It seems common that most guys start on gels but go to injection's. Has anyone had long-term success with gel?
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It seems common that most guys start on gels but go to injection's. Has anyone had long-term success with gel?
As long as you absorb well, get your test to where you want it then its fine to continue with this, however injections are a far more effective delivery system for those that dont absorb the gel properaly so really just boils down to personal preference and of course cost.
well said by edmundo
several threads similar actually
kelkel was a long believer in the gel and did well
only few others in my 6 years here have i heard stuck with it for very long
just too inconvenient, messy
How long is long-term in your mind? Gel works well for me and I have been on (and off) for almost 2 years. Did injections for about 6 months...wasn't so good for me. Doing Testopel right now, but not sure if I will continue that beyond the so called normal 4 month efficacy period.
It is a pretty individual thing. Injections, if they work for you, are far cheaper than any alternative.
Id really like to know why a lot of guys that do well on gel for a while and then there after not so much, could it be something like the pores of the application site gradually get clogged up by the other preservative/ingredient's in the gel?
good questionQuote:
Originally Posted by edmundo22
i dont remember if that ever got completely figured out but thats a good theory, imo
i guess writing the mess off as inneffective was simpler when there are better, more effective, less messy, more convenient alternatives
Here's another question what exactly is going on when added Test is making us feel so much better?
I'v read a study that shows SSRI's lower testosterone and dopamine so does anyone know how raising Testosterone levels actually increases dopamine?
Yup :)
That is mainly what I was getting at, the reasons people switch. I was wondering if they switched because the gel was not working properly (not absorbing) or if it was other factor's such as cost and/or inconvenience. I think the main issue would perhaps be cost.Quote:
Originally Posted by jpkman
From what Ive heard it seems like the gel is expensive even with insurance. And some insurance won't let you use compounded cream.
I have very good insurance (for now...anything good can go away) and the gel co-pay is only a bit more than my co-pay for generic test. cyp. If you compare the actual price for gel (on patent) versus generic test. cyp., the difference is "huge". Were it not for good insurance, I'd go injections again in a new york minute.
The Testopel cost was another even bigger shocker. Won't discuss the price, but I was shocked. Again, my co-pay wasn't that big...but the cost to my employer was significant.
My concience may end up driving me back to injections eventually.
I think I officially hate pharmaceutical company's, they take something that's relatively inexpensive, convert it into a gel for convience and jack up the price, its way too expensive, my doc says he not allowed legally to prescribe shots, wouldn't be surprised if he's getting a percentage for pushing the gel.
About a year and a half for my husband. He's still doing well on it. Feels better on gels than shots in the libido department.
thanks for posting that...we dont hear a lot of proponentsQuote:
Originally Posted by PPC
can u also share if he uses certain areas to apply or any other possible tips/secrets
i remember feeling good on them as well and/but felt like something might be missing and in the back of my mind wanted my hands on the vial anyway so i dont know if i could have done well long term
wuts he use testim or androgel
I had no real issues with the gel. I was on 1.62% @ 6 pumps all covered by insurance. Had my level in the 800's at peak and 4-500's trough. It just pushed my DHT level through the roof. Since switching to cyp and evaluating the two I would not go back. Feel better and not slapping the gel on every day is nice. Still have about 3 bottles of it actually.
yeh for some reason i still have androgel been expired for 4/5 yearsQuote:
Originally Posted by kelkel
Deep down we're all hoarders! How you feeling JPK?
PRETTY DARN GOOD BRO....THANKS
first cardio follow up told em i'm pretty much 90% back lifting and cardio and he said attaboy....you prolly better off than u were the days leading to the big day and you gotta keep the fat off...but his opinion is the lipitor gonna keep me tight anyway
Excellent! Keep it up!
He uses androgel. He exfoliates then applies to shoulders, lats, upper arms and yes, he wipes some excess on his scrotum.Quote:
Originally Posted by jpkman
He doesn't require an AI using 8 pumps of the gel. He did require adex doing shots so this is method is easier for him to manage. At 8 pumps his T Total trough is a little below 600. So his peak is probably pretty close to 800. His latest E2 was 23 - nice.
I don't know his DHT. His doc is laid back and doesn't monitor that. But he has no prostate issues, in fact on the gel his voiding is great. Four years ago, pre any TRT his PSA was 1.3, now after a few years of TRT it is 1.8. That half point jump is to be expected after commencing TRT but I guess his DHT is not causing prostate issues if his PSA is not constantly rising.
JPKman, are you now using Niacin after your recent health issue? Apparently it is the only thing which will help with Lpa levels. Statins won't do that. Slo niacin or prescribe niaspan will help eliminate the flushing. Has your Doc talked to you about this option?
Thanks ppc
Actually just lipitor and a beta blocker and aspirin
My family doc had given me some samples of a statin that had a niacin in it think its called simcor...boy an hour after taking I would feel that flushing for 30 minutes...I now have plenty of lipitor...he said that it WILL lower the ldl but i will monitor it
Yes, it has to be a slow release niacin or it will cause serious flushing. The lipitor should lower the LDL but didn't you once mention you had high levels of Lipoprotein (a)? That's known as the widow maker and it is purely genetic and a key marker for heart attack risks. Diet does not play a part in LPa levels. Exercise will not bring it down. I'm going by memory whether you mentioned you had levels of this protein or not, could be wrong. The niacin, to my knowledge is the only thing that will have a positive effect on bringing LP(a) down. Niacin must be at least 1 gram per day in dosing to have an effect on those levels I've read. Dr Arthur Agatston, The author of the book The South Beach Diet is a cardiologist and has a lot to say about the benefits on niacin of LP(a) levels in the book he wrote specifically for cardiovascular concerns called The South Beach Heart Program. It's a pretty good read.
You can get slo niacin from any pharmacy. Flush free niacin is different and will not be the powerful heavy hitter one with elevated levels of LP(a) would need.
Yes I do....sorry when u abreviated I thought u meant lipids...yes i confirmed I had hi lipoprotein a 7/8 years ago...THANKS SO MUCH
Ppc can I ask does exfoliating make that much of a difference in your husbands experience?
Sorry, I don't know the difference. He has always exfoliated since using gels.Quote:
Originally Posted by edmundo22
When I used gel, I wore a plastic glove (like food preparers wear) to eliminate waste. A single glove would last for weeks. I like gels but switch primarily because injections give you a more consistent levels and higher ones if you wish. When I used gels my test levels would be over 1200 a few hours after application and then would drop to 500. All in all, I think injections are easier as you don't have to worry about transference or waiting a few hours before swimming for absorption to take place. After switching, I found injections to be much more effective because I can maintain a higher consistent level of test.