Big Bulk

[Bolltted]

Stats:
Hi, 165 pounds nearly 6"5. I am an ex long distance athlete with a very good knowledge base on fitness and nutrition. After my second knee replacement months ago, I was depressed as I couldn't not do what I love which is to train day in day out (marathon). After some thought I decided bodybuilding would be my new obsession/hobby as I had always been intrigued by the lifestyle. I know weird, but I won't explain why here as it will take too long.
Start picture taken on wednesday oct 19th.

Expectations: Lets see what happens. I have done a lot of research on lifting weights and steroids in the past 8 months. I plan on bulking to at least 240 pounds followed by a one month cruise leading in to a summer blast.

Concerns: I have tons of pramipexole, arimidex and accutane just in case. I have a very strong liver (taken a lot of diclofenac, ibuprofen and t3 while I was an endurance athlete). I do not believe in keeping gains or building a base. I believe the only gains you can keep are what your body can hold onto naturally. I have experience with epo blood doping and other techniques and protocols for improving cardiovascular performance. I also believe that experience using steroids does not correlate with abuse. If you believe that I am abusing steroids then you should label anyone taking these doses as abusers regardless of experience.

Diet (Will increase with size gain):

7am
2 cups quick oats dry
1 cup frozen berries
7 eggs
brown sugar and salt to tase
~80g protein ~160g carbs Low fat

10-11am
2 scoops whey
2 cups whipping cream 33%
~50g protein ~170g fat Low carbs

2pm
~300g ground beef
1.5 cups white rice dry
~80g protein ~53g fat ~220g carbs

Mixed fruit intra workout

PWO Meal 5:30pm
~400g white pasta dry
tuna, chicken or ground beef
tomato sauce with veggies and spices
~110g protein ~20-40g fat ~330g carbs

This is my diet(proteins will be interchanged to keep things fresh). Yes my pre and post workout meals are large and many would say "more meals less volume". Well, I am essentially eating multiple meals as I like to sit and eat these meals for 2-3 hours while I study thereby achieving the same effect.

Important! I have an EXTREMELY fast metabolism. I am the type that can handle these carbs and not get fat on this amount of carbs. Hell I could drink a litre of cream and a 750ml bottle of nesquik a day along with my meals for a month and not get obese (I am sure I would put on a few).

Lifting Schedule:

Mon-Chest
Tues-Legs
Wed-Back
Thurs-Shoulders
Fri-Arms/Traps/Deads
Sat/Sun-Deads if not feeling it on Fri

Will provide weekly updates at the least.

Let me end this in saying that I am in NO WAY CONDONING ANYONE DO THESE STUPIDLY HIGH DOSES. I AM EXPERIMENTING ON MY BODY AND AM LOOKING FOR A FORUM TO SHARE MY EXPERIENCE.

[Bolltted]

10/20/2016 Thursday: Just pinned 3cc test e left delt and 2.5cc tren e in right delt. Smooth thick oil. Trained shoulders good first session pushing 115 military barbell easily for 10 reps. Have always had very strong shoulders and calves growing up in high school.

10/21/2016 Friday: Injection pain is is fucking terrible yup don’t inject 2.5ccs of tren and 3ccs of test in each delt when you are 165 pounds. Did squats good surprisingly good form, back very tight from superdrol. Trained traps and arms as well good weight on curls. Grip is VERY weak going to take a while to get that up to par. Yup definitely feeling the superdrol they are fucking strong sat in bed for four hours with headache and nausea.

[TheTaxMan]

WTF, this has to be trolling? 2000mg test and 1500mg of tren , superdrol and dbol and a goal of gaining 75lbs from it?

Im a pretty easy going guy and all up for an "educated risk" but this sounds suicidal

I hope its just a joke

[Bolltted]

WTF, this has to be trolling? 1500mg test and 1000mg of tren , superdrol and dbol and a goal of gaining 75lbs from it?

Im a pretty easy going guy and all up for an "educated risk" but this sounds suicidal

I hope its just a joke

Thanks man. Nope not a joke will update as I can. Will provide weekly weight and pics every thursday as well!

[TheTaxMan]

Have you cycled before? Why have you decided to use such a high dose? Your not going to get more gains by using such crazy dosages

You said you researched for months, where have you read this would be a good idea?

2000mg of test and 1500mg of tren ? Ive never heard of it, I would love to know where you obtained this info/research as being a good idea?

[Bolltted]

Have you cycled before? Why have you decided to use such a high dose? Your not going to get more gains by using such crazy dosages

You said you researched for months, where have you read this would be a good idea?

2000mg of test and 1500mg of tren? Ive never heard of it, I would love to know where you obtained this info/research as being a good idea?

No, I the only ped I have used is epo. I thought about using 150-200mg testosterone a couple years back for my running but ended up deciding against it due to fear of hurting my cardiovascular performance. Oh and no, nearly all the information I have read online suggests a maximum of around 500-750mg of test per week for a first timer. I am experimenting on my body to see if there is any merit to the "more is better" theory. I could not find any logs of first timers using over 1000mgs a week so decided I would try it myself, see what happens and share with others.

[Back In Black]

Lol, waiting for all the side effects to hit. This is stupidity at best. Good luck though buddy.

[TheTaxMan]

Fair enough experiment with your body, but imo your gambling with your life here mate, you say you have a strong liver, its possible you may not have one after this

[clarky.]

You might have very good knowledge in fitness and nutrition but you have no clue at all about AAS. This is just pure nonsense and it is ppl like you that give AAS a bad name Welcome.

[GSXRvi6]

10/21/2016 Friday: Injection pain is is fucking terrible yup don’t inject 2.5ccs of tren and 3ccs of test in each delt

Umm, here's your sign...

Yup definitely feeling the superdrol they are fucking strong sat in bed for four hours with headache and nausea.

This has to be some of the dumbest shit I have seen posted up here. I hope you don't have a heart attack / stroke / grow tits before you realize just how damn stupid this is.

All of the good information out there are still people that do this kind of shit. amazing.

Subscribed for entertainment.

Do us a favor and post your blood pressure and labs as well so we can watch you wreck your organs while your at it.

[Bolltted]

Umm, here's your sign...



This has to be some of the dumbest shit I have seen posted up here. I hope you don't have a heart attack / stroke / grow tits before you realize just how damn stupid this is.

All of the good information out there are still people that do this kind of shit. amazing.

Subscribed for entertainment.

Do us a favor and post your blood pressure and labs as well so we can watch you wreck your organs while your at it.

Yeah I will get bloodwork done at the halfway mark. If liver values are atrocious even after stopping the superdrol, I will most likely scratch the dbol .

[RigPig]

Did Bostin Lloyd design this cycle? Where's the 3ccs of SEO in each muscle everyday? That's all that's missing in the fuckin train wreck.
If you live through this I'll be amazed.

[marcus300]

For any newbie's reading please don't try and follow anything what the OP is doing, its extremely dangerous, immature and its how not to run a cycle for your level and experience.

In fact this log is a joke but might make interesting reading to see how not to cycle if its not just a troll.

[Cuz]

Future " How not to run a cycle

[Baxter35]

Just stumbled on this! Should be interesting.OP please don't die on us so you can keep us posted. No sense adding much else to what others have already said. It's stupid, you know it's stupid, and I don't think anything will change your mind so....... just please be honest with everything so we'll have a good log to discourage others.

[Obs]

73lbs water weight in a month and heart failure my predictions. No balls left. Probably tits. And straight into depression and trt. Never to use his pecker again. Good luck with the experiment.

[GSXRvi6]

Yeah I will get bloodwork done at the halfway mark. If liver values are atrocious even after stopping the superdrol, I will most likely scratch the dbol.

With your cycle you have to worry about more than your liver. Between the tren doing what tren does to kidneys (since you did your research you should know it's affects on BP, hairline, leukocytes, lipids, dopamine uptake, kidneys etc) your BP from the gear and all the water your going to take on your going to do some amazing amounts of stress to your heart and kidneys as well.

Playing with Prami is playing with fire, and I don't mean the "oh it can make you sick" anyone here that has ran prami for a good click knows what I'm talking about. Dopamine agonists are not skittles and I think people don't take them serious enough.

Your diet is also crap for this, your HDL's are going to tank so bad and then you look at the food your eating on top of that. I honestly don't think you've done a lot of research, my guess is you've read a few internet posts, a couple youtube videos and subscribe to Bostin's channel. If you actually did your research you wouldn't be doing this.

At 165lbs your scrawny, what you need is food, and if you can't grow on food and something as simple as 500mg of test then you don't know how to eat and train.

[Bolltted]

With your cycle you have to worry about more than your liver. Between the tren doing what tren does to kidneys (since you did your research you should know it's affects on BP, hairline, leukocytes, lipids, dopamine uptake, kidneys etc) your BP from the gear and all the water your going to take on your going to do some amazing amounts of stress to your heart and kidneys as well.

Playing with Prami is playing with fire, and I don't mean the "oh it can make you sick" anyone here that has ran prami for a good click knows what I'm talking about. Dopamine agonists are not skittles and I think people don't take them serious enough.

Your diet is also crap for this, your HDL's are going to tank so bad and then you look at the food your eating on top of that. I honestly don't think you've done a lot of research, my guess is you've read a few internet posts, a couple youtube videos and subscribe to Bostin's channel. If you actually did your research you wouldn't be doing this.

At 165lbs your scrawny, what you need is food, and if you can't grow on food and something as simple as 500mg of test then you don't know how to eat and train.

Thanks man. I appreciate your advice and I agree with 99% of it. However, I am going to have to disagree with your thoughts on my cholesterol. During my time as an endurance athelete, I always had a similar diet with very high fats and carbs. I would usually intake about double the amount of whipping cream leading up to a meet. My blood work has always been terrific, cholesterol being no different. I do see your point about the kidneys. And for what reason am I going to be holding water? From my understanding, water retention can be managed and prevented while using anabolics?

Edit: Forgot to mention I have been taking niacin regularly for the past 4 years and have been monitored by a doctor (my father). But to be more clear, my goal is not to be healthy. I am experimenting and I believe that at my age I will live through it and regain my health post blast.

[ironbeck]

1500mg of tren is a big mistake without experience! your either going to lose your job, get divorced or hurt someone.

[Marsoc]

Lolwow. I never cycled ever. But those dosages are insane.
All I was wondering is how your 165lbs and 6'5" lol. U should be at least 200 by not lifting a finger. ..what's makes u think that u can add on 100 lbs. and keep it. Why do u lack the weight as is....from cardio and no eating or....
Not to mention that ur training sessions probably matters most aside from diet and no magical compunds let alone 5 kilos of multiple compounds a day lmao. . What's an example of ur training session going to be like. What methods of intensity.

[TheTaxMan]

Lolwow. I never cycled ever. But those dosages are insane.
All I was wondering is how your 165lbs and 6'5" lol. U should be at least 200 by not lifting a finger. ..what's makes u think that u can add on 100 lbs. and keep it. Why do u lack the weight as is....from cardio and no eating or....
Not to mention that ur training sessions probably matters most aside from diet and no magical compunds let alone 5 kilos of multiple compounds a day lmao. . What's an example of ur training session going to be like. What methods of intensity.

Because hes literally just started lifting

[hammerheart]

1500mg of tren is a big mistake without experience! your either going to lose your job, get divorced or hurt someone.

A proud member of the AR was left in hospital with liver failure after over a gram of tren . Well some have to learn the hard way I guess.

[Bolltted]

Lolwow. I never cycled ever. But those dosages are insane.
All I was wondering is how your 165lbs and 6'5" lol. U should be at least 200 by not lifting a finger. ..what's makes u think that u can add on 100 lbs. and keep it. Why do u lack the weight as is....from cardio and no eating or....
Not to mention that ur training sessions probably matters most aside from diet and no magical compunds let alone 5 kilos of multiple compounds a day lmao. . What's an example of ur training session going to be like. What methods of intensity.

I'm training chest on monday. I can post a couple snippets on here. A friend has already shown me the ropes, I am confident I will have no problem with technique.

[Marsoc]

I'm training chest on monday. I can post a couple snippets on here. A friend has already shown me the ropes, I am confident I will have no problem with technique.

Bro snippets is for fucking photo albums lol. I doubt u know wht actual intensity is. I mean u say U ran before. I guess if ur a natural runner it can't relate but I can relate the pains of rucking with 90 lbs in my pack to the intensity in the gym. But still it has nothing to do with it. What's ur snippets lol. So regular sets. A little pump ..or...snippets,,,hmmmmmlol

Check out Eart Gym lmao ..it a beginners guide to using what U got. No gym Pass etc. but that's easy shit. Non offenses i just like to see what others idea of intensity is. And I usually can't compare. I just want U to have real views on whts what. Aside from any cycles .but I'm sure u know all about it since ur boy gave u some snippets..lol

I don't mean to sound like I'm taking it personaly but I guess i am in a way. Just cuz I hate pure ignorance and arrogance. Especially combined lol

[Bolltted]

Bro snippets is for fucking photo albums lol. I doubt u know wht actual intensity is. I mean u say U ran before. I guess if ur a natural runner it can't relate but I can relate the pains of rucking with 90 lbs in my pack to the intensity in the gym. But still it has nothing to do with it. What's ur snippets lol. So regular sets. A little pump ..or...snippets,,,hmmmmmlol

Check out Eart Gym lmao ..it a beginners guide to using what U got. No gym Pass etc. but that's easy shit. Non offenses i just like to see what others idea of intensity is. And I usually can't compare. I just want U to have real views on whts what. Aside from any cycles .but I'm sure u know all about it since ur boy gave u some snippets..lol

I don't mean to sound like I'm taking it personaly but I guess i am in a way. Just cuz I hate pure ignorance and arrogance. Especially combined lol

Haha I meant a clip of my training session if you would like to see intensity. And I know intensity very well. I offer you to try running at least 40 miles a week at a real competitive pace. I appreciate the input, I'll apply it to my training.

[Mr.BB]

For any newbie's reading please don't try and follow anything what the OP is doing, its extremely dangerous, immature and its how not to run a cycle for your level and experience.

In fact this log is a joke but might make interesting reading to see how not to cycle if its not just a troll.

^^This x2

[Vash the Stampede]

Allow me to take some inspiration from Marcus and use his favorite word, cunt.

This stupid cunt has been warned by us, and knows what he is doing is a death wish. I have zero sympathy for dumb cunts like this. As far as I'm concerned, he deserves all the pain, suffering and possibly death.

Good riddance to useless cunts.

[GSXRvi6]

Thanks man. I appreciate your advice and I agree with 99% of it. However, I am going to have to disagree with your thoughts on my cholesterol. During my time as an endurance athelete, I always had a similar diet with very high fats and carbs. I would usually intake about double the amount of whipping cream leading up to a meet. My blood work has always been terrific, cholesterol being no different. I do see your point about the kidneys. And for what reason am I going to be holding water? From my understanding, water retention can be managed and prevented while using anabolics?

Edit: Forgot to mention I have been taking niacin regularly for the past 4 years and have been monitored by a doctor (my father). But to be more clear, my goal is not to be healthy. I am experimenting and I believe that at my age I will live through it and regain my health post blast.

Your planning on taking 2 grams of test and you have dbol in the mix later down the road as well, your going to be taking on water like a sinking ship. Water retention can be managed while using anabolics but with the cycle you have outlined I would argue it can't be prevented.

I'm not sure you can understand this, or many do understand this and there are those that would argue due to something they read on the internet but your body can only use so much test, how much depends on the individual. Myself for example, I need very little test, I achieve homeostasis on 100mg /wk and can "grow" on as little as 200mg/wk. My max is somewhere around 600mg/wk at 1 gram I was throwing away money and my sides skyrocketed. I'm one of the guys on here that hates test, add enough to get the job done and no more is my take on it. My buddy who is smaller than I am requires double that for homeostasis - genetics. Once you take "enough" test the knob is turned all the way to the "grow" setting, you can't keep twisting the knob. But if you keep slamming in test on top of that it doesn't just sit around waiting for it's turn to bind to a receptor, your body starts cranking out LOTS of metabolites because it has all this free test floating around. There are more metabolites than just estrogen and DHT, all of those metabolites at high doses can start causing side effects. So when you put in just enough test to get the job done, you grow with your side effects minimized and managed. When you throw in enough test to get the job done and then dump buckets more on top of that, you don't add any benefit but your sides will go through the roof. At your size, 2 grams is going to make a ton of estrogen (your taking a 19-nor which increases aromitase activity to boot) so your going to hold water - I don't care if you wait a few weeks and start taking dex your still going to hold water and have sides, this is assuming your gear is real of course.

Water is going to increase your blood pressure.

Superdrol, even on a proper cycle will raise your blood pressure, add that to my previous statement

Tren , even on a proper cycle, will raise your blood pressure, add that to my previous two statements.

So we can establish some quick facts right away, the first one is, regardless of what you do your going to take on some water, and your blood pressure is going to go up.

Now lets look at tren, Tren will cause your nephrons's to constrict, there is good and bad from this, but this adds stress to the kidneys, now add some water retention and increased blood pressure ON TOP of this and your guaranteed some level of kidney damage. Maybe not enough for you to care today, maybe not even enough to move you to stage 2 but you WILL impact your kidneys, but for me who is in stage 3a due to non AAS reasons I tend to take my kidney health very serious.

Then you have trens affect on dopamine, so I don't know if you actually read about it or if you just saw someone post something about "if your on tren you need prami to keep from getting milky tits" or something to that effect. With your doses and the amount of estrogen your going to crank out no doubt you could end up needing that prami, do you know how many D receptors prami binds to vs a DA like Caber? Do you know what each of those receptors are related to? I'm going to guess no, anyone who researches how prami actually works would be smart enough to toss that shit in a trash can, and if you do end up needing it, and you do end up tossing down prami daily for your cycle your going to get to experience the living hell of dopamine receptor burn out on top of all your other sides.

AAS in general is hard on your lipids, tren dreadfully so. It doesn't matter what your past diet was like and how your cholesterol ended up, if your pinning AAS it's a new ball game. If you do take your dex that also is not good for your lipids on to of the AAS and that diet. So is that diet horrible, I would say no, is that diet horrible for the drugs your taking, I'll say yes. Your missing LOTS of shit you should have in that diet.

I'm coming back off of serious injury and multiple surgeries and compared to you I'm an old man. I'm two years post op and I'm just now, just NOW getting back on the "serious" horse with my training and diet and I'm 6' with a lean body mass of 205lbs (tank tested) and I'm on 250mg/wk of sust.

I see all these videos out there of people doing INSANE dosages, I see people posting up here of their INSANE dosages and right away I think they must have fake shit or they are really dumb. Common ones are Anavar , everyone says "oh it's crap you need at least 100mg/day" or "you need to run at least a gram of primo" listen man their shit is fake or they are dumb or both. If you can't grow off 200mg of primo your doing it wrong or your shit is fake, simple as that.

Maybe your the rare genetic super freak and your body will tolerate this amount of gear just fine (highly unlikely), but there are safer ways to experiment and find out.

[NACH3]

If you can't grow off 200mg of primo your doing it wrong or your shit is fake, simple as that.

Though I do believe what your saying holds truth - no matter how good your primo is at 200mgs/day you won't gain much of any muscle tissue if at all really...ran it a few times myself and 1G+(primo not test) was the lowest I'd ever run it... its weak and should be ran far longer than 12 wks(16-20) for optimal results...

However, what the OP is considering/or has started is a complete disaster

[KINGKONG]

The tren will make you crazy at those doses your gonna have to tranquilize yourself to sleep..The sides will be harsh!!you seem to know your not suppose to cycle this high at your size and experience level, soooooo I wish you the best of luck?what else can be said?

[GSXRvi6]

If you can't grow off 200mg of primo your doing it wrong or your shit is fake, simple as that.

Though I do believe what your saying holds truth - no matter how good your primo is at 200mgs/day you won't gain much of any muscle tissue if at all really...ran it a few times myself and 1G+(primo not test) was the lowest I'd ever run it... its weak and should be ran far longer than 12 wks(16-20) for optimal results...

However, what the OP is considering/or has started is a complete disaster

At 200mg/wk over 16 - 24 weeks it will add more lean muscle tissue than natural based on my observations from a friend adding 200mg of primo to his TRT. I think what I have is schering primo in amps (I'd have to dig it out, to see). There was a definite boost in muscle growth over his standard TRT albeit nothing fast or dramatic, but it was so side effect friendly and in-line with his goals that it was the right thing for him. Obviously genetic response is also a factor.

I think Primo gets a bad rap simply because it's so slow not necessarily because of how weak it is. just my opinoin, I don't have a lot of experience with it. I've never ran a full cycle of it, I shed like a dog on it.

I will also add based on your pic your not a 165lbs 21 yo, and if you need a gram I wouldn't argue that one bit, my issue is when someone flips on youtube, see's Dylan telling people they have to run at least a gram and half, so some kid runs out and jumps on a gram and a half of primo on their first cycle because that's what someone on youtube said you needed to do.

[Marsoc]

Haha I meant a clip of my training session if you would like to see intensity. And I know intensity very well. I offer you to try running at least 40 miles a week at a real competitive pace. I appreciate the input, I'll apply it to my training.

First tweet weeks I started running about 1.5 years ago before I fell off ..story explained else where's. I was bulked up to 220lbs natural. Note prior to me training that 1.5-2 years ago I haven't lifted since high school days..10+ years ago . For hockey wrestling football soccer baseball. Basketball. I played. Not bragging but I dabbled here and there

So when I jut started running I was 220lbs running 7 minute miles. 2 weeks into it. I def would love to get my super long distance game up. It becomes real mental. Jut like weight training if ur actually going to failure and beyond
I do sprint intervals for now

[DocToxin8]

What astonished me most is not that you're gonna use such a ridiculous dosage which most experienced bodybuilders wouldn't do,
but that you claim to be educated and know what you are doing!

Luckily AAS has very low acute toxicity, so you'll live through it,
but it's a total waste. You're current level of muscle mass would improve massively with a simple test only cycle (with pct, AI and hCG ofcourse),
at a dose of 500mg f.ex.

But go ahead and log your journey, might be fun, but I suspect we'll see you begin to log and then suddenly stop hearing from you, as you won't be able to finish this cycle.

And again, to all newbies, this is not an "educated" or informed person about AAS use. He does state a disclaimer in his first thread.
So let's give him slack if he want to do this, after we've all told him how stupid it is. But most importantly, this is not someone anyone else should listen to.
That's the biggest problem I have with the OP, he makes it sound like he knows his shit. He don't.

[DocToxin8]

And saying you know you're liver works well cause you've used a lot of diclofenac, t3 and ibuprofen just proves you're ignorant about such issues.
None of those agents are known for their liver toxicity.
Diclofenac and ibuprofen are NSAIDs, they can be hard on the stomach lining, kidneys, and lead to circulation issues long term.
T3 isn't hepatotoxic either.
So you're citing 3 drugs which don't affect the liver (unless ridiculous amounts are used, in which case kidney failure would set in first, or thyreotoxicosis with T3) as proof that you have a good liver?!

[Bolltted]

At 200mg/wk over 16 - 24 weeks it will add more lean muscle tissue than natural based on my observations from a friend adding 200mg of primo to his TRT. I think what I have is schering primo in amps (I'd have to dig it out, to see). There was a definite boost in muscle growth over his standard TRT albeit nothing fast or dramatic, but it was so side effect friendly and in-line with his goals that it was the right thing for him. Obviously genetic response is also a factor.

I think Primo gets a bad rap simply because it's so slow not necessarily because of how weak it is. just my opinoin, I don't have a lot of experience with it. I've never ran a full cycle of it, I shed like a dog on it.

I will also add based on your pic your not a 165lbs 21 yo, and if you need a gram I wouldn't argue that one bit, my issue is when someone flips on youtube, see's Dylan telling people they have to run at least a gram and half, so some kid runs out and jumps on a gram and a half of primo on their first cycle because that's what someone on youtube said you needed to do.

Hey man read both of your replies, definitely some good information there. I appreciate you taking the time out of your day to respond. But on the age and weight thing. Funny thing is I actually screenshotted the picture from a video taken the same day (wednesday). Video shows me stepping on the scale and with my face in it you can clearly tell I'm 21 lol.

[Bolltted]

Your planning on taking 2 grams of test and you have dbol in the mix later down the road as well, your going to be taking on water like a sinking ship. Water retention can be managed while using anabolics but with the cycle you have outlined I would argue it can't be prevented.

I'm not sure you can understand this, or many do understand this and there are those that would argue due to something they read on the internet but your body can only use so much test, how much depends on the individual. Myself for example, I need very little test, I achieve homeostasis on 100mg /wk and can "grow" on as little as 200mg/wk. My max is somewhere around 600mg/wk at 1 gram I was throwing away money and my sides skyrocketed. I'm one of the guys on here that hates test, add enough to get the job done and no more is my take on it. My buddy who is smaller than I am requires double that for homeostasis - genetics. Once you take "enough" test the knob is turned all the way to the "grow" setting, you can't keep twisting the knob. But if you keep slamming in test on top of that it doesn't just sit around waiting for it's turn to bind to a receptor, your body starts cranking out LOTS of metabolites because it has all this free test floating around. There are more metabolites than just estrogen and DHT, all of those metabolites at high doses can start causing side effects. So when you put in just enough test to get the job done, you grow with your side effects minimized and managed. When you throw in enough test to get the job done and then dump buckets more on top of that, you don't add any benefit but your sides will go through the roof. At your size, 2 grams is going to make a ton of estrogen (your taking a 19-nor which increases aromitase activity to boot) so your going to hold water - I don't care if you wait a few weeks and start taking dex your still going to hold water and have sides, this is assuming your gear is real of course.

Water is going to increase your blood pressure.

Superdrol, even on a proper cycle will raise your blood pressure, add that to my previous statement

Tren , even on a proper cycle, will raise your blood pressure, add that to my previous two statements.

So we can establish some quick facts right away, the first one is, regardless of what you do your going to take on some water, and your blood pressure is going to go up.

Now lets look at tren, Tren will cause your nephrons's to constrict, there is good and bad from this, but this adds stress to the kidneys, now add some water retention and increased blood pressure ON TOP of this and your guaranteed some level of kidney damage. Maybe not enough for you to care today, maybe not even enough to move you to stage 2 but you WILL impact your kidneys, but for me who is in stage 3a due to non AAS reasons I tend to take my kidney health very serious.

Then you have trens affect on dopamine, so I don't know if you actually read about it or if you just saw someone post something about "if your on tren you need prami to keep from getting milky tits" or something to that effect. With your doses and the amount of estrogen your going to crank out no doubt you could end up needing that prami, do you know how many D receptors prami binds to vs a DA like Caber? Do you know what each of those receptors are related to? I'm going to guess no, anyone who researches how prami actually works would be smart enough to toss that shit in a trash can, and if you do end up needing it, and you do end up tossing down prami daily for your cycle your going to get to experience the living hell of dopamine receptor burn out on top of all your other sides.

AAS in general is hard on your lipids, tren dreadfully so. It doesn't matter what your past diet was like and how your cholesterol ended up, if your pinning AAS it's a new ball game. If you do take your dex that also is not good for your lipids on to of the AAS and that diet. So is that diet horrible, I would say no, is that diet horrible for the drugs your taking, I'll say yes. Your missing LOTS of shit you should have in that diet.

I'm coming back off of serious injury and multiple surgeries and compared to you I'm an old man. I'm two years post op and I'm just now, just NOW getting back on the "serious" horse with my training and diet and I'm 6' with a lean body mass of 205lbs (tank tested) and I'm on 250mg/wk of sust.

I see all these videos out there of people doing INSANE dosages, I see people posting up here of their INSANE dosages and right away I think they must have fake shit or they are really dumb. Common ones are Anavar , everyone says "oh it's crap you need at least 100mg/day" or "you need to run at least a gram of primo" listen man their shit is fake or they are dumb or both. If you can't grow off 200mg of primo your doing it wrong or your shit is fake, simple as that.

Maybe your the rare genetic super freak and your body will tolerate this amount of gear just fine (highly unlikely), but there are safer ways to experiment and find out.

Really informative post. Thanks man.

[NACH3]

At 200mg/wk over 16 - 24 weeks it will add more lean muscle tissue than natural based on my observations from a friend adding 200mg of primo to his TRT. I think what I have is schering primo in amps (I'd have to dig it out, to see). There was a definite boost in muscle growth over his standard TRT albeit nothing fast or dramatic, but it was so side effect friendly and in-line with his goals that it was the right thing for him. Obviously genetic response is also a factor.

Oh ok - yeah I agree with you in the fact the longer it's run the better and it's sure quality LBM ive also put on. Plus it's very side friendly and if run along TRT dose I can see that working too! BTW - Shering is definitely one of the better brands out there that I've read about... also, the first time I ran it I ran it at 400/wk, then 600wk, highest was 750-800mgs/wk... so I should've said I'd run about a G or so knowing how it effects me(I also love the compound)

I think Primo gets a bad rap simply because it's so slow not necessarily because of how weak it is. just my opinoin, I don't have a lot of experience with it. I've never ran a full cycle of it, I shed like a dog on it.

It's a great compound if you have the $ and time table to run it long enough... I'd shed like a dog too if and when I run it again lol

I will also add based on your pic your not a 165lbs 21 yo, and if you need a gram I wouldn't argue that one bit, my issue is when someone flips on youtube, see's Dylan telling people they have to run at least a gram and half, so some kid runs out and jumps on a gram and a half of primo on their first cycle because that's what someone on youtube said you needed to do.

I totally agree G! It's not cool to say it's useless at say any amount/dose as we're all different and respond differently.... due to how I worded some things (I'd only ever run 1g+) wasnt what I meant and would have very bad implications on any younger newer members - so I thank u for clearing that up, as well... We're all here to help each other! Right on brotha!

[TheTaxMan]

Will be good to stop pouring more attention or critique to this thread

Whats needed to be said, has been said several times

Good luck OP, although a wreckless cycle, wether trolling or not, il be watching

[GirlyGymRat]

You weight 25 lbs more and are over a foot taller. The issue is with food not with your lack of AAS.

I don't see one post of support for the over the top cycle. Members, monitors and staff have expressed concern for your health. Please took at the experience that comes with the advice.

I understand u r are hard gainer. It's a problem I do not have but have gf whose metabolism is on overdrive. This means u have to eat more. I was quite surprised to see your meal plan at only 5 meals. You should be eating 8 times a day.

How much u spend on groceries a week?

[Bolltted]

10/24/2016 Monday: Injected 2.5cc and 3cc in both glutes. Far less pain than in delts. Virtually pain free. Up about 20 pounds I believe. Excited for my 1 week physique update. Definitely packing on weight, abs have almost disappeared. Whipping cream with NO cardio is helping immensely. Force-feeding food along with completely eliminating cardio (1 hour morning cycle) is working wonders. Superdrol seems to be working well muscles are really tight in the gym. Did notice some chest spasms during my chest workout today. Very lethargic, napping at least 2 hours everyday.


EDIT: Reply to guy above. You should have really read my post. I outlined how I enjoy larger meals and eat them over 2-3 hours. Thereby, equaling the same as 2 or more meals. And I believe the diet above which consists of 6k+ calories while hitting my protein, fat and carb macros is more than sufficient. Even in all my years of endurance training, I never measured calories as they mean nothing to me.