GH, Insulin, T3, and AAS

[itsjinx]

I am starting a cycle of Jin, insulin, t3, and AAS(Tren,Test,Deca) and I am wondering how to filter in the Jin, insulin and t3 with the AAS. I have never taken Jin or Insulin but I plan on doing 10IU ED 5 on 2 off for 10 weeks(50IU's a week). I was told to take 3IU of insulin 2 times per day while on the GH while also taking Cynomel(T3). Does this seem accurate as far as doses? Has anyone used 10IU's per day? Most people that I see posting are talking about 2 to 5 IU's per day so I'm wondering if 10IU's is too much or still too little. I am going for lots of mass and some leaness as my main goals. Current stats: 6'2, 190lbs. 10% B/F, 23 years old.

Any info is appreciated!

[LL08]

10ius a day is way too high to start with. This might be the end point but IMO sides from this could be tremendous. Start off with 3iu gh a day and see how that goes then go up to a max of 6iu a day. As for the t3 I'd only use a max of 25mcg. Insulin is a whole other kettle of fish. research that hard. Sorry I'll post more info later I'm in a hurry.

-LL

[itsjinx]

10ius a day is way too high to start with. This might be the end point but IMO sides from this could be tremendous. Start off with 3iu gh a day and see how that goes then go up to a max of 6iu a day. As for the t3 I'd only use a max of 25mcg. Insulin is a whole other kettle of fish. research that hard. Sorry I'll post more info later I'm in a hurry.

-LL

LL, thank you for your responses in this post and the other one. I guess I'm just confused as to why GH has such a good reputation for building mass if all I ever hear about is people taking 2 to 5IU a day and saying they put on a few pounds only per month. I've taken 3 AAS cycles now with every steroid ever made and had very good results but I'm looking to go above what steroids have done and venture into the GH and insulin.Are you suggesting that if I were to do 5 IU/s per day 5on/2off with a 10 week AAS cycle would be better? I've heard from many people that without the Insulin that GH is a waste of time because the two are needed for synergistic effects. If that is the case, what would you say is the best dose of insulin? I have spent many hours researching Insulin and thats how I came to the conclusion of that dose. Thanks again!

[LL08]

Well insulin isn't as much my forte I'll leave a more definative post on this for bros like Gear and Mr. Sparkle. If your just doing this recreationally I would definitely not go past 10iu per day with the insulin, I do know bros using more but is this a good idea. I don't know. With the slin you must build it up also. For building up Slin will be incredible and you are correct slin and gh do have synergistic effects.

Now the hype from gh has been from the fact that through its release of igf-1 the bodybuilder can actually pass there genetic limits in terms of number of muscle fibers. This is through hyperplasia or the branching out of satellite cells or muscle fibers. The effectiveness of this as a bodybuilding compound are not very well researched as this would be unethical.

What I think will surprise you though is that Insulin alone is rumoured to be the reason that body builders lately have been getting so big. So learn about insulin and let me warn you there is a lot to read on this forum...As for gh I'd reco a longer term cycle of this and cycle igf-1 with it. This will be the best for bb purposes as the most important growth factor released by rHGH is IGf-1 and LR3IGF-1 shows results much sooner.

I hope this helped you somewhat.

-LL

[Xe0n]

Hi bro,

Run HGH between 5-10IU 5 on 2 off, personally I'd run about 6-8IU if I could afford it... I believe it was BDTR that said his hat size increased 2 sizes after he ran 10IU of HGH for a little while... that's a bit scary I wouldn't want my head to get too big, so I'd probably go with around 6-8IU... I'd also split it into 2iu shots, so maybe 3-4 shots per day for maximum effectiveness. The minimum I would do is 2 shots per day...

Shoot insulin at 10iu PWO, but start at 3iu and work up to the 10iu dosage. Make sure you do adequate research on the slin meal timing, you must take in 10g of carbs per iu immediately (10g/iu initially anyway, until you get used to the feel and have a blood glucose monitor to test your bg levels), and then follow the shot with a meal 45-60 mins later of about 50g protein 50g carbs and then another meal a following hour later with 40g protein 40g carbs. Don't consume any fats at all for 4 hrs after the shot, and don't sleep until 4 hrs has passed since the shot. This timing is all for the use of Humalog or equivalent. (Novorapid)

You can add an additional shot of insulin in the morning or at mid day, but the general consensus is that it's not really necessary, plus you will have to watch your fat intake strictly all day, and with the carb consumption from 2 shots you will probably gain some fat... I'd leave adding additional shots of slin out of the equation until you get yourself into a big plateau at a large weight, (250lb+) for you also risk things such as decreased insulin sensitivity...

Run T3 at 12.5-25mcg per day... I'd go with 12.5mcg if you are trying to bulk hard and 25mcg if you care more for staying lean, I've seen people run it at either dose and it works fine. You could also crank that up if you wanted to cut...

What doses of gear are you running bro. PM me on that one if you want...

P.S My next cycle is 12 weeks, using insulin PWO, and also in the mornings during PCT (great for fighting catabolism during pct, not necessary when you are on cycle) I am also running HGH 3iu 5 on 2 off until I run out... (because I can't afford more)

Hope this has helped

[LL08]

XeOn be prepared to buy itsjinx new shoes and surgery on his jaw hands and lower back if your reco'ing him taking hgh doses that high first up. Itsjinx your 23 so chances are your epiphyseals in your lower back haven't closed and your legs have so with high doses you will get bigger hands, feet jaw and the lower back may cause some problems. You may have back problems down the track. Just be careful. I can afford it and I would never go over 6iu a day. Just my opinion though. Cheers

-LL

[G-Force]

Hi bro,

Run HGH between 5-10IU 5 on 2 off, personally I'd run about 6-8IU if I could afford it... I believe it was BDTR that said his hat size increased 2 sizes after he ran 10IU of HGH for a little while...

speaking of BDTR

where has he gone

i've been away for a couple of months but have just come back and havent seen him around
there were rumours of a banning....

[MMA]

I am starting a cycle of Jin, insulin, t3, and AAS(Tren,Test,Deca) and I am wondering how to filter in the Jin, insulin and t3 with the AAS. I have never taken Jin or Insulin but I plan on doing 10IU ED 5 on 2 off for 10 weeks(50IU's a week). I was told to take 3IU of insulin 2 times per day while on the GH while also taking Cynomel(T3). Does this seem accurate as far as doses? Has anyone used 10IU's per day? Most people that I see posting are talking about 2 to 5 IU's per day so I'm wondering if 10IU's is too much or still too little. I am going for lots of mass and some leaness as my main goals. Current stats: 6'2, 190lbs. 10% B/F, 23 years old.

Any info is appreciated!

GH is not AS, so don't fall into the trap of thinking of it the same way and trying to make it fit into a roid cycle. yes it does stack well with test, but it's great for PCT too, and works much better with longer cycles. and you would get dramaticly more bang for your buck running 3 IUs/day 3 times as long., if you're looking for big results in a shorter amount of time, use igf1lr3, ould fit your mass goals better than GH anyway.

[LL08]

speaking of BDTR

where has he gone

i've been away for a couple of months but have just come back and havent seen him around
there were rumours of a banning....

Retired

[itsjinx]

Thanks everyone for your replies, I really do appreciated it!

Is it then fair to say that the general consenus would be for me to substitute Insulin for IGF-1 and stack that with the GH and AAS?

LL, you scared the balls out of me enough to convince me to do a consistant 5 IU ED 5on/2off. If I were to do this, I would be using GH before, during, and after the cycle because you guys are saying its good to have GH going before AAS and that its also good to have it after for PCT. What would you recommend for doses of IGF-1 if stacked with these portions of GH for maximum mass gains?

[fred9]

why do you not use hgh 7days a week...5on 2 off is just to safe some money...if you can afford 10iu 5on 2off , then i would go with 5iu each day

[Gear]

Most people run GH 5/2 or 6/1 and are happy with the results, so why not save the extra money instead of running GH ED.

-Gear

[MMA]

why do you not use hgh 7days a week...5on 2 off is just to safe some money...if you can afford 10iu 5on 2off , then i would go with 5iu each day

a lot of people think long term ED use would destroy your endo GH production, it's not just about saving money.

[itsjinx]

a lot of people think long term ED use would destroy your endo GH production, it's not just about saving money.

Yeah 5/2 was for me not destroying my natural GH, not cost. Any info on IGF-1 doses for this 5iu 5/2 GH intake?

[MMA]

alright, you're obviously intelligent and do good research, but now we're getting into some territory and substances that are so new, there are no definitive answers. the interactions of the drugs we know about are already very complex, and then we're getting into new drugs that we just don't have a big body of info on yet.

here are some of the issues we're running into. you're correct IGF is much better suited to your goals than a high dose GH cycle. however, there is some evidence that IGF is suppressive to GH production. which means there is no point in running 5 on 2 off with the GH during your IGF1 cycle, you might as well run ED (during your IGF cycles anyway). much of the action of GH is mediated by it's conversion to IGF (which you'll already have in abundance) so you can probably get away with a much lower dose of GH during your IGF cycles, something like a replacement dose. this has been demonstrated in increase the effect of the IGF as well.

the T3 - the GH will reduce your T3 output, so it's a good idea to take some to compensate. however, higher doses of of T3 interfere with the action of IGF1, negating some of the effect of your GH. however, T3 does not interfere with IGF1 in the LR3 form for some reason, so you could run higher doses of t3 during your IGF cyces, and lower doses with just your GH.

IGF stacks powerfully with insulin, especially for your mass goals. too powerful actually - it's VERY dangerous to mix them until you're expert with them. get comfortable with the IGF alone before attempting to mix it with sln. i am not experienced enough with sln to give further advice on it.

i would run a month of IGF1 at the peak of your cycle (amazing results), a month off, and the first week or 2 of PCT. you could also use the IGF cycle to "kickstart" your slow starting GH cycle (note, this is still a theory, not an accepted practice, but i like the idea and wanted to throw it out there).

[itsjinx]

alright, you're obviously intelligent and do good research, but now we're getting into some territory and substances that are so new, there are no definitive answers. the interactions of the drugs we know about are already very complex, and then we're getting into new drugs that he just don't have a big body of info on yet.

here are some of the issues we're running into. you're correct IGF is much better suited to your goals than a high dose GH cycle. however, there is some evidence that IGF is suppressive to GH production. which means there is no point in running 5 on 2 off with the GH during your IGF1 cycle, you might as well run ED (during your IGF cycles anyway). much of the action of GH is mediated by it's conversion to IGF (which you'll already have in abundance) so you can probably get away with a much lower dose of GH during your IGF cycles, something like a replacement dose. this has been demonstrated in increase the effect of the IGF as well.

the T3 - the GH will reduce your T3 output, so it's a good idea to take some to compensate. however, higher doses of of T3 interfere with the action of IGF1, negating some of the effect of your GH. however, T3 does not interfere with IGF1 in the LR3 form for some reason, so you could run higher doses of t3 during your IGF cyces, and lower doses with just your GH.

IGF stacks powerfully with insulin, especially for your mass goals. too powerful actually - it's VERY dangerous to mix them until you're expert with them. get comfortable with the IGF alone before attempting to mix it with sln. i am not experienced enough with sln to give further advice on it.

i would run a month of IGF1 at the peak of your cycle (amazing results), a month off, and the first week or 2 of PCT. you could also use the IGF cycle to "kickstart" your slow starting GH cycle (note, this is still a theory, not an accepted practice, but i like the idea and wanted to throw it out there).

MMA, thanks for that AWESOME advice! I believe I understand exactly what you are saying. First of all I will lay off the insulin on this one because it seems that most people say to not take it right now. I will take both gh and IGF for only 4 weeks on together with a break in between off the IGF and maybe another 4 weeks on later. During those 4 weeks on IGF and GH, I will do GH ED to get the maximum effect. I will be taking T3 at low doses(25mcg) throughout the entire cycle.

Starting: After a month of taking just GH alone, I will add in the IGF and then a couple weeks later start my AAS on the cycle and end the cycle with just being on GH and PCT for a month after I get off AAS and maybe stay on lower doses of just GH for some short period of time after. I'm not sure If i'm allowed to ask you for L3IGF-1 sources and prices? If someone has to PM me with that then that is great.

I will be shooting both GH and IGF subcutaneously because that is what I have learned is best, especially for site injection(abs) which is another benefit. I heard Tren is good to take when on GH along with Test and Deca so that's what i will focus on and maybe at the end of the AAS throw in some winstrol to clean up. I'm still not sure what doses of IGF i will be taking but any suggestions on that and anything else are always welcomed!

[Xe0n]

Hey bro, you have PM's disabled, so I emailed you with a reply.

Cheers

[fred9]

Yeah 5/2 was for me not destroying my natural GH, not cost. Any info on IGF-1 doses for this 5iu 5/2 GH intake?

yeah i just read it in another thread about that...never heard about it but its very interesting...

[MMA]

MMA, thanks for that AWESOME advice! I believe I understand exactly what you are saying. First of all I will lay off the insulin on this one because it seems that most people say to not take it right now. I will take both gh and IGF for only 4 weeks on together with a break in between off the IGF and maybe another 4 weeks on later. During those 4 weeks on IGF and GH, I will do GH ED to get the maximum effect. I will be taking T3 at low doses(25mcg) throughout the entire cycle.

Starting: After a month of taking just GH alone, I will add in the IGF and then a couple weeks later start my AAS on the cycle and end the cycle with just being on GH and PCT for a month after I get off AAS and maybe stay on lower doses of just GH for some short period of time after. I'm not sure If i'm allowed to ask you for L3IGF-1 sources and prices? If someone has to PM me with that then that is great.

I will be shooting both GH and IGF subcutaneously because that is what I have learned is best, especially for site injection(abs) which is another benefit. I heard Tren is good to take when on GH along with Test and Deca so that's what i will focus on and maybe at the end of the AAS throw in some winstrol to clean up. I'm still not sure what doses of IGF i will be taking but any suggestions on that and anything else are always welcomed!

the only suggestion i would add is that IGF1lr3 is also an excellent PCT drug, so i would recomend timing your first IGF cycle so that you can use IGF again during PCT. and just because IGF seems to be less effective after a month or so doesn't mean you're required to run it for the full month every time. during PCT, once the IGF has your balls hanging large and low, i wouldn't really feel the need to keep running it.

[MMA]

a few more IGF1lr3 thoughts...it's flat out a more powerful drug than GH, with more bang for your buck, especially for your goals. it works powerfully on it's own, and on a cycle. it would probably make sense to budget for 6 months per year of IGF1lr3 (not a 6 month cycle, but month on/month off) before splurging on a GH cycle.

[MMA]

Hey bro, you have PM's disabled, so I emailed you with a reply.

Cheers

we disabled PMs for new members because every time a newbie made a veiled request for a source, he would get a hundred PMs from scammers trying to take his money before he smartened up. not a slam on Xe0n, i don't know him, just a general rule. i don't give out sources, but bring your post count over 25, and PM me what everyone else gave you, and i'll tell you if they're a scammer.

[itsjinx]

we disabled PMs for new members because every time a newbie made a veiled request for a source, he would get a hundred PMs from scammers trying to take his money before he smartened up. not a slam on Xe0n, i don't know him, just a general rule. i don't give out sources, but bring your post count over 25, and PM me what everyone else gave you, and i'll tell you if they're a scammer.

Thanks for all the info MMA. I will plan it out like you said.. You also said that you recommend taking IGF 6 months out of the year. My question is: Does it need PCT after taking it? Does it affect your natural testosterone or could I just take it alone at certain times with no needed repercussions?

Also, when can I have PMs enabled? And am if we aren't allowed to ask for sources am I allowed to post a website I was given to purchase IGF-LR3 to see if it is legit?

[MMA]

Thanks for all the info MMA. I will plan it out like you said.. You also said that you recommend taking IGF 6 months out of the year. My question is: Does it need PCT after taking it? Does it affect your natural testosterone or could I just take it alone at certain times with no needed repercussions?

Also, when can I have PMs enabled? And am if we aren't allowed to ask for sources am I allowed to post a website I was given to purchase IGF-LR3 to see if it is legit?

that 6 months out of the year was a hypothetical situation, comparing it's "bang for the buck" value compared to GH. it's so new, there are no studies demonstrating safety with long time use, i was just extrapolating from what we do know. it seems to become less effective after a month of continuous use, but no one has reported a problem using the time on=time off rule of thumb, so theoreticly you should be able to be on it 6 months/year.

it has been used very successfully off cycle on it's own, so you could run an IGF1lr3 cycle during your AS cycle, then another between cycles. it's so new, the absolute best way to cycle it is still subject to debate.

it doesn't affect your own testosterone (except by helping increase it post AS cycle). it may be suppressive to GH, but that doesn't appear to require PCT.

there are others here far more expert on GH/igf1lr3/sln than myself, you should research the old igf threads for more info.

[LL08]

If your goals were weight loss, sense of wellbeing or for track & field or some similar sport I would reco the gh splurge as Hgh itself ups IGF levels AND T3 levels, furthermore, studies trying to mimic Hgh by a synergy of T3 and Igf show that IGF and T3 can't mimic the properties of H by itself. So again we're visiting the fact that there is more to gh than igf-1 and t3. However there is no doubt igf-1 is majorly responsible for gains from hgh.

Good points made by MMA giving some invaluable advice..cheers.

[LL08]

I think I might have to explain in further detail my above point. Recently studies have shown us that initially up until week 4 of rHGH supplementation T3 levels are raised. Because of this extra free T3 caused by the hGH, your TSH levels go down, the general consesus amongst the scientific community now is that after about a month your T3 levels will be shutdown. That is why it is essential to supplement a small dose T3 after 3-4weeks of gh use

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Growth hormone administration stimulates energy expenditure and extrathyroidal conversion of thyroxine to triiodothyronine in a dose dependent manner and suppresses circadian thyrotrophin levels: studies in GH deficient adults."

Author

Jørgensen JO; Møller J; Laursen T; Orskov H; Christiansen JS; Weeke J

Address

Medical Department M (Endocrinology and Diabetes), Aarhus Kommunehospital, Denmark.

Source

Clin Endocrinol (Oxf), 41(5):609 14 1994 Nov

Abstract

OBJECTIVE: The impact of exogenous GH on thyroid function remains controversial although most data add support to a stimulation of peripheral T4 to T3 conversion. For further elucidation we evaluated iodothyronine and circadian TSH levels in GH deficient patients as part of a GH dose response study. PATIENTS: Eight GH deficient adults, who received stable T4 substitution due to central hypothyroidism; two patients, who were euthyroid without T4 supplementation were studied separately. DESIGN: All patients were initially studied after at least 4 weeks without GH followed by 3 consecutive 4 week periods in fixed order during which they received daily doses of 1, 2 and 4 IU of GH/m2 body surface area. The patients were hospitalized for 24 hours at the end of each period. MEASUREMENTS: Circulating total and free concentrations of T4 and T3, total rT3 and TSH were measured once at the end of each study period. Circadian TSH levels were recorded during the period without GH and during GH treatment with 2 IU GH. RESULTS: Highly significant GH dose dependent increases in total and free T3 and a reduction in rT3 were observed. The T3/T4 ratio also increased with increasing GH dosages (P < 0.001). In seven patients subnormal T3 levels were recorded in the period off GH, despite T4 levels well within the normal range. Resting energy expenditure also increased and correlated with free T3 levels (r = 0.47, P < 0.05). The circadian TSH levels exhibited a significant nocturnal increase during the period without GH, whereas GH therapy significantly suppressed the TSH levels and blunted the circadian rhythm (mean TSH levels (mU/l) 0.546 +/ 0.246 (no GH) vs 0.066 +/ 0.031 (2 IU GH) (P < 0.05)). The two euthyroid non T4 substituted patients exhibited qualitatively similar changes in all parameters. CONCLUSIONS: GH administration stimulated peripheral T4 to T3 conversion in a dose dependent manner. Serum T3 levels were subnormal despite T4 substitution when the patients were off GH but normalized with GH therapy. Energy expenditure increased with GH and correlated with free T3 levels. GH caused a significant blunting of serum TSH. These findings suggest that GH plays a distinct role in the physiological regulation of thyroid function in general, and of peripheral T4 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Now does IGF produce the same effect on thyroid function as GH does? I guess it depends on if the effects from GH is before its conversion to IGF in the liver or a byproduct of it not directly linked to IGF; or it is the IGF causing it. I'd be interested, if any knows which ones is the case and why.

Personally I have not found or seen any evidence that Lr3Igf-1 effects T3. In fact 'head studies done with Igf-1+T3 against hGH alone, the Igf-1+T3 was beaten by the Hgh and they couldn't/can't figure out what caused it.

Again supporting what I have been saying all along...Hgh has more to it than igf-1 and so on.

Now the initial rise in T3 from Hgh could be the prime reason for fat loss, but the Igf-1 created by the Hgh or Igf-1 alone may cause a change in FAT CELLS which keeps them from adding any more calories and more likely to be in lipolysis.

Otherwise why would you bother with hgh if you can just use T3. You wouldn't and anecdotal evidence on this site alone shows great success stories of hgh and Igf-1 for fat loss.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[LL08]

"Serum T3 levels were subnormal despite T4 substitution when the patients were off GH but normalized with GH therapy. "

BUT The people in the study were T3 DEFICIENT to start and we can see that they said that the hGH then NORMALIZED the T3 levels.

How does this help us?.. if you have low T3 you can tell your doctor to give you hGH.

We can see that the increased energy expenditure seems to be ONLY from the corresponding rise in t3. So for this reason T3 alone might be a good cost effective solution for someone who only wishes to lose weight...

'GH caused a significant blunting of serum TSH (or Thyroid).' So, rhgh causes Thyroid shutdown in 4 weeks or LESS.

My point is this, initially HGH raises T3 levels but after a time hgh shuts t3 levels down. In the above 4 week study yes, there was still enough conversion of endogenous t4 to t3 during this time, but it wouldn't take much longer for that to start to drop as well. So when i posted above that hgh increased T3 and IGF-1 I left a lot of reasoning out.

For this to be utilised I'd suggest a very small dose of t3 for the first 3-4 weeks, maybe 12.5mcgs MAX then raise that to 25mcgs when the boosting t3 effects of hgh wear off 4 weeks after your first iu.

Hope my post is clearer now.

-LL

[MMA]

"Serum T3 levels were subnormal despite T4 substitution when the patients were off GH but normalized with GH therapy. "

BUT The people in the study were T3 DEFICIENT to start and we can see that they said that the hGH then NORMALIZED the T3 levels.

How does this help us?.. if you have low T3 you can tell your doctor to give you hGH.

We can see that the increased energy expenditure seems to be ONLY from the corresponding rise in t3. So for this reason T3 alone might be a good cost effective solution for someone who only wishes to lose weight...

'GH caused a significant blunting of serum TSH (or Thyroid).' So, rhgh causes Thyroid shutdown in 4 weeks or LESS.

My point is this, initially HGH raises T3 levels but after a time hgh shuts t3 levels down. In the above 4 week study yes, there was still enough conversion of endogenous t4 to t3 during this time, but it wouldn't take much longer for that to start to drop as well. So when i posted above that hgh increased T3 and IGF-1 I left a lot of reasoning out.

For this to be utilised I'd suggest a very small dose of t3 for the first 3-4 weeks, maybe 12.5mcgs MAX then raise that to 25mcgs when the boosting t3 effects of hgh wear off 4 weeks after your first iu.

Hope my post is clearer now.

-LL

thanks, thats great info. the relationship between GH and t3 is much more complex than i had initialy realized.

question - if the t3 is naturally elevated the first 4 weeks, wouldn't this be the worst time to supplement it? wouldn't you want to wait until it dropped, to avoid blunting the natural endogenous boost?

[LL08]

This is what I will personally do and from the above it should have been my recomendation. I was just playing it safe with recomendations to others as this research is also relatively new to me..

I will personally try gh with no t3 until week three and then add 12.5mcgs. I will get bloodwork done at week 2 to see if in fact the above theory is true. I am of the school of thought that too much gh will harm H supplementation.

[LL08]

[QUOTE=MMA]thanks, thats great info. the relationship between GH and t3 is much more complex than i had initialy realized.
QUOTE]

No problems, it would be niave for me or any other single member here to think we know it all, when scientists don't.

-LL

[MMA]

also, isn't there a study showing that the t3 supression goes away after 6 months of GH use?

[LL08]

haven't seen that as yet. If you have a link please PM it to me, otherwise if you have any clues about it I'll search for it. Sounds very interesting I was under the impression that for long term H cycles you need to take T3 from the first to last month...Great to have you back anyway MMA.

[Robinson]

Very interesting!

I'm gonna start GH for many months in June. If I use t3 I will wait for 3 to 4 weeks into cycle.

2 q's:

-Not sure if I will use 12,5 or 25 mcgs. How do that doses compare to the level of a normal persons thyroids? (at first, goal is cutting up)

-Normally t3 is used for around 4 weeks up to a maximum of 6. Does this maximum also apply when using low doses as 12,5 and 25 mcgs with HGH? I reckon it should be cycled in this case also. How many time off?

Thanks

[MMA]

haven't seen that as yet. If you have a link please PM it to me, otherwise if you have any clues about it I'll search for it. Sounds very interesting I was under the impression that for long term H cycles you need to take T3 from the first to last month...Great to have you back anyway MMA.

don't have a pubmed link, just something posted on the boards. i'll try to look up the basis.

the only other issue i think we should be concerned about is that we don't want to reinvent the wheel. redbaron once gave a link to some board that had an an amazingly detailed igf/gh/t3 cycle, that had taken all these factors into account (thats where i got half this info from). i'm going to have to go back thru his old posts one by one till i find it. unless someone else can list the boards with the best GH forums.

[GearIdentity]

Great info provided in this thread, thank you!

[MMA]

we disabled PMs for new members because every time a newbie made a veiled request for a source, he would get a hundred PMs from scammers trying to take his money before he smartened up. not a slam on Xe0n, i don't know him, just a general rule. i don't give out sources, but bring your post count over 25, and PM me what everyone else gave you, and i'll tell you if they're a scammer.

itsjinx, let me give you some more advice that will help you. this is the secret technique called "post whoring". go to the lounge and post a bunch of ridiculous nonsense. then go to war/politics/relgion and ruthlessly slam everyone you don't like. this will quickly bring up your post count to where you can recieve PMs

[LL08]

itsjinx, let me give you some more advice that will help you. this is the secret technique called "post whoring". go to the lounge and post a bunch of ridiculous nonsense. then go to war/politics/relgion and ruthlessly slam everyone you don't like. this will quickly bring up your post count to where you can recieve PMs

hehe. No doubt you have practiced this MMA. Join Date: Jan 2005 and Posts: 2,284. So we're talking 2284 posts in 98 - 128 days, therfore 18-24 posts a day. you "WHORE." hehe just playing.

-LL

[spound]

hehe. No doubt you have practiced this MMA. Join Date: Jan 2005 and Posts: 2,284. So we're talking 2284 posts in 98 - 128 days, therfore 18-24 posts a day. you "WHORE." hehe just playing.

-LL

Damn I could never find time to post that much

[MMA]

Damn I could never find time to post that much

neither could i, i wouldn't be able to train. those stats are the result of some issues with my username

[spound]

neither could i, i wouldn't be able to train. those stats are the result of some issues with my username

Well, how can I get those same problems? I want my post count to go up LOL I have been here almost a year now and havent even broke the grand mark

[LL08]

neither could i, i wouldn't be able to train. those stats are the result of some issues with my username

haha I was assuming something similar to that.

-LL