What happened to all the IGF fans?

**cutting_king** · 06-20-2008, 03:35 PM

Hi all
Well i've been away from the site for a while now as i've not been on the net much. I must say the opinions seem to have really changed since i was last here. There used to be so many people that were using IGF and really happy with the results. Now it looks like almost everyone has dismissed it as useless. I must say i was a bit suprised. I know its not for everyone as its highly priced and only gives modest gains and therefore AS are much better value for money. But for someone who is sick of the sides of steroids (mainly really bad water retention and uncontrollable aggression) then IGF does everything i need it to.
I usually run it every couple of months for 3-4 weeks as a bit of a training booster and at the same time add in some clen . This has helped me to get the leanest i've ever been and i've totally avoided loosing any muscle mass, something i've always found hard to do when cutting in the past without steroids. On top of this fat loss i manage to gain a few pounds with each cycle and the IGF really seems to do a lot for muscle fullness and prolonged pumps after a workout. Its all good!
Anyway thats pretty much it, just wondered if anyone out there still uses IGF on its own and what kind of results they are getting?
I'm thinking i might try it with MGF next, either that or i'll up the dosage as i'm currently only doing 40mcg daily. Wouldn't mind seeing what kind of results i would get from 60-80mcg

Anyway, let me know your thoughts

King

**smokeyd** · 06-20-2008, 03:44 PM

yeah your right it seems like it was a fad for a while and now its gone, sure it will be back just like everything else

**cutting_king** · 06-20-2008, 03:58 PM

Originally Posted by smokeyd

yeah your right it seems like it was a fad for a while and now its gone, sure it will be back just like everything else

Yea i think the main problem was because it was a relatively new product (compared to steroids ) that it got hyped up so much that when people bought it they were expecting some kind of miracle and were subsequently dissappointed. Like i said the gains are obviously modest with IGF. Personally i'd love to try HGH but with the high price tag and the amount of fakes around i'd be too worried about wasting my money

**40plusnewbie** · 06-20-2008, 05:31 PM

I'm using IGF and am getting some mgf very soon. I like the IGF, I'm using 40mcg bilaterally ~ EOD on my posterior and anterior forearms, biceps and triceps.

**cutting_king** · 06-20-2008, 05:41 PM

Originally Posted by 40plusnewbie

I'm using IGF and am getting some mgf very soon. I like the IGF, I'm using 40mcg bilaterally ~ EOD on my posterior and anterior forearms, biceps and triceps.

40mcg bilaterally....sounds good, have you always run that dosage? if not have you found there is a good improvement in results increasing from a lower dose to 80mcg daily? if so are the extra gains worth the extra cost of using a higher dose? (obviously they are otherwise you wouldn't be doing it)
I think i'm going to do a similar dose on my next cycle. I have just got myself a local supplier which is soooo much better than having to import from the US. There is nothing worse than waiting a month for a delivery of IGF (yes a month!!) when you really wanna get started with it

King

**40plusnewbie** · 06-21-2008, 08:03 AM

Originally Posted by cutting_king

40mcg bilaterally....sounds good, have you always run that dosage? if not have you found there is a good improvement in results increasing from a lower dose to 80mcg daily? if so are the extra gains worth the extra cost of using a higher dose? (obviously they are otherwise you wouldn't be doing it)
I think i'm going to do a similar dose on my next cycle. I have just got myself a local supplier which is soooo much better than having to import from the US. There is nothing worse than waiting a month for a delivery of IGF (yes a month!!) when you really wanna get started with it

King

When I say 40mcg bi-laterally I mean 20mcg in the muscle on the left side and 20mcg on the right. I use every other day on average. I"ve only been using this substance for 2 weeks and this is the only dosage I have used, I am happy thus far though.

**plzr8** · 06-21-2008, 08:40 AM

pinnacle ate them

**Timm1704** · 06-21-2008, 10:11 AM

its not IGF that has fallen out of favour, its IGF-LR3 as accoridng to pinnacle, the adaptions they made to IGF to make it into LR3 rendered it useless for muscle gain, and few have challenged this theory.

The main reason people stray from AAS is not due to water retention (a minor side effect, and one that GH and IGF can be associated with also) and 'uncontrollable'

aggression (lol), but the negative affect they have on natural hormone production, and the whole PCT thing/temporary gains that they are known for.

**james21** · 06-21-2008, 10:18 AM

I still LOVE igflr3, i was getting receptor grade... just finished it about 2 weeks ago

**RedBaron** · 06-21-2008, 01:03 PM

I think what has happened really is LR3-IGF 1 has been around long enough and been kicked around sufficiently to define the scope of what it is good for. As has been mentioned a few times, it is a great glucose disposal agent, and will result in some tightening up and great muscle fullness. I used it for a good time for those exact reasons.

I think the reason it has fallen out of vogue somewhat is that there are many questions and few answers right now about its long-term implications, and as huIGF-1 has now hit the market, Gropep has not only NOT began any trials to attempt to capitalize on their patented product, but they have adamantly preached against its use and safety in humans. While a certain percentage of that is legal CYA' ese, the fact they aren't pursuing the money trail makes enough of us wonder to taper off use.

As to its growth potential, it is true enough you will see a pound or two here and there, but that can easily be explained by its "insulin -like" functions. You could make the same statement about insulin. Pump up the muscles full enough, long enough, and you will gain a little bit of muscle.

So I think that is the answer for most of the community right now. After everyone gave it a good, honest go, most moved on to more promising waters. All of that said, there is no question that LR3 is a great GDA, and as far as muscle fullness, some fat loss, and in general a bit of tightening up if that is your only goal, you will no doubt feel good about it.

**Gear** · 06-21-2008, 07:40 PM

I think most users expect too much from LR3 and that's why there are doubts.

-Gear

**naturalsux** · 06-21-2008, 07:48 PM

Originally Posted by RedBaron

I think what has happened really is LR3-IGF 1 has been around long enough and been kicked around sufficiently to define the scope of what it is good for. As has been mentioned a few times, it is a great glucose disposal agent, and will result in some tightening up and great muscle fullness. I used it for a good time for those exact reasons.

I think the reason it has fallen out of vogue somewhat is that there are many questions and few answers right now about its long-term implications, and as huIGF-1 has now hit the market, Gropep has not only NOT began any trials to attempt to capitalize on their patented product, but they have adamantly preached against its use and safety in humans. While a certain percentage of that is legal CYA' ese, the fact they aren't pursuing the money trail makes enough of us wonder to taper off use.

As to its growth potential, it is true enough you will see a pound or two here and there, but that can easily be explained by its "insulin -like" functions. You could make the same statement about insulin. Pump up the muscles full enough, long enough, and you will gain a little bit of muscle.

So I think that is the answer for most of the community right now. After everyone gave it a good, honest go, most moved on to more promising waters. All of that said, there is no question that LR3 is a great GDA, and as far as muscle fullness, some fat loss, and in general a bit of tightening up if that is your only goal, you will no doubt feel good about it.

good post, thanks

**Polska** · 06-22-2008, 10:42 AM

I've used LR3IGF-1 on/off for a couple of years. I never saw any permanent growth from it. I saw a little water retention and muscle fullness, increased pumps, increased vascularity. There are way better results to be had from Insulin combined with HGH in my opinion...

**TheJuicer** · 06-22-2008, 03:19 PM

I'm on IGF-1 by itself right now and my gains..

...I lost an inch on my waist and my muscle are def. fuller and I'm holding a little water. Its not bad but not amazing...

...gym weights have went up ever so little..I think that its from the water I'm holding...

**Gear** · 06-22-2008, 04:53 PM

The only proper way to know if IGF is for you is by using it on its own for a few months ON/OFF. It's difficult to say if certain something is working well when you are using 5 different things at once.

-Gear

**cutting_king** · 06-23-2008, 11:52 AM

Originally Posted by Gear

The only proper way to know if IGF is for you is by using it on its own for a few months ON/OFF. It's difficult to say if certain something is working well when you are using 5 different things at once.

-Gear

I totally agree. A lot of people have said that they thought IGF was useless because they were running it with tren /test/EQ etc and didn't see any more gains than they would do normally with that cycle. But it must be impossible to know what kind of effect you are having when you are taking so many compounds at once anyway. I've used IGF a good few times on its own now and its quite clear that you see results when it starts to kick in. Its just a shame we dont have more clinical trials done with results we can all relate to. I'm talking about human trials. The only thing that im unsure of is.....
Pinn, and others, have on many occasion explained that adding the LR3 to the IGF1 renders it useless as a muscle builder. But at the same time we are being told there are no human clinical trials to prove this. So is this just a theory? I think someone should set up a lab somewhere and conduct independant tests, i will happily supply myself as a guinnea pig if someone supplies the product

**RedBaron** · 06-23-2008, 03:32 PM

The problem is that Gropep (the owner of the patent to LR3) has in no uncertain terms made it clear - LR3 is NOT for human use in any way, shape, or form. A few of us have talked with representatives from Gropep. They have stated that LR3 was specifically designed for long life for convenient use in cell culture tests in labs. They have further stated that the animal testing that has been done has resulted in kidney and other organ damage. As mentioned above, some of that is to release them from potential liability if someone were to hose their health by using their product. But given that, the fact still remains that there is a HUGE potential for money ... and Gropep isn't going after it, and are still adamantly preaching against its use and usefulness in humans. At last count, I think folks in Australia still like money, so if LR3 had the potential to be useful in humans to any significant degree, they would be preparing human trials and beginning the process to bring to product to the commercial drug industry where ga-zillions of dollars would be waiting for them.

As to trying it by itself, I think several of us did just that. As I mentioned above, it is a pretty handy glucose disposal agent, will help you lose a little fat and tighten up a bit, and will give you some pretty outrageous muscle pumps and fullness. Those were all observations made using ONLY LR3, and actually by more than a few long-term bodybuilders. As far as muscle building potential, it is certainly no better than HGH and insulin which at least for now would be the safe road to travel until we have more confirmation as to the long-term safety of LR3 in the human body.

As to having human trials to prove it as a muscle builder, I don't think you are ever going to see this as Gropep has already said IT IS NOT APPROPRIATE FOR HUMAN USE. Given that statement, there isn't a lab, research facility, or legitimate doctor in the world that is going to touch it. All that being said, there is a human form of bio-identical IGF-1 that has cleared human trials and is now on the market for children with growth issues. It is on the market and being prescribed right now.

The next move is really Gropep's. If their product really does do organ damage with long-term use, then they will maintain the stand they have already made. If there is merit to it in humans, I would expect as some point in time they would bring it to the table and begin trials to allow their investment in the product to pay off. Until that time, what you are hearing from many folks here is to be careful ... it may or may not be a wise thing to run it long-term, and the results are achievable with other substances with a bit more of a demonstrated safety record.

**legobricks** · 06-23-2008, 03:45 PM

Originally Posted by cutting_king

Hi all
Well i've been away from the site for a while now as i've not been on the net much. I must say the opinions seem to have really changed since i was last here. There used to be so many people that were using IGF and really happy with the results. Now it looks like almost everyone has dismissed it as useless. I must say i was a bit suprised. I know its not for everyone as its highly priced and only gives modest gains and therefore AS are much better value for money. But for someone who is sick of the sides of steroids (mainly really bad water retention and uncontrollable aggression) then IGF does everything i need it to.
I usually run it every couple of months for 3-4 weeks as a bit of a training booster and at the same time add in some clen . This has helped me to get the leanest i've ever been and i've totally avoided loosing any muscle mass, something i've always found hard to do when cutting in the past without steroids. On top of this fat loss i manage to gain a few pounds with each cycle and the IGF really seems to do a lot for muscle fullness and prolonged pumps after a workout. Its all good!
Anyway thats pretty much it, just wondered if anyone out there still uses IGF on its own and what kind of results they are getting?
I'm thinking i might try it with MGF next, either that or i'll up the dosage as i'm currently only doing 40mcg daily. Wouldn't mind seeing what kind of results i would get from 60-80mcg

Anyway, let me know your thoughts

King

Pinnacle came back.

PT · 06-23-2008, 03:56 PM

i posted in a previous thread that im a igf fan. i use it all the time and have decent results.

**legobricks** · 06-23-2008, 04:04 PM

Originally Posted by pietro75

i posted in a previous thread that im a igf fan. i use it all the time and have decent results.

I do like it becuase my strength goes up, i hold a bit of water, my muscles are DEF. fuller, harder, and a bit more vascular, plus a bit of fat loss. Just to expensive to be running all the time. Id rather go for GH.

PT · 06-23-2008, 04:38 PM

Originally Posted by legobricks

I do like it becuase my strength goes up, i hold a bit of water, my muscles are DEF. fuller, harder, and a bit more vascular, plus a bit of fat loss. Just to expensive to be running all the time. Id rather go for GH.

i agree hgh is better for the money. red, blue and yellow tops are so cheap right now that its nothing to run a 6 month cycle of them plus my results are always better. i try to run igf during every pct because i like it there or with my hgh and slin when i get a good price. i have been on hgh straight for way to many months to remember but i have had tthe best results of my life from it.

**cutting_king** · 06-23-2008, 11:58 PM

I must say i'm tempted to get on the hgh band wagon, the concern i have is that although i have researched slin i still dont think i'd be comfortable using it. And i know that you dont really get the best out of hgh without it. The other downside being that hgh has so many fakes out there and with the price being so high i would hate to think i was spending my money on something thats doing nothing. My source is getting some shortly though so maybe i'll just order a couple of months worth and try it at 4iu daily to "test the water"

Thanks for the replies so far, especially the info on Gropep. I have heard that they have said it can damage organs in the animal tests they did but one thing Pinn has stated is that humans and animals are vastly different and an effect it has on their bodies may not happen in a human. Then again thats not to say it wont either. Its just a case of weighing up benefits/risks, which in this case is hard when you dont know what the potential risks are i suppose

King

**40plusnewbie** · 06-24-2008, 02:44 AM

Originally Posted by pietro75

i agree hgh is better for the money. red, blue and yellow tops are so cheap right now that its nothing to run a 6 month cycle of them plus my results are always better. i try to run igf during every pct because i like it there or with my hgh and slin when i get a good price. i have been on hgh straight for way to many months to remember but i have had tthe best results of my life from it.

What's a month's worth cost? I know a place that sells it (might not be the cheapest) but it's like 5-6 hundred for a kit of, I don't know, a dozen vials or something. I'd have to look it up. They sell both the jintropin and the other. Legit company that sells quality stuff.

Are there places that sell some other form that is good but not of the highest grade or something?

Plus I don't like the idea of importing vials internationally. Seems to me like they stand out more than other stuff. Am I wrong about this?

what does it cost month to month to run?

edited in: 10, 10iu vials for almost 5bills, how long does that last?

PT · 06-24-2008, 02:55 AM

erase the price bro, were not allowed to post that but unless you have american hgh it should be a quarter of that price

**3v1lj03** · 06-24-2008, 03:20 AM

Originally Posted by pietro75

erase the price bro, were not allowed to post that but unless you have american hgh it should be a quarter of that price

Really no way your kiddin

PT · 06-24-2008, 03:29 AM

well jinos are going up since the chineese government shut them down. they will be up again or someone else will take over because the one thing i have learned over the years is that when there is a demand someone will supply. there will be fake jinos hitting the streets soon so watch out for them

**chainsaw1** · 06-27-2008, 08:09 AM

The whole hyperplasia that comes with IGF is false. There are still sites that preach how great IGF is, but I won't waste my money on it. It gave some muscle fullness and pumps, similar what I found with Arginine (AAKG).

**cutting_king** · 06-27-2008, 11:32 AM

Originally Posted by chainsaw1

The whole hyperplasia that comes with IGF is false. .

Do you have some references to back that up? I keep hearing that but i've not yet heard it backed up with lab tests or factual evidence. Would be great to see them if you have them

King

**goose** · 06-27-2008, 11:46 AM

Originally Posted by cutting_king

Do you have some references to back that up? I keep hearing that but i've not yet heard it backed up with lab tests or factual evidence. Would be great to see them if you have them

King

Just check out the thread pinnacle im calling you out.

Spend several thousands on this peptide,believe me,save your cash and use HGH.

**plzr8** · 06-27-2008, 12:01 PM

Originally Posted by goose4

Just check out the thread pinnacle im calling you out.

Spend several thousands on this peptide,believe me,save your cash and use HGH.

off topic, but goose...dont know if its the raised test levels or not, but LOVE the new avy buddy!

haha

**goose** · 06-27-2008, 12:04 PM

Originally Posted by plzr8

off topic, but goose...dont know if its the raised test levels or not, but LOVE the new avy buddy!

haha

LOL.

Correction with my post I meant `I spent`

**chainsaw1** · 06-28-2008, 08:37 AM

Originally Posted by cutting_king

Do you have some references to back that up? I keep hearing that but i've not yet heard it backed up with lab tests or factual evidence. Would be great to see them if you have them

King

Just from personal experience, there was no new muscle growth.

**notanormalgent** · 07-03-2008, 04:10 AM

Originally Posted by chainsaw1

Just from personal experience, there was no new muscle growth.

Ditto.

However, I'm still a fan because of the results WHILE running it, however, the results do not last.

**IFR** · 07-03-2008, 11:39 AM

I liked it but quit using it because it only lasted a few days in the fridge so I had to use it up real fast. HGH lasts longer once mixed so I allways get that instead.

**cutting_king** · 07-03-2008, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by IFR

I liked it but quit using it because it only lasted a few days in the fridge so I had to use it up real fast. HGH lasts longer once mixed so I allways get that instead.

IGF1-LR3 is stable in the fridge for at least 6 months according to my source.

**Mutation** · 07-03-2008, 07:36 PM

Originally Posted by cutting_king

IGF1-LR3 is stable in the fridge for at least 6 months according to my source.

That would depend on what you mix it with. If using BW, it's life is minimal.

**Pinnacle** · 07-04-2008, 04:00 PM

Originally Posted by RedBaron

The problem is that Gropep (the owner of the patent to LR3) has in no uncertain terms made it clear - LR3 is NOT for human use in any way, shape, or form. A few of us have talked with representatives from Gropep. They have stated that LR3 was specifically designed for long life for convenient use in cell culture tests in labs. They have further stated that the animal testing that has been done has resulted in kidney and other organ damage. As mentioned above, some of that is to release them from potential liability if someone were to hose their health by using their product. But given that, the fact still remains that there is a HUGE potential for money ... and Gropep isn't going after it, and are still adamantly preaching against its use and usefulness in humans. At last count, I think folks in Australia still like money, so if LR3 had the potential to be useful in humans to any significant degree, they would be preparing human trials and beginning the process to bring to product to the commercial drug industry where ga-zillions of dollars would be waiting for them.

As to trying it by itself, I think several of us did just that. As I mentioned above, it is a pretty handy glucose disposal agent, will help you lose a little fat and tighten up a bit, and will give you some pretty outrageous muscle pumps and fullness. Those were all observations made using ONLY LR3, and actually by more than a few long-term bodybuilders. As far as muscle building potential, it is certainly no better than HGH and insulin which at least for now would be the safe road to travel until we have more confirmation as to the long-term safety of LR3 in the human body.

As to having human trials to prove it as a muscle builder, I don't think you are ever going to see this as Gropep has already said IT IS NOT APPROPRIATE FOR HUMAN USE. Given that statement, there isn't a lab, research facility, or legitimate doctor in the world that is going to touch it. All that being said, there is a human form of bio-identical IGF-1 that has cleared human trials and is now on the market for children with growth issues. It is on the market and being prescribed right now.

The next move is really Gropep's. If their product really does do organ damage with long-term use, then they will maintain the stand they have already made. If there is merit to it in humans, I would expect as some point in time they would bring it to the table and begin trials to allow their investment in the product to pay off. Until that time, what you are hearing from many folks here is to be careful ... it may or may not be a wise thing to run it long-term, and the results are achievable with other substances with a bit more of a demonstrated safety record.

Yep. I'm one of the people you are referring to in regards to talking at length with Gropep.

I've also experimented quite a lot of LR3 on it's own. Actually conducted an experiment with two of my friends as well, and had my endocrinologist over see the project.

It's boils down to LR3 is a very good GDA, as we both have mentioned previously.
However LR3 IGF-1 does not work in the same pathways as does HGH in regards to lyposis, so technically it isn't a fat burner, but used wisely with a tight diet, it can be advantageous to use it as a GDA, thus helping you shed fat easier.

~RR

**chainsaw1** · 07-08-2008, 08:12 AM

but no hyperplasia or new muscle growth?

**legobricks** · 07-08-2008, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by Pinnacle

Yep. I'm one of the people you are referring to in regards to talking at length with Gropep.

I've also experimented quite a lot of LR3 on it's own. Actually conducted an experiment with two of my friends as well, and had my endocrinologist over see the project.

It's boils down to LR3 is a very good GDA, as we both have mentioned previously.
However LR3 IGF-1 does not work in the same pathways as does HGH in regards to lyposis, so technically it isn't a fat burner, but used wisely with a tight diet, it can be advantageous to use it as a GDA, thus helping you shed fat easier.
~RR

And with my experience the IGF1Lr3 is great for doing that but IMO way to pricey for the results.