First injection ater 6 months of gel

[Mr Bill]

Recievced my first injection after 6 months of gel, first it was Adrogel with no luck and then 3 weeks of Testim that brought my total test down to 65.
Phyician assistant gave me 200mg of test E and said to get labs in 2 weeks and come back for my next shot in 4 weeks???? I asked about weekly shots and was told that they would raise the amount of test if I needed but not the frequency of the shots. I was also told that all the patitients do well on this schedual. So from what I understand from reading about the half life of test E I shoud expect to feel like shit again in 14 to 20 days with this schedual. I have an appointment with a clinic on Tuesday that said they will set me up with weekly shots at home. My cost will be going from $10 dollars co pay a month to $150 out of pocket if the insurance doesn't want to recognize the clincs phamacy.

[frawnz]

200mg/month of test E is a waste of your time. Go to a different doctor/endo/urologist who knows what they're doing.

[steroid.com 1]

You'll do much better with the Clinic; this MD doesn't know what he's doing. Check into hCG and an AI as well with your new protocol.

[APIs]

I just cannot believe this shit goes on! 200 mgs every 4 weeks? WTF?

[steroid.com 1]

I just cannot believe this shit goes on! 200 mgs every 4 weeks? WTF?

I know, and probably no hCG or testing for E2.

When men have real hormonal problems and seek the proper medical treatments only to find them in an even worse condition...malpractice if you ask me.

[zaggahamma]

sign up with the clinic for your own well being for now and while your benefiting from getting conservative care you can be looking for a better doctor than the quack you have now...you can even segue into a regular doctor when they see youre already being prescribed hormones...its no guarantee but its worth a shot to eventually have your meds and labs all under insurance....very few ppl get their insurance to pay for anti aging clinic care

[blacksmoke]

sign up with the clinic for your own well being for now and while your benefiting from getting conservative care you can be looking for a better doctor than the quack you have now...you can even segue into a regular doctor when they see youre already being prescribed hormones...its no guarantee but its worth a shot to eventually have your meds and labs all under insurance....very few ppl get their insurance to pay for anti aging clinic care

I like this idea! To bad you didn't write this a couple months ago.

[Mr Bill]

I know, and probably no hCG or testing for E2.

When men have real hormonal problems and seek the proper medical treatments only to find them in an even worse condition...malpractice if you ask me.

Nope, no hcg and he said that E2 is not an issue.

[zaggahamma]

I like this idea! To bad you didn't write this a couple months ago.

i actually probably did in another post...

all good...you can only go forward from here anyway..

best of luck

[Mr Bill]

sign up with the clinic for your own well being for now and while your benefiting from getting conservative care you can be looking for a better doctor than the quack you have now...you can even segue into a regular doctor when they see youre already being prescribed hormones...its no guarantee but its worth a shot to eventually have your meds and labs all under insurance....very few ppl get their insurance to pay for anti aging clinic care

Thats what I plan to do. This is quack number two!!! I will be at the clinic on Tuesday for my physical but they said that I should not have a problem because I have all my labs for the past year. I was thinking that after I was with the clinic for awhile and doing well I would talk to my family doctor about prescribing the meds. I keep him up to date with what has been going on with me and I told him that I was going to a clinic if the urologist didn't want to treat me correctly. He told me he was not up to date with TRT.

[zaggahamma]

Thats what I plan to do. This is quack number two!!! I will be at the clinic on Tuesday for my physical but they said that I should not have a problem because I have all my labs for the past year. I was thinking that after I was with the clinic for awhile and doing well I would talk to my family doctor about prescribing the meds. I keep him up to date with what has been going on with me and I told him that I was going to a clinic if the urologist didn't want to treat me correctly. He told me he was not up to date with TRT.

good plan bro....wish you would update this post with how it all goes with the clinic and how you respond, etc. and eventually if your regular docs get on board

[Mr Bill]

I just cannot believe this shit goes on! 200 mgs every 4 weeks? WTF?

I know it sucks. I was pissed when I went in for the visit but took the shot just to get started. With my T level down in the 60's I was feeling like I had the flu without the fever.

[Mr Bill]

good plan bro....wish you would update this post with how it all goes with the clinic and how you respond, etc. and eventually if your regular docs get on board

I will be around to update. It has been a long 6 months since I started TRT.

[bass]

I just cannot believe this shit goes on! 200 mgs every 4 weeks? WTF?

my thoughts exactly!

OP, JP gave you a good advice! find a clinic, i like mine!

[Mr Bill]

3 days since my shot and I feel a hell of alot better!

[THE-DET-OAK]

dude i feel so sorry for you- you feel great now because your levels get as high as they are gonna be from your shot within 48 hours, problem is you are going to feel worse than you did before if he doesnt give you another one within 7-10 days. I see this shit all the time, these quacks have no idea what they are doing to people.


just so you know E2 level is more important IMO than T level.

[Mr Bill]

dude i feel so sorry for you- you feel great now because your levels get as high as they are gonna be from your shot within 48 hours, problem is you are going to feel worse than you did before if he doesnt give you another one within 7-10 days. I see this shit all the time, these quacks have no idea what they are doing to people.


just so you know E2 level is more important IMO than T level.

That is why I am headed to a clinic in the AM t5o get on weekly shots

[steroid.com 1]

That is why I am headed to a clinic in the AM t5o get on weekly shots

Good news MB!

Remember to inquire about hCG. You need hCG for many reasons not discounting if you don't want testicular atrophy and other nasty things.

Also, ask about an Aromatase Inhibitor and get a full blood panel done (the clinic will probably insist unless you have recent labs). E2 follows T in most men and high E2 can put you right back into the shits and worse if it gets out of control. (Just see what's happened to some men on this board with mismanaged E2 on a TRT program.)

I doubt that your clinic will miss these things as they are the ones, for the most part, who understand correct protocols and know what to measure and manage in men on TRT.

[Mr Bill]

Good news MB!

Remember to inquire about hCG. You need hCG for many reasons not discounting if you don't want testicular atrophy and other nasty things.
Also, ask about an Aromatase Inhibitor and get a full blood panel done (the clinic will probably insist unless you have recent labs). E2 follows T in most men and high E2 can put you right back into the shits and worse if it gets out of control. (Just see what's happened to some men on this board with mismanaged E2 on a TRT program.)
I doubt that your clinic will miss these things as they are the ones, for the most part, who understand correct protocols and know what to measure and manage in men on TRT.

The clinic recommends HCG with any TRT so that is covered. I just had a full panel 3 weeks ago and I got copies of all my blood work since I started. They said AI was not a problem if it is needed. I have been doing bunch of reading and learning on here and a couple of other sites and I am glad these sites exist.

[steroid.com 1]

The clinic recommends HCG with any TRT so that is covered. I just had a full panel 3 weeks ago and I got copies of all my blood work since I started. They said AI was not a problem if it is needed. I have been doing bunch of reading and learning on here and a couple of other sites and I am glad these sites exist.

Did you have your E2 tested on your last BW? If I recall correctly it was no because your MD said E2 was not a problem with exogenous test (LMAO). If not, don't worry, they will probably put you on a very low dose and check in a few months anyway.

Glade to see you heading in the right direction. In a few months you won't believe the changes you're going to see in yourself!

[Mr Bill]

Did you have your E2 tested on your last BW? If I recall correctly it was no because your MD said E2 was not a problem with exogenous test (LMAO). If not, don't worry, they will probably put you on a very low dose and check in a few months anyway.

Glade to see you heading in the right direction. In a few months you won't believe the changes you're going to see in yourself!

When I was 10 mg of Androgel I had nipple soreness and an E2 of 39 so the endo said to come off the gel for a couple of weeks and we will retest?? I said screw that and my GP sent me to the urologist who stoped the Androgel and put me on 5 mg of Testim. That took away the nip soreness but brought my total T down to 65 so I probaly will need an AI

[GotNoBlueMilk]

Take it from a guy who gets sore nipples at 28 E2, keep an AI handy! And the first think you need to do is keep a constant T protocol and figure out exactly how to manage your E2 levels. The-Det-Oak makes a valid point, although maybe not technically 100% true. E2 levels are extremely important. Don't over look them.

[Mr Bill]

The clinic put me on a weekly dose 100mg of test cyp and b-12. I have to get labs in 6 weeks and then we will talk about HCG and an AI if needed.

[steroid.com 1]

The clinic put me on a weekly dose 100mg of test cyp and b-12. I have to get labs in 6 weeks and then we will talk about HCG and an AI if needed.

Why wait for the hCG? With 100 mg/wk you will go into HPTA shutdown. You'll see when your balls start hurting and get smaller. I can see waiting for the AI with test in 6 weeks...but no hCG...hmmmmm

[Vettester]

Why wait for the hCG? With 100 mg/wk you will go into HPTA shutdown. You'll see when your balls start hurting and get smaller. I can see waiting for the AI with test in 6 weeks...but no hCG...hmmmmm

Definitely agree. Not sure why they just wouldn't get the entire protocol in place, then run labs in 6 weeks.

[steroid.com 1]

Definitely agree. Not sure why they just wouldn't get the entire protocol in place, then run labs in 6 weeks.

Yup, thought the exact same thing...not sure what type of Clinic this is.

[zaggahamma]

about hcg...it is necessary to determine if the patient is secondary or primary hypoganadic before knowing if hcg will help correct?

[THE-DET-OAK]

yes.

[Firestorm#1]

I am droping from 1200mg a week to 500mg. I did not feel different on 1200mg vs 600mg per week. I want to add in some tren if I can find some.

[Firestorm#1]

When I went to a clinic all I could get was the gel. I went to a MD and he gave me what I wanted. Test-e. My wife gives me the shots.

[GotNoBlueMilk]

My wife gives me the shots.

Don't let jpkman read that. He insists on doing all the sticking in his house.

[JohnnyVegas]

Why wait for the hCG? With 100 mg/wk you will go into HPTA shutdown. You'll see when your balls start hurting and get smaller. I can see waiting for the AI with test in 6 weeks...but no hCG...hmmmmm

My doc waited a little while for hCG so he could get a feel for what the Test did on its own. Then added the hCG. That way you know what the different compound's effects are. Sounded good to me. *shrugs*

[zaggahamma]

Don't let jpkman read that. He insists on doing all the sticking in his house.

too late...read it...used to reading that though...but same rule round these parts still

[Mr Bill]

My doc waited a little while for hCG so he could get a feel for what the Test did on its own. Then added the hCG. That way you know what the different compound's effects are. Sounded good to me. *shrugs*

Thats what I was told. One compound at a time, but if I started to have complications or sides to let them know and we will get labs earlier.

[steroid.com 1]

I see it in black and white. 100 mg of Test weekly WILL put a man in HPTA shut down...there's no questioning that. So why wait to see that a man will being to show early signs of testicular atrophy (and the sides that go with it) a month or so after they start only to eventually put them on a hCG protocol?

[zaggahamma]

I see it in black and white. 100 mg of Test weekly WILL put a man in HPTA shut down...there's no questioning that. So why wait to see that a man will being to show early signs of testicular atrophy (and the sides that go with it) a month or so after they start only to eventually put them on a hCG protocol?

i know you are a proponent for hcg and i agree with you...i would be running it if i didnt want to stay infertile...i think the problem is what these doctors are given as an easy prescription to write which is usually the gels hince the commercials (low T) but and hcg is becoming a taboo name by the dieters....what is MY worse risk at not having hcg in my protocol..

[THE-DET-OAK]

what is MY worse risk at not having hcg in my protocol..

there are effects of HCG at the pituitary that are still not widely understood, in regards to HCG. alot of guys say they do not have that happy go lucky feeling without it. This MIGHT be why.

here is a quote from Crisler.

"But theres another metabolic reason to employ this protocol. The P450 Side Chain Cleavage enzyme, which converts CHOL into pregnenolone at the initiation of all three metabolic pathways CHOL serves as precursor (the sex hormones, glucocorticoids and mineralcorticoids), is actively stimulated, or depressed, by LH concentrations. It is intuitively consistent that during conditions of lowered testosterone levels, commensurate increases in LH production would serve to stimulate this conversion from CHOL into these pathways, thereby feeding more raw material for increased hormone production. And vice versa. Thus the addition of HCG (which also stimulates the P450scc enzyme) helps restore a more natural balance of the hormones within this pathway in patients who are entirely, or even partially, HPTA-suppressed."

[zaggahamma]

there are effects of HCG at the pituitary that are still not widely understood, in regards to HCG. alot of guys say they do not have that happy go lucky feeling without it. This MIGHT be why.

here is a quote from Crisler.

"But theres another metabolic reason to employ this protocol. The P450 Side Chain Cleavage enzyme, which converts CHOL into pregnenolone at the initiation of all three metabolic pathways CHOL serves as precursor (the sex hormones, glucocorticoids and mineralcorticoids), is actively stimulated, or depressed, by LH concentrations. It is intuitively consistent that during conditions of lowered testosterone levels, commensurate increases in LH production would serve to stimulate this conversion from CHOL into these pathways, thereby feeding more raw material for increased hormone production. And vice versa. Thus the addition of HCG (which also stimulates the P450scc enzyme) helps restore a more natural balance of the hormones within this pathway in patients who are entirely, or even partially, HPTA-suppressed."

yes thanks i've read that before...like i said, i would be wanting or on hcg if i didnt like the idea of being infertile...i'm wondering if i change my mind if its not too late in the game for hcg benefits and or possible being fertile again (being on trt for over 5 years)

[THE-DET-OAK]

its never too late, and honestly im guilty of not using HCG sometimes for the same reason,

[Mr Bill]

First at home shot went well last night