Trt question

[O-town Beef]

Hi I am on .75ml test E (200mg/ml) eow. I asked my Dr about hcg and he says its not necesaary. I seem to be seeing posts to the contrary. Is hcg needed as long as on trt? Also if I want to run a cycle of 500mg test e per week along with an oral do I need pct or can I just go back to trt doses? My plan is 12 weeks 500mg test e per week with 40mg dbol ed for 4 weeks. I have tried some aas before but of course really didnt know what I was doing.

Thank you.
48 yo. Many years of lifting, almost 2 years on trt

[kelkel]

First, an every other week protocol is horrible. Test has about a 5-7 day half life and your doc is dosing it on it's terminal life. Indicates he doesn't understand hormones. Look at this graph:



I post images like this frequently to give guys a graphic image of how T metabolizes and why it's important to inject weekly at a minimum.

If not really sure of what you're doing I'd suggest you follow Austinites Successful First Cycle sticky thread in the AAS Forum. It will keep you safe. When done you just go back to your TRT dose. PCT is not needed on TRT.

When it comes to HCG, again your doctor is not to current with his knowledge base. If you care about the health of your testicals (imho) you should be on it. I don't know of any other body part I'd want to wither and shrink. Here's another excerpt from an Andrology Journal on HCG:

A known critical element in the development of healthy spermatogenesis is high intratesticular testosterone.13 In men using exogenous testosterone, these levels can be greatly diminished. Intramuscular human chorionic gonadotropin (hCG) therapy is an option shown to protect against, or at least to diminish, the impact that exogenous testosterone has on intratesticular testosterone levels. In a randomized, controlled trial of 29 healthy men randomly assigned to four groups, testosterone enanthate was given 200 mg per week plus either intramuscular saline, 125, 250, or 500 IU hCG every other day. Sperm, intratesticular testosterone levels, and gonadotropins were measured at day 0 and day 21. Intratesticular testosterone levels were suppressed by 94% in the placebo group, 25% in the 125 IU hCG treatment group, and 7% in the 250 IU hCG treatment group, and they were increased 26% from baseline in the 500 IU hCG treatment group.13 Thus, even with supraphysiologic doses of testosterone replacement, healthy levels of intratesticular testosterone were maintained by low-dose hCG therapy.
The benefits of hCG therapy are not limited to maintaining healthy levels of intratesticular testosterone levels alone. These benefits also include maintenance of spermatogenesis in males receiving testosterone supplementation. We have previously demonstrated the ability of hCG therapy to maintain spermatogenesis in men receiving TST. When 26 hypogonadal men receiving TST via transdermal patches or intramuscular injections and concomitant low-dose hCG were studied retrospectively, factors such as serum and free testosterone, estradiol, serum parameters, and pregnancy rates were evaluated. Results showed no differences in semen parameters during 1 year of follow-up, and none of the men became azoospermic during the treatment.14

[FONZY007]

Hi I am on .75ml test E (200mg/ml) eow. I asked my Dr about hcg and he says its not necesaary. I seem to be seeing posts to the contrary. Is hcg needed as long as on trt? Also if I want to run a cycle of 500mg test e per week along with an oral do I need pct or can I just go back to trt doses? My plan is 12 weeks 500mg test e per week with 40mg dbol ed for 4 weeks. I have tried some aas before but of course really didnt know what I was doing.

Thank you.
48 yo. Many years of lifting, almost 2 years on trt

I personally would go look for another doctor, I inject 160-180mgs a week. I've backed down before to see and end of feeling run down. Took me almost 3 years also to hit the right spot. Good luck on fixing your issue.

[bass]

^^^ Fonz, where does 160-180 put you on the scale for total and free?

OP, i agree with the above. your best weapon against ill informed doctors is knowledge.

[Simon1972]

Consensus is clear on this one, if your Dr won't adjust your dose and you self inject you should at least do the following.

Split your dose in half and inject weekly or split into quarter and inject twice a week.

This will stabiise your test levels, give your more available test and prevent aromatasation of test to estrogen. This alone will improve your situation.

Having said that, once you get blood work done, I'd be surprised if your test would be high enough.

Either way, the twice weekly injection into stomach fat is the best protocol to follow, get blood work and work with your Dr to adjust dosage on the results

I take 75mg shot 2x a week. , (150mg week)

Hcg is of use as it converts to pregnenolone and dhea. The expression of those two hormones on your bodies biology can't be discounted and guys generally feel better on it. However this is secondary to getting your trt sorted first. Tackle hcg once your Dr is sorted with your test concerns. Maybe supplement on those two hormones until you get hcg. Easily bought on eBay.

[FONZY007]

^^^ Fonz, where does 160-180 put you on the scale for total and free?

OP, i agree with the above. your best weapon against ill informed doctors is knowledge.

I break into 2 injections a week and puts me around 700 total

[kelkel]

I break into 2 injections a week and puts me around 700 total

Always interesting to hear where other guys levels are on different doses. Fascinating how we all metabolize so differently.

[Simon1972]

I break into 2 injections a week and puts me around 700 total

Fonz, is that subQ or Im?

i do 150mg a week /split SubQ and that gets me at 865ng/dl,
847 p/mol (170-670) of free test
using anastrozole 1 tab a week/split and an E oF <44 (<160)

would be good to get a collation of results in a simple format to help get a general feel of what is he general expectation dose dependant from all the guys.

sorry to hijack the post OP!!

[BuzzardMarinePumper]

In GA this is standard treatment by MD's that get paid from Insurance Companies of the HMO group they are members of ! My Dr. is of the same thought process but not tied to only one HMO group ! He scripted me the same similarly @ 200mg of Cypionate 1 x every 2 weeks , with self inject at home ? Got me up to 375 and MD said I was in normal range and GTG ? WTF ! . . . . . Dr did script Astrosonol ( generic Arimidex ) @ 1mg a day due to E -2 being ( 72 ) and Dr saw no problem with E - 2 , further proving his lack of understanding of TRT ! I had to be very agressive to get Ai scripted ! I got balanced by going to 70 to 80 mg of Test. every 3.5 days and upped to 700 to 800 Test level and Ai @ .25mg the day after I inject putting my E - 2 at 26 to 30 ! I now have to get additional Testosterone from UGL and have huge supply of Ai . I also acquire HCG from online source that is thought to be repeatable by many members of this forum. So I get free BW paid by Insurance every 4 mths . Get a total Hormone blood panel as described in the sticky at the top of the HRT section of this forum and read it myself by guidelines given and request from my MD desired BW and scripts it is hit or miss but your health your responsibility ! There is more than enough info + knowledgeable members on this forum to be balanced and take charge of your own TRT ! This does require more than just going to the Dr and doing what ever he says with no questions !

Well Star may be just a GA. Medical Group , but they give every male that goes to a Well Star Dr the same 200mg bi-weekly and inject in the office because they get plenty of insurance money due to uneducated males that think what they are doing is a good TRT protocol ? The Dr's know they are not providing good health care but case the money , actual in violation of their medical oath ! This goes to show that so many Dr's are practicing medical treatment as opposed to being professional medical providers !

Hi I am on .75ml test E (200mg/ml) eow. I asked my Dr about hcg and he says its not necesaary. I seem to be seeing posts to the contrary. Is hcg needed as long as on trt? Also if I want to run a cycle of 500mg test e per week along with an oral do I need pct or can I just go back to trt doses? My plan is 12 weeks 500mg test e per week with 40mg dbol ed for 4 weeks. I have tried some aas before but of course really didnt know what I was doing.

Thank you.
48 yo. Many years of lifting, almost 2 years on trt

[FONZY007]

Always interesting to hear where other guys levels are on different doses. Fascinating how we all metabolize so differently.

True Kel, wierd huh. I even tested lower also like 500 range. I was like wth lol. I fell I'm a hypermetabolizer and was thinking to switching to 3 times a week smaller injections. Idk though, I fell normal and that what counts

[FONZY007]

Fonz, is that subQ or Im?

i do 150mg a week /split SubQ and that gets me at 865ng/dl,
847 p/mol (170-670) of free test
using anastrozole 1 tab a week/split and an E oF <44 (<160)

would be good to get a collation of results in a simple format to help get a general feel of what is he general expectation dose dependant from all the guys.

sorry to hijack the post OP!!

I do IM, and I also take liquidex .25 - .30 twice a week day after injection

[Mr.BB]

Always interesting to hear where other guys levels are on different doses. Fascinating how we all metabolize so differently.

Yes, but without knowing how much time has passed since last shot is hard to take definite conclusions.

[bass]

I break into 2 injections a week and puts me around 700 total

Always interesting to hear where other guys levels are on different doses. Fascinating how we all metabolize so differently.

Exactly why i asked. not hijacking this thread but i believe it adds to the conversation and knowledge. i do 80mgs twice a week SQ and it puts me at 840-850 and my free at 34-35 on scale of 5-21. no AI, and my E2 is at the low end. SQ really works for me.

[FONZY007]

Exactly why i asked. not hijacking this thread but i believe it adds to the conversation and knowledge. i do 80mgs twice a week SQ and it puts me at 840-850 and my free at 34-35 on scale of 5-21. no AI, and my E2 is at the low end. SQ really works for me.

While doing SQ my total test dropped to 450, but I was able to let go of the AI. Then I was trading off then eventually just went back to IM