TRT with no AI?

**Trevtrev** · 10-24-2013, 02:10 PM

Started trt this week. Dr prescribed 50mg test and 250iu hCG both twice a week, but no AI.

Is no AI to start normal?

Also, is it best to not use an AI? Could it be because my body fat is low?

When I asked he said if I end up having problems that we could talk about it.

Btw I'm 44yo, 184lbs, 13% bf.

**xcraider37** · 10-24-2013, 02:23 PM

Originally Posted by Trevtrev

Started trt this week. Dr prescribed 50mg test and 250iu hCG both twice a week, but no AI.

Is no AI to start normal?

Also, is it best to not use an AI? Could it be because my body fat is low?

When I asked he said if I end up having problems that we could talk about it.

Btw I'm 44yo, 184lbs, 13% bf.

If your estradiol is high on your next blood work you request an AI it's that simple.

**kelkel** · 10-24-2013, 08:37 PM

It sounds like you have a doc that knows what he's doing! No need to start with an AI and I'd bet you won't need it anyway with your low body fat and the twice per week protocol. The aromatase enzyme lives in the skin, particularly stomach fat, so less fat = less turnover of T to E. If in fact your E does jump up a bit too much then consider DIM, zinc and copper as a first option.

**Beethoven** · 10-24-2013, 08:47 PM

I'm on a similar protocol, no need yet.

**powerlifterty16** · 10-24-2013, 08:49 PM

i doubt ull need an ai at that protocol with your bf. sounds good. is it sub q?

**Trevtrev** · 10-25-2013, 04:06 PM

Doing the test IM and the hCG subq

Thanks for the responses guys!

**vmons01** · 10-26-2013, 10:17 AM

I started on an Ai 6 weeks after starting treatment and was weaned off of it 6 months later. I now take 1mg every 8 weeks now and should probably be completely off of it shortly. I have very little bodyfat and have lost even more since starting treatment a year ago. I'm at about 11% bf at 45 years old.

**Brett N** · 10-26-2013, 10:44 AM

I was started on 1/4 mg 2x a week when I started TRT. Had some symptoms persist and I (along with doc and someone else on forum) felt my e was lowered too much. Doctor pulled me off of it for 2 weeks and will start at only 1/4 a week to see what happens then.

Not everyone needs an ai.

**Trevtrev** · 10-26-2013, 04:52 PM

Originally Posted by kelkel

It sounds like you have a doc that knows what he's doing! No need to start with an AI and I'd bet you won't need it anyway with your low body fat and the twice per week protocol. The aromatase enzyme lives in the skin, particularly stomach fat, so less fat = less turnover of T to E. If in fact your E does jump up a bit too much then consider DIM, zinc and copper as a first option.

What are the correct ratios of DIM, zinc, and copper for this purpose?

**2Sox** · 10-26-2013, 05:14 PM

Originally Posted by Trevtrev

What are the correct ratios of DIM, zinc, and copper for this purpose?

I have very little body fat - 148lbs at 5'6' and I still need an AI - albeit a very low dose - .25mg E3Ds or so. Probably because of my age - 66. On day three, the brain fog sets in and I start yawning and I know I'm due. I'd rather go without it but it doesn't work out that way.

BTW, I'm taking DIM (100mg 2x a day) Copper 4mg/day, Zinc 50mg/day along with it. Tried these alone without Adex but it didn't do the job.

**imnotnatty** · 10-26-2013, 05:51 PM

Your doctor is good, ive had a few and some were morons and some good, i like that he gave you hcg !, that shit works, i bet you're getting "all kinds of erections" lol, enjoy my man!

**Trevtrev** · 10-28-2013, 07:01 PM

Question: is the consensus that hCG is best taken the day before my T pin?

Like this:

Sunday: hCG
Monday: T
Wednesday: hCG
Thursday: T

**powerlifterty16** · 10-28-2013, 07:03 PM

yup! helps stabilize t levels.
a lot of members pin t 3x per wk though, so im assuming theyd pin on friday as well going by your schedule.

**imnotnatty** · 10-28-2013, 07:16 PM

Originally Posted by powerlifterty16

yup! helps stabilize t levels.
a lot of members pin t 3x per wk though, so im assuming theyd pin on friday as well going by your schedule.

Woe, i didnt know this, doctor didnt tell me this. is there any documentation on this somewhere i can read? it kinda makes sense in my head.

**LFH40** · 11-06-2013, 11:18 AM

Originally Posted by 2Sox

I have very little body fat - 148lbs at 5'6' and I still need an AI - albeit a very low dose - .25mg E3Ds or so. Probably because of my age - 66. On day three, the brain fog sets in and I start yawning and I know I'm due. I'd rather go without it but it doesn't work out that way.

BTW, I'm taking DIM (100mg 2x a day) Copper 4mg/day, Zinc 50mg/day along with it. Tried these alone without Adex but it didn't do the job.

You take Adex and still supplement with the DIM, Zinc, Copper combo? I haven't been prescribed the AI yet, however, I want to try your combo and see if that helps me any. Sorry it didn't work for you as a stand alone. I'm paranoid that will be my case too.

**LFH40** · 11-07-2013, 11:26 AM

Originally Posted by LFH40

You take Adex and still supplement with the DIM, Zinc, Copper combo? I haven't been prescribed the AI yet, however, I want to try your combo and see if that helps me any. Sorry it didn't work for you as a stand alone. I'm paranoid that will be my case too.

Did it work?

**Juced_porkchop** · 11-07-2013, 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by xcraider37

If your estradiol is high on your next blood work you request an AI it's that simple.

exactly!

i would rec dex at 0.25mg eod possibly if needed. but it will depend son blood work

**2Sox** · 11-07-2013, 02:51 PM

Originally Posted by Juced_porkchop

exactly!

i would rec dex at 0.25mg eod possibly if needed. but it will depend son blood work

I'm definitely no authority on AIs but this seems rather high. Wouldn't it be best to start out with a lower dose and less frequently? With a low body fat and at 44 y.o., perhaps a better starting dose would be .25mg every 3.5 days and then to see what BW looks like and how one feels. One can always titrate up later.

I was with a men's clinic for about a month early on, and they stated everyone on .5mg every 3.5 days. Stupid protocol IMO. Put me right to sleep every time I took the pill and I had no idea what it was until later on when I became a member of this forum.

**wizarddeath** · 11-07-2013, 04:50 PM

I dont do AI on my current protocol, the Dr is letting me decide.

I may ask after next blood work, but right now I am OK.

I do

150 mgs(thursday)
300 IUD HCG (Tuesday and Sunday)

**jomamma007** · 11-07-2013, 05:36 PM

Originally Posted by wizarddeath

I dont do AI on my current protocol, the Dr is letting me decide.

I may ask after next blood work, but right now I am OK.

I do

150 mgs(thursday)
300 IUD HCG(Tuesday and Sunday)

split that 150mgs injection into twice weekly, and you wont need one.

**dreadnok89** · 11-08-2013, 06:43 AM

Ya no e issues anymore, as a matter of fact its toooo low. I don't use ad ex or that Dim stuff at all. Its kills it too much. I like taking .25 exestanane or aromas in once a week regardless of my level. It leans me out and gets my free test up. It doesn't kill all your E. I heard its more expensive than adex, that's why they don't prescribe it.

Now I see why they don't prescribe it to guys really. Some people go overboard with the AI and always run estrogen way to low. Too many scary side effects with that