Is natural T production suppression always directly proportional to exogenous T?

**edmundo22** · 08-16-2012, 03:04 PM

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

**Bonaparte** · 08-16-2012, 03:18 PM

Not really. Any decent dose of test will shut you down completely in a matter of weeks.

**steroid.com 1** · 08-16-2012, 03:39 PM

^^^^Maybe even less than that given how the negative feedback loop works.

**edmundo22** · 08-16-2012, 04:32 PM

Ok, then Will hcg maintain bassline T values while adding exogenous T?

**steroid.com 1** · 08-16-2012, 06:17 PM

hCG will produce natural Testosterone production but it largely unknown what amounts of hCG will produce how much increase in serum levels...we're all different.

**HRTstudent** · 08-16-2012, 11:35 PM

Your natural T production will shut down at even a small dose. Our bodies respond quite rapidly to this actually.

If you're on TRT and plan to be, then its safe to assume that afer about 2 weeks whatever T is in your system is "artificial".

**gbrice75** · 08-17-2012, 07:37 AM

This is of great interest to me as well, particularly keeping the testes stimulated to produce natural test as my wife and I want another kid or 2 asap. I am prescribed HCG (500iu 2x weekly) but need to find a doc who is versed with regards to HMG as my current doc had no clue about it.

**Juced_porkchop** · 08-17-2012, 09:36 AM

Originally Posted by HRTstudent

Your natural T production will shut down at even a small dose. Our bodies respond quite rapidly to this actually.

If you're on TRT and plan to be, then its safe to assume that after about 2 weeks whatever T is in your system is "artificial".

Pretty sure thats not true, you can even be on hrt for years and still have some comming from you. shut down doesnt always mean TOTAL shut down. some people eve run BIG long cycles and get there wife or GF preggo while on it, seen it.
id say after a few months you would be pretty shut down.
but the amount depends on the person, compounds and time on them in my op.

**steroid.com 1** · 08-17-2012, 09:49 AM

Originally Posted by Juced_porkchop

Pretty sure thats not true, you can even be on hrt for years and still have some comming from you. shut down doesnt always mean TOTAL shut down. some people eve run BIG long cycles and get there wife or GF preggo while on it, seen it.
id say after a few months you would be pretty shut down.
but the amount depends on the person, compounds and time on them in my op.

Correct; that's why it's best to use the terminology " HPTA Suppression".

Some men will shut down others will be severely suppressed.

The symptoms of both are the same however.

**bass** · 08-17-2012, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by edmundo22

Is natural T production suppression always directly proportional to exogenous T?

I'd say yes depending how long you been on TRT you will be shut down unless you do proper PCT, even then you'll be lucky to get back to 80% of where you were, and if your body tries to bounce back on its own it will be minimal.

**HRTstudent** · 08-17-2012, 01:11 PM

Originally Posted by Juced_porkchop

Pretty sure thats not true, you can even be on hrt for years and still have some comming from you. shut down doesnt always mean TOTAL shut down. some people eve run BIG long cycles and get there wife or GF preggo while on it, seen it.
id say after a few months you would be pretty shut down.
but the amount depends on the person, compounds and time on them in my op.

I said nothing in relation to fertility. Testosterone production and fertility is far far more complex.

But it is true, when you take testosterone exogenous our bodies respond rapidly in an effort to maintain homeostasis.

And I agree that shutdown is not an all or nothing scenario. But for all intents and purposes, " If you're on TRT and plan to be, then its safe to assume that after about 2 weeks whatever T is in your system is "artificial"."

**Bonaparte** · 08-17-2012, 01:50 PM

Originally Posted by Juced_porkchop

Pretty sure thats not true, you can even be on hrt for years and still have some comming from you. shut down doesnt always mean TOTAL shut down. some people eve run BIG long cycles and get there wife or GF preggo while on it, seen it.
id say after a few months you would be pretty shut down.
but the amount depends on the person, compounds and time on them in my op.

From everything I've seen, testosterone will always shut down LH and FSH production completely. There is no way that your pituitary will keep functioning when it is being bombarded with test and, more importantly, estrogen.
But this doesn't mean that you'll be infertile (not right away, at least). Some guys can remain fertile even after being shut down for years on HRT.

If you have bloodwork from someone who has been on supraphysiological doses of test for months (without using letro or SERMs the whole time) and still has any remaining LH and FSH production, I'd like to see it.