Calculating TDEE but on cycle

[Notpretty]

I read a sticky on calc of my TDEE

I’m 50 years old, 6’ 208

Men: BMR = 66 + (13.7 x weight in kg) + (5 x height in cm) - (6.8 x age in years)

BMR x 1.4 (activity level for me) =
TDEE or Total daily energy expend.

For me it comes to 2707 calories

But, if you are on cycle does that number change or need to change?

If so, higher...yes?

[GearHeaded]

theres a lot more that goes into it then what you list. TDEE is really a very rough starting point is all. Yes if your on cycle that will change your calorie demands and energy expenditure, but it depends on what compounds your running and at what dosages. 600mg a week of Tren may require 500 additional calories, where 250mg of Test may not require but 100 extra calories. also , the amount of Protein thats in your diet is very important to factor in. as protein is thermogenic and the body requires 30 cals of energy to metabolize every 100 cals of protein.

example. say your maintenance was 2000 cals per day. but lets say you ate all those cals in protein. well just from eating that much protein the body is going to burn 600cals just to metabolize the protein. now your already in a calorie deficit. now lets say you take Tren and that stimulates your CNS and ramps up muscle building and requires another 300 cals. your now at a 900 cal deficit. you would actually need to eat 2900 cals just to hit your maintenance.


this is where guys run a tren cycle, up there protein and lower carbs and fats, and then they end up losing weight instead of gaining weight when they thought the tren was going to blow them up

[Notpretty]

Thanks!

Yeah, I’m learning. I’m trying to clean up my diet and have a base to work from for my next cycle. I’m currently off but the question is in context on my next cycle.

Plan: 600 mg test E hcg and ai with cialis daily, NAC, fish oil, enduricin, whey protein post workout. After 4th week drop test e to 400mg add Tren E 400 mg. All per week in two pins per week. 12 weeks

Diet plan: 5-6 meals a day,

But that’s where it gets tough. I’m trying to calculate the food in take but I need a base. I think my numbers are close based on seeing how my body reacts. I’ll increase TDEE during Tren E by say 300-400? Less for first 4 weeks...say 100-200?

Diet will focus on lean meats/protein low fats except for omegas, but carbs are a question mark. I’ve seen you state higher carbs on cycle and when I’ve increased them it works in past cycles. So what percent protein to carbs would you suggest? I’ve heard equal. Assume 15 percent fat.

[GearHeaded]

Thanks!

Yeah, I’m learning. I’m trying to clean up my diet and have a base to work from for my next cycle. I’m currently off but the question is in context on my next cycle.

Plan: 600 mg test E hcg and ai with cialis daily, NAC, fish oil, enduricin, whey protein post workout. After 4th week drop test e to 400mg add Tren E 400 mg. All per week in two pins per week. 12 weeks

Diet plan: 5-6 meals a day,

But that’s where it gets tough. I’m trying to calculate the food in take but I need a base. I think my numbers are close based on seeing how my body reacts. I’ll increase TDEE during Tren E by say 300-400? Less for first 4 weeks...say 100-200?

Diet will focus on lean meats/protein low fats except for omegas, but carbs are a question mark. I’ve seen you state higher carbs on cycle and when I’ve increased them it works in past cycles. So what percent protein to carbs would you suggest? I’ve heard equal. Assume 15 percent fat.

I never focus on actual percentages . I fix my protein intake and thats stays the same for the most part. and thats based on a couple factors, one of which is wither the client is cutting or massing, on cycle or off cycle.
lets say a 200 pound guy. I'll fix protein at say 250g per day (roughly 40g per meal). Then fats I may set at a fixed .5g per pound of body weight. Carbs however fluctuate and fill in the rest of the diet. I generally do carb cycling, so some days carbs are 400g per day, other days 250g other days only 50, and perhaps 1 day a week with cheat meal a 500g re-feed day. this is totally dependent on the client and many factors and drugs being taken and insulin sensitivity factors, wither or not taking exogenous insulin etc.

so you can see with something like that percentages don't really matter. of course you could look at the diet and each individual day and see what the percentages are, but I never build a diet that way personally

[marcus300]

Nothing is set in stone, I find daily or weekly adjustment are needed depending how you are reacting to training and the current diet, sticking to some calculations are muscle suicide imho but they are a good base to start from. One thing is for sure don't hold back on food, that's one thing I can truly say you wont become a freak eating like a women, eat like a beast and train like one and the results will shine but daily or weekly adjustment are needed to keep building to achieve your goals

[GearHeaded]

Nothing is set in stone

absolutely true. but you have to have a starting point. especially with clients. you have to give them some fixed numbers to work off to start things out and see how their body reacts. if you change things too fast you'll never know whats working. after a few weeks, I may up fats and lower carbs for example. so yes nothing is set in stone, its all subject to change and adjustment over time..

AND of course with myself, I can make those changes way way quicker and on the fly, like you suggest, but with clients it takes lots of photos, feedback, and small adjustments over time.
thats just my personal experience

[Notpretty]

Thanks for the feedback.

Yeah, I need abase to work from and that’s really what I’m asking...in the context of the cycle and data I discussed above. I hope I can learn some of the tweaks and carb cycling and workout day versus non workout day focus. I have a general sense of that.

The one basic thing I’ve learned from my last cycle and how my body reacts is that I need to eat more calories period. At the end of the cycle I increased them by a third (yes a third) and the gains went through the roof. I added whey protein post workout after a breakfast high in protein...egg whites...at the same time. I did gain some body fat but not much. So I think I know about what my base is given a similar cycle and my training level. But after this next cycle which is bulking, I want to cut. And as you said that’s another ball game. I need to learn how to cut but not reduce the calories too much. I also need to know how aerobic changes affect the cutting process and diet. Yes, I’m learning. I’ve read many of the stickies and several others but each often presents me more confusion and more questions.

[GearHeaded]

yeah a lot of guys don't realize how many calories they actually have to consume to build muscle. most don't eat enough (this is if they are eating clean). Its hard to consume 5 meals of clean food at 1000 cals per meal. getting those macros tweaked though is pretty important. for example, IF your consuming more protein then you need, then that becomes an expensive and wasteful processes, as your body simply takes those proteins and turns them into sugars in your body via gluconeogenisis, AND it burns a ton of energy to metabolize those extra proteins (protein is also $ finically way more expensive then carbs). When all you would of need to of done is consumed more Carbs and less protein , and you'd of been in a way better spot.

Timing is also important, imo. you noticed more gains when you started adding in more workout timed nutrition. theres a reason for that.

if you put a rough diet together, throw it up in the diet section. I'll take a look at it and help you out best I can

[Notpretty]

Thanks again. It’s a process of learning how my body reacts and knowledge. Takes time. I do have a degree in physical education so I’m not totally stupid but I am 50 years old so it’s dated knowledge.

Yes, I get the over use of protein being a waste of money and calorie burn they require to process. I get some of the importance of timing of diet. I’m still struggling to eat as often as needed. 5-6 meals a day takes planning and focus. My body doesn’t want to eat that often and I find myself forcing the food down. I’m hoping I’ll adapt in time. I don’t have a diet to put up right now as I’m Off cycle. I really need one set up for me. I will say my diet is pretty clean. I occasionally cheat but not much.

I know to maintain gains while Off you do need to up protein but not much beyond that...eat less I assume but how much I don’t know. Lots of factors I assume determine that.

I guess if you have or know of a thread that discussed cutting in general I’d be interested in that.

[GearHeaded]

I guess if you have or know of a thread that discussed cutting in general I’d be interested in that.

are you going to cut and diet in a calorie deficit while OFF cycle ? personally I don't recommend that for guys that are enhanced. every body builder since Arnold, Frank Zane, to todays guys would always run more drugs and up regulate things when they were preparing for a show and on a diet to get shredded.
this is the only way to hold onto massive amounts of muscle and get to very low BF % . thats why a natural pro body builder weighs 160 pounds on stage and a enhanced pro bodybuilder weighs 260 pounds on stage.

just my 2 cents on that

As for cutting diets. they are pretty simple as compared to recomps . Up your protein to help thermogenesis and preserving muscle tissue, lower your fats way down (unless we are utilizing fats for fuel or keto), and restrict your carbs to the point that they are only there to fuel workouts and replenish some glycogen. then make sure those macros put you in an overall calorie deficit. cuts are times when consuming more veggies and micro nutrients are a good idea, help keep you full, but being in a calorie deficit you want to make sure you get adequate micro nutrients still and veggies are very low calorie to be able to do this

[Notpretty]

Right now I’m off cycle trying to maintain my recent on cycle gains. I’m trying to eat just what I need to avoid loss. Then I’ll cycle for 12 weeks as described at the start of this thread. Hoping to gain 15-20 lbs. If I can get lose body fat during the 12 weeks and gain 15 lbs of muscle that would’ve ideal. I’ve read that’s generally not possible or very hard to achieve.

So net, I’d like to add 15 lbs of muscle and drop BF by 10% from my current body...however that is possible over whatever period of time it requires

[Notpretty]

Right now I’m off cycle trying to maintain my recent on cycle gains. I’m trying to eat just what I need to avoid loss. Then I’ll cycle for 12 weeks as described at the start of this thread. Hoping to gain 15-20 lbs. If I can get lose body fat during the 12 weeks and gain 15 lbs of muscle that would’ve ideal. I’ve read that’s generally not possible or very hard to achieve.

So net, I’d like to add 15 lbs of muscle and drop BF by 10% from my current body...however that is possible over whatever period of time it requires