estrogen

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-27-2011, 07:11 PM

so i got my blood work back today and my estrodial was 88, every other test came back perfectly normal. and i havent gotten the results on my total testosterone yet but my estrodial was way over were it should be. what could be cuasing this?

**SlimmerMe** · 04-27-2011, 07:51 PM

Do you have any more blood work to post? this might help figure this out.....

**KyleJumpjets** · 04-27-2011, 07:58 PM

What are the ranges for ur estradiol?

**Bullseye Forever** · 04-27-2011, 09:20 PM

you are lucky my friend,a males range should be around 20-25pg/ml.......i had mine checked 2 weeks ago,and mine was 125.6pg/ml!!!

**Vettester** · 04-28-2011, 12:13 AM

Originally Posted by bigbossofdariver

so i got my blood work back today and my estrodial was 88, every other test came back perfectly normal. and i havent gotten the results on my total testosterone yet but my estrodial was way over were it should be. what could be cuasing this?

Various possibilities ranging from testosterone conversion to E2 and it's never been dealt with, or obesity. Not sure on your stats or if you've been on HRT long ... I'd be curious. Good news is that a AI will get that in order for you in short time. On your labs, are they running SHBG and free "T"? Would be curious to know that too.

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-28-2011, 12:22 AM

just total test, and thats the thing im not running anything or never have run anything my estrogen levels are just that high.

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-28-2011, 12:25 AM

Originally Posted by SlimmerMe

Do you have any more blood work to post? this might help figure this out.....

will post tomorrow, everything was basically exactly normal. and im 19 btw and have never ran anything.

**Vettester** · 04-28-2011, 12:38 AM

Are you packing the BF?

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-28-2011, 12:50 AM

Originally Posted by vetteman08

Are you packing the BF?

yes im pretty heavy, around 28 percent body fat. but i had no idea my estrogen would be effected this much.

**SlimmerMe** · 04-28-2011, 09:10 AM

OP: are you cycling or have you been on a cycle or any steroids for that matter?

since you are 19?

curious and might help to figure out how to proceed further.....

**Vettester** · 04-28-2011, 09:44 AM

Yes, estrogen unfortunately becomes a factor with high BF. I'll look for your awaited lab results, but regardless, getting that BF in check is going to have to be a huge priority for you if you want to get the other variables balanced out.

**bass** · 04-28-2011, 01:46 PM

why is this posted here, this is HRT section, you should post it in the cycle section! but i am guessing you posted here so you don't get chewed up by too many members! two no-nos....

1. too young to cycle!
2. too fat to cycle!

do a PCT ASAP, lose BF down to 18% or so, train hard naturally, then consider cycling! good luck!

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-28-2011, 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by bass

why is this posted here, this is HRT section, you should post it in the cycle section! but i am guessing you posted here so you don't get chewed up by too many members! two no-nos....

1. too young to cycle!
2. too fat to cycle!

do a PCT ASAP, lose BF down to 18% or so, train hard naturally, then consider cycling! good luck!

did you read my post? im not on anything.

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-28-2011, 02:44 PM

Originally Posted by SlimmerMe

OP: are you cycling or have you been on a cycle or any steroids for that matter?

since you are 19?

curious and might help to figure out how to proceed further.....

nope no cycles, not now nor in the past. 100 percent natural. unless you count creatine

**bass** · 04-28-2011, 02:50 PM

Originally Posted by bigbossofdariver

did you read my post? im not on anything.

sorry i don't know why i thought you were cycling! my mistake!

**Bullseye Forever** · 04-28-2011, 08:25 PM

Originally Posted by vetteman08

Yes, estrogen unfortunately becomes a factor with high BF. I'll look for your awaited lab results, but regardless, getting that BF in check is going to have to be a huge priority for you if you want to get the other variables balanced out.

good point

**steroid.com 1** · 04-28-2011, 09:06 PM

Originally Posted by bigbossofdariver

so i got my blood work back today and my estrodial was 88, every other test came back perfectly normal. and i havent gotten the results on my total testosterone yet but my estrodial was way over were it should be. what could be cuasing this?

There are a ton of reasons why you are converting to high E2. You're BW, if thorough, should tell the story. You're a young dude to have this high of an E2. Please post with ranges, tell all of your supplements, OTC drugs...thing like that. I'd also like to know what you MD has to say as to why you are so high? You need to get things straight my friend...you're way to young to be dealing with this...

**Vettester** · 04-28-2011, 09:49 PM

Agreed!!! ^^^^

**SlimmerMe** · 04-28-2011, 10:31 PM

Originally Posted by bigbossofdariver

nope no cycles, not now nor in the past. 100 percent natural. unless you count creatine

You have got to be straight up here. I knew all of this rang a bell. Didn't you ask earlier right here in this forum how to beat the system by trying to find a doc to prescribe TRT? Plus also a couple years ago you took some stuff?

The only way to get help here is to be up front. Please.

**SlimmerMe** · 04-28-2011, 10:45 PM

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**Vettester** · 04-29-2011, 01:09 AM

Last time I wasn't straight up with Slimmer, she wore that exact avi costume and she kicked the shiat out of me. Must admit, it was worth every minute of it.

**SlimmerMe** · 04-29-2011, 10:55 AM

^^^ Yep.....that is what happens......

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-29-2011, 01:43 PM

Originally Posted by SlimmerMe

You have got to be straight up here. I knew all of this rang a bell. Didn't you ask earlier right here in this forum how to beat the system by trying to find a doc to prescribe TRT? Plus also a couple years ago you took some stuff?

The only way to get help here is to be up front. Please.

yeah i did ask that but never went through with it. and yes i did take a halodrol liquigels and novedex xt about 2 and half years ago. when i was 17, didnt think that would be the problem. im not trying to lie or deceive anyone i just didnt figure that had anything to do with my levels being so high.

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-29-2011, 01:46 PM

supplements are creatine, multi, fish/flax seed oil. thats it and im not on any drugs, besides maybe some ibprofen once a week. and the doc had literally nothing to say about it, but he did say once he gets my total test back he will probably refer me to an endo.

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-29-2011, 07:16 PM

also what would be a decent dosage to get my estrogen levels down? 18mg ed of aromasin ? or is that to high?

**forrest_and_trees** · 04-29-2011, 08:03 PM

:whoa: 18mg? I'm not familiar with aromsin, but i hope it's not like Arimidex or Anastrzole... if so, that much will knock you on your ass. Also, I know there's tons of info stating that creatine is safe and plenty of people will tell you so, but I started taking it in my mid twenties, and [it could be a complete coincidence, but...] it was about that time that my Low T issues became more pronounced. Not saying it's the cause, but it's better to be safe than sorry... Especially at your age. You're call on that one.

As for why, do you take DHEA or consume a lot of soy products or proteins? Are you currently working out or are you more sedentary? What are the symptoms besides just the numbers? Any puffy or sensitive nipples? Any lumps behind your nipples? Do you seem to retain water, i.e. drink a lot of liquid and hardly ever piss? Are you moody, emotional or depressed? Do you have minimal masculine features... yes I realize you're only 19 and everybody develops at different rates, but high E can lessen masculine development. Do yo have any physical features you'd consider more feminine that masculine? Thin skin, big hips and ass? Lower forehead and lots of hair on your head but minimal body hair? More of a puffy appearance all over. Do you have more pronounced knuckles or when you put your fingers out straight, are they more like dimples? Do you have visible veins on your arms and hands or are they more soft an puffy?

As for getting it down, move on to another doc if this one will not help. At you're age, I'm not sure if the AIs like Arimidex and Anastrozle are a good idea or not. I'd look into that more closely before you begin and if you do get on them, .25mg EOD for a while until you get tested, if you're numbers aren't coming down, then you can bump it up to .50 Eod... but I'd go real easy on that stuff if you're not on TRT. You should also read up on high E in males.

Best of luck and let us know what happens.

**SlimmerMe** · 04-29-2011, 08:14 PM

^^^ great info Forrest~

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-29-2011, 08:27 PM

im pretty sure my high estrogen levels are due to high test levels along with high body fat, just a guess. becuase im very masculine but also have feminine features. as for your questions, i do eat alot of protein, around 400gs a day. i workout 3 times a week about hour to an hour and half each session. my nipples are not puffy but i do have bloated look to me, always have. my moods flactuate quite often, i go from happy to depressed almost daily. as for the minimal masculine features, would definately be a NO. im 6,3 325lbs with around 28 percent body fat. deep voice, large chin. my raw lifts are bench press:400, squat ATG:500, deadlift:550, with about 4 years of half assed liftting and 1 year of serious lifting. as for feminine features i do gain alot of weight in my hips/ass but nothing to dramatic. i do have alot of hair on my head but i also have alot of body hair so. and i do have veins showing in my arms but their pretty minimal. and my old doc refered me to an endo, he will be calling me in the next cpl days to set up an appointment. so it should be about a week or two before i get an appointment. will report back with what the endo tells me. also what would be the difference of taking an AI while on TRT vs off?

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-29-2011, 08:29 PM

thanks for all the help guys, will report back ASAP.

**forrest_and_trees** · 04-29-2011, 09:00 PM

OK.. that clears up a lot. Time to get your total and free T levels checked, that could be the case and if you're on the high side, it could very well be due to amortization. You may also want to look into "xenoestrogens" as they may be contributing. High protein can be one source. I could just be that you need a simple change in diet. I.E. Hormone free meats, dairy and poultry. Avoid soy and eat only organic vegis. If you eat a lot of processed foods, that can do it too. Also, avoid cooking in plastic containers, i.e. microwaving plastic containers, etc. If you want to get real anal about it, even avoid drinks in plastic bottles if you can, and believe it or not, even tap water can be an issue depending on where you live.

You'll likely find a number of the things you mentioned will clear up once you get your E under control. And yes, going to an Endo is a good idea, they're better trained to handle this sort of stuff. If the endo gives you push back, then move on to the next doc until you find one who will work with you. That part alone can often be the biggest challenge, as a lot of these guys get real conservative about this stuff. Especially at your age. Just stand your ground.

As for the comment about TRT, guys on TRT tend to be in the high end of normal T range. More T mean more aromatization, hence the high E. AI's like Arimidex and Anastrozle are pretty powerful and will quickly knock down your E levels. If you're not on TRT, there's possibility you could be in the lower half of normal which means it's harder to recover from over doing it with the AI. And it's *real* easy to over do it with AI's. In your case, the high T may very well be the case along with a tendency to aromitization, so you'd have less of an issue recovering if you overshoot the mark... and trust me, you don't want to drop your E *too* low.

Just out of curiosity, how's your libido and sexual performance? High E can effect that as well. ...as can low E.

Good luck.

**zaggahamma** · 04-30-2011, 07:10 AM

the site where i get my arimidex 1mg also sells aromasin 25mg....so the fact that the aromosin are/come in 25mg tabs makes me think 25mg might be a more normal dose or even like stated in this post 18mg

**bigbossofdariver** · 04-30-2011, 04:21 PM

forrest and trees, my libido is good i usually

two or three times a day, but i did notice as i started to gain weight i started finishing quite a bit quicker. not sure if that has to do with anything. and if i do end up using aromasin or some other AI i will do half the dosage either ED or EOD, really depends on what the endo says.

**forrest_and_trees** · 05-01-2011, 09:35 AM

Hopefully you'll get a good Endo but TRT/HRT is something you need to take a *real active roll in* as many docs, even endos, don't know everything about it. Think of it as taking your Bugatti to a Ferrari shop, they may know more than the local shop on the corner, but unless they specialize in your needs, there will still likely be areas they're don't know about. My doc prescribed 1mg *daily* ...:whoa: That's WAY too much. So it's better to be conservative and start slow. You'll begin to tell when things change and when you go too far. In the end, you know yourself better than anyone, and will learn to read the signs over time based on how you feel and things like puffy, sensitive nipples, etc. Some other things take longer to show but just be patient. I'm talking about overall puffiness. Much of that is just water and should clear up in a week or so as long as you keep your levels in check, but there's also a layer of fat you've likely developed due to high E and that may take months to improve... but it will. Just hang in there.

**GotNoBlueMilk** · 05-01-2011, 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by bigbossofdariver

forrest and trees, my libido is good i usually

two or three times a day, but i did notice as i started to gain weight i started finishing quite a bit quicker. not sure if that has to do with anything. and if i do end up using aromasin or some other AI i will do half the dosage either ED or EOD, really depends on what the endo says.

In my TRT travels I have discovered a link between E2 levels and nerve function. Low E2 and I get minor numbness and impaired sense of smell. Gaining weight could be from water and higher E2 levels, in which case you might experience greater sensativity. I know I do.

**bigbossofdariver** · 05-01-2011, 03:46 PM

yeah i know quite a bit about all of this, been lurking this forum for about 6 months now. its why i had my hormone levels checked in the first place when no one else thought i should.

**bigbossofdariver** · 05-01-2011, 03:47 PM

Originally Posted by GotNoBlueMilk

In my TRT travels I have discovered a link between E2 levels and nerve function. Low E2 and I get minor numbness and impaired sense of smell. Gaining weight could be from water and higher E2 levels, in which case you might experience greater sensativity. I know I do.

hm thanks good to know.

**bigbossofdariver** · 05-02-2011, 03:37 AM

one more quick question what would be the best range to have my estrodial in? 10-20?

**GotNoBlueMilk** · 05-02-2011, 04:45 AM

10 is on the low side. 20 is really the low end of a good range, generally speaking. 30 is the high end, generally speaking. Keep in mind everyone is different. Some people do better with higher E2 and some can't even hit 30 w/o getting gyno. For starters, shoot for the 20-30 range and then work from there to fine tune it to your body's needs and how it reacts at different levels.

**bigbossofdariver** · 05-02-2011, 04:30 PM

Originally Posted by GotNoBlueMilk

10 is on the low side. 20 is really the low end of a good range, generally speaking. 30 is the high end, generally speaking. Keep in mind everyone is different. Some people do better with higher E2 and some can't even hit 30 w/o getting gyno. For starters, shoot for the 20-30 range and then work from there to fine tune it to your body's needs and how it reacts at different levels.

thats what i figured, around 20 would be optimal. was actually pretty funny, when i first got my results of the estrodial being 88 and the range was 3-56. i ask the doc" wouldnt 15-25 be the optimal range." he says "well 3-56 is the optimal range."