Insulin window of oppertunity

**ozzie** · 05-31-2005, 08:10 AM

I was reading an old article by Kerry Kayes of chemical warefare products (chemical nutrition now dorian yates is involved) and he was talking about the window of oppertunity that is created in the body to consume up yo 3 times as much protein following training due to the stress placed upon it for upto 1.5 hrs. Ive read in numerous different places on this site about the reccomended guide lines for protein intake whilst using slin and was just curious if your body could effectively use more? Cheers, ozzie.

**rodge** · 05-31-2005, 08:17 AM

i bet you will get some more responses over here :-)

-rodge

**Big Bapper** · 05-31-2005, 08:35 AM

I dont think Kerry said that, it was the co aouther of the book the now descessed Paul Borrorson who said the body could digest 1g of protein per KG of bodyweight.

I was reading an articial by pro BodyBuilder John Hodgson who Kerry took under his wing many years ago and is now manger at CNP/DYA, who said "it is impossible for the body to digest that much protein in one sitting, even after training".

**ozzie** · 05-31-2005, 01:49 PM

Yeah or it was Dr.Dave Perry one of the three. They use to really push the "window of oppertunity" in the bi monthly magazine they use to publish, i think it was called battle news? So you think the guide lines Gear lays out to protein intake pwo with slin are about right and any more would be a waste? Im not trying to pick holes with what established and respected members think im just young and curious!

**rodge** · 05-31-2005, 01:54 PM

Originally Posted by ozzie

So you think the guide lines Gear lays out to protein intake pwo with slin are about right and any more would be a waste? Im not trying to pick holes with what established and respected members think im just young and curious!

gear is always right on depending pwo nutrition and slin.

-rodge

**ozzie** · 05-31-2005, 02:16 PM

I also saw on Hookers profile of slin that you could also take 1iu of slin with every meal as well as your pwo meals to really optimise nutrient uptake to the muscle. Has any one tried this and if so did they think it made much difference? Cheers

**rodge** · 05-31-2005, 02:21 PM

i don't think thats a good idea as taking slin several times a day increases the change of becoming insulin dependant.

-rodge

**Big Bapper** · 05-31-2005, 05:24 PM

Originally Posted by ozzie

I also saw on Hookers profile of slin that you could also take 1iu of slin with every meal as well as your pwo meals to really optimise nutrient uptake to the muscle. Has any one tried this and if so did they think it made much difference? Cheers

I would not take slin with every meal. I find its only use is to shultle nutrients into the muscle PWO or to fight of catabolisim first thing in the morning when natural insilun levles or low. One thing I do agree on from the book or battle news is to take 10g carbs per 1iu of slin.

My PWO protcal is 10iu slin, 120g dextros and 60g hydrolysed whey. 1 hour later 200g chicken, 240g brown rice and 2 scoops of N-Large.

**jwillfcsl** · 05-31-2005, 05:55 PM

so what are you saying, you take slin in the morning and post workout, or just post workout, and isnt the added 2 scoops of N-large on the second meal too many calories, with the chicken and rice, i am looking to start slin eventually, but my main concern is warding off unneeded fat,

**Gear** · 05-31-2005, 08:18 PM

Originally Posted by Big Bapper

My PWO protcal is 10iu slin, 120g dextros and 60g hydrolysed whey. 1 hour later 200g chicken, 240g brown rice and 2 scoops of N-Large.

For most, the 240g of rice will be too much as that would contain too much carbohydrates, meaning excess will be stored and you will gain fat. Generally speaking, for your PPWO and PPPWO meals, 50g of carbs is enough.

When you use insulin , you only want to consume just enough carbohydrates to keep out of hypogycemia. Anymore isn't necessary.

-Gear

**Gear** · 05-31-2005, 08:25 PM

Originally Posted by jwillfcsl

so what are you saying, you take slin in the morning and post workout, or just post workout, and isnt the added 2 scoops of N-large on the second meal too many calories, with the chicken and rice, i am looking to start slin eventually, but my main concern is warding off unneeded fat,

If AAS isn't present, insulin in the AM can be beneficial to stave of catabolism. Otherwise, insulin PWO is the only way to go. As I said in my previous reply to this post, you only want to consume just enough carbohydrates to stay ouf of hypo. You don't want the extra carbs as it will lead to fat gain which you aready know.

If you are worried about ganing fat, get a BG monitor. It will will show you your BG levels which will indicate if you are having too much carbs or not enough. This is a great little tool that will help you fine tune your diet.

-Gear

**Gear** · 05-31-2005, 08:29 PM

People should stick to taking insuluin PWO only. Taking slin with meals only increases the chances of fat gain. Unless you are really good at feeding your body the exact amount of carbs it needs at certain times (which is almost impossible), then stick to taking slin PWO only.

Apart from that, taking slin with meals only increase the chances of becoming dependant which I think was already mentioned by someone else above.

-Gear

**Gear** · 05-31-2005, 08:36 PM

Insulin is rather a tricky drug to use. You never know how much nutrients your body needs PWO. One day you might need 60g of dex for recovery and to stay out of hypo, the next day you might train at same resistance level but your body might need a 100g to recover. So, you never know.

How much fuel your body needs for recovery and to stay out of hypo also depends on how active you have been throughout the day, and what you have been eating as all these effect your BG.

That is why I mentioned getting a BG monitor. It will tell you where your BG level is at. If it is too high, then obviously you have consumed too many carbs. If your BG level is too low, then you know there is plenty room for more carbs. You just have to keep on monitoring your BG all throughout the insulin active period.

Hope that cleared up a few things in terms of PWO nutrition and how much one may need.

-Gear

**ozzie** · 06-01-2005, 12:29 AM

Thankyou, Ozzie.

**Big Bapper** · 06-01-2005, 05:21 AM

Originally Posted by jwillfcsl

so what are you saying, you take slin in the morning and post workout, or just post workout, and isnt the added 2 scoops of N-large on the second meal too many calories, with the chicken and rice, i am looking to start slin eventually, but my main concern is warding off unneeded fat,

Yes I am saying is slin can be used first thing in the morning, but I only use it PWO because trough trail and error I find that if I take it at any other time of the day it makes me fat.

In regards to the 2 scoops of N-Large in my PWO meal, yes this meal should be as clean as possible. 2 scoops of N-Large only has 2.5g of fat so at 260lbs and using GH 6iu 5 on/2 off I can get away with it, this is something I have started recently when Bulking and I dont seem to be adding much fat.

PWO I just like a big meal to fill me up after my heavy duty workout.