How often to carb up / Cheat day? ? ?

[< <Samson> >]

So I went by my last thread's advice and had a solid carb up day(just one). I pounded down about 500g's of carbs from simple carbs early in the morning then the rest from complex carb sources.


In theory how often should I do this? Till the weight stops dropping or weekly or?

[digsy1983]

think the 'refeed' duration is dependant on the calorie defecit amount. if severer defecit a 'refeed' is 7-10 days. if not so dractic a cut 2-3 weeks. and also how driven you are is a factor, but too driven will lead to a slower metabolism and therefore slower fat reduction. think the term balancing act could be applied to this.

[gbrice75]

So I went by my last thread's advice and had a solid carb up day(just one). I pounded down about 500g's of carbs from simple carbs early in the morning then the rest from complex carb sources.


In theory how often should I do this? Till the weight stops dropping or weekly or?

There's no right answer. It depends on your body, how you respond to carb depletion, and more importantly, carb refeed's. I've seen people carb up every 7 days, 10 days, 14 days, and not at all.

[MR-FQ320]

I wouldny use simple carbs to refuel glycogen stores, well I added some raisins and sultanas to some weetabix, thats as simple as it got for me.

[gbrice75]

^^ same here. Doesn't work well for me. Seems to work best for ectomorphs in my experience.

[digsy1983]

i was under the impression that simple carbs didnt go to fueling glycogen stores, just liver glycogen. or is this one of them old facts that outdated??

[MR-FQ320]

i was under the impression that simple carbs didnt go to fueling glycogen stores, just liver glycogen. or is this one of them old facts that outdated??

Carbs fill glycogen stores whatever, just don't go mental, you are only replenishing stores not overloading them, you may have undone a weeks worth of dieting.

[< <Samson> >]

Tough tough shit. . . .

It is such a fact - One thing may work for one person and do the complete opposite or nothing at all for other people.


Just know what works for me < for the most part.


I will try to go by weight. . . .I dropped my cals by 200 and kicked the protein even higher.

Now I am running @ 1600 cals pro @ 250+ fat any carbs r negative or well under 20 per day

[digsy1983]

samson, have you not looked into carb cycling? seems a bit drastic IMO to keep reducing cals especially when you have a fair bit of lbm.

theres an inofrmative video about just reducing cals in the tread below.

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...rn-how-to-Diet

[--->>405<<---]

i was under the impression that simple carbs didnt go to fueling glycogen stores, just liver glycogen. or is this one of them old facts that outdated??

not sure where u got this from. now fruit sugar (fructose) is stored in the liver which only has a capacity for either 50g or 100g i cant remember which. the rest can be stored as body fat.

regular simple carbs this is not the case. i have replenished glycogen with simple carbs in excess of 500g with no probs.. for a lot of people simple carbs during refeed part of a carb cycle can be ideal because some people tend to hold less water with them for some reason. i dont believe there is any scientific data to support this but something i learned from UD2.0

with a refeed it is better to start with simple carbs and work ur way to more complex as the refeed progresses..

this may not be the case for all people as well.. u gotta see what works for u.

[--->>405<<---]

So I went by my last thread's advice and had a solid carb up day(just one). I pounded down about 500g's of carbs from simple carbs early in the morning then the rest from complex carb sources.


In theory how often should I do this? Till the weight stops dropping or weekly or?

what does the rest of ur diet and workouts look like? how many grams carbs r u refeeding with in total and how often?

[digsy1983]

I remember reading it in an article when I was googling. I don't eat simple carbs so not given it much thought really. But i was a bit perplexed when I read ud2.0 and Lyle mentioned eating simple carbs. Thought I'd err on the side of caution and stick with complex carbs.

Liver glycogen stores apx 100g.

[< <Samson> >]

what does the rest of ur diet and workouts look like? how many grams carbs r u refeeding with in total and how often?

Sup homesilce. . . .

My workouts are 4x a week with heavy lifts. All broken into individual muscle groups. Sort of, yesterday was deads, bi's and abs. Today in the AM I did 40 minutes of fasted cardio.

Diet is 4 meals a day(sometimes 5)

1. 2 eggs and 8 OZ's of chicken liver cooked in olive oil

2. Shake (half of carton of egg whites and 2 1/2 scoops of whey)

3. Chicken milk (8 oz's of baked plain chicken and 1/4 cup walnuts)

4. Same as #3 Sometimes I change either into ground beef or replace the chicken liver with gb sometimes with plain beans


I also add in 1-2 Tbsp of Psylium Husk Fibre sime time throughout the day along with about 6g's of fish oil.

[gbrice75]

I remember reading it in an article when I was googling. I don't eat simple carbs so not given it much thought really. But i was a bit perplexed when I read ud2.0 and Lyle mentioned eating simple carbs. Thought I'd err on the side of caution and stick with complex carbs.

Liver glycogen stores apx 100g.

Like I said earlier, some people do fine with starting their refeeds using simple carbs, others don't. IMO you can't go wrong with complex. It's not as if you NEED simple carbs to 'jumpstart' a refeed. Unless you know your body and tolerance to simple carbs, insulin surges, high BGL, etc. then you should stick with complex IMO. I'm with you.

[--->>405<<---]

I remember reading it in an article when I was googling. I don't eat simple carbs so not given it much thought really. But i was a bit perplexed when I read ud2.0 and Lyle mentioned eating simple carbs. Thought I'd err on the side of caution and stick with complex carbs.

Liver glycogen stores apx 100g.

not a bad thing to do. i used to be that way and still prefer complex over simple for sure but it is a nice thing to have some simple carbs once in awhile because they tend to be tastier IMO. this is a good thing about experimentation.

in the beginning of my diet i stuck to the proven methods. after i achieved my goals i was afforded the freedom of experimentation. one thing i learned is in moderation, deviation from proven methods are not catastrophic. usually these deviations go without any significant negative result. (speaking for myself).

these are things u will learn about urself over time.

[gbrice75]

not a bad thing to do. i used to be that way and still prefer complex over simple for sure but it is a nice thing to have some simple carbs once in awhile because they tend to be tastier IMO

Welcome to the reason why i'm currently fat and my life sucks, lol!

[--->>405<<---]

Welcome to the reason why i'm currently fat and my life sucks, lol!

LOL.. u ought to be seeing some positive results by now from ur TRT!

[digsy1983]

Ha I think it's every ones opinion that simple carbs are tastier than complex carbs.
I've found I'm fine cutting out all simple carbs, but if I.do.have simple carbs I crave them over the next few days. So I.stay clear of them for them.
Yeah I'll be alot more laxed when I reach my goal, but until then it's a regimented approach.

Sorry Samson! I'll.stop with the simple carb hijacking! Lol

[< <Samson> >]

It's all good as long as it works.


I don't have much left to lose at this time. . . . I am not looking to pulling into the single digits at this time. That will come when I reach a higher LBM weight.

[--->>405<<---]

how many days are u running this diet before refeeding?

[gbrice75]

LOL.. u ought to be seeing some positive results by now from ur TRT!

Strength-wise, definitely. Can't say the same cosmetically.

Ha I think it's every ones opinion that simple carbs are tastier than complex carbs.
I've found I'm fine cutting out all simple carbs, but if I.do.have simple carbs I crave them over the next few days. So I.stay clear of them for them.
Yeah I'll be alot more laxed when I reach my goal, but until then it's a regimented approach.

Sorry Samson! I'll.stop with the simple carb hijacking! Lol

That's how sugar works for a lot of people. It's quite literally an addictive compound. That's why when you stay away for a few days the cravings subside. But one sweet thing and they surge again.

[< <Samson> >]

how many days are u running this diet before refeeding?

Still working on that part. For the first 2 months I had no refeed - period.

Now, it's getting a little trickier. Before my refeed I had no change in my weight for almost 2 weeks, did the cheat day 3 days later at the same diet as above I dropped a pound.

[--->>405<<---]

i guess were putting the cart b4 the horse.. IMO (depending on ur stats) at 1600cals per day with no carbs u should be droppn fat. u also prob should be eatn more. i suggest u post ur complete stats. IMO u may need to re-do this diet..

[< <Samson> >]

post ur complete stats. IMO u may need to re-do this diet..

32

201 Lbs. as of this morning

Bf % should be right at 16% now

I don't see any issues with the diet so far. I can throttle the cal intake real easily by just adding in more food in each meal a small amount at a time.

My break down on yesterday was 1600 cal 240+pro 12<carb & about 50-60 fat

[MR-FQ320]

Less than 12 g of carbs a day ?

[--->>405<<---]

i suppose samson i assumed u were having probs with this diet for some reason. LOL.. on second thought maybe u werent. in any event IMO if ur running no carbs u should refeed at least every week. immnot a fan of keto diets per se although i do run no/low carbs for 5days in a row (maybe i am and just dont know it!) but i always have 2 refeed days after 5 consecutive no/low days.

also from what ive read by Lyle MacDonald he recommends not running a cut any longer than 8 consecutive weeks without running maintenance cals for 2 consecutive weeks during the interim. this will help bring the body back closer to homeostasis hormonally and in other areas too. then after 2 weeks maintenanc u can run another 8week cut.

i think this could only help ur situation.

at 201lbs 16%bf ur rough maintenance is: 2532cals

1600cals is a substantial deficit and running it for extended periods of time could cause u to have a metabolic response that will further hinder ur progress. if i were u i would consider adding in more refeeds and running a maintenance diet at 2500cals for 2 weeks.

im a little busy rite now but ill chek in on u later!

[MR-FQ320]

Are you doing cardio ? Have you thought about clen or t3 ? Either way I think your metabolism has slowed down, you need to speed it up. Maybe two weeks at maintenance will reinvigorate you b

[digsy1983]

quick question,

is 2532 cals not a bit low for maintenace especially for a guy thats lifting 'heavy' 4 times a week and doing a bit of cardio?

i know the lbm x 15 formula gives 2532 just seems slightly low, to me.

(maybe better to be slighly under if 'refeeds' havent been factored in to the old diet for a while tho.)

[--->>405<<---]

quick question,

is 2532 cals not a bit low for maintenace especially for a guy thats lifting 'heavy' 4 times a week and doing a bit of cardio?

i know the lbm x 15 formula gives 2532 just seems slightly low, to me.

(maybe better to be slighly under if 'refeeds' havent been factored in to the old diet for a while tho.)

it is what it is man. a rough estimate for maintenance. the "tdee" formula we have used in that past is inaccurate like a mofo IMO. i bulked at 3200cals putting on 2-2.5lbs per week. using that formula my maintenance is 3215cals..

LBM x 15 is GTG IMO for rough starting point. it may err to the low side but thats what i prefer.. id rather increase cals than have to lose unwanted fat..

[digsy1983]

yeah, suppose.

don't know what the avg recommendation for daily cals for men is on your side of the pond. in the U.K 2500 cals is the av recomendation for men. guess thats why 2532 seems low to me, but also now, the 'RDA' of 2500 seems high. this might explain a bit of why we're quickly catching up in the over weight nation fun time eating sport. lol

[< <Samson> >]

I am still on my EC stack.

Getting very close to bouncing back to maintenance since I am quite close to reaching my goal to run another cycle.


I am pretty sure my diet would have to be a bit more in check if I ever want to see the single digits.

Can't bitch about this too much though since as of now I lost right about 44 pounds.

[Brohim]

Strength-wise, definitely. Can't say the same cosmetically.



That's how sugar works for a lot of people. It's quite literally an addictive compound. That's why when you stay away for a few days the cravings subside. But one sweet thing and they surge again.

That's why people in America are fat. They eat sugar and are on a treadmill cycle of sugar. If they would stop eating sugar for a few weeks they wouldn't have cravings anymore.

[--->>405<<---]

yeah, suppose.

don't know what the avg recommendation for daily cals for men is on your side of the pond. in the U.K 2500 cals is the av recomendation for men. guess thats why 2532 seems low to me, but also now, the 'RDA' of 2500 seems high. this might explain a bit of why we're quickly catching up in the over weight nation fun time eating sport. lol

interesting.. here everything is typically "based on a 2000 cal diet".. funny how what our govt bases things on is 500cals less than urs and we have a fatty problem.. do yall have fast food restaurants?? (besides macdonalds and burger king)

[digsy1983]

interesting.. here everything is typically "based on a 2000 cal diet".. funny how what our govt bases things on is 500cals less than urs and we have a fatty problem.. do yall have fast food restaurants?? (besides macdonalds and burger king)

our fatty trend has/is becoming a major problem. yeah we have a fair amount of fast food joints/takeaways, but think its more the microwaveable foods and convenience foods causing the problem. home cooked food is a thing of the past for most areas of the u.k. interesting tho that your cals is lower than ours!

[digsy1983]

44 pounds is a fair chunk to drop, well done man!

think i asked this previous, but have you looked into carb cycling? i'm currently doin it and 405 (i think i can safely say this) is a big fan. it could be worth a read, he explains everything and the diet/training are synchronised so its all set out in the plan. could be worth while for you either now, or in the future.

i have the file on PDF format, if youre intersted. or just check out lyle mcdonalds web site.

[< <Samson> >]

Yeah, when I actually do put my mind to something it happens and works just fine.

But, yeah we are fat sheeple and treated as such.

Sadly to say my gf is stuck in this trend and it is making life a little more difficult than necessary. She will go to the gym - then stop by Taco Bell on the way home.


That just pisses me off

Then ask me why is she not losing weight and what can she do to change that. Real cool, real real cool.

That right there is the sheeple on a huge scale.

We were at the mall the other day. Me being in fairly decent shape now makes me a minority amongst the fat Homer Simpson's roaming around me. Lame way lame

[digsy1983]

Meant to ask this yesterday, but time was getting late this side of the world.

Wot is sheeple? Im assuming it's sheep and people mixed, people just following the crowd? I've never heard his before, but I.like the term!

[< <Samson> >]

Wot is sheeple? Im assuming it's sheep and people mixed, people just following the crowd? I've never heard his before, but I.like the term!

Yup, those are sheeple. lol

This just how I picture most of the sheeple:

[digsy1983]

Hahaha! I like it!