does trt make you dumber or smarter

**powerlifterty16** · 08-28-2013, 06:26 PM

on trt have you noticed a lot of cognitive benefits? Ive read mixed things like testosterone is neuro toxic...and then i read low t causes cognition problems...i get worried about the neurotoxic stuff, but hope it is not neurotoxic and in fact is better for the brain

**ctenosaura** · 08-28-2013, 09:54 PM

Since on TRT, planning skills better, problem solving skills much better, and much more sure of myself. It could also be from the liquid CIA opening up smalls veins in my brain

**Times Roman** · 08-28-2013, 09:57 PM

it's kind of a silly question.

on the one hand, TRT will make you feel better if that is what you truly need. So your overall mood and disposition will improve.

but you can also say the same thing about coffee. coffee will "wake you up" and make you more energetic, allowing you to get more work done, more efficient with your time.

but does it make you "smarter"?

if you define "smarter" as a higher IQ, then I would think the answer is "NO"

**powerlifterty16** · 08-28-2013, 10:14 PM

i wouldnt call it silly, a lot of people go on trt for the cognitive benefit and low t is known to cause cognition problems, but ive also heard test can be neurotoxic aka making your brain function worse...so i just wanted to hear insight

**Times Roman** · 08-28-2013, 10:21 PM

Originally Posted by powerlifterty16

i wouldnt call it silly, a lot of people go on trt for the cognitive benefit and low t is known to cause cognition problems, but ive also heard test can be neurotoxic aka making your brain function worse...so i just wanted to hear insight

the "silly" part is saying whether or not it makes you dumber or smarter.

I think it loses it's silly-ness if you state it exactly as you just did, whether or not there is a cognative benefit.

Since TRT will help improve your activity levels (if TRT is actually needed), then I would suggest it also improves cognative activity levels as well.

Again, this should come as no surprise, as coffee is a well known and well understood cognative stimulator as well.

Cheers!
---Roman

**powerlifterty16** · 08-28-2013, 10:30 PM

i was more concerned with the dumber aspect than the smarter..worrying that if irose my test levels too high(not above normal range though), it would be neurotoxic..but a big reason I do want to go on trt is increased productivity.

by coffee do you mean caffeine in general?

**bass** · 08-28-2013, 10:51 PM

Power, I think you're overthinking the whole aspect of TRT, I know you been reading allot and I commend you for it, but you are forgetting that TRT is not a magic pill, its simply replacing what you don't produce anymore. will it make you smarter or dumber? no like TR noted, but it will help you focus butter.

**powerlifterty16** · 08-28-2013, 11:05 PM

Originally Posted by bass

Power, I think you're overthinking the whole aspect of TRT, I know you been reading allot and I commend you for it, but you are forgetting that TRT is not a magic pill, its simply replacing what you don't produce anymore. will it make you smarter or dumber? no like TR noted, but it will help you focus butter.

true bass, ido overthink things sometimes lol. I just have always been a pretty smart guy and have recently been thinking about stereotypes of high t dumb guys vs low t smart guys, and wondering if higher normal t could negatively impact my intelligence, but I guess the more likely reality is that LOW TEST isnt healthy, and is definitely not allowing my brain to work as it should, and I think that if we look at the same person longitudinally along their lives' we will see they function better at 20 vs at 80.

i guess trt is one of those things where you need real life experience to fully understand it....def a lot of what ifs involved that can't be answered.

**StinkyFinga** · 08-29-2013, 04:07 AM

For me personally I've noticed being on a cycle improves my cognitive behavior. To be honest, the antidepressants screw with my mind I would the sense that I seem to forget things so quickly. The memory is there but it takes me a while to bring it out. Even something I may have did yesterday.

Being on, my focus is much better. I feel "sharp" like I can think on the fly. Off cycle I get all stumbled and awkward I panic then I'm thinking of everything but the question. I definitely attribute the lack of clarity to the antidepressants. I never use to be like that. I can't explain why I see an increase in clarity while on cycle. Maybe placebo. Maybe confidence. Maybe my body feels whole and connected.

So yes I believe it can help if you are truly feeling low T symptoms.

**VTX1800** · 08-29-2013, 07:59 AM

It's not adderall

**Ryanmcd** · 08-29-2013, 09:54 AM

Originally Posted by powerlifterty16

ido overthink things sometimes lol.

yes!

**powerlifterty16** · 08-29-2013, 02:28 PM

Originally Posted by StinkyFinga

For me personally I've noticed being on a cycle improves my cognitive behavior. To be honest, the antidepressants screw with my mind I would the sense that I seem to forget things so quickly. The memory is there but it takes me a while to bring it out. Even something I may have did yesterday.

Being on, my focus is much better. I feel "sharp" like I can think on the fly. Off cycle I get all stumbled and awkward I panic then I'm thinking of everything but the question. I definitely attribute the lack of clarity to the antidepressants. I never use to be like that. I can't explain why I see an increase in clarity while on cycle. Maybe placebo. Maybe confidence. Maybe my body feels whole and connected.

So yes I believe it can help if you are truly feeling low T symptoms.

i seem to forget what im talking about mid sentence lol

**Low Testosterone** · 08-29-2013, 03:09 PM

Long term low testosterone has been linked to Alzheimer's disease, meaning those with low testosterone who ignore it are far more likely to develop Alzheimer's. There are numerous studies available on this regarding how great the percentage increase is. I've read one study that stated low testosterone increases the risk by more than 200% but all the studies show the increase in risk is very significant.

The next question would be has TRT been linked to Alzheimer's or anything similar? The answer, no.

***LowT Mike*** · 08-29-2013, 03:41 PM

There is good evidence for a strong correlation between T levels and cognitive performance such as spatial abilities or mathematical reasoning. Higher bioavailable and free testosterone concentrations have each been associated with better performance in specific aspects of memory and cognitive function, with optimal processing capacity found in men ranging from 35 to 90 years of age even after adjustment for potential confounders including age, educational attainment and cardiovascular morbidity; whereas total testosterone was not. THIS IS WHY FREE T is KING!!

In men undergoing hormonal therapy for prostate cancer, Irs common practice that men w/ Prostate CA are given a drug to suppress T levels. Suppression of endogenous testosterone synthesis and blockade of the androgen receptor resulted in a beneficial effect on verbal memory but an adverse effect on spatial ability and visuomotor slowing and slowed reaction times in several attentional domains; plasma amyloid levels increased as T levels decreased (This amyloid build forms a plague narrowing vessels surrounding the brain which is the culprit for alztimers and various dementias of the brain as "Low Testosteorne" above mentioned.) Discontinuation of treatment resulted in improved memory but not visuospatial abilities. One of the possible protective mechanisms of action of T would be through its conversion into estradiol (E2), the most potent estrogen. Both serum E2 and T levels were lower in men with AD compared to age-matched controls. E2 exert protective effects on the brain structures in aging patients. Dont let your E2 fall to 0

Therefore, although the evidence from observational studies is not uniform, lower free testosterone appears to be associated with poorer outcomes on measures of cognitive function, particularly in older men and testosterone therapy in hypogonadal men may have some benefit for cognitive performance.

I would have to say during my career in Mens Health TRT. The number 1 symptomatic improvement men tell me is that their memory and energy to focus has improved dramatically. Ive heard stories from blue collar workers say that since TRT they are now remembering to turn in their time sheet and that treatment saved their job to CEOs thanking me that I gave them back their LION MOJO to command fortune 500 companies that were on the verge of collapse.

**StinkyFinga** · 08-29-2013, 03:43 PM

So I am not crazy and experiencing placebo. All the more reason I think TRT is right for me regardless of what my 423 level says.

**powerlifterty16** · 08-29-2013, 04:44 PM

Originally Posted by LowT Mike

There is good evidence for a strong correlation between T levels and cognitive performance such as spatial abilities or mathematical reasoning. Higher bioavailable and free testosterone concentrations have each been associated with better performance in specific aspects of memory and cognitive function, with optimal processing capacity found in men ranging from 35 to 90 years of age even after adjustment for potential confounders including age, educational attainment and cardiovascular morbidity; whereas total testosterone was not. THIS IS WHY FREE T is KING!!

In men undergoing hormonal therapy for prostate cancer, Irs common practice that men w/ Prostate CA are given a drug to suppress T levels. Suppression of endogenous testosterone synthesis and blockade of the androgen receptor resulted in a beneficial effect on verbal memory but an adverse effect on spatial ability and visuomotor slowing and slowed reaction times in several attentional domains; plasma amyloid levels increased as T levels decreased. Discontinuation of treatment resulted in improved memory but not visuospatial abilities. One of the possible protective mechanisms of action of T would be through its conversion into estradiol (E2), the most potent estrogen. Both serum E2 and T levels were lower in men with AD compared to age-matched controls. E2 exert protective effects on the brain structures in aging patients. Dont let your E2 fall to 0

Therefore, although the evidence from observational studies is not uniform, lower free testosterone appears to be associated with poorer outcomes on measures of cognitive function, particularly in older men and testosterone therapy in hypogonadal men may have some benefit for cognitive performance.

I would have to say during my career in Mens Health TRT. The number 1 symptomatic improvement men tell me is that their memory and energy to focus has improved dramatically. Ive heard stories from blue collar workers say that since TRT they are now remembering to turn in their time sheet and that treatment saved their job to CEOs thanking me that I gave them back their LION MOJO to command fortune 500 companies that were on the verge of collapse.

i have terrible spatial skills...took some iq stuff in highschool did very well in verbal stuff, but spatial stuff was around the 1st percentile aka profoundly retarded lol. Some spatial tests i was ok on but when i had to draw a copy of a picture i got 1 percentile lol.