Does anyone else "Self Bleed" ??

[Times Roman]

My labs came back and my RBC was too high. in afghanistan, i could donate blood, problem solved. But here can't pass the prescreen since lived in europe during the mad cow disease era. My doc saysmy RBC is "dangerously high" and wants to cut my trt dose from 80 to 60mg / week to cure the problem. my total test came back 31 points over the high range, and no free test was taken like i had asked.

Hgb 19.4 actual

13.0 - 17.0 range
g/dL

Hematocrit
56.0 actual
39.0 - 51.0 range
%


E results:
Estradiol
52 actual
< 50 preferred range
pg/mL

since i've been blasting a bit, and not donating blood, is the explanation for the high RBC. So i'm thinking I may start drawing off a pint every other month.

What do you blokes think? Anyone else do this?
BTW, i've never pinned into a vein before

[Brazensol]

You mean on purpose? lol.

[steroid.com 1]

TR - You can still have blood drawn and destroyed and not be used for transfusions.

You have a medical reasons for such a procedure...check around there are medical places where you can get this done.

Don't do something like this on your own as there could be disastrous outcomes.

[Brazensol]

Seriously though, if mine goes to high (it was borderline before starting trt) my doc told me the lab would do it. I think he called it a medical phlebotomy. I don't know if trt patients can donate blood or not. If you can then you could just do that. Because of some of the crap holes I have been to while in the military I cannot donate blood.

[Times Roman]

TR - You can still have blood drawn and destroyed and not be used for transfusions.

You have a medical reasons for such a procedure...check around there are medical places where you can get this done.

i emailed my doc on this and he chose to ignore it, and instead, his response was to lower my dose

[steroid.com 1]

Seriously though, if mine goes to high (it was borderline before starting trt) my doc told me the lab would do it. I think he called it a medical phlebotomy. I don't know if trt patients can donate blood or not. If you can then you could just do that. Because of some of the crap holes I have been to while in the military I cannot donate blood.

That's it! Forgot the medical term...

Fvck your Doc TR; call around and get your blood pulled properly.

[tboney]

My labs came back and my RBC was too high. in afghanistan, i could donate blood, problem solved. But here can't pass the prescreen since lived in europe during the mad cow disease era. My doc saysmy RBC is "dangerously high" and wants to cut my trt dose from 80 to 60mg / week to cure the problem. my total test came back 31 points over the high range, and no free test was taken like i had asked.

Hgb 19.4 actual

13.0 - 17.0 range
g/dL

Hematocrit
56.0 actual
39.0 - 51.0 range
%


E results:
Estradiol
52 actual
< 50 preferred range
pg/mL

since i've been blasting a bit, and not donating blood, is the explanation for the high RBC. So i'm thinking I may start drawing off a pint every other month.

What do you blokes think? Anyone else do this?
BTW, i've never pinned into a vein before

I have not heard about to many guys on 60 to 80 mgs of test a week getting polycythemia. Was it high before you started trt?? There are other conditions that can lead to the elevated RBC's..... Any bloodwork on your liver?

Not saying that its not the test just offering other possibilities....

[GotNoBlueMilk]

Mine it right at the top of the range at 80 mg /week.

It was either JP or Bass who did the self phlebotomy thing. He couldn't get a donation center to do it so did it himself and wrote about it here. Unfortunately, he didn't do the utube thing so we missed out on the movie.

Keep in mind you need to poke a rather large needle (blood clots a medium to smaller sized needle) into a vein. It's a tough thing to do w/o experience. So you may want to find a clinic, a doc, or an experienced drug user who mainlines. And I can't recommed using a mainliner at all . . . just not a good thing.

[kelkel]

It was Bass who did it over the toilet successfully (OMG.) Definitly jump on a therapeutic draw. Your doc should offer this.

[Times Roman]

Seriously though, if mine goes to high (it was borderline before starting trt) my doc told me the lab would do it. I think he called it a medical phlebotomy. I don't know if trt patients can donate blood or not. If you can then you could just do that. Because of some of the crap holes I have been to while in the military I cannot donate blood.

Yep. Where i lived in the military is what is disqualifying me....

That's it! Forgot the medical term...

Fvck your Doc TR; call around and get your blood pulled properly.

Mate, i wouldn't even know where to start. Call the lab at Kaiser and see if they would do it?

I have not heard about to many guys on 60 to 80 mgs of test a week getting polycythemia. Was it high before you started trt?? There are other conditions that can lead to the elevated RBC's..... Any bloodwork on your liver?

Not saying that its not the test just offering other possibilities....

no, i was cruising on 100mg/week in afghanistan, with two blasts while there, and was managing it quite nicely by donating blood. was there a year, and donated 3x 1 liter each time.

[Times Roman]

It was Bass who did it over the toilet successfully (OMG.) Definitly jump on a therapeutic draw. Your doc should offer this.

Bass, huh? I'll pm him

[bass]

yea fvck your doc TR, get another doc to give you a script to draw your blood and dispose of it as GD noted. GNBM, yes it was me, it actually very easy, heck easier than IM test shot, no pain, you just need the right tools. you need a minimum 18 g. needles, manual blood pressure monitor cuff, tube to attach to your needle and a 16 oz water bottle. there i another member that dose this, forgot his name, but he was the one who helped me learn how to do it. he used a small needle and used vacuum to pull the blood out, it takes too long so i went to 18 g.

TR, drink plenty of water and take one baby aspirin each day until you get this resolved, in fact it won't hurt to it while on TRT. if i get tempted I'll do a short video of how it done and post it, been saying this for a Long time and now i think its time.

[bass]

BTW make sure some one else is with you in case you pass out!

[tboney]

Yep. Where i lived in the military is what is disqualifying me....



Mate, i wouldn't even know where to start. Call the lab at Kaiser and see if they would do it?



no, i was cruising on 100mg/week in afghanistan, with two blasts while there, and was managing it quite nicely by donating blood. was there a year, and donated 3x 1 liter each time.

Do you remember if your hematocrit was high before you started trt? Well whatever the case you need to find a clinic or doc to perform the procedure.... If your hematocrit is high on 100mg/week, Im sure it gets way high during your blasts.....Keep up with this.

[Times Roman]

yea fvck your doc TR, get another doc to give you a script to draw your blood and dispose of it as GD noted. GNBM, yes it was me, it actually very easy, heck easier than IM test shot, no pain, you just need the right tools. you need a minimum 18 g. needles, manual blood pressure monitor cuff, tube to attach to your needle and a 16 oz water bottle. there i another member that dose this, forgot his name, but he was the one who helped me learn how to do it. he used a small needle and used vacuum to pull the blood out, it takes too long so i went to 18 g.

TR, drink plenty of water and take one baby aspirin each day until you get this resolved, in fact it won't hurt to it while on TRT. if i get tempted I'll do a short video of how it done and post it, been saying this for a Long time and now i think its time.

OK. I'll go 18g. i'll drink the water and take the baby aspirin, all a week ahead of time. plus i'll get sometihing to tie off on, to get the vein to stick out even farther.

BTW make sure some one else is with you in case you pass out!

pass out? pain/blood doesn't bother me too much. I don't pass out. wife was watching when she was helping me put a few stitches in me once, and SHE was the one that almost passed out!!! (we didn't have insurance, so i said fuk it, i'll do it myself)

Do you remember if your hematocrit was high before you started trt? Well whatever the case you need to find a clinic or doc to perform the procedure.... If your hematocrit is high on 100mg/week, Im sure it gets way high during your blasts.....Keep up with this.

all my levels were g2g prior to trt. liver is still good, but my E is running a little high, which i have a solution for in the medicine cabinet.

[Times Roman]

when i asked my endo to help, this was his response...

I'm not aware of therapeutic phlebotomy being done at Kaiser except when ordered by oncology specialists for treatment of iron overload (hemachromatosis). You can check with Dr. Shiithead to see if the policy of the local injection clinic in Manteca differs.

[Brazensol]

Do you have sleep apnea? If I remember right that causes high hermatocrit.

[Times Roman]

Do you have sleep apnea? If I remember right that causes high hermatocrit.

yes i do have sleep apnea. have a liink for that?

[Brazensol]

I will try to remember where I read it. I might even be wrong. I have been doing so much research on low T and hypothyriodism that it all kind of runs together at the moment.

[Brazensol]

I did a Yahoo! search and found this and it seems there are quite a few more.

Choi JB, Loredo JS, Norman D, Mills PJ, Ancoli-Israel S, Ziegler MG, Dimsdale JE.


This study assessed the relationship between hematocrit levels and severity of obstructive sleep apnea (OSA) and examined how this relationship was affected by the degree of hypoxia as well as by possible confounding factors. Two-hundred sixty three subjects (189 men and 74 women) underwent nocturnal polysomnography with oximetry and had measurements of hematocrit, hemoglobin, white blood cell count, body mass index (BMI), blood pressure (BP), and 24-h urine norepinephrine (NE). Patients with severe OSA [respiratory disturbance index (RDI) >30] had significantly higher hematocrit values than patients with mild to moderate OSA or nonapneic controls (p < 0.01). However, only one patient had a hematocrit in the range of clinical polycythemia. Hematocrit levels were significantly correlated with BMI, BP, urinary NE, RDI, percent of time spent at oxygen saturation <90%, and with mean oxygen saturation. Multiple linear regression analysis revealed that mean oxygen saturation, RDI, and percent of time spent at oxygen saturation <90% were significant predictors of hematocrit level, even after controlling for gender, ethnicity, 24-h urine NE, BMI, and BP (p < 0.05). The severity of OSA is significantly associated with increased hematocrit, even after controlling for possible confounding variables. However, nocturnal hypoxemia in OSA does not usually lead to clinical polycythemia.


Perhaps sleep apnea and trt combine to raise hematocrit even higher...

[Times Roman]

thanks mate. do you have a link in case i need it for my doc?

[Brazensol]

Here ya go;

http://www.sleepassociation.org/inde...stract&id=2742

[Times Roman]

thank you!!

[GirlyGymRat]

vampire! problem solved!!!

[GirlyGymRat]

lipo!!! one pint of blood at a time

[Times Roman]

vampire! problem solved!!!

careful there girly!

....almost sounds like you are voluntering??

[GirlyGymRat]

careful there girly!

....almost sounds like you are voluntering??

sorry, i dislike blood and such...just offering solutions, luv!

[Northernguy]

My labs came back and my RBC was too high. in afghanistan, i could donate blood, problem solved. But here can't pass the prescreen since lived in europe during the mad cow disease era. My doc saysmy RBC is "dangerously high" and wants to cut my trt dose from 80 to 60mg / week to cure the problem. my total test came back 31 points over the high range, and no free test was taken like i had asked.

Hgb 19.4 actual

13.0 - 17.0 range
g/dL

Hematocrit
56.0 actual
39.0 - 51.0 range
%

E results:
Estradiol
52 actual
< 50 preferred range
pg/mL

since i've been blasting a bit, and not donating blood, is the explanation for the high RBC. So i'm thinking I may start drawing off a pint every other month.

What do you blokes think? Anyone else do this?
BTW, i've never pinned into a vein before

Can you explain a bit about all this and RBC stuff to me please

[ironbeck]

I had a friend that was a medic in the army, that used to give us I-Vs after a long night of partying....but taking ones own blood, I guess would not be that difficult IF you know what your doing? Sounds like it could be messy with out the proper medical equipment. an ounce of blood covers like 3x area vs paint or more.....good luck.

[Permabulk]

While this thread sparks my interest in kinky blood sex (Semi-jk), an 18 Ga?!?! As someone who is a little needle shy, it blows my mind you guys need to use a pin that big.

Do you guys think if you took the plunger out of a 25 Ga or a 32 Ga, and just got that sucker into a vein, it would flow? Even slowly?

[ironbeck]

While this thread sparks my interest in kinky blood sex (Semi-jk), an 18 Ga?!?! As someone who is a little needle shy, it blows my mind you guys need to use a pin that big.

Do you guys think if you took the plunger out of a 25 Ga or a 32 Ga, and just got that sucker into a vein, it would flow? Even slowly?

What? dude it would squirt all over the place with every heart beat...I mean like a friggin geyser...15-20 ft

[Mario L]

If only you came across one of those times where you squirt after removing the pin. For me it's only happen 2 times out of a 100. So it's a longshot. I did search for about a hour if there was a online co like a privatelabmd that could write a order for a theraputic draw. Came up blank. Sorry bro.

[redhawk01]

If I'm not mistaken, the blood center where I usually donate, has a sticker that you put on the bag. If you decide not to give up your blood, you just put on the corresponding sticker, yay or nay. They don 't know until they scan it. Anonymously

[SEOINAGE]

vampire! problem solved!!!

yeah i was thinking what if you drained your own blood then drank it?