Peptides, Tissue Growth & Protection and Practical use surrounding them *A must read*

[Juced_porkchop]

Peptides, Tissue Growth & Protection and Practical use surrounding them

Hello all of you in internet land!
Today I wish to cover the subject of peptides and their possible uses.
There seems to be a lot of people out there unsure of what peptides are or flat out think they are some sort of gimmick.
I was at one point in time in the same boat, so no worries keep reading and you might learn something. After many years of research on this topic and countless personal experiences with peptides I feel I am qualified to try to help others out there by putting together this article covering the most popular peptides, their uses, how to use them safely and most effectively.

What so WHAT in the world is a PEPTIDE???

Isn’t that the stuff in my wife’s shampoo???

Well…… I might be. But not all peptides are the same! Just like not all amino acids are the same.
Peptides are actually very similar to amino acids (protein molecules) believe it or not.
A peptide is a short, large molecule of an amino acid molecule that can bind chemically to other molecules to form a larger molecule by peptide bonds. They are listed as a peptide or protein depending on their size.

I know it sounds confusing and in some ways it is. But it is not too hard to understand them.
There are many kinds of peptides out there some are your basic protein type peptide that I will not bother to cover at this time or that would make this more of a diet article than a peptide article. Another is a “peptide hormone” they are secreted into the blood stream and have an endocrine function in the body.[1]

There is even something called a neuropeptide. One of many for e.g. is DSIP (Delta Sleep-inducing Peptide). They are small protein-like molecules used by the neurons to communicate.
They are much smaller than a neurotransmitter and are considered neuronal signaling molecules and they affect many functions in the brain like; pain, hunger, memory and can even effect you’re learning abilities!
Still think Peptides might be a gimmick? HA I sure don’t. I think they are GREAT!
No I won’t be talking about neuropeptides today, but I wanted to at least mention them because I feel they are pretty cool and very important.


Today I will be talking about Peptide Hormones!

Peptide hormones are not the same as steroid hormones.
Steroid hormones are synthesized from cholesterol, and are lipids (they are fat based). While peptide hormones are proteins and are formed by a sequence of amino acids.
As mentioned above these are the ones that have physical effects on the body like growth and repair and has been of very big interest to the bodybuilding scene and in recent years I feel at a massive scale due to the internet and many places selling these peptides.
I felt I really should put something together about these powerful peptides and how they might help you in your quest to recovery, fat loss and growth.



I will start with the basics of what each one does then I will get into more detail on how you can use them safely and effectively.

GHRP-2
Is a human growth hormone secretagogue. That means it stimulates the body's own release of HGH. It is a ghrelin receptor agonist is also seems to have some protective effect on some tissues and an anti-inflammatory effect as well. The excessive hunger some feel with GHRP-6 use does not seem to be an issue with GHRP-2. The half-life is about 20 minutes so multiple doses per day are optimal.

GHRP-6
Is also a human growth hormone secretagogue and stimulates the body's own release of HGH. It is a ghrelin receptor agonist and also seems to have some protective effect on some tissues and an anti-inflammatory effect as well. The half-life is about 20 minutes so multiple doses per day are optimal.
*Note: GHRP-6 seems to cause excessive hunger in some people compared to GHRP-2. It is not a bad thing per say but depending on if your bulking or cutting you may prefer one over the other.

CJC-1295
Is a growth hormone releasing hormone (GHRH) and it aides in the stimulation of the pituitary gland to increase production of growth hormone and stimulates GH and IGF-1 secretion. It will keep a steady increase of HGH without an increase in prolactin as can be an issue for some peptides of this nature. It is an analog to a peptide that is naturally produced to stimulate pituitary production of growth hormone. It has a half-life of about 7-10 days. This means once a week dosing is optimal in most cases.

CJC-1293
Is also a growth hormone releasing hormone (GHRH) and it aides in the stimulation of the pituitary gland to increase production of growth hormone and stimulates GH secretion. It is an analog to a peptide that is naturally produced to stimulate pituitary production of growth hormone. The GH pulse from a single administration of CJC-1293 is much greater than that of cjc-1295 but duration is slightly shorter. There is debate on which is better but both are useful regardless in my opinion.

IGF1 Des
IGF-1 Des is an IGF-1 analogue of our native igf1 with the last 3 amino acids in the IGF-1 chain removed. That leads it to have little protein binding (good thing), but similar action causing it to be about 10 times more potent than normal IGF-1.[2] The active life is still fairly short, only about 20 minutes making multiple doses daily optimal for some users while others still feel once a day dosing is still worthwhile and the way to go.

IGF1LR3
Is also an IGF1 analogue with a 13 amino acid extension at the N-terminus. The alteration leads to less binding in the body greatly extends its half-life from 20min to about 20+ hours. Once a day dosing is optimal.

IGF1Ec / Mechano Growth Factor (MGF)
IGF1 Ec is derived from IGF-I but its effects differ from the systemic IGF-I produced by the liver. It is released as a pulse following muscle damage, is involved in the activation of muscle stem cells and also seems to protect the myocardium against ischaemia, which improved cardiac function after heart attacks. There is debate on dosing but i feel post workout (once daily even on non workout days) is a good way to go about it.[3]

MT2
Melanotan II (MT2) is a melanocortin. Melanocortins (MCs) are a family of multifunctional peptidergic hormones. MT2 is an analog of these and plays a role in the tanning process but will vary between skin types with its use. It is not really used in any growth as HGH or igf1 would be, but I feel due to its potential skin protection that I should add it in this article even if tanning is not the main focus of this article.



As you can see all this stuff seems to revolve around IGF1 and HGH, so to understands its effects does not mean needing to fully understand each and every peptide (though a basic knowledge should be known about each one you use). Each peptide is working as either an IGF1 analog or as a HGH releaser and HGH converts to IGH1 giving most of its tissue growing effects anyway.

It’s more understanding what IGF and HGH do in the body, to fully understand what these peptides can potentially do for you.

I would like to talk mainly about IGF1 as I feel it is the main cause for growth over that of HGH solely.[4]
The liver is the organ mostly responsible for the production of serum IGF-I even when taking exogenous HGH it is still mainly converted in the liver.

IGF-1 acts differently in different types of tissues its not all tissues grow from its effects. When active in muscle cells and associated cell’s they stimulate growth by increasing protein synthesis along with amino acid absorption. IGF-1 also plays a role as a source of energy; IGF mobilizes fat for use as energy in adipose tissue by preventing insulin from transporting glucose across cell membranes. This results in the cells having to switch to burning off fat as a source of energy which I feel is a great quality about IGF-1.IGF also seems to mimic's insulin in the human body. It makes muscles more sensitive to insulin's effects.[5][6]

I think one of the most interesting effect’s IGF has on the body is its ability to cause hyperplasia, that is when an actual splitting of cells occurs leading to more cells. You are basically your growing more cells with the use of HGH and IGF-1.
Hypertrophy is what occurs when practising weight training and steroid use . Hypertrophy is simply an increase in the size of muscle cells but not growing new cells. In humans after you are done puberty you mostly have a set number of muscle cells that you have developed with that doesn’t vary much.All you would be able to do is increase the size of these muscle cells, but you don't actually gain more of them.
This is not good for someone with “bad genetics” in the area of muscle cells.
With IGF use you are able to cause hyperplasia which increases the number of muscle cells and gives you the ability to change your genetic capabilities in terms of muscle tissue and cell count.[6]
Being able to alter a person’s capacity to build muscle density and size is an awesome thing to have control over.
When you do a “cycle” of HGH releasing peptides or even straight use of IGF1 analogs on its own, you not only add to growth and recovery while on them, you give yourself a greater number of cells to work with and down the line grow then.

When you finish a cycle of IGF-1…. in a way you are not really finished because you are still left with these new cells regardless of stopping the use of IGF1 or HGH releaser peptides and that is one of the things I just LOVE about HGH and IGF1. The fact you have residual effects is awesome for muscle building!


OK, OK we know igf1 causes growth of size and cells, but how do I use this stuff effectively?
Well by knowing the basics of each peptide, how they might have a synergy when used together and fully understanding the effects of HGH and igf1 that’s how!

Unfortunately a lot of the use of IGF1 and HGH by bodybuilders and athletes is an underground trend of their use and you might not find some of the info needed to stack them optimally together or use them in a home setting.
I wish to give you some of that information here.

Secretagogues are different from GHRH's, they share no sequence relation and derive their function through action at a different receptor and it has been established that the use of Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (CJC1295 is one for e.g.) and a Growth Hormone Releasing Peptide (GHRP-6 or GHRP-2 for e.g.) together results in synergistic release of GH from pituitary.
It is like saying 2+2=5 not 4, if you get what I am trying to say.

I strongly rec stacking a GHRP with a GHRH for optimal results in tissue growth and fat loss, even if also using an IGF1 analog in the same cycle as some like to do.


Here are some good examples of “peptide cycles” (Taken Sub Q):

1#
Wk1-8 40mcg ed IGF-1LR3

2#
Wk1-12 1000mcg (1mg) every week CJC-1295
Wk1-12 100mcg 2-3X ed GHRP-2 or GHRP-6
Wk1-12 10-20mcg ed IGF1 Ec (post workout’s)

3#
Wk1-12 100mcg 2-3X ed CJC-1293 (CJC w/o Dac)
Wk1-12 100mcg 2-3X ed GHRP-2 or GHRP-6

4#
Wk1-8 40mcg ed IGF-1LR3
Wk1-12 100mcg 2-3X ed CJC-1293 (CJC w/o Dac)
Wk1-12 100mcg 2-3X ed GHRP-2 or GHRP-6

5#
Wk1-8 10-20mcg 1-2X ed IGF-1 Des

6#
Wk1-8 10-20mcg 1-2X ed IGF-1 Des
Wk1-12 100mcg 2-3X ed CJC-1293 (CJC w/o Dac)
Wk1-12 100mcg 2-3X ed GHRP-2 or GHRP-6

7#
Wk1-8 10-20mcg 1-2X ed IGF-1 Des
Wk1-12 1000mcg (1mg) every week CJC-1295 (Sub Q)
Wk1-12 100mcg 2-3X ed GHRP-2 or GHRP-6

8# (MT2 cycle is for tanning purposes only, dependent on skin type and these are guidelines only)
Wk1-4 0.5mg 2-3X a week of MT2 (10min tan every week)
Wk4-8 0.5mg 1X a week of MT2 (10min tan every other week)
Wk8-? 0.5mg 1X a month of MT2 (tan and dose as needed) *maintenance

These cycles above would be optimal ways of using these peptides for muscle growth and fat loss.

Using one or more of the HGH releasing peptides along with an IGF peptide like IGF-1lr3 could lead to growth and more fat loss over just the use of IGF-1lr3.
But the use of one or more of the HGH releasing peptides without IGF-1 could lead to less total gains in mass as well. So stacking is goal dependent.
I feel they stack together very nicely personally and I highly recommend IGF1LR3 to my friends new to and interested in peptides.

IGF1lr3 or IGF1 Des are good peptides to start out with due to the simple ease of their.
Then once you feel comfortable I would highly recommend stacking it with one of the GHRP’s and GHRH’s for maximum results.

There are new discoveries every day in the field of “the human body” and I would be VERY Happy If I had some effect on this knowledge spreading, so I hope you learned something and enjoyed my article on these peptides and how to use them most effectively and safely.

I look forward to helping all I can and making more of these kinds of informative articles.
Till the next time,







Take care!









References:
1) Peptide Hormone Secretion/Peptide Hormone Action: A Practical Approach 2 Volume Set Author: K.Siddle, J. C. Hutton, Oxford University Press, 1991
2) Des(1–3)IGF-1 Treatment Normalizes Type 1 IGF Receptor and Phospho-Akt (Thr 308) Immunoreactivity in Predegenerative Retina of Diabetic Rats A. Kummer,1 B. E. Pulford,2 D. N. Ishii,2 and G. M. Seigel11University of Rochester School of Medicine and Dentistry, Rochester, New York, USA 2 Colorado State University, Fort Collins, Colorado, USA
3) Heart Lung Circ. 2008 Feb;17(1):33-9 Mechano-growth factor reduces loss of cardiac function in acute myocardial infarction. Carpenter V, Matthews K, Devlin G, Stuart S, Jensen J, Conaglen J, Jeanplong F, Goldspink P, Yang SY, Goldspink G, Bass J, McMahon C. Source Waikato Clinical School, Private Bag 3200, Hamilton, New Zealand. Mechano-growth factor reduces loss of cardia... [Heart Lung Circ. 2008] - PubMed - NCBI
4) The somatomedin hypothesis: 2001.Le Roith D, Bondy C, Yakar S, Liu JL, Butler A. Clinical Endocrinology Branch, National Institutes of Health, Bethesda, Maryland 20892-1758, USA. [email protected] The somatomedin hypothesis: 2001. [Endocr Rev. 2001] - PubMed - NCBI
5) Mechanisms of disease: metabolic effects of growth hormone and insulin-like growth factor 1.
6) LeRoith D, Yakar S.Division of Endocrinology, Diabetes and Bone Diseases, Department of Medicine, Mount Sinai School of Medicine, New York, NY 10029-6574, USA. [email protected]

[Blergs]

oops

[DanB]

did you write that yourself? do you rep for anybody? sounds like something straight from a peptide site

why advise cjc1295?

and why use the term cjc 1293? you know this is inaccurate and a term made by pep suppliers?

why tell people to use 100mcg of a ghrh/ghrp when the saturation dose is 1mcg per kg?

I haven't personally used MGF but the consensus on dats forum is it is worthless so that is good enough for me

don't get me wrong, fair play for taking the time to post it but there is a few holes......

[Juced_porkchop]

did you write that yourself? do you rep for anybody? sounds like something straight from a peptide site

why advise cjc1295?

and why use the term cjc 1293? you know this is inaccurate and a term made by pep suppliers?

why tell people to use 100mcg of a ghrh/ghrp when the saturation dose is 1mcg per kg?

I haven't personally used MGF but the consensus on dats forum is it is worthless so that is good enough for me

don't get me wrong, fair play for taking the time to post it but there is a few holes......

the "holes" are oppinions
I dont want to hear the bro-lore of how CJC-1295 is how a womens body would pump HGH and how its not worth using or how its not good for men. That is BS. and I'm tired of seeing it repeated, I have used it myself.
I have also used GRF (1-29) or CJC1293 or CJC no Dac or what ever you want to call it.

also Satuation dose I have seen conflictiong opinions and studies... again opinion.
I beleave and know myself from exp that 100mcg 2-4 X a day is nice and i also know CJC1295 is great to use also.
I like cjc-1295 long term more with some GHRP-2 or MK677.

I know Dat be tru and I agree with most of what he has to say. but everyone has ther oppinion regardless.

[Juced_porkchop]

And no I don't rep for a pep company and yes I made that myself from what I have learned over the years from reading AND from use.
Shit I support the board sponser here!
And if anyone asked me where to go for peptides I would say go with AR-R all the way!

[Juced_porkchop]

Im new here but I am not new to the forums. :-D

[DanB]

the "holes" are oppinions
I dont want to hear the bro-lore of how CJC-1295 is how a womens body would pump HGH and how its nto worth using or how its not good for men. that is BS. and im tired of seeing it repeated, I have used it myself. Well there is charts and studys on dats board to show it isnt mearly an opinion
I have also used GRF (1-29) or CJC1293 or CJC no Dac or what ever you want to call it. Why not use the correct terms?

also Satuation dose I have seen conflictiong opinions and studies... again opinion. Again studys on dats forum
I beleave and know myself from exp that 100mcg 2-4 X a day is nice and i also know CJC1295 is great to use also. 100mcg may be nice but is a waste if you weigh 60kg, again studys on Dats forum prove this

I know Dat be tru and I agree with most of what he has to say. but everyone has ther oppinion regardless His are backed by studys.

So if studys are mearly opinions then what can we use to educate ourselves?

Not trying to get into a pissing match, just saying how it is inaccurate and potentially harmful/waste of money for people unlike ourselves who havnt used/done any research who might read this and take it as gospel

[Juced_porkchop]

So if studys are mearly opinions then what can we use to educate ourselves?

Not trying to get into a pissing match, just saying how it is inaccurate and potentially harmful/waste of money for people unlike ourselves who havnt used/done any research who might read this and take it as gospel

I am assuming people already have a good base and good amount of lb. on them, or they shouldn’t be using aas or peptides in my opinion.
And you are looking for a pissing match.
I think its good info and many others on other forums do as well. So are you on my back because I am a new member?
Is that how this place is?

I am not wasting my time with you. I have seen enough studies on things to understand in many cases where there is a study proving one thing there is one proving the opposite if you look hard enough.
I made this from reading many studies (yes even on datbetrues forum and his other work) made my choice on what I think is relevant and true from them combined with my personall experience on them.
If you don’t like it fine.

But don't bother poster here because I am not wasting my time with you when I am only posting this to help others that are new to this.
Sorry but as much as I think Dat be true is right and he has A LOT of good info and I would rec others to his info…. Dat be true is not the gospel ether, so back off.

[Juced_porkchop]

Could a mod just take out all this crap besides the first post? if so thanks....

[DanB]

I am assuming people already have a good base and good amount of lb. on them, or they shouldn’t be using aas or peptides in my opinion. A good base dosnt mean 100kg which is weight to justify 100mcg dosing for ghrh's/ghrp's
And you are looking for a pissing match. Not at all, I just stating my opinion as you stated yours in the OP, if I wanted a pissing match I would find one alot easier with a clueless newbie in Q&A
I think its good info and many others on other forums do as well. So are you on my back because I am a new member? New, old no difference, its info posted not how long you been a member
Is that how this place is? Not at all, if you look around, there is several respected members who joined only a couple months ago

I am not wasting my time with you. I have seen enough studies on things to understand in many cases where there is a study proving one thing there is one proving the opposite if you look hard enough. I have done, I have also looked into who funds certain studys
I made this from reading many studies (yes even on datbetrues forum and his other work) made my choice on what I think is relevant and true from them combined with my personally experience on them. Fair enough
If you don’t like it fine. No problem, as I said, fair play for taking the time to post it

But don't bother poster here because I am not wasting my time with you when I am only posting this to help others that are new to this. Its a public forum so until staff tell me otherwise..... and newbies should hear both sides of the story if you trying to educate somebody, do you not agree?
Sorry but as much as I think Dat be true is right and he has A LOT of good info and I would rec others to his info…. Dat be true is not the gospel ether, so back off. No he isnt your correct and I never stated he was, but neither is russianstar or whatever his name is who advocates use of cjc1295, but only for a couple months at a time then time off or onto mod grf to avoid possible complications as you failed to mention in the OP and Dat admits he makes mistakes, but when data is in front of you, its hard to dismiss it

Above

[DanB]

Could a mod just take out all this crap besides the first post? if so thanks....

So you can give your opinion and that is gospel with no arguements allowed? if mods feel the need to remove my posts I wont complain but somehow I cant see it happening

[DanB]

Anyways I have made my points, no point me going any further as I have given my opinion

Best of luck

[gixxerboy1]

No Mod is going to delete post. People are aloud to post different views. Members can read it all and decide for themselves

[Juced_porkchop]

I agree a debate on both sides is the best way to learn, done and done.
russianstar! I know him also, forgot about him.
I should see what other thoughts he has recently.

[DanB]

I agree a debate on both sides is the best way to learn, done and done.
russianstar! I know him also, forgot about him.
I should see what other thoughts he has recently.

Dont get me wrong, its nothing personal against you and I hope you dont take it as such

[tballz]

This is great! This is how we all learn!

[Times Roman]

the only thing I see is that I wouldn't take the cjc1295 w/dac anymore. took it for 6 months. no, i didn't feel anything, as it wouuld impact me at a glandular level, but now take it without the dac, which means pinning 3x a day instead of 1x a week, but that's ok by me.

[Times Roman]

I was thinking about putting together a similar thread, but instead of focusing on growth factors, focus on other things instead, like tissue repair and such (tb4, PQQ, etc.)

[DanB]

I was thinking about putting together a similar thread, but instead of focusing on growth factors, focus on other things instead, like tissue repair and such (tb4, PQQ, etc.)

wouldnt be a bad idea TR, I see alot of questions on this recently and not many here have experience with this to help

[Juced_porkchop]

Dont get me wrong, its nothing personal against you and I hope you dont take it as such

At first I was, I didnt know you just wanted a debate, because I know how it is when you have a low post count at some places and start posting, so I ran for my guns.

It's all good.

[Times Roman]

At first I was, I didnt know you just wanted a debate, because I know how it is when you have a low post count at some places and start posting, so I ran for my guns.

It's all good.

debate is a healthy way to learn.

[Juced_porkchop]

I was thinking about putting together a similar thread, but instead of focusing on growth factors, focus on other things instead, like tissue repair and such (tb4, PQQ, etc.)

I plan to do a few more over the months on things like viagra, aas, pct, thermogenics. Some i already have in the works. Ill post it up when i finish them and post them on my home forum.
Some might agree others not, but it is atleast guide lines for someone.
for TB500 and others like it will be hard since its only now growing massively now in use, even though its been around for a long time now and used with animals (mainly horses)

[Juced_porkchop]

I should mention I was in a bad car accident about 7years ago and since then it has been none stop research for me almost daily on things to do with tissue repair, supps, diet and hormones.
my first "cycle" was deca only for 11 weeks from Doc after accident then agian one more time form him. after that it was all me! (and testosterone as i dont rec any cycles with out atleast a SMALL dose of test in there)
I have found IGF1 helping with back pain for me because doc say I am "losing fluid" "have buldging disks and pressing disks" and some other stuff with my back now.
The TB sounds promising and I DO plan to learn more on that one.

I'm in pain daily but i dont want to just take pain meds, I need to stay strong and deal with it, even if im in a bad mood 50% of the time from it.

[tballz]

I was thinking about putting together a similar thread, but instead of focusing on growth factors, focus on other things instead, like tissue repair and such (tb4, PQQ, etc.)

Have you checked out TB500?

[Times Roman]

Have you checked out TB500?

I've been considering it. aka Tb4. it has some interesting properties. but for a 6 week course you will drop about $500 or so....

...so im going to wait until i get hurt then try it.

[DanB]

I've been considering it. aka Tb4. it has some interesting properties. but for a 6 week course you will drop about $500 or so....

...so im going to wait until i get hurt then try it.

lol positive thinking there my man

I remember staff here saying their wife was on it and showing great results thus far

[taewon]

Usually 20-50 per bottle

[Juced_porkchop]

I've been considering it. aka Tb4. it has some interesting properties. but for a 6 week course you will drop about $500 or so....

...so im going to wait until i get hurt then try it.

I am also very interested in this one!
Been looking into it.

[Razor]

Well ghrp2 increased my prolactin and progesterone and gave me gyno so fck that shit, Im never using that one again

[yannick35]

Isn't GH suppose to do all that too? just wondering, i am into tissue repair right now anything that can help me heal faster. I GH is enough or are these peptides worth it

[Juced_porkchop]

Isn't GH suppose to do all that too? just wondering, i am into tissue repair right now anything that can help me heal faster. I GH is enough or are these peptides worth it

both can be used. depends on your resources.
ALOT of fake HGH out there, something to keep in mind.

[Muscletech]

NOW, I will probably to buy peptides instead rHGH.. Too many, many fakes out there..

[happysumo]

Awesome write up!

[noon]

Some one Pm. me with there real experiences onthese diff substances

[Juced_porkchop]

Some one Pm. me with there real experiences onthese diff substances

there is alot of info on peptides across the forums, I dont think anyone is going to spoon feed you via PM.

lots of info here. only this forum gave me a bit of a hard time, the other 3 loved and understood it, so to each there own. ;-)

[Juced_porkchop]

Well ghrp2 increased my prolactin and progesterone and gave me gyno so fck that shit, Im never using that one again

that sucks!
I never had an issue with ghrp-2. I ran it this year witrh some tren and test + cjc. went well.

[Juced_porkchop]

NOW, I will probably to buy peptides instead rHGH.. Too many, many fakes out there..

yeah cant agree more with that statement!
PISS'S me OFF!
but at least IGF1 is found fairly easily and honestly have liked it as well maybe better then hGH (in terms of mass gains, not all the others like fatloss, though it is there)

[Tasmaniac]

Juiced porkchop: Fantastic thread! I'm about to start cycle #2. Except with IGF-1 LR3. What kind of gains did you get off that cycle mate? I'm guessing a bigger, more vascular kind of look. Cheers

[Juced_porkchop]

Juiced porkchop: Fantastic thread! I'm about to start cycle #2. Except with IGF-1 LR3. What kind of gains did you get off that cycle mate? I'm guessing a bigger, more vascular kind of look. Cheers

THANKS! :-D
I got MUCH fuller muscles, better pumps when working out (sometimes painful, but nice) and some lean mass.
I LOVE IGF1lr3 but my next run will be IGF1 Des to give a go. :-P

How did/are you going to run the IGF1lr3?

[Tasmaniac]

THANKS! :-D
I got MUCH fuller muscles, better pumps when working out (sometimes painful, but nice) and some lean mass.
I LOVE IGF1lr3 but my next run will be IGF1 Des to give a go. :-P

How did/are you going to run the IGF1lr3?

I've switched from GHRP-6 to GHRP-2, added MOD GRF and I am using IGF-1 LR3 after working out. The pumps are insane. As one poster on another forum said a while back, I get a pump brushing my teeth. It's nuts. You really can! lol

I've been running the GH for a couple of months now. From next month I am also going to run sus. I ordered a heap of extra pct stuff from ar-r yesterday and will probably pick the sus up next week.

I really want to get over 100kg. My natural weight is only about 60 so I think that's good enough. That might be my last AAS course then. I'd definitely like to continue using GH though. It's great.