What if you use all whey protein with slin?

***Mr. Sparkle*** · 04-11-2005, 05:25 PM

I was thinking the other day when I read something that Gear said, he said that he always uses simple sugars as his sugar source while on slin.... So that made me think.... Insulin is active for 2.5 hours... then after that its back to normal. So while the slin is active why dont we just use whey the whole time?

So it would go a little something like this.... This is for 10ius of humalog IM
Shot plus 10-15 min 80g of whey and for me 80g of dex and 3g of CEE
1 hour after the drink, more whey... 50g and 40-50g of dex...1g of CEE
1 hour after that repeat above

By this time the insulin that was injected is pretty much used up, BG gets to the normal range. So my thinking is this, if you are shutting nutriants and a higher level with slin, then why take the time to break down solid foods? So is this one of those wow Sparkle thats a good idea, (like the lagging body part thread).... or is this just an ignorant way, so to speak, to go about it?

**wilthepill123** · 04-11-2005, 05:53 PM

Thats the "whey" I do it. Ahohoho. But seriously thats how i prefer to do it, I've always wondered why everyone consume solids as their PPWO meal while on Slin, it just doesnt make sense

***JohnnyB*** · 04-11-2005, 05:58 PM

I would only use whey protein isolates, it has less fat then any other whey

JohnnyB

**Ironman5151** · 04-11-2005, 05:59 PM

good question bump

**Whitey** · 04-11-2005, 06:35 PM

Yes, that is an interesting thought. Presumably you could absorb more protein that way.

It would be good to have a couple facts on the table:
How long does it take to digest and absorb whey vs. solid protein?
What is the rate of absorption of protein on insulin ? That would tell you how much protein you should use to maximize your absorption capability.

Of course, I doubt there are easy answers to this, especially the last question...

***Mr. Sparkle*** · 04-11-2005, 07:22 PM

Will, great minds think alike

Whitey- Well Id say that if you have too much then thats good... I mean all you would do was crap it out.... haha. Im sure whey iso is way faster absorbing than say a steak....

JB- The protein I use is whey iso... substance HP ohh so tasty!!!

Im glad Im not alone on this, I will do this from now on and see if I can tell a difference...

Seems like this very simplistic way to do it, just might work

**jerseyboy** · 04-11-2005, 07:25 PM

Originally Posted by Mr. Sparkle

I was thinking the other day when I read something that Gear said, he said that he always uses simple sugars as his sugar source while on slin.... So that made me think.... Insulin is active for 2.5 hours... then after that its back to normal. So while the slin is active why dont we just use whey the whole time?

So it would go a little something like this.... This is for 10ius of humalog IM
Shot plus 10-15 min 80g of whey and for me 80g of dex and 3g of CEE
1 hour after the drink, more whey... 50g and 40-50g of dex...1g of CEE
1 hour after that repeat above

By this time the insulin that was injected is pretty much used up, BG gets to the normal range. So my thinking is this, if you are shutting nutriants and a higher level with slin, then why take the time to break down solid foods? So is this one of those wow Sparkle thats a good idea, (like the lagging body part thread).... or is this just an ignorant way, so to speak, to go about it?

Wow Sparkle, that's a great idea! No really. I use Isopure because it's a protein isolate and has 0 fat and 50 grams of protein.

**joevette** · 04-11-2005, 07:47 PM

Interesting idea. I've used whey for my second meal before, but there was no reasoning behind it.

**Gear** · 04-12-2005, 02:55 AM

Isolate PWO and whole foods for the rest of the time while insulin is active. Your body will respond and digest whole foods a lot easier than processed nutrition such as powders. That is why I use whole foods and not protein powders. You put your self to the test and use carb powders as your carbs source for the whole week, then following week use carbs from whole foods and I bet you, you will feel better and put more weight on while using carbs from whole foods than processed foods (powders).

I only have 2 shakes p/day (ISO PWO & concentrate before bed with some healthy fats), and the rest of my protein I get from whole foods during the day. That's just what I do.

-Gear

**Gear** · 04-12-2005, 03:01 AM

I would never rely on powders. Most powders are there for the extra benefits only, and are not there to be replaced for whole foods. All those meal replacement products that come in powder form are no good if you ask me. If you want better gains and give your body the best form of nutrients (and this is important espeically when using insulin ) then stick with whole foods. ISO PWO is all good though, that's about it but.

Sometimes if I miss a meal for whatever reason, I will have a shake instead, because its better that you have some kind of nutrients than none. But I would much rather stick with whole foods.

-Gear

**wilthepill123** · 04-12-2005, 04:38 AM

Gear makes a point. However, that still doesnt disprove the point that whey protein may digest faster and more efficiently while slin is active....

Your body will respond and digest whole foods a lot easier than processed nutrition such as powders.

Now I've always believed that protein shakes are broken down a whole lot faster and more efficiently than complex protein sources (like chicken or fish), because it is already processed, while with complex protein even the quality of your chewing can affect the protein you actually absorb! Im not attacking what you're saying Gear, you're a smart fellow, I'd just like to understand the science behind what you're telling us.

Maybe someone should put both methods to the test and juxtapose their gains? Sparkle our aspiring insulin guru you up for the challenge?

**Gear** · 04-12-2005, 05:34 AM

I see what yo are saying, but I think you may have missunderstood part of my point.

What I was trying to say is, "body response to form of nutrients", not which form of nutrients gets broken down faster. Just because certain form of nutrients are broken down fast, it doesn't mean your body will respond well to it. So that excatly was my point. = High/low body response to nutrient forms. (processed & non-processed foods)

I am only going by my experience and from what I believe and from what I have learnt. The reason why I think non processed foods are better and will be more suitable for our bodies is because of its purity. With processed foods such as powders, there are many chemicals added to those powders that our bodies may not respond to as well to simply because they are not used to getting those added chemicals and because those chemicals are not natural. It probably does no harm, but I am sure there still is a minor difference. So, I choose to eat whole foods because they are 100% what it is. For example, boiled egg whites... boiled egg whites are nothing but pure protein with no addetives, nothing but pure eggwhite.

On the other, you can also get egg white in powder form which has been processed, and usually when something is processed, there are addetives for colour, flavour, taste, etc. Also we all know eggwhites have to be kept in the fridge and only usually last about 2 weeks. If kept outside the fridge, it will go off a lot sooner than that. Powders expiry date is 1yr+. So what addetive is it that they use to keep this apparent "100% nothing but pure eggwhite powder" from going off (even when out of the fridge)? These are the kind of addetives that our bodies dont need because they are not natural. Whole foods don't have these addetives.

I have a friend that is a successfull biochem in Australia, and he makes his own supplments. He showed me what protein isolate looks like half way through the process. It looks like yogurt. If you put it in the cup and turm the cup upside down, it will still be stuck. Even thicker than chocolate moose/cream etc. I said to him "how the hell do you turn that into such fine powder form"? He said, "easy, certain chemicals... same with tablets too. For example, certain chemicals must be used to keep the tablet in one piece and from not falling apart". I said "so when making tablets, you have to use "whatever" to be able to turn it into powder form, and also use another chemical so the tab does not come apart and stays in one piece"? He laughed, and said "there many other chemicals that are in all supplments, otherwise no one would use these supps because they would taste bad and probably wouldn't be very comfy to eat either becaue of the form they are in". So, because these addetives are not natural, our bodies do not need them.

To cut this long of a story short, to me, it is common sense that your body will respond better to whole foods simply because of their purity. And when using insulin, because insulin is very diet dependant, the level of response that your body will have to "whatever" you are having is very important.

So, it is not about how long it takes for your body to break it down, more importantly, its more about how well your body responds to it, and how well your body likes that "form" of nutrient you just had. IMO, there is no way you can live by consuming powders. Well I am sure you could live, but I think you would end up in an unhealthier state than if you consumed whole foods instead.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying powders are bad, I think they are beneficial for what we are doing, and quite frankly, I canot go without my aminos, protein, and the rest of the processed supplments I use. But if just believe that if our body had a choice to choose from processed and non processed, it would choose the non processed nutrients.

Hope I haven't confused anyone too much.

-Gear

**wilthepill123** · 04-12-2005, 01:13 PM

Good point Gear, i understand perfectly

***Mr. Sparkle*** · 04-13-2005, 01:26 PM

I see what you mean..... but Im talking about the small amount of time that slin is active... I know you know that Im just saying. Whey protein is broken down within an hour.... how long does it take to digest a peice of meat?
So 50g of whey, or 50g of protein from beef.... in this instance Id like to take the whey...

**Latimus** · 04-13-2005, 04:10 PM

i would love to have the time and money to eat 400grams of stake/chicken/fish etc but i dont have the time to do it...nor do i want to spend my whole day making these meals and i have better things to spend my money on...lol such as igf-1 lol....anyway i have always used a ton of whey protein with enzymes lots of vits...fiber, flax oil and greens......i have 3 solid meals a day but i find my body has grown off the whey as well as it would off real foods.....so i go with whey.....cheap/fast...couldnt be happier with whey...love it!

**Gear** · 04-14-2005, 04:03 AM

Originally Posted by RedBaron

As already mentioned above as well, your body digests and treats the protein sources somewhat differently. While protein powders are great for keeping the protein count up, over reliance on them won't give you as good of results as getting a good portion of your protein from solid meals. I will typically eat four solid protein meals per day and have three to four shakes per day. The times I have tried to cut down on the solid meals and just drink more shakes, I seem to have more trouble holding my lean weight.

Great point, that's excatly what I meant too. The only time I have shakes is PWO and before bed, and the rest of my meals are from whole foods. Sometimes I may replace a shake for a meal if I don't have enough time for a proper meal, but I would much rather have a proper meal.

I have also tried to consume shakes during the day, and even the weight gainers did not help me maintain weight, and it made me feel not as healthy.

-Gear