I need some help controling E levels

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08-21-2010, 05:31 PM
bbrock

I need some help controling E levels

Ok I had my latest blood work done through a clinic were i can get free health care. My T came back at 755 but my estrogen came back at 230. I take 400mg every two weeks of Tes cypianate. The Doc wanted me to cut my T down to 200 mg every two weeks. I told her that i wouldn't do it. I flat out asked her if she had any experience with TRT and she really wouldn't answer. I asked her to perscribe Armidex and she wouldn't do it. What she did do is refer me to an endocrinologist. So its going to take quiet awhile to get to this doctor. In the mean time i just got som liquidex in for my pet rat. Just so happens that my rat has the same estrogen levels as me. I think i am going to give it .5ml every other day to lower its estrogen. So that would be .5mg of liquidex. I have never seen a rat with that high of estrogen before. Do you guys think this is to aggressive. That rat is experiencing almost every symptom for high estrogen in male rats. I am thinking after a few weeks to a month i will have to lower his dose.
08-21-2010, 07:27 PM
pittbulldad

I would change to 200mg per week that would get you a little better balanced..
08-21-2010, 08:27 PM
bbrock

Quote:

Originally Posted by pittbulldad

I would change to 200mg per week that would get you a little better balanced..

Pitt I am definitely wanting to do that but my doc that is perscribing my TRT has me come in every other week for the injection. I am afraid that if i don't come in he will not perscribe it to me. A new Doc that i went to said she would let me give my own injections but she wanted me to cut my dose from 400mg every to weeks to 200mg every two weeks. I no i may cut the dose down eventually but not until i get my estrogen under control. She didn't know what she was talking about.
08-21-2010, 10:09 PM
Vettester

Taking such a large amount e2w will def lead to more issues like the one you and your rat are experiencing. Yes, I agree with the Liquidex protocol, but you need to run more lab work in 6 weeks or so to see your progress. Point out the fact to your doc that the half life is only 7 to 8 days, and that you're just trying avoid the peaks and valleys. You're not asking for anymore, just more frequently, so that shouldn't be a problem. If they're that anal you might consider moving on elsewhere.
08-21-2010, 11:38 PM
bowers32

as usual the vetteman is right on the mark.... taking high doses of anti-E will knock you on your ass and just all around make you hate life... trust me,... been there done that,...
08-22-2010, 01:33 AM
bbrock

Quote:

Originally Posted by vetteman08

Taking such a large amount e2w will def lead to more issues like the one you and your rat are experiencing. Yes, I agree with the Liquidex protocol, but you need to run more lab work in 6 weeks or so to see your progress. Point out the fact to your doc that the half life is only 7 to 8 days, and that you're just trying avoid the peaks and valleys. You're not asking for anymore, just more frequently, so that shouldn't be a problem. If they're that anal you might consider moving on elsewhere.

What would be a good dosage for liquidex. Seen some guys on here having problems getting their Estrogen low and i have yet to see anyone's Estrogen as elevated as mine. I was taking DHEA and i have since stopped. I am going to start pinning once a week instead of the large dose every other week. Would you recomend .25mg liquidex every other day or twice a week.
08-22-2010, 02:39 AM
lovbyts

Dont think that just because you lower you dose you wont feel the same. Also the Endo is a good idea. Change it so he/she gives you the prescription. Tell them you want to inject every week to keep your levels more level but you dont want to come in every week and you can do it yourself. They can monitor via blood work.

This makes it MUCH nicer and anything left over from month to month can be saved up for a nice little boost cycle ever once in a while. Just be mindful of when your next blood test will be.
08-22-2010, 07:50 AM
forrest_and_trees

Quote:

Originally Posted by vetteman08

Taking such a large amount e2w will def lead to more issues like the one you and your rat are experiencing. Yes, I agree with the Liquidex protocol, but you need to run more lab work in 6 weeks or so to see your progress. Point out the fact to your doc that the half life is only 7 to 8 days, and that you're just trying avoid the peaks and valleys. You're not asking for anymore, just more frequently, so that shouldn't be a problem. If they're that anal you might consider moving on elsewhere.

I agree, I would just tell your doctor that the 2 week regimen is not working for you because by the end of the second week, you are beginning to feel crappy again. Give her something to go on like you feel fatigued, achy, irritable etc. and that it's affecting your relationship and the ability for you to do your job. You'll just have to agree to go in once a week and take 200mg a week.

I too had to convince my doc about Arimidex. I provided him with several reports I'd found and printed out. If you're interested, PM me and I'll shoot you the files, I have them in PDF format with the important points highlighted. He eventually went to his pharmaceutical rep who confirmed what I told him. The problem is, they use a drug reference guide for this kind of situation, and the current standard guide does not list Adex as a drug intended for males and the dosing is too high. You'll have to half and even quarter the pills you get by physically cutting them. Once they understand that, and are comfortable you understand, they should comply.

Plus, I know it's kind of playing games but, the doc holds all the cards, you need to treat them like your boss, i.e. let them think the ideas are theirs instead of challenging their knowledge; if you know what I'm talking about.

Best of luck!
08-22-2010, 10:11 AM
Vettester

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbrock

What would be a good dosage for liquidex. Seen some guys on here having problems getting their Estrogen low and i have yet to see anyone's Estrogen as elevated as mine. I was taking DHEA and i have since stopped. I am going to start pinning once a week instead of the large dose every other week. Would you recomend .25mg liquidex every other day or twice a week.

I like the 0.5mg eod program. This is just MHO, but I wouldn't go over 2.0mg during any given week. Your E2 will steadily come down over the next month and two months, which is how you should do it. A good testimony on this forum is Forrest & Trees. His protocol is a good example of how to do it correctly.

Yeah, keep the DHEA in the cabinet for the time being. Truthfully, you might be able to scale the "T" back a little and see the same results, maybe even better. I don't know when they ran labs, but if it was on day 12 or day 14 of your pinning sequence, there might be a lot of variance with your score. At 400mg you're going to have a BIG spike in the first handful of days, then it will decline steadily. Just for grins, I wonder what 150mg/wk would do for you? If you could hold a true 700 to 750 score because your dosages were more consistent, then that's less "T" being converted to "E", thus your program will get balanced and on track faster. Might be worth giving some consideration ... Nothing saying that you can't bump it up a little in the very near future if you're not satisfied with your results. Food for thought.
08-22-2010, 10:25 AM
Lifeguard102

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbrock

Ok I had my latest blood work done through a clinic were i can get free health care. My T came back at 755 but my estrogen came back at 230. I take 400mg every two weeks of Tes cypianate. The Doc wanted me to cut my T down to 200 mg every two weeks. I told her that i wouldn't do it. I flat out asked her if she had any experience with TRT and she really wouldn't answer. I asked her to perscribe Armidex and she wouldn't do it. What she did do is refer me to an endocrinologist. So its going to take quiet awhile to get to this doctor. In the mean time i just got som liquidex in for my pet rat. Just so happens that my rat has the same estrogen levels as me. I think i am going to give it .5ml every other day to lower its estrogen. So that would be .5mg of liquidex. I have never seen a rat with that high of estrogen before. Do you guys think this is to aggressive. That rat is experiencing almost every symptom for high estrogen in male rats. I am thinking after a few weeks to a month i will have to lower his dose.

It drives me nuts when doctors don't know didly about TRT.
The only way they learn is from the Pharma reps.
Without them they don't know. So I guess there aren't any who push test.

Go see an anti-aging doc. Google if you can.
Ask the office if they take your insurance.
Anti-aging docs are usually primary care , same as the ignoramous you spoke to , and they know the deal.
They often will go up to 400mg p/ wk.

Give it a shot.
08-22-2010, 01:16 PM
Vettester

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifeguard102

They often will go up to 400mg p/ wk.

Give it a shot.

What's the point of doing that much for a continuous TRT program?
08-22-2010, 05:59 PM
bbrock

Quote:

Originally Posted by vetteman08

I like the 0.5mg eod program. This is just MHO, but I wouldn't go over 2.0mg during any given week. Your E2 will steadily come down over the next month and two months, which is how you should do it. A good testimony on this forum is Forrest & Trees. His protocol is a good example of how to do it correctly.

I was using trees protocol when i was thinking of how much liquidex to take.

Yeah, keep the DHEA in the cabinet for the time being. Truthfully, you might be able to scale the "T" back a little and see the same results, maybe even better. I don't know when they ran labs, but if it was on day 12 or day 14 of your pinning sequence, there might be a lot of variance with your score. At 400mg you're going to have a BIG spike in the first handful of days, then it will decline steadily. Just for grins, I wonder what 150mg/wk would do for you? If you could hold a true 700 to 750 score because your dosages were more consistent, then that's less "T" being converted to "E", thus your program will get balanced and on track faster. Might be worth giving some consideration ... Nothing saying that you can't bump it up a little in the very near future if you're not satisfied with your results. Food for thought.

They ran labs on me about 3 to four days after the injection so it should have been in the middle of the spike. I am going to start injecting once a week. It only makes sense. I am on my third dose of liquidex and i feel great i have more energy than i have had in months and im in a good mood. My blood sugar is coming in great and my prostate is feeling better. Yeah my prostate was swelling because of high E. I had every symptom in the book.