Recomp Cycle Diet Help

[Ghosty]

Im looking at starting a recomp diet come Jan.

Here's what i've got.

194lbs
17%bf (this is a very rough guess, top abs are slighty visible when crunched, theres muscle seperation on quads, shoulder and traps. most fat is around lower abs and back and glutes)

Maintenance cals: around 3000
so i was thinking from what i read to go the following route
Training days: 2800 cals
Protein: 365g
Carbs:175g
Fats:75g
totals per day

Non Training days: 2500 cals

Protein:350
Carbs:130
Fats:65

Am I on the right track here?

[--->>405<<---]

ghosty welcome man

based on ur stated stats: 194lbs 17%BF u have 161.02lbs LBM

a good estimate for maintenance formula: (LBM x 15)

161.02 x 15 = 2415cals (rough maintenance)

IMO if u want to try to recomp ud do better with 2500cals on training days and 1900cals on non-training days (no starchy carbs + good amount of cardio)

how many days out of 7 do u lift?

[Ghosty]

see, this is what i hate. there are so many different formulas to use to get daily cal intake and every one gives a different answer. sigh

any how thank you for the help there.

i will be on cycle, so aren't that abit low? Just wondering

I was thinking of the follow training protocol
weights 5 times a week: Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday and Saturday
Cardio: fasted 45-60 min cardio on off days friday and sunday. And maybe 10-20min HIIT cardio post training.

Goals are to keep weight stagnant and just drop 2-3% bf per cycle aswell

[--->>405<<---]

^^ sorry ur frustrated with the formulas. i have used the one i gave u as well as katch/mcardle and believe the one i gave u to be the better of the 2 and the bset i know of. i started at 26.6%bf and have managed to cut down to 9.9%bf as of 2 weeks ago. and im not done yet. so i have a fair amount of experience with cutting.

the problem with katch, and harris benedict is the activity level multiplier. it is errant IMO to the high side whereas the one i gave u if anything is errant to the lower side. personally id rather increase cals than have to lose fat! but i think its pretty close nonetheless. katch/harris gives me maintenance cals which i gain 2.5lbs per week on.. up to u what to use but im trying to save u some time here.

personally i would cut before cycling. i suggest u post a pic so we can see how close u are on ur bf% seeing as how everything hinges on LBM..

[Ghosty]

the idea is to get bf down to 14% range. I only want to start said cycle in Feb. i have clen, yohimbe hcl, t3 and eph on hand to help speed this up. Currently im just eating clean no strict diet and doing cardio 3x a week. and only training legs twice. Carbs at the moment are low and only in the first 3 meals of the day, rest of the day is protein and healthy fats. But like i said nothing strict atm.

I will get a accurate bf reading first week in jan. As for pic, you gona laugh but i dont want to post pics up in the public.

Another thing my food sources currently and for the proposed future diet are as follows:

Protein: chicken breast fillet, hake fillets, rump mince, egg whites and whey iso
carbs: oats, basmati rice, wholewheat low gi bread(thinking of changing this)
Fats: natty peanut butter and almonds

[--->>405<<---]

u say u want to be the same weight u are right now (193lbs) but just at 14%bf is this correct?

[Ghosty]

Yes but i know natty that aint gona happen in the next 5 or so weeks. So ideally i dont mind dropping down to 187lbs and be around 14%bf
If my calculations are correct i should still be at the same LBM of 161lbs then.
Then from there start the cycle and drop bf further while keeping weight the same.

or are these goals unreasonable?

[--->>405<<---]

at 193lbs 14%bf u will have 166lbs LBM..

right now at 193lbs 17%bf u have 160lbs LBM

IMO to achieve the goals u want u dont need to cycle at all and i think u would be taking a risk that is unnecessary.. ur talkn losing 3%bf down to 14% which is easily achieveable with not a ton of effort. the only other obstacle u will have is gaining 6lbs of LBM. also IMO attainable without AAS. ur gonna do what u want but this is my opinion. why take the risk when ur just talking about a little more time??

also i see ur 176cm about 5'10"

u dont need to cycle for this dude.

[Ghosty]

So are these goals possible in a 5 month span if diet and training is in check? No AAS.

[--->>405<<---]

So are these goals possible in a 5 month span if diet and training is in check? No AAS.

i think u could be pretty close yes. the bf% drop is NO PROBLEM.. u should be able to drop 3%bf in 2 months. (give or take a week or 2).. ive cut from 13.1%bf to 9.9%bf in 7 weeks.. thats the same % drop ur looking for.. but usually its harder to get from 13 to 10 than 17 to 14..

then all u will have to do is add LBM..

[Ghosty]

Sorry i forget to say the main goal weight and bf% is 187lbs and 8%bf. I wanna achieve this by end may next year.
Hence the reason i wanna run the AAS.

Short term goal was to drop the 2-3%bf before cycle which was planned for feb. So even my weight drops slighty i dont mind aslong as i can get to 14%bf by 4 feb.
At the 14%bf my weight should be around 185-187 if i didnt loose muscle and taking water weight in account aswell.

Is that realistic goals?

[--->>405<<---]

^^ from 17% bf 194lbs (161.02lbs LBM) to 8%bf 187lbs (172.04lbs LBM) in 5months?? its possible for some. i dont know if its possible for u or not. with proper diet, cardio, weights, and maybe gear..

i started at 13% like i told u mid oct and im hoping to be at 8% mid feb... thats 4months and 5%bf dropped.. u need 9%dropped.. plus gain 11 lbs LBM.. u have ur work ahead of u dude. personally i am skeptical u will be able to accomplish this in that short of a time frame.. im not saying its impossible, but considering ur 17% now ur somewhat out of shape and 8% is pretty ripped. plus u wanna throw 11lbs LBM on top. u will need gear for sure..

if i were u id cut natty to at least 12% if not 10% then run gear...

[Ghosty]

OK i hear what your saying. What i'll do is, is to do the recomp diet natty for now and reasses later on what to do. for now i want get this diet sorted.

With the giving cals you suggested what macro split should i be looking at? My original split was 40/30/30.

[Ghosty]

mini bump

P.s >>405<< i decided to put pics up. will you please have a look for bf guestimate.

[--->>405<<---]

id put u in the 13-15% neighborhood. definitely NOT 17%..

id prob use 14% to be safe when calculating LBM

194 x .86 = 166.84

166.84 x 15 = 2502cals

what has ur diet looked like so far? personally i suggest cycling ur carbs based on activity.

[Ghosty]

i've been on a bulking diet the last 5 months eating roughly 3500-3800 cals. Macro split of 40/40/20.

when you say cycle carbs should i look a low/med/high rotation. doing high carbs on back and leg days, med carbs on shoulder and chest day and then low carbs on arm and off days?

[--->>405<<---]

thats one way u could do it yes. personally IMO a better way to look at lifting schedule is goal oriented workouts.

im assuming burning fat is gonna be ur primary goal? lifting everyday or 5 days per week is more of a mass gaining protocol. structuring ur diet daily based on goals is a better way to look at things IMO esp when burning fat is at the top of the list. to burn fat u need 2 key ingredients IMO to get optimal results:
1. caloric deficit
2. cardio

obviously the more of this u have the better ur results are going to be. separating fat burning days from lifting days is proving to be effective for myself. this will allow u to focus ur lifting days on preserving LBM and eat more food. u can accomplish this in many ways. spending an entire workout and day for arms when ur wanting to burn fat is a waste of time IMO. u would fare better to do a 3 day split:

chest/back
legs
arms/shoulders

u can keep cals and carbs higher on these days which will free up more non-lifting days for cardio, reduced carbs, and caloric deficit which will lead to burning fat. fasting is also a good tool to have. u may not want to implement all these tools at one time but to have the knowledge at ur disposal when u are approaching different phases of body composition comes in handy for keeping the results coming. the leaner u get, the harder it is to keep burning fat..

[Ghosty]

I dont wanted to loose weight to quickly or have to much of a deficit so i dont add lbm during this.

So maybe something like this:

Monday: Chest And Triceps followed by 20 min HIIT
Tuesday: Back And Biceps follwed by 20 min HIIT
Wednesday: Fasted Cardio of 45-60 min, later the day Calves, abs and 10-20min HIIT
Thursday: Shoulders followed by 20 min HIIT
Friday: Fasted Cardio of 45-60 min, later the day Calves, abs and 10-20min HIIT
Saturday: Legs followed by stationary bike for 10-20 min light cardio
Sunday:Fasted Cardio of 45-60 min

So thats 4 days for weight training = high carb
And 3 days for fasted cardio with 2 off those days a light cardio and training session later on = Low carb

So no need for a medium carb day then, correct?

[--->>405<<---]

i wouldnt want u to lose weight too quickly either. obviously this is not ideal in most situations. how do u plan to set ur diet if u run this schedule?

[Ghosty]

well Regarding cardio what i will do is start of with only two fasted cardio session and begin at 30min. The HIIT cardio i will start at 10min. This way i have room to add and up intensity after weekly assessments.

Well high carb day will look as follow:
meal 1
6 egg whites and 2 slices low gi wholewheat bread - 39p 32c 3 f (grams)

Meal 2 (pre workout)
60g oats - 8p, 31c, 5f

meal 3 (post workout shake)
50g whey - 39p, 4c, 1f

Meal 4
200g chicken breast fillet and 50g basmati rice - 48p, 37c, 4f

Meal 5
200g chicken breast fillet and 30g almonds - 50p, 6c, 21f

Meal 6
200g rump mince and 30g almonds - 52p, 6c, 21f

Meal 7
200g hake fillet and 100g broccolli - 34p, 7c, 2f

Meal 8
50g iso whey and 30g peanut butter - 54p, 3c, 18f

totals: 324g pro, 126g carbs, 71g fats a day
total cals: 2439


Low Carb day:
meal 1
6 egg whites and 2 slices low gi wholewheat bread - 39p 32c 3 f (grams)

Meal 2
200g chicken breast fillet and 50g basmati rice - 48p, 37c, 4f

Meal 3
200g chicken breast fillet and 20g almonds - 48p, 4c, 12f

Meal 4
200g rump mince and 20g almonds - 50p, 4c, 16f

Meal 5
200g hake fillet and 100g broccolli - 34p, 7c, 2f

Meal 6
50g iso whey and 30g peanut butter - 54p, 3c, 18f

totals: 273g pro, 87g carbs, 55g fats a day
total cals: 1935

how does that look?

[--->>405<<---]

on higher carb days id run:
300p
200c
55f

on lower carb days id start at:
300p
100c
55f

u can then eliminate starch completely at some point and only have veggie carbs on low days. i would run low carbs on calves and abs day. im still failing to see why u would designate an entire day for shoulders??

[Ghosty]

ok, will redo diet with those macros

No specific reason for only training shoulder, in the past i did abs and calves with shoulders. But the current layout it changed.

[Ghosty]

adjusted diet
High carb:
meal 1
6 egg whites and 2 slices low gi wholewheat bread - 39p 32c 3 f (grams)

Meal 2 (pre workout)
60g oats - 8p, 31c, 5f

meal 3 (post workout shake)
50g whey - 39p, 4c, 1f


Meal 4
200g chicken breast fillet and 50g basmati rice - 48p, 37c, 4f

Meal 5
200g chicken breast fillet, 50g basmati rice and 20g almonds - 52p, 41c, 14f

Meal 6
200g rump mince, 50g basmati rice and 20g almonds - 54p, 41c, 18f

meal 7
200g hake fillets and 100g brocolli - 34p, 7c, 2f

meal 8
30g iso whey and 20g peanut butter - 33p, 2c, 12f

total macros: 307g pro, 195g carbs and 59g fat a day
total cals: 2539

low carb day
meal 1
8 egg whites and 3 slices low gi bread - 52p, 48c, 5f

meal 2
200g chicken breast fillet and 50g basmati rice - 48p, 37c, 4f

meal 3
200g chicken breast fillet and 20g almonds - 48p, 4c, 12f

meal 4
200g rump mince and 20g almonds - 50p, 4c, 16f

meal 5
200g hake fillet and 100g brocolli - 34p, 7c, 2f

meal 6
50g iso whey and 30g peanut butter - 54p, 3c, 18f

total macros: 286g pro, 103g carbs and 57g fats a day
total cals: 2069

and now?

[--->>405<<---]

adjusted diet
High carb:
meal 1
6 egg whites and 2 slices low gi wholewheat bread - 39p 32c 3 f (grams)

Meal 2 (pre workout)
60g oats - 8p, 31c, 5f

meal 3 (post workout shake)
50g whey - 39p, 4c, 1f


Meal 4
200g chicken breast fillet and 50g basmati rice - 48p, 37c, 4f move rice to PWO, add green veggie

Meal 5
200g chicken breast fillet, 50g basmati rice and 20g almonds - 52p, 41c, 14f move rice to PWO and almonds to meal 7, add green veggie

Meal 6
200g rump mince, 50g basmati rice and 20g almonds - 54p, 41c, 18f move rice to meal 1,pre w/o, or pwo and almonds to meal 7

meal 7
200g hake fillets and 100g brocolli - 34p, 7c, 2f

meal 8
30g iso whey and 20g peanut butter - 33p, 2c, 12f swap whey with casein when u can or have 30g protein worth of meat..

total macros: 307g pro, 195g carbs and 59g fat a day
total cals: 2539

low carb day
meal 1
8 egg whites and 3 slices low gi bread - 52p, 48c, 5f

meal 2
200g chicken breast fillet and 50g basmati rice - 48p, 37c, 4f

meal 3
200g chicken breast fillet and 20g almonds - 48p, 4c, 12f id have green veg here and almonds to meal 5

meal 4
200g rump mince and 20g almonds - 50p, 4c, 16f green veg here, almonds to meal 5

meal 5
200g hake fillet and 100g brocolli - 34p, 7c, 2f

meal 6
50g iso whey and 30g peanut butter - 54p, 3c, 18f swap whey with casein when u can or have comparable amount of protein from meat

total macros: 286g pro, 103g carbs and 57g fats a day
total cals: 2069

and now?

for both meal 3 and 4 on "low" days the green veg u add in i would not worry about the additional carbs, just add em in to beef up the meal. impact will be negligible IMO..

fats are better kept at the end of the day IMO and away from carbs. maybe it doesnt matter, but then again maybe it does might as well play it safe IMO.. the rest of it looks good except suggested changes in BOLD.. questions?

[Ghosty]

ok let me get this right with the changes:

high carb day

meal 4 is my post workout meal, do you stil want me to move meal 5's carbs here. and if i do so then there is only protein in meal 5 and nothing else.
Same if i move meal 6's carbs to meal 1, then that meal will also only have protein.

if im reading correctly you want as follow

meal 1: eggs, bread and rice (breakfast)
meal 2: oats (pre workout)
meal 3: whey (post work out shake takin directly after training)
meal 4: chicken rice and more rice and green veggies (post wotkout meal an hour after training)
meal 5: chicken
Meal 6: Rump
Meal 7: Hake, greens and almonds
Meal 8: casein and peanut butter (before bed)

is this correct? or did i miss read

[--->>405<<---]

ok let me get this right with the changes:

high carb day

meal 4 is my post workout meal, do you stil want me to move meal 5's carbs here. and if i do so then there is only protein in meal 5 and nothing else.
Same if i move meal 6's carbs to meal 1, then that meal will also only have protein.

if im reading correctly you want as follow

meal 1: eggs, bread and rice (breakfast)
meal 2: oats (pre workout) id have protein here too
meal 3: whey (post work out shake takin directly after training) finish ur starchy carbs with this meal
meal 4: chicken rice and more rice and green veggies (post wotkout meal an hour after training) no rice just meat and veg
meal 5: chicken plus green veg
Meal 6: Rump u can have a veg here too if u like
Meal 7: Hake, greens and almonds no need for greens here unless u want them
Meal 8: casein and peanut butter (before bed) yes or u can have meat and fat

is this correct? or did i miss read

u misread

lets make some clarifications:

meal 2 = PRE w/o (need protein and carb - if u want fruit or higher GI carb this is the meal for it)

meal 3 = PWO (whether or not it constitutes a meal by definition or not - any time u ingest food it is a meal IMO)

meal 4 = PPWO

my suggestion is for u to have all ur carbs in meals: 1, pre w/o, PWO (keeping carbs around ur workout is better IMO) it doesnt matter to me what the carbs are (rice, potatoes, oats, whatever..)

for meal 4 if u noticed i suggested add green veg for additional substance, i also suggested this for meal 5..

id also like to note there is no need for 8 meals, u could combine some of the meals to have bigger portions and reduce the number of meals which will make them more substantial such as combining the amount of protein in meal 6 and 7 on ur high carb day. keep in mind the specific protein types do NOT matter as much as the amount of protein eaten. for example instead of having rump mince (whatever that is ) and hake fillets (whatever that is ) u could also just have 88g protein worth of beef, chikn, egg whites, etc.. understand??

this make it clearer??

[Ghosty]

ok nice, will restructure again and hopefully third time lucky

quick q
1. seeing as im having a whey shake after training and your suggesting carbs there, can i go with oats and should still drink it immediately after training or wait half an hour?

reason for 8 meals is that i have a very long day and this way i dont get peckish or the need to nibble because im eating every 2 and half hours. works for me

lol and btw rump mince is super lean beef mince and hake fillet is a white fish fillet, think you guys know it as cod but dont qoute me on that

[Ghosty]

Also, Do I count the protein from oats, green veggies and bread?

[--->>405<<---]

ok nice, will restructure again and hopefully third time lucky

quick q
1. seeing as im having a whey shake after training and your suggesting carbs there, can i go with oats and should still drink it immediately after training or wait half an hour? any carb source (preferably complex IMO) is fine. and yes u can wait 30minutes.. or an hour..

reason for 8 meals is that i have a very long day and this way i dont get peckish or the need to nibble because im eating every 2 and half hours. works for me

lol and btw rump mince is super lean beef mince and hake fillet is a white fish fillet, think you guys know it as cod but dont qoute me on that

im assuming mince is like ground for us? the word mince i dont quite get.. LOL.. cod i do understand!

Also, Do I count the protein from oats, green veggies and bread?

i count all my protein.. some of them are incomplete and some of them become complete when combined with other stuff but just count it all its way easier and wont make much difference IMO..

[Ghosty]

lol yeah, minced meat = ground beef....

new layout:

High carb days

Meal 1
6 egg whites and 4 slices low gi ww bread - 48p, 64c, 6f

Meal 2 (pre workout)
100g oats and 30g whey iso - 41p, 52c, 8f

Meal 3
50g whey and 100g oats - 53p, 56c, 9f

Meal 4
200g chicken breast fillet and 100g green veggies - 46p, 7c, 2f

Meal 5
150g chicken breast fillet and 100g green veggies - 35p, 7c, 2f

Meal 6
150g rump mince/ground beef and 100g green veggies - 37p, 7c, 8f

Meal 7
200g Hake fillet and 20g almonds - 36p, 2c, 12f

Meal 8
30g iso whey and 20g peanut butter - 33p, 2c, 12f

Low carb day:

meal 1
8 egg whites and 3 slices low gi bread - 52p, 48c, 5f

meal 2
200g chicken breast fillet and 50g basmati rice - 48p, 37c, 4f

meal 3
200g Chicken breast fillet and 100g green veggies - 46p, 7c, 2f

meal 4
200g rump mince and 100g green veggies - 48p, 7c, 6f

meal 5
200g hake fillet and 40g almonds - 40p, 8c, 22f

Meal 6
50g iso whey and 30g peanut butter - 54p, 3c, 18f

Holding thumbs

[--->>405<<---]

ding ding ding ding ding! we have a winner!

get rid of they whey before bed when u run out.

im assuming the 100g in PWO is oats..

good work..

[Ghosty]

"does little happy dance"

i have a sealed bag of casein which i'll use when the whey runs out
will run this diet begin of jan and run a log aswell...

405 to you my great man i say thank you and a merry christmas!!!

[--->>405<<---]

right back atcha there pal!

[Lunk1]

Ahhh...another satasfied customer that can avoid AAS till they are needed~

Great job both of you!!!!

[Ghosty]

hey there

I got a quick question or two:

1. The current diet plan is perfect for me when i train mornings but if i had to train late afternoons would having my pre-wotkout meal be enough for energy?

2. will calculating calorie intake for woman be the same as for men? For example the whole lbm x15?

[--->>405<<---]

hey there

I got a quick question or two:

1. The current diet plan is perfect for me when i train mornings but if i had to train late afternoons would having my pre-wotkout meal be enough for energy?

2. will calculating calorie intake for woman be the same as for men? For example the whole lbm x15?

1. think about it like this: make sure u have ur carbs pre workout and PWO only whenever that may be. u can also have carbs in meal 1.. so if u lift between meals 5 & 6 then have carbs in meal 5 and carbs in meal 6, if u lift between meal 7 & 8 then have meal 7 pre workout carbs and meal 8 pwo carbs.. get it?

2. i would use the same formula to estimate and be prepared to modify based on results..