non-script slin with androgel?

**Legal_Lifter** · 05-21-2004, 12:07 PM

i am on 4 times the normal dose of androgel (from my doctor) and it still seems worthless. blood tests show very low test levels. i am considering adding slin on my own. i have not researched the diff types recently, but last i checked there were perscription and non-perscription forms of slin. unfortunatley, if memory serves, it was the long acting, more dangerous type that you can pick up OTC??? is this still the case? seems odd that the safer form would be the one requiring a script... but most of the laws governing hormones are hoplessly misguided...

also, for any slin experts, i have read both for and against going IM instead of sub-Q. any thoughts?

**einstein1905** · 05-21-2004, 12:18 PM

The shorter acting insulin , Humalog, is prescription only here in the states. You can purchase it from online int'l pharmacies easily though.
Get your doc to switch you over to injectable test.
What arguments have you heard against going IM with insulin?

**Legal_Lifter** · 05-22-2004, 09:52 AM

i am working hard to find a legit, knowledgeable doctor for my primary care to refer me to. i may have a line on one that will not look at me like a deer in headlights and say they do not understand endocrinology and were lost five minutes back in our conversation about testosterone and estrogen blocking and HCG , etc...

as far as slin IM... i do not like sub-Q, and tried both methods, but not long enough to note results on my body. i know the standard method is sub-Q. a few people said that IM would be fine, a few said it will cause it to be even longer acting and more unpredictable as to the results and proper dosage??? if i do it, i want to do the legal form or have a script for the safer form, but i also want to do it right...

***JohnnyB*** · 05-22-2004, 11:00 AM

Bro get you test level normalized before doing anything alse. I don't know about you but when mine was low I was always moody, get back to normal before starting to do other thing to add muscle.

JohnnyB

**Legal_Lifter** · 05-22-2004, 12:31 PM

unfortunately, that is "the big problem". u & i know what i need to restart my test production, but most doctors don't. i am 36, so it is a good time for testosterone replacement anyway. but this androgel is not effective on me as it is on some. even with HCG , clomid, etc... i do not think my test level will come back to what it was in my 20's (1100) and then "STAY" there. it will drop again. most doctors seem to feel that as long as it is between 200-800 a man should be happy. we all know that is not always true. my last test showed 80... yes 80, not 800. this is really bad. i will need continuous supplementation forever to have "high normal" to supra physiological levels. the strange part is that, while the low level does affect my mood and energy, and i am much weaker and lighter... the doctor keeps claiming i do not "appear" to be showing the normal signs of low test levels (in HIS opinion)... i am about 6 foot, 220lbs, 16% fat and if i muster the urge to actually train & eat for any length of time without quiting, can still press 405lbs for 4 reps and a 450lb single. i am bigger and stronger than the doctor, and apparently he considers having sex at least once per dayor two above average. but he is missing the point. i was happier and healthier at 250lbs with 5%-8% bodyfat, benching 500lbs and enjoying sex as many times per day as i could get it. i had more energy and my mood was great. most doctors (like mine) are quick to load you up on chemicals like zoloft and trazadone and narcotics like xanax (buckets of it). but these do not work on many people, and in fact lower test levels further and make people weaker and worse. it has been clinically proven that men past 30 that do not respond to those drugs, that were found to have low test levels, once those levels were restored, all was just peachy. i know that slin will not "fix" me, but i was hoping it would help me while i continue to try to find a doctor with the common sense and ability to get my T level up and keep it there indefinatly. it isn't rocket science, but they must bow the the almighty drug companies and government, which leaves most of us hanging out to dry, and wastes millions of health insurance dollars on the most costly and useless meds. oh well, my soap box is tilting to one side, i know i am preaching to the choir. but, it is very frustrating knowing exactly what you need and hitting so many road blocks.

**Legal_Lifter** · 05-22-2004, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by einstein1905

The shorter acting insulin , Humalog, is prescription only here in the states. You can purchase it from online int'l pharmacies easily though.
Get your doc to switch you over to injectable test.
What arguments have you heard against going IM with insulin?

i am trying to get him to see the light or refer me to someone that was actually awake thru med school. which is the OTC slin? is it Humalin? i "lost" my notes when i "lost" my gear and freedom.