from cleaning irrigation systems applied to soil must not exceed the maximum residual disinfectant limit under the Safe Drinking Water Act, except that chlorine products may be used in edible sprout production according to EPA label directions.

(i) Calcium hypochlorite.

(ii) Chlorine dioxide.

(iii) Sodium hypochlorite.

(3) Copper sulfate—for use as an algicide in aquatic rice systems, is limited to one application per field during any 24-month period. Application rates are limited to those which do not increase baseline soil test values for copper over a timeframe agreed upon by the producer and accredited certifying agent.

(4) Hydrogen peroxide.

(5) Ozone gas—for use as an irrigation system cleaner only.

(6) Peracetic acid—for use in disinfecting equipment, seed, and asexually propagated planting material.

(7) Soap-based algicide/demossers.

(8) Sodium carbonate peroxyhydrate (CAS #–15630–89–4)—Federal law restricts the use of this substance in food crop production to approved food uses identified on the product label.

(b) As herbicides, weed barriers, as applicable.

(1) Herbicides, soap-based—for use in farmstead maintenance (roadways, ditches, right of ways, building perimeters) and ornamental crops.

(2) Mulches.

(i) Newspaper or other recycled paper, without glossy or colored inks.

(ii) Plastic mulch and covers (petroleum-based other than polyvinyl chloride (PVC)).

(c) As compost feedstocks—Newspapers or other recycled paper, without glossy or colored inks.

(d) As animal repellents—Soaps, ammonium—for use as a large animal repellant only, no contact with soil or edible portion of crop.

(e) As insecticides (including acaricides or mite control).

(1) Ammonium carbonate—for use as bait in insect traps only, no direct contact with crop or soil.

(2) Aqueous potassium silicate (CAS #–1312–76–1)—the silica, used in the manufacture of potassium silicate, must be sourced from naturally occurring sand.

(3) Boric acid—structural pest control, no direct contact with organic food or crops.

(4) Copper sulfate—for use as tadpole shrimp control in aquatic rice production, is limited to one application per field during any 24-month period. Application rates are limited to levels which do not increase baseline soil test values for copper over a timeframe agreed upon by the producer and accredited certifying agent.

(5) Elemental sulfur.

(6) Lime sulfur—including calcium polysulfide.

(7) Oils, horticultural—narrow range oils as dormant, suffocating, and summer oils.

(8) Soaps, insecticidal.

(9) Sticky traps/barriers.

(10) Sucrose octanoate esters (CAS #s—42922–74–7; 58064–47–4)—in accordance with approved labeling.

(f) As insect management. Pheromones.

(g) As rodenticides.

(1) Sulfur dioxide—underground rodent control only (smoke bombs).

(2) Vitamin D3.

(h) As slug or snail bait. Ferric phosphate (CAS # 10045–86–0).

(i) As plant disease control.

(1) Aqueous potassium silicate (CAS #–1312–76–1)—the silica, used in the manufacture of potassium silicate, must be sourced from naturally occurring sand.

(2) Coppers, fixed—copper hydroxide, copper oxide, copper oxychloride, includes products exempted from EPA tolerance, Provided, That, copper-based materials must be used in a manner that minimizes accumulation in the soil and shall not be used as herbicides.

(3) Copper sulfate—Substance must be used in a manner that minimizes accumulation of copper in the soil.

(4) Hydrated lime.

(5) Hydrogen peroxide.

(6) Lime sulfur.

(7) Oils, horticultural, narrow range oils as dormant, suffocating, and summer oils.

(8) Peracetic acid—for use to control fire blight bacteria.

(9) Potassium bicarbonate.

(10) Elemental sulfur.

(11) Streptomycin, for fire blight control in apples and pears only until October 21, 2014.

(12) Tetracycline, for fire blight control only and for use only until October 21, 2012.

(j) As plant or soil amendments.

(1) Aquatic plant extracts (other than hydrolyzed)—Extraction process is limited to the use of potassium hydroxide or sodium hydroxide; solvent amount used is limited to that amount necessary for extraction.

(2) Elemental sulfur.

(3) Humic acids—naturally occurring deposits, water and alkali extracts only.

(4) Lignin sulfonate—chelating agent, dust suppressant.

(5) Magnesium sulfate—allowed with a documented soil deficiency.

(6) Micronutrients—not to be used as a defoliant, herbicide, or desiccant. Those made from nitrates or chlorides are not allowed. Soil deficiency must be documented by testing.

(i) Soluble boron products.

(ii) Sulfates, carbonates, oxides, or silicates of zinc, copper, iron, manganese, molybdenum, selenium, and cobalt.

(7) Liquid fish products—can be pH adjusted with sulfuric, citric or phosphoric acid. The amount of acid used shall not exceed the minimum needed to lower the pH to 3.5.

(8) Vitamins, B1, C, and E.

(9) Sulfurous acid (CAS # 7782–99–2) for on-farm generation of substance utilizing 99% purity elemental sulfur per paragraph (j)(2) of this section.

(k) As plant growth regulators. Ethylene gas—for regulation of pineapple flowering.

(l) As floating agents in postharvest handling.

(1) Lignin sulfonate.

(2) Sodium silicate—for tree fruit and fiber processing.

(m) As synthetic inert ingredients as classified by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), for use with nonsynthetic substances or synthetic substances listed in this section and used as an active pesticide ingredient in accordance with any limitations on the use of such substances.

(1) EPA List 4—Inerts of Minimal Concern.

(2) EPA List 3—Inerts of unknown toxicity—for use only in passive pheromone dispensers.

(n) Seed preparations. Hydrogen chloride (CAS # 7647–01–0)—for delinting cotton seed for planting.

(o) As production aids. Microcrystalline cheesewax (CAS #'s 64742–42–3, 8009–03–08, and 8002–74–2)–for use in log grown mushroom production. Must be made without either ethylene-propylene co-polymer or synthetic colors.

(p)–(z) [Reserved]

[65 FR 80637, Dec. 21, 2000, as amended at 68 FR 61992, Oct. 31, 2003; 71 FR 53302 Sept. 11, 2006; 72 FR 69572, Dec. 10, 2007; 75 FR 38696, July 6, 2010; 75 FR 77524, Dec. 13, 2010; 77 FR 8092, Feb. 14, 2012; 77 FR 33298, June 6, 2012]

[kalspic]

good info times, all of it is new to me. ill do further research. unfortunatly it makes sence. try starting a garden and dont add anything extra except water and see what you get...nothing too impressive. there are always loop holes. but one thing i didnt add was how organice foods make me feel. i dont eat enough of them so i cant tell. but eating healthy in general makes me feel energetic and better over all. is the price worth the product, probably not but responisble farming is( crop rotations, composting, non-cruel livestock raising etc.) i need to check into the local farms and see what they use, i cant say for sure they dont use any of these, but talking to them it sounded like they dont spray anything on their crops.

thy are also small farms and i was going more towards the local farmers market which i didnt clearly state.

i take it you dont even think about buying organic?

[Times Roman]

the perception with many people is that NO chemicals are used, and the organic farmers are doing NOTHING to change that perception. AND the cost of organic produce is outrageous. In fact, organic foods are no more nutritious than non organic foods, and non organics pose no greater health risk to the population than organic foods.

There is NO reason you should pay twice the price just for an "organic" label

it's a freaking scam, and I refuse to buy anything organic!!

[Times Roman]

BTW...

a bloke down the street from me has a one acre garden he cultivates every year. uses less chems than "organic" farmers. AND his prices are the same as non organics you see at the grocery store.

mate, the REAL solution is buy your produce locally, something that doesnt' get trucked in from half way across the state, needing referigeration, etc.

buy local, and you can't beat the quality. Period!

[kalspic]

BTW...

a bloke down the street from me has a one acre garden he cultivates every year. uses less chems than "organic" farmers. AND his prices are the same as non organics you see at the grocery store.

mate, the REAL solution is buy your produce locally, something that doesnt' get trucked in from half way across the state, needing referigeration, etc.

buy local, and you can't beat the quality. Period!

i cannot agree more. i fully support local business and farming. the draw back to that where i am, we're atleast 10 years behind most of the country. at the restaurant we also make it a point to list on the menu the local farmers we buy from