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Thread: Androgel not enough

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    JohnnyDapps is offline New Member
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    Androgel not enough

    Hey everyone! Just registered to this site. A little about me: I'm 33yrs old. I've been weight lifting since high school. Been all natty for the most part. I served 13 years in the U.S. military. In 2010 I suffered a tramatic brain injury in Afghanistan and one of the problems that came along with that is my brain no longer tells my testicles to produce testosterone . I went 3 yrs with low-T and didn't realize it. I've been on Androgel (max dose 4 pumps) for 2 years now and my test is back up to the 500 or so range (normal for my age I guess). Where I need help is I want my test levels higher for performance reasons of course. I'm still training 5 days a week and watching my diet. I'd like more reward for my efforts! Please help!

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    My Androgel experience, and changing TRT prescription

    Quote Originally Posted by anabolicsqa View Post
    1-2 yrs. ago I found a doctor that ran a blood panel and the results showed that my testosterone levels were well below a woman's normal lower bound of testosterone. My doc started me on 10g/day Androgel (transdermal, 100mg of testosterone). which was affordable with my insurance. For every 5g packet of gel, I first targeted where my skin was thinnest or palest, and squeezed every last drop to any surface I didn't cover. 2-3 months later, my doc ran a blood test, and it showed that my Testosterone was over 1000 ng/dL. Then I switched from Androgel to Testosterone Enanthate for less hassle and to avoid transferring Testosterone to anyone through touch.
    Quoting a previous post, a prescription of 10g Androgel in 2x 5g packets per day, is 100mg testosterone /day. To reiterate my quote, labs done months later showed my T levels exceeded 1000 ng/deciliter.

    Why not try asking your doc for a very typical TRT prescription of 200mg testosterone enanthate per week (1 injection)? For me, a single injection of 200mg testosterone cheaper, and less of a hassle in so many ways. Try to ask for a prescription of 10mL testosterone enanthate at 200mg/ml. My Androgel prescription cost $25 or so per month, and 10 mL generic Test. Enanthate 200mg/ml costs me less than $20 without using my insurance. Your doc should sympathize changing your prescription to injectable T, if you argue that you don't want to transfer testosterone to your girlfriend or to children.

    It's possible to reach above normal testosterone levels with Androgel, but the injectable route is less work and is the more popular route of administration by most, and there has to be a good reason why.

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    Simon1972's Avatar
    Simon1972 is offline Knowledgeable Member
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    agreeed- go the subq route, its less work- less transference- you wont lose most of it on your clothing , children etc- no need to worry about sweating or not showering for the obligatory 4 hrs minimum, im on creams and im over it too.

    will be asking fro a sub q script from my dr as soon as i get some spare time.

    also consider you may have blocked pores- have you tried another body part for application? either way subQ is the bomb!
    anabolicsqa likes this.

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    Sorry to hear about your injury and the consequences of it. But it's fortunate that there's help available.

    In general, I agree with the comments above. You can get a coupon online from GoodRx and pick up a 10mL vial of Test Cyp for $44 at Walgreens without insurance. This lasts for several months for TRT purposes. I always like Androgel but as the months went by I needed more of it and it got too expensive. Went to SQ and life is good. As Simon says, "It's duh bomb"

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    JohnnyDapps is offline New Member
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    Thanks for the advise guys. Here's the latest: I'm switching to injectable Test starting next week. My Dr wants to give me 100ml a week. Is this enough? Everyone seems to suggest 200ml a week. I asked my Dr if 100ml weekly was enough and he said that's where he wants to start me at and go from there. I just want to be like "give me the 200ml a week already!" We'll see how it goes.

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    JohnnyDapps is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyDapps
    Thanks for the advise guys. Here's the latest: I'm switching to injectable Test starting next week. My Dr wants to give me 100ml a week. Is this enough? Everyone seems to suggest 200ml a week. I asked my Dr if 100ml weekly was enough and he said that's where he wants to start me at and go from there. I just want to be like "give me the 200ml a week already!" We'll see how it goes.
    ^correction: I meant mg not ml

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    Yes, 100mgs per week is a great starting dose. Pull BW in six weeks and see where you land and titrate accordingly. It's always better to start low and adjust than to start high. And 100 mgs is a normal starting dose. The main thing to watch is your Free Testosterone Level, not Total T. Total means nothing as it's the Free T that works for you so keep your focus there please.

    Also be sure you monitor your estrogen via a sensitive estrogen assay, not standard estradiol which is geared for women. If you use Labcorp I can give you the proper codes for it if needed. Keep an eye on your hemoglobin and hematocrit as well. Many guys split their weekly injections in half and go every 3-4 days, which helps to keep T levels steady and mitigate estrogen issues. Consider this as it's great for SQ injections if you go this route. Don't forget to speak to your doc about HCG as well. Read the sticky at the top of this forum and also google Dr. Crislers paper on HCG. Take it to your doc.

    Best of luck and a big "Thank you for your service."
    Glad you're here!
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    JohnnyDapps is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by kelkel
    Yes, 100mgs per week is a great starting dose. Pull BW in six weeks and see where you land and titrate accordingly. It's always better to start low and adjust than to start high. And 100 mgs is a normal starting dose. The main thing to watch is your Free Testosterone Level, not Total T. Total means nothing as it's the Free T that works for you so keep your focus there please. Also be sure you monitor your estrogen via a sensitive estrogen assay, not standard estradiol which is geared for women. If you use Labcorp I can give you the proper codes for it if needed. Keep an eye on your hemoglobin and hematocrit as well. Many guys split their weekly injections in half and go every 3-4 days, which helps to keep T levels steady and mitigate estrogen issues. Consider this as it's great for SQ injections if you go this route. Don't forget to speak to your doc about HCG as well. Read the sticky at the top of this forum and also google Dr. Crislers paper on HCG. Take it to your doc. Best of luck and a big "Thank you for your service." Glad you're here!
    thanks Kelkel. I'll keep all this in mind. Is HCG an aromatase inhibitor? Should I be on something to suppress estrogen?

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    kelkel's Avatar
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    No, HCG can actually increase intra-testicular E2 a bit but that's not a reason to not use it. It's an important aspect of a healthy protocol. In short it mimics LH function that your pituitary would normally put out if not secondary hypogonadal like you are. This keeps your testicals functioning to an extent and prevents them from shrinking. There's no reason for your doctor to refuse this if he's educated in hormone replacement.

    You should only be on an AI if it's needed. BW at 6 weeks will guide you in that aspect. You're goal is to not use any at all. The smaller, twice weekly injections will help with this: Less injected at one time = less spike in E2.
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    JohnnyDapps is offline New Member
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    Kelkel, I see your posts all over these forums and you really seem to have a lot of useful knowledge that you're sharing. Thanks. Since I have you in my thread right now, what do you know about peptides? There's quite a bit of compounds out there. Thanks.

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    kelkel's Avatar
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    I'm occasionally useful. Yes, there are many out there. Take a look at AR-R 's site (click on banner at the upper right of this forum) as they have descriptions of their purpose. All are different, from GHRH's to GHRP's. Also look at the below link and you'll find a few interesting threads within that will help.


    IGF-1 LR3, HGH, and INSULIN QUESTIONS
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyDapps View Post
    Kelkel, I see your posts all over these forums and you really seem to have a lot of useful knowledge that you're sharing. Thanks. Since I have you in my thread right now, what do you know about peptides? There's quite a bit of compounds out there. Thanks.
    Find the site, datbtrue. A complete and essential guide to peptides. You can also find a very reliable source there (I use the peptides from this source). I believe you'll be very pleased.

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    kelkel's Avatar
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    Dat does have a ton of interesting stuff. Lots to read.
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    JohnnyDapps is offline New Member
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    Awesome. Thanks guys.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2Sox
    Find the site, datbtrue. A complete and essential guide to peptides. You can also find a very reliable source there (I use the peptides from this source). I believe you'll be very pleased.
    2Sox, I need a reference for datbtrue. ?

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    kelkel's Avatar
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    Just use google. Multiple hits will pop up.
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyDapps View Post
    2Sox, I need a reference for datbtrue. ?
    None needed. When you find the site, just register and in no time you'll be rockin'.

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