Urgent: Need help plz. Can tanked E2 cause *debilitating* pain and weakness?

[forrest_and_trees]

I apologize in advance for the long post, but this is serious.... Thx for reading it...

Starting 5-6 years ago, from time to time, after an evening of heavy drinking, I'd wake up in the middle of the night with muscles *so weak and painful* that I can *barely* move! To be clear, it's NOT a result of working out. When it fist began, it would usually clear up within 12-48 hours, depending on how much I'd drank. Early on, the occurrences were pretty rare, but over the years they've become more frequent, until more recently, within the past couple months, it happens almost every time I drink; regardless of how little.

The feeling is nothing like the dull ache of sore muscles after a workout; it's much worse and as I've said, my muscles feel weak. For example, if I try to stand up, I get shooting pains in my thighs that increases the more I exert myself. If I try to use my arms to help push myself up, I get the same pain in my biceps and forearms. [this is all over my body] Once I'm standing, I can only shuffle my feet, because I'm unable to lift them. One night, a few years ago, I'd fallen asleep while sitting on the floor watching TV with my back to couch. When I woke up at about 1AM and tried to get up off the floor, the pain was so bad that it took me nearly 10 mins just to get my butt up on the couch, so I was sitting, and another 5 mins to stand. If the house had been on fire I'd be dead! Sometimes, on good days, I'd wake up the next morning and all was fine like it never happened. More often though, the pain and severity of the weakness gradually fades within a day or so. Sometimes it's limited to the larger muscles; other times it's my forearms and upper body. And sometimes, one leg or arm can be worst than the other. There are times it gets bad enough that doing something as simple as pushing down the plunger on a soap dispenser, or opening a refrigerator drawer, causes pain in my forearms the harder I push or pull.

Additionally, in the past, whenever I had sore muscles from workouts or exerting myself, anti inflammatories like Alieve would do the trick, but not with this. It's like my muscles are missing an essential chemical or hormone.

I've covered the obvious things, like hydration, electrolytes, B12, high doses of potassium, magnesium, and even backing soda in water, in case it's lactic acid build up. But it inconclusive if that's actually helping. My blood sugar is good and my liver function has been good; I have bi-annual check ups with my doc, for the HRT, and get full panels done each time. Last was in April and I have another appt next week to go over my labs from two weeks ago. I've told my doctor about this in the past, but he didn't seem too concerned. However at that point it wasn't as severe or frequent.

Initially it took a night of binge drinking to bring this on, and even then it was pretty rare, now I can feel it with only a couple beers, with the frequency is increasing to nearly anytime I drink now.

Prior to ten years ago, I drank daily. Usually a twelve pack on weeknights and hard alcohol with the friends on weekends. But after discovering my Low T and Hypothyroidism, and beginning my HRT ten years ago, my drinking decreased quite a bit. I'd try to limit it to Fri and Sat nights or social events; typically drinking 2 or 3 tall boys or a few cocktails. Now I'm down to 1 night a week, and trying to take a weekend or two off. But at this point I'm prepared to give up drinking altogether. The frequency, severity, and duration of these, "attacks" has increased to the point it has me very concerned.

This past Friday I had a couple drinks at home and all seemed OK, but then I was woken up at 4AM because the pain and weakness was so bad I could barely roll over. The next day I was sore, but I began feeling better by mid day. Good enough that I took a motorcycle ride and I figured that was the end of that episode. But around dusk I began feeling weakness in my arms, even though I hadn't had anything to drink. By around 10PM I was feeling worse. That was the first time it's ever reoccurred after getting better without drinking again. I woke up Sunday, able to get about, but still feeling mild pain doing even the simplest tasks. By mid day I felt better, and thought the episode was over, but by sundown, the pain had gradually returned. This time predominately in more forearms. it got so bad, that around 9PM I couldn't' even use my computer mouse. Here it is Monday morning, and while I was able to get a good night's sleep, in the morning I still felt a touch of soreness anytime I exert myself; nothing serious, but it was still there. Thankfully though, as I'm writing this, I'm now back to normal; I can bound up a flight of stairs, two steps at a time, where I could *barely* get up one stair at a time, with great pain, just two nights ago ..This time around was definitely the longest it's ever lasted.

Now... About the the E2. For the past year I haven't been doing a regular routine of Anastrozol. I've tried cutting back and only taking it when I felt like I needed it, and I think may have over done it Friday... At least I'm hoping so... After injecting on Wednesday night, I took a half 1mg on Thursday morning. Then on Friday morning, I pinned 300IU of HCG and preemptively took a 1mg AI. That evening, I noticed my nipples were getting puffy, so I took another 1mg. Could this have tanked my E2 enough to cause all this pain and weakness? [God I hope so. Because the alternative is worse.] FWIW, I don't experience the usual clicking of the joints during these episodes.

FWIW - A few months back, my pharm could only get a brand of test cyp I've had bad reactions to in the past. Normally I get 4-1ml vials a month, but this time they could only get me a 10ml vial of a brand I've had good response too. At first I didn't feel any different using this new 10ml vial, but after a week or two, began feeling little things, like not wanting to leave the house, even on weekends. [I work from home] No longer being interested in the thing I liked doing or needed to do. Then I began feeling bummed out all the time, then eventually anxious, and so on. You would think this all screams red flag, but it happened so gradually, that I was in a fog before I realized what was happening. During this period, I began feeling the same kind of weakness and pain in my muscle, but more mild. [If last weekend was a 10, this was more like a 3 or 4.] Things like getting up out of bed or even a chair took effort. My forearms would hurt a little if I picked up something heavy. I started to think something was *seriously* wrong with me, but then I finished that vial and pinned myself with an new 1ml. Within hours, my mood began to improve. That night I'd slept better than I had in a couple months. By the next day the pain was gone and my muscles felt stronger again. But this only lasted about a day, and within 36 hours of pinning, I felt like crap again. Until the next pin and repeat.

To stop the roller coaster, I figured screw it, that 10ml bottle was obviously bad and my levels must be low, so I pinned a full 1ml [vs. .5ml] to give me a boost an get me baseline back to a better place. This definitely helped. That was 2 weeks ago and this past week I switched my pinning days form Fri AM and Mon PM, to Sun AM and Wed PM. Rather than skip a day during the switch, to keep my baseline up, I pinned twice in two days; Mon PM and Wed PM; which is why I took the second AI on Friday. I figured my E2 was likely higher due to the extra T in my system.

So I guess this all begs the question: can drinking alcohol effect your E2 levels in some people, [or at least your muscles ability to utilize the e2] and if your E2 drop low enough, can it become debilitating?

Thanks again for reading this post. I greatly appreciate your in put and would very much like to hear your thoughts. I"m crossing my fingers it's only low E2

Thx,

F/T

[GearHeaded]

what your experiencing is not at all odd or rare. its pretty common among people who have been fairly heavy drinkers most their life. its gets worse and worse the older you get and the longer you keep drinking . its alcoholic muscle and nerve damage. alcohol is destroying your ability to 'fire' your muscle with electrical nerve impulses. over time if you keep drinking it can get to the point that it becomes permanent and you can end up losing the use of your limbs and ability to even walk. yes you can end up in a wheel chair from alcoholic nerve damage.

your body is telling you that its already damaged. time to quit while you still have a chance and nothing permanent has happened as of yet.

fyi - I'm speaking from experience. I've looked into this because of my own circumstances and I have experienced exactly what you have. I also had a friend that drank all day every day, and the last time I seen him (years ago) he was struggling to walk and to get in and out of a car cause his legs were so weak and painful to move

[forrest_and_trees]

GearHeaded, thank you so much for replying! Man, I'm just glad I posted here today; this makes lots of sense. FWIW This place already saved my ass once, [no exaggeration] and you may have just done it again. A million thanks to you and this forum!

So are you taking any supplements to manage yours? If so, any recommendations? I've been taking sublingual B12 for years, but ran out a while back and need to get some more, should I continue that along with a B Complex, or is the B Complex enough? What about Vitamin E and A? Do you take them?

If you are managing yours, have you noticed any improvements in your overall wellbeing, etc.?

You da man GearHeaded!

[GearHeaded]

sometimes we don't know things even exist or are real until we find them out or experience them for ourselves . you don't buy a bottle of whisky and it comes with paperwork (like a script from a pharmacy does) stating all the negative shit that can happen. "alcoholic nerve damage" is not listed on a warning label on a bottle of beer. but its real and can cripple you. you might have a liver of steel and think your fine, until one day your limbs stop functioning and you can't contract your muscles.

anyhow, I'm glad you posted. your body is giving you signs and its time to make a change for the better

I would focus on nutrition . eat lots of good quality Whole Foods that are micro nutrient dense. get your body filled with an abundance of nutrients.

I would focus on lowering inflammation.. the inflammation is part of the cause of your issues. alcohol is one of the most inflammatory things we can consume. your body needs a break from constant inflammation so it can heal itself.
this is also tied to your nutrition. you'll want to consume lots of high quality nutrient dense food but also lower inflammatory foods. this mainly means staying away from sugars, processed foods, and processed oils.
if you quit drinking all together, you'll likely have sugar cravings

as for supplements
- a good quality Chelated Muti vitamin and mineral supplement
- Taurine
- B complex
- Vitamin K2 and D3
- magnesium and zinc
- Choline and inositol
- NAC
- Coq10
- Fish oil

thats the basics . the list could easily go on and on . but again quality nutrition is your biggest support system right now

[forrest_and_trees]

Thx for those recommendations. Giving up the drinking is easy; it's eating high quality nutrient dense food that's the hard part. But what do they say? One step at a time.