How much HCG for TRT when fertility is a non-issue?

[ascendant]

Had a vasectomy, so getting my woman pregnant is not a concern. Everything I read online talks about how much HCG to take if you want to remain fertile. All I care about is them not shriveling up, lol. But, I mean I was doing 150IU 3x per week previously, and they never shrunk at all. And any time I have ever done cycles in the past, they don't shrink. So, I think ball shrinkage may not be an issue for me.

So basically, what's the min HCG you should take if all you care about is countering the negative effects of TRT (with just Test Cyp)?

[wellshii]

I take a very small amount.
My clinic sends me(not any more due to fda)
A 5000 iu vial.
That thing lasted me 4 months.
Im a firm believer in microdosing and tapering up.
Balls have been fine .

[F4iGuy]

Great question! I'm wondering about this now too.

[Swilderbeast]

Same I’ve had a vasectomy so ball shrinkage means nothing to me. But bounce back between cycles is my main concern.

[Cylon357]

Had a vasectomy, so getting my woman pregnant is not a concern. Everything I read online talks about how much HCG to take if you want to remain fertile. All I care about is them not shriveling up, lol. But, I mean I was doing 150IU 3x per week previously, and they never shrunk at all. And any time I have ever done cycles in the past, they don't shrink. So, I think ball shrinkage may not be an issue for me.

So basically, what's the min HCG you should take if all you care about is countering the negative effects of TRT (with just Test Cyp)?

If you are never going to come off, and fertility is REALLY your only concern, the minimum you need to take is zero iu per week.

But life isn't so simple. You might need to come off for some reason, or decide to come off, or decide you want kids, etc. If any of those happen, that 'no hcg' policy is going to suck.

I look at it like insurance: you may never need it, but when you do, you are glad you had.

So, i would say 500iu per week is a good number. Someone somewhere has put together a chart showing the typical amount of HCG to imitate natural production. I want to say, but am not sure, that 600iu per week maintains natural production levels, so that any thing you add with T is on top of natty. But don't quote me on that. You can quote me on the insurance analogy, though.

[Quester]

Had a vasectomy, so getting my woman pregnant is not a concern. Everything I read online talks about how much HCG to take if you want to remain fertile. All I care about is them not shriveling up, lol. But, I mean I was doing 150IU 3x per week previously, and they never shrunk at all. And any time I have ever done cycles in the past, they don't shrink. So, I think ball shrinkage may not be an issue for me.

So basically, what's the min HCG you should take if all you care about is countering the negative effects of TRT (with just Test Cyp)?

I haven't taken HCG with my TRT for a few years. Balls shrank then stabilized. If you add other compounds, you're balls will rpobably shrink a little. Other than shrinkage and virility, I don't think there's a reason to take HCG

[ascendant]

Thanks for the feedback guys. From what I'm gathering so far, I think the 450iu a week should suffice, if not maybe even less. I mean I'm in my 40s, so TRT is here to stay. And with the vasectomy, no other reason I'd ever come off. Definitely don't want more kids. Mainly just wanted to make sure that if there was anything else HCG impacted other than natural test production, I wasn't going to miss out on it. Plus, I like the idea of doing what I can to keep up my body's own test production at least a little while taking the exogenous test cyp. One thing I can definitely confirm as well is that the TRT between cycles makes it MUCH easier to keep gains after cycles, so I want to keep that test level as high as possible without health risks or other side-effects.

[ruffcute]

I use to take 250ui twice a week. It was always sufficient in keeping the nuts healthy the right size.
I would add though that if your going to keep the same vial and use it over 3 months or so - I use to get the 10,000Ui vial reconstituted with 4ml as per the guide.
Then you might want to increase the dose slightly as the weeks and months go on. I believe I read that HCG deteriorates, so maybe upping it from 250ui the first month of shots to, 300ui for the second month and 350ui per shot for the third.

[Test Monsterone]

Around 750 iu/week maintains normal endogenous test levels (according to a large study I read). I take even more than that and my balls have shrunken by around 30%. I only take it every 4th day, which may be too infrequent as the half-life is 24-36 hours. When I was doing more frequent injections my balls were bigger.

HCG also stimulates the testes to produce endogenous testosterone, which is said to reduce bad cholesterol, since our natural testosterone is produced from cholesterol.

[Painjunky]

If I’m understanding correctly, you all are saying that when on test with hcg , your natural production of test does not shut down? I was under the impression that all hcg did was mimic the production of LH so if and when you stoped taking exogenous test , your testes would be ready to restart production. Did the science change? This is interesting because my levels where always around 300/350pts higher when taking 500iu weekly with trt. And my natural total t levels before trt was 350 .
I quit taking it almost a year ago because I have no interest in having more kids and it was the most expensive part of trt besides blood work and since I could only get it in 10,000iu kits , it would go bad before I’d finish a vial. I can’t tell any difference in ball size but I did have to bump up the test dose to bring it back up to the low 900s

[Painjunky]

Can you post a link to that study by chance?

[Cylon357]

If I’m understanding correctly, you all are saying that when on test with hcg , your natural production of test does not shut down? I was under the impression that all hcg did was mimic the production of LH so if and when you stoped taking exogenous test , your testes would be ready to restart production. Did the science change? This is interesting because my levels where always around 300/350pts higher when taking 500iu weekly with trt. And my natural total t levels before trt was 350 .
I quit taking it almost a year ago because I have no interest in having more kids and it was the most expensive part of trt besides blood work and since I could only get it in 10,000iu kits , it would go bad before I’d finish a vial. I can’t tell any difference in ball size but I did have to bump up the test dose to bring it back up to the low 900s

This is essentially true, but is missing a bigger part of the picture.

In short: hcg causes the testicles to remain functioning and producing testosterone, but other parts of the overall system, the HPTA, are not functioning.

There are 3 parts to the HPTA axis: the hypothalamus, pituitary gland, and testicles. The hypothalamus determines if hormone release is needed. If so, it singles the pituitary gland to ramp up or slow down the release of LH based on what it sees. The LH tells the testicles to make test.

On cycle, or on trt, the hypothalamus determines 'whoa! too much!! too much!! halt production!!' and tells the pituitary to stop producing LH, which in turn stops the testicles from producing T. This can lead to testicular atrophy and will definitely lead to cessation of normal function.

HCG hops in here and pretends to be LH, so that the testicles remain functional.

So yes, you can maintain production while on AAS / TRT, but you are still shutting down part of the HPTA.

[Painjunky]

Got it. Thanks for the explanation.