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  1. #1
    natg101 is offline New Member
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    19 Years Old, Really Need Help!

    Going to try and be detailed, so post will be long, but i really appreciate anyone who takes the time to help!!!

    **INFO***Never taken a PH/Steroid , and at 19 years old i already suffer from low T and high estrogen. No medication or injuries. Eat healthy(good fats, protein, healthy carbs, fruit, vegetables, etc. Workout 4x week. Supplement with extra vit d, zinc, and fish oil.

    **SYMPTOMS***- Lethargic, fat gain, gyno, water bloat, muscle weakness, and horrible libido.

    **LAB WORK***
    TOTAL T- 405pg/ml(8/2010)= 315(1/2011)= 359(2/2011)= 405(3/2011)= 460(5/2011)
    % Free T- 2.2(8/2010)= 2.3 (2/2011)
    SHBG-22 nmol/L(8/2010)= 25.8(2/2011)= 31.6(3/2011)= 43(5/2011)
    Vit D- 63.9 ng/ml(8/2010)
    FSH- 2.7 mint Units/Liter(1/2011)= 1.3 (2/2011)= 2.46 (3/2011)= 2.4(5/2011)
    LH-2.35 mint Units/ml(1/2011)= 2.28(2/2011)= 2.46 (3/2011)= 4.9 (5/2011)
    Prolactin- 7.5 ng/ml(1/2011)= 9.3 (3/20110
    Estradiol- 43.67 pg/ml (2/2011)= 35(3/2011)= 21(5/2011)
    Cortisol- 11.83 ug/dl (3/2011)

    My estrogen was high or high normal so my doctor gave me arimidex to get me below 30 pg/ml. I was take 1/32 mg a day(compounded). Everything was better. Better erections, lost fat around belly etc, actually wanted to have sex. The blood work labeled 5/2011 was about 1 month after starting the arimidex. My LH and Total T was higher, and i expected and the E2 was better. The SHBG actually went up which is weird.

    I had to stop the Arimidex because even on that super low dose i guess my estrogen went to low because my joints started hurting really bad.

    Regardless of my numbers i feel horrible and want to attempt some kind of treatment. My doc recommended a trial of the Testosterone cream for a month or so to see how i respond. If it improves that much better i could stay on it and add in HCG +plus the armidex if i need it. Another option would be mono HCG therapy

    Does that sound reasonable? I want to make sure to stay fertile. Would this combo allow that most likely? I am young to have to deal with all of this, but living like i am now is miserable.

    Thanks!


    Few more lab results i found....not sure if relevent 8/2011
    Neutrophil % 46
    Mono % 8
    Lymph 38
    Eos 7
    Baso 0

    WBC 4.7
    RDW 11.7
    RBC 5.3
    Platelet 154
    MCV 92
    MCHC 33
    MCH 30
    HGB 16
    HCT 48.8

    Ca 9.7
    BUN 25
    AST 46
    ALT 40
    Alk Phos 177
    Albumin 4.6
    Last edited by natg101; 06-07-2011 at 06:20 PM.

  2. #2
    lifter65 is offline Associate Member
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    man i feel you im same age as you and doc shoppin, hope you find what works cuz i still havent

  3. #3
    natg101 is offline New Member
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    Goodluck^

    BTW, i am on my own with this. The doctors around here are not very knowledgeable on the subject. I have tried many, but at least my current doctor will listen/work with me and actually write prescriptions. So I have done a lot of my own research, but really need some help! Thanks

  4. #4
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    None of your labs has ranges so without knowing the lab and ranges it's hard to tell anything.

    That being said, if you have high E2, which it appears, and low T (not off the charts BTW) then TRT protocol might be worth looking into. At your age, however, I'd want to know why this is happening to you. You have no history that could cause it so something is amiss. .

    "My doc recommended a trial of the Testosterone cream for a month or so to see how i respond. If it improves that much better i could stay on it and add in HCG+plus the armidex if i need it. Another option would be mono HCG therapy" These are reasonable options in my opinion barring anything medically wrong that's causing this to happen to you. The Endocrine system is really complex and way over my head but I'd want to rule out everything first then if all else proves out "ok" I'd opt for one of these reasonable options.

  5. #5
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    I feel for you. But at your age you're in a tough spot. You could just be a "late bloomer" and if you mess with TRT, it could screw you up for life... and 19 that's a long time. Frankly I'm surprised your doc is doing what he is since most docs won't touch someone your age. Age aside, your symptoms did sound like high E, and you probably over did it with the Arimidex , even at 1/32mg Which is pretty damn low. But it sounds like you doc made a good call there. I'd back off the Arimidex when you start feeling bad, and go to every other day, [EOD] until you begin to feel better. if you start to see the signs of high E again, you can always bump it up to every day. But then you get into the cycle of off and on trying to maintain the ideal levels.

    For the record, as I said above, your age is an issue and I don't recommend Test in any form but if you're going to try anything, I would try the HCG first and see how you respond. it may be all you need. That and stay up on your numbers with blood work. Best of luck.

  6. #6
    natg101 is offline New Member
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    Not sure what is causing. Never been on any medications. My previous doctor(and endo), said he tested my thyroid and it came back fine. And i don't remember any serious hits to the groin/head.
    Could be family issue? Both grandpas and dad are overweight/gyno.

    Would like to investigate further, but my insurance is being stingy on running more and more tests.

    Also whats wrong with starting T? I know its a life long commitment, but in my mind being on T and feeling like a normal teenager is worth it compared to living the "best years of my life" and youth feeling run down and like im 80 struggling to get a boner.

    Thats why i thought a test run would be nice to see if the improvement would be worth it.

    ...also nearly 20 and really doubt my levels will improve significantly with time. I'm pretty much full grown..

    thoughts?

  7. #7
    lifter65 is offline Associate Member
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    whats your free t in ng/dl or pg/ml, also doesnt look like you have a shbg problem cuz your % free t is pretty good, unfortunately shbg is my problem which is hard to correct

  8. #8
    natg101 is offline New Member
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    ^ usually 8-10 ng/dl i believe..like 1.7-2.3%.

    From what i've read, lowering my estrogen should have decreased SHBG, but mine actually increased

  9. #9
    lifter65 is offline Associate Member
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    yeah mines 2.2 ng/dl while ON trt, lol i would be happy with yours

  10. #10
    zaggahamma's Avatar
    zaggahamma is offline Mr. Moderation
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    glad you at least have a doctor willing to work with you and glad your feeling better....please keep us posted IN THIS THREAD...
    would be a great learning experience...
    not a lot of ppl find that their T was low E was high at your age....some of us wonder if/how long we could have been low

    best of continued progress to you!

  11. #11
    JD250's Avatar
    JD250 is offline Knowledgeable Member
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    That's true JPK.....I have sat and thought this through several times and am convinced that I was low for years before I realized it....maybe not at 20 but for several years anyway.

    I'm glad you have a decent doc, many people here would love to have a good one. keep working with him and keep us updated on a regular basis.....it really is important.....there are others in your situation who will benefit and when they show up asking questions we'll be able to reference this thread.

  12. #12
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    bass is offline HRT Specialist ~ Knowledgeable Member
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    damn that sucks at 19 to have these symptoms, and yes please keep us updated. you have a good doctor, you will be fine! but like the guys said, find out why the symptoms at your age!!

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by natg101 View Post
    Also whats wrong with starting T? I know its a life long commitment, but in my mind being on T and feeling like a normal teenager is worth it compared to living the "best years of my life" and youth feeling run down and like im 80 struggling to get a boner.

    Thats why i thought a test run would be nice to see if the improvement would be worth it.

    ...also nearly 20 and really doubt my levels will improve significantly with time. I'm pretty much full grown..

    thoughts?
    Hey, I get ya. You seem like a smart guy and I applaud you for doing the research. Just be sure to temper your intelligence with some wisdom. Learn from others here.

    I'm just suggesting you might want to leave T treatment as a last resort. At your age there may be better options to kick-start your own natural production like HCG , which would allow you to still lead a long happy *normal* life.

    The problem with T treatment is endocrine system is very complex and interconnected. You can very easily start a cascade effect, where other systems begin to shut down, like your thyroid, which would only make a bad situation worse. Unfortunately, little is known about all this, many of us will never know what lead to what, but we know what it's like to live with it and I'm sure there's not one person on this board, given the chance, that wouldn't have done thinks differently if it meant avoiding HRT.

    As for late starts, I didn't reach my peak developmentally until I was about 23. Just hang in there. Your on the right path.
    Last edited by forrest_and_trees; 06-10-2011 at 12:57 AM.

  14. #14
    NOSUPERMODEL is offline Member
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    Have you tried any natural supps to boost your testosterone ? Like Tribulis Testris?

    I don't remember back when I was 19, but I have always been overweight and dealt with gyno. Your lucky more and more doctors are starting to pay attention to the male hormones. They used to just say..."its a part of getting old" and only worry about the females.

    I know its hard not to think about the "right now" moment, but try and think long term. You would hate to mess up your hormones now and regret it later in life.

  15. #15
    natg101 is offline New Member
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    Thanks for the replys everyone. So my next step sounds like trying HCG ? Does that sound reasonable? Any recommendation on dosage based on my lab numbers?

  16. #16
    zaggahamma's Avatar
    zaggahamma is offline Mr. Moderation
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    Quote Originally Posted by natg101 View Post
    Thanks for the replys everyone. So my next step sounds like trying HCG? Does that sound reasonable? Any recommendation on dosage based on my lab numbers?
    NOBODY is recommending ANYTHING without your doctor my young bro

  17. #17
    natg101 is offline New Member
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    My doctor is not an expert on this, but like i said he's the best i've found. He's not sure what to do, but will listen to my opinion and let me try it if it sounds reasonable. Thats why i NEED recommendations.

  18. #18
    bass's Avatar
    bass is offline HRT Specialist ~ Knowledgeable Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by natg101 View Post
    My doctor is not an expert on this, but like i said he's the best i've found. He's not sure what to do, but will listen to my opinion and let me try it if it sounds reasonable. Thats why i NEED recommendations.
    that could be scary! a 19 year old guiding a doctor to prescribe some serious hormones!

  19. #19
    lifter65 is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by bass View Post
    that could be scary! a 19 year old guiding a doctor to prescribe some serious hormones!
    lol doctors knowledge on this stuff is just pathetic

  20. #20
    JD250's Avatar
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    There are some sticky threads at the top of this forum and I believe one of them is about HCG ........might be a good place to start. Nope I was wrong........someone help me here.....somewhere on this site is a link to a good article concerning HCG...........I thought I had stuff like this bookmarked but I cant find it at the moment.....not to fear, someone will come up with it.
    Last edited by JD250; 06-08-2011 at 05:58 PM.

  21. #21
    natg101 is offline New Member
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    bump, in for link!!

    And yes it scary. i don't want to screw myself up, but i also hate feeling miserable and not enjoying life.(srs 19 years old and would not care if i ever had sex again- just no interest.(was better when i got my e2 down)

  22. #22
    lifter65 is offline Associate Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by natg101 View Post
    bump, in for link!!

    And yes it scary. i don't want to screw myself up, but i also hate feeling miserable and not enjoying life.(srs 19 years old and would not care if i ever had sex again- just no interest.(was better when i got my e2 down)
    hey its tough no doubt but you're tough man you'll get through it, you just gotta see it through til the end

  23. #23
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    Here's a link to papers published by Dr. John Crisler, one of the worlds leading medical authorities on TRT. See the link for HCG Update. This and the others are excellent reads for any man on TRT. I've read his stuff over and over again.

    http://www.allthingsmale.com/publications.html

  24. #24
    Tbound is offline Junior Member
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    Great point!!
    Quote Originally Posted by jpkman View Post
    NOBODY is recommending ANYTHING without your doctor my young bro

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