Where to inject HGH & INSULIN?

[scorp22]

Thanks for your help ive read all posts and still can't find the correct location of an injection. Thanx.

[dsmdrew]

intermuscular

[Fixr]

You inject both insulin and HGH sub-q. They are most readily absorbed in the inner thigh area, but most people take the HGH in the stomach because of its localized effects.
If you didnt know the answer to this question, I would really recommend doing more homework. Insulin is a very potent and even more volatile drug and you could very easily kill yourself with one injection.

[Fixr]

Also read these 3 stickies:

My Guide to HGH for anyone interested
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=192403
Anabolic Review Profile: Insulin

[Warrior]

I have always done slin IM... in the triceps. It' delivers quicker onset. A diabetic might want a slower release for more stable blood glucose, but as a non-diabetic athlete - typical rule-of-thumb is to get it metabolized quickly. If you are used to subcutaneous, then you should cut the dose back a little before trying IM.

Also, the site should be lean enough that you can get a regular slin pin to reach into the muscle...

Old study...

Intramuscular versus subcutaneous injection of unmodified insulin: consequences for blood glucose control in patients with type 1 diabetes mellitus.
Diabet Med. 1990 May;7(4):335-42.

• Vaag A, Pedersen KD, Lauritzen M, Hildebrandt P, Beck-Nielsen H.

Hvidore Hospital, Copenhagen, Denmark.

Using the perpendicular injection technique lean diabetic patients may often inject insulin intramuscularly (IM). Guided by ultrasound measurements of the subcutaneous (SC) thickness of the thigh, the aim of the present study was to re-evaluate the absorption kinetics of unmodified insulin from IM and SC injection sites and to evaluate the consequences of IM injection of unmodified insulin for blood glucose control in Type 1 diabetic patients. T50% values (time until 50% of the injected insulin is absorbed from the injection site) of SC injected, radioactively labelled, human unmodified insulin (125I-Actrapid) were 338 +/- 13 (+/- SE) min, 289 +/- 27 min, and 287 +/- 27 min during rest, light physical activity, and strenuous exercise, respectively. Intramuscularly injected unmodified insulin was absorbed faster, T50% 232 +/- 20 min, 113 +/- 13 min, and 112 +/- 5 min during the same levels of physical activity in the same order. When unmodified insulin (Actrapid) was given IM 30 min before breakfast, lunch, and dinner together with intermediate-acting insulin (Protaphane) SC at 2200 h, a more physiological profile of plasma free insulin and a more stable blood glucose profile was obtained than with SC administration into the thigh. The coefficient of variation of blood glucose concentration during the study (3 days each route) was lower with IM than with SC injection of unmodified insulin (33 +/- 4 vs 43 +/- 3%, p less than 0.01). No difference in frequency of hypoglycaemic attacks was found and patients claimed that IM injection was no more painful than SC injection. These data suggest that IM injection of soluble insulin into the thigh is beneficial.

[rodge]

i shoot my slin/hgh both PWO IM bilateral since recently, my favourite way of administrating it thus far. when on lr3 then i add that too.

-rodge

[FatManExp]

So can I use a 23g 1.5 inch pin and inject HGH just like test into my rear end ? I've never tried injecting anywhere else on the body, so this is just my comfort zone.

[Skills]

So can I use a 23g 1.5 inch pin and inject HGH just like test into my rear end ? I've never tried injecting anywhere else on the body, so this is just my comfort zone.

Like using a bazooka to shoot a rabbit. If a main driver of hgh use is fatloss better shooting it subQ with a smaller needle, I use [1ml 27g 1/2 inch needle] into the area where fatloss is most desired. HGH subq injections also stay in one's system longer. I inject subq into my gut, love handle area and tops of legs.

[plzr8]

i also shoot hgh subq...igf IM

[Skills]

From an oracle at another board......


Most of the studies I have found (about 7 of them) state that not only is SQ faster absorbing, the absolute bioavailability is higher. By a 12% margin if I recall correctly.

Article for that:
The mean half-life of intravenous somatropin in normal males is 0.6 hours, whereas subcutaneously and intramuscularly administered somatropin has a half-life of 1.75 and 3.4 hours, respectively.
The absolute bioavailability of somatropin is 75% and 63% after subcutaneous and intramuscular administration, respectively.



With a half life of max 3 hours quoted everywhere I research, it just doesn't make sense to do anything other then multiple ED shots.
Although to be honest I don't think injection frequency matters much for benefits, but becomes intrinsically attached to the occurance of sides.


An example of one of the many studies backing this up:

For reasons of convenience, Dr. Rudman in his 1990 study had given his 12 elderly men only 3 injections of HGH per week, at a high dose of 16 IU.

In a study published in 1996, Dr. Maxine Papadakis of UCSF reported mixed results with the identical high dose, low frequency protocol of HGH injections. Although both Rudman and Papadakis found significant multiple benefits, especially on the body composition of the subjects, they also reported some unpleasant side effects. These included carpal tunnel syndrome (wrist pain), gynecomastia (enlarged breasts), pains in both large and small joints and edema (excess fluid) in the legs.

Papadakis’ team also noted, however, that the side effects disappeared or decreased markedly within 2 weeks after the HGH dose was lowered by 25 to 50%.

Chein and Terry chose to adopt an injection regimen, which more closely approximated the natural rhythms of normal HGH secretion.
A dose of 0.3 to 0.7 IU of HGH was given twice daily, for a weekly total of about 4 to 8 IU HGH. Thus, Chein and Terry’s weekly dose was only about one quarter to one half of the dose Rudman and Papadakis gave their patients 3 times weekly.

Chein and Terry have not found any major side effects among their 800 patients. Minor joint aches and pains and slight fluid retention are the only side effects they have found, and these generally disappear in the first month or two of treatment.

Chein and Terry believe their lower dose; natural rhythm HGH protocol is responsible for the minimal incidence of severity of side effects in their patients.


This is the one study that I can find that seems to be contradictory:
The pharmacokinetics and acute effects of an authentic recombinant DNA-derived human growth hormone (rhGH) produced by genetically engineered mammalian cells were determined in 12 healthy volunteers following intravenous (i.v.), intramuscular (i.m.) and subcutaneous (s.c.) administration of 4 IU (1.3 mg) hGH/m2 body surface area. Following i.v. administration, apparent elimination half-life of rhGH was 18 min. Following i.m. administration, a mean peak serum concentration of 36.9 ng/ml (range 13-61 ng/ml) occurred at 3 h, and following s.c. administration, more sustained but lower serum concentrations occurred, with mean peak concentrations of 16.4 and 16.3 ng/ml at 4 and 6 h (ranges 9.0-27.5 ng/ml and 6.5-35.5 ng/ml at 4 and 6 h, respectively).
The mean area under the curves was lower after s.c. (134 +/- 48 ng.h.ml-1) than after i.m. (194 +/- 48 ng.h.ml-1) injections (p < 0.03). Comparable results were obtained for the same dose of rhGH given subcutaneously in concentrations of either 4 IU/ml or 10 IU/ml.


So essentially we still have to make up our own minds.
I have decided to do GH sub-q, and IGF-1 IM.

TS

[FatManExp]

Like using a bazooka to shoot a rabbit. If a main driver of hgh use is fatloss better shooting it subQ with a smaller needle, I use [1ml 27g 1/2 inch needle] into the area where fatloss is most desired. HGH subq injections also stay in one's system longer. I inject subq into my gut, love handle area and tops of legs.

I was always a good game hunter,

So simply put, use a 1.2 inch 27g, pinch me gut or love handles, insert pin at 45 degree angle, inject ?

[Fixr]

I was always a good game hunter,

So simply put, use a 1.2 inch 27g, pinch me gut or love handles, insert pin at 45 degree angle, inject ?

that would be fine. you can use a 29 or 30g pin as well.

[Skills]

Sounds good, the only other thing is to alternate spots day to day.