IGF read?!?! kinda interesting

[Jdawg50]

Took this off bolox
http://www.professionalmuscle.com/fo...3138#post53138
Basically says the pre-diluted IGF doesent work?
I've been on for three days and something is happening??

[LightWeightBaby]

it is only one guy saying that, i just think he is a dumbass

[sin]

i think the link he gave shows some pretty good points. small molecules have a tendency to stick to glass, and igf-1 is pretty small. as far as binding it to albumin, that sounds like a bad idea. having full size foreign proteins in my blood stream sounds like an autoimmune disease waiting to happen. personally i think that some of the activity of the igf-1 may be lost, but enough remains to get some gains from it. im more inclined to trust a molecular biology company and their info than i am a grey market research company looking to make a quick buck.

[einstein1905]

I had to join that board and post over there....it was just too painful to read that and not respond. That kid is throwing out a bunch of unfounded claims and nothing more. As far as albumin being dangerous, it isn't. It's the most prevalent protein in your bloodstream at any moment. The addition of albumin or some other protein would be to just "block" and binding of IGF to the glass, which in and of itself is very unlikely due to its structure. It wouldn't "bind" to IGF, it may weakly associate with some regions, but this will have little or no effect on its potency.

[sin]

I had to join that board and post over there....it was just too painful to read that and not respond. That kid is throwing out a bunch of unfounded claims and nothing more. As far as albumin being dangerous, it isn't. It's the most prevalent protein in your bloodstream at any moment. The addition of albumin or some other protein would be to just "block" and binding of IGF to the glass, which in and of itself is very unlikely due to its structure. It wouldn't "bind" to IGF, it may weakly associate with some regions, but this will have little or no effect on its potency.

you are talking about YOUR albumin, recognition of self/non-self is a big deal. there are a number of autoimmune diseases that are related or thought to be related to this. and not to sound like a dick, but you think you can see how these two proteins (IGF and albumin) are going to interact? how can you tell without looking at tertiary and quaternary structure, even then it would take a computer program to even have an idea.

[einstein1905]

you are talking about YOUR albumin, recognition of self/non-self is a big deal. there are a number of autoimmune diseases that are related or thought to be related to this. and not to sound like a dick, but you think you can see how these two proteins (IGF and albumin) are going to interact? how can you tell without looking at tertiary and quaternary structure, even then it would take a computer program to even have an idea.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/Structure/CN3D/cn3d.shtml
The above program, as well as many other, will predict tertiary structure or show the actual tertiary structure submitted to medline. That's unneccesary though with IGF-1 and albumin. Albumin has no significant reactivity motifs. That's why it's commonly used in numerous protein assays to block nonspecific binding to reduce background.
Regarding autoimmune disease and albumin, you're off base. My albumin and your albumin are identical. Bovine serum albumin is almost identical to human. BSA in humans will even rarely cause be recognized (i.e. no anti-BSA antibodies will be propogated). Although a lot of autoimmunity does stem from an immunogen elliciting an cell-mediated response, which subsequently cross-reacts with a "self" component, thay are all pretty well characterized.
Not to sound like a pompous ass, but I'm an MD/PhD student....biomedical research is what I do. I'm in the lab the better part of each day or doing literature searches in the library. That's why when someone spouts off some "scientific" data, I question it. If it isn't in a peer-reviewd scientific journal, it's nothing more than someone's opinion.

[sin]

thanks for the response einstein, you actually made my day. its not often that people can back up claims like this. not that predicting tertiary structure will necessarily show you how proteins interact. i disagree with your albumin argument, since it is used because it interacts with most proteins, thats why it binds and reduces background. as far as BSA in the body, the effects may not be drastic, but they can be present. look at diseases like scleroderma, there is a possibility that this disease is from fetal cells that get into the females blood stream and propogate over a number of years. and not to sound like a pompous ass, but im finishing up my PhD in molecular pharmacology, so to your couple years of lab research i have about five.

[Jdawg50]

Well the IGF I got is doing something!

[01dragonslayer]

Well the IGF I got is doing something!

How long have you been on and whats your dose bro?

[Jdawg50]

4 days 25mcgs 2 x ed