First ever Test E only cycle

[Jangles1]

your injury is in your arm.. not your legs and back...
foam roll your forearms and bis and tris....
use voodoo floss on your arms around your elbow joint not on your elbow joint....
use straps for all pulling exercises for a month to give your forearms a break...

I never though about support tbh, but I will look into this now man...

As for foam rolling arms, I will certainly give it a good go.

Thanks for your help!

[GearHeaded]

injuries, and especially over use injuries are part of the game Jangles. most all of us that hit the gym hard have to work through them.

8 months ago I was in a wheel chair, had surgery, bed ridden for 4 months and lost 40 pounds of muscle.

I recovered as best I could and hit the gym as soon as I could. well 2 months ago I was inline machine pressing 450 lbs for 6-8 reps and felt pretty damn good (even though my back was still shot). Well now I tweaked or tore something in my rotator cuff and I can barely bench press 135 . thats sucks but thats life.
also not too long ago was barbell curling 135 for reps, well over use and overdoing curling led to tendonitis in my elbows and I'm now stuck curling only 45 pound dumb bells. I just got to keep grinding and work around what I can. . I still can't squat because of all the rods and screws in my back still need more time to set in , but I'll destroy the leg extension machine (again I do what I can).

just gotta keep grinding and work around injuries, because injuries are always going to be there to one degree or another .

[Jangles1]

injuries, and especially over use injuries are part of the game Jangles. most all of us that hit the gym hard have to work through them.

8 months ago I was in a wheel chair, had surgery, bed ridden for 4 months and lost 40 pounds of muscle.

I recovered as best I could and hit the gym as soon as I could. well 2 months ago I was inline machine pressing 450 lbs for 6-8 reps and felt pretty damn good (even though my back was still shot). Well now I tweaked or tore something in my rotator cuff and I can barely bench press 135 . thats sucks but thats life.
also not too long ago was barbell curling 135 for reps, well over use and overdoing curling led to tendonitis in my elbows and I'm now stuck curling only 45 pound dumb bells. I just got to keep grinding and work around what I can. . I still can't squat because of all the rods and screws in my back still need more time to set in , but I'll destroy the leg extension machine (again I do what I can).

just gotta keep grinding and work around injuries, because injuries are always going to be there to one degree or another .

100 % mate. I felt like giving up today when I couldn't bench or dumbbell press. Instead I got my thoughts together and went and tried the pressing machines (which I avoid like the plague) and managed to get in 3 sets on that. I guess finding work arounds is something I have to get used too. Although struggling to find an upper pec work around.

Its just so frustrating man.

Kudos to hitting the gym after your wheelchair scenario btw. Thats motivation !!!

There is a girl in the gym who is in a wheelchair and I often see her doing weighted pull ups with chains. That shit is inspiring and makes me feel very fortunate.

[Jangles1]

Coming up to the end of week 10. Fuck today was 1) hard and 2) BRUTAL on my forearms. The pump was out of this world. Felt like my arms were made out of steel or something. Very weird sensation. I had to leave pull ups as I felt that something would snap in my forearms as they were so tight.

Below are some pics


This is the start of my journey. I am 179lbs here and I tried to cut down to as low as I felt I could simply to shed as much BF as I could. Obviously I am skinny as fuck here...




Here is today PRE workout pump. Its important to say 'pre' workout as this is I guess what I look like naturally now with no 1 hour workout to help my body look much better




And here is the side by side. I do not know my weight yet as I am waiting until Monday to weigh (so I have had a full week back from the holidays, eating and training properly).





Overall, I am happy with the progress. I am not moaning, but I did think I would be more blown up at this point. By blown up I mean more bulging muscles (bis, tris, traps). Instead I have just filled out somewhat. By no means am I disappointed. Its been quite a nice steady progression and it IS what I wanted, not to blow up too much too fast.

Like everyone has said, I could have most likely achieved something similar without AAS over 6 or so months (a rough guess). I would love to have seen the transformation without AAS at this point, but hey, thats impossible and I most certainly do not regret doing it.

Maybe I am been too harsh on myself. Looking closely at these pics I do look to have gained a huge amount of size, just not really bulging biceps or triceps. I only get that post work out after with a pump.

Can anyone give me a NONE biast opinion on how long this transformation would have taken if I did the exact same thing but removed the Test ?


I still have 5 shots of Test Cyp (250mg) and 10+ test prop shots left before my PCT. Hopefully the legit dosed Test Cup starts to kick in at the start of week 11. I was thinking of extending my cycle to 14 weeks to give the Test Cyp time to kick in. I want to make the most of this and with me having almost no negative sides, I think it would be beneficial to me.

Currently I am on 100mg eod of Test P and 250mg twice a week Test C. (the test P is in there to make up for the TRT dose of test I was on for the first 6 weeks). Essentially I am on 850mg of Test E a week and have no sides. Even acne has stopped. Very weird.

Any opinions on the cycle and if extending to 14 weeks, good or bad are welcome as long as they're constructive.

[hollowedzeus]

Coming up to the end of week 10. Fuck today was 1) hard and 2) BRUTAL on my forearms. The pump was out of this world. Felt like my arms were made out of steel or something. Very weird sensation. I had to leave pull ups as I felt that something would snap in my forearms as they were so tight.

Below are some pics


This is the start of my journey. I am 179lbs here and I tried to cut down to as low as I felt I could simply to shed as much BF as I could. Obviously I am skinny as fuck here...




Here is today PRE workout pump. Its important to say 'pre' workout as this is I guess what I look like naturally now with no 1 hour workout to help my body look much better




And here is the side by side. I do not know my weight yet as I am waiting until Monday to weigh (so I have had a full week back from the holidays, eating and training properly).





Overall, I am happy with the progress. I am not moaning, but I did think I would be more blown up at this point. By blown up I mean more bulging muscles (bis, tris, traps). Instead I have just filled out somewhat. By no means am I disappointed. Its been quite a nice steady progression and it IS what I wanted, not to blow up too much too fast.

Like everyone has said, I could have most likely achieved something similar without AAS over 6 or so months (a rough guess). I would love to have seen the transformation without AAS at this point, but hey, thats impossible and I most certainly do not regret doing it.

Maybe I am been too harsh on myself. Looking closely at these pics I do look to have gained a huge amount of size, just not really bulging biceps or triceps. I only get that post work out after with a pump.

Can anyone give me a NONE biast opinion on how long this transformation would have taken if I did the exact same thing but removed the Test ?


I still have 5 shots of Test Cyp (250mg) and 10+ test prop shots left before my PCT. Hopefully the legit dosed Test Cup starts to kick in at the start of week 11. I was thinking of extending my cycle to 14 weeks to give the Test Cyp time to kick in. I want to make the most of this and with me having almost no negative sides, I think it would be beneficial to me.

Currently I am on 100mg eod of Test P and 250mg twice a week Test C. (the test P is in there to make up for the TRT dose of test I was on for the first 6 weeks). Essentially I am on 850mg of Test E a week and have no sides. Even acne has stopped. Very weird.

Any opinions on the cycle and if extending to 14 weeks, good or bad are welcome as long as they're constructive.

I went from 174 skinny to 200ish in 16 or so weeks if i recall right. Obviously put on fat but added mass naturally with low t.

Definetly think you jumped the gun a wee tad

[GearHeaded]

Can anyone give me a NONE biast opinion on how long this transformation would have taken if I did the exact same thing but removed the Test ?

this is really hard to tell. it depends on natty test levels as well. if you naturally have low T then it is much more difficult to put on size. If your natty T levels were 700+ range, then I think you could of put on 20 pounds in about 6-8 moths naturally. If your natty T levels were less then 300, then it may take a year or two just to gain 10.

When I was diagnosed with Low T and got that fixed and got my levels to 900-1200 (instead of the 160s it was), I put on about 30 pounds in 6 months. thats how important T levels are to growth. and that was all keepable muscle gains, as I have since that time added another 30-40+ pounds to that original 30 (all while still maintaining abs).. of course that additional 30-40 came through years and years of hard training, nutrition, dozens of steroid cycles, HGH, insulin etc.. but my point is having optimal Test levels can easily sustain you at a 30 pound or so heavier body weight in as little as 6 months .

get blood work done 8 weeks after PCT and make sure you've recovered good natty Test levels if you want to continue to grow

[Jangles1]

I went from 174 skinny to 200ish in 16 or so weeks if i recall right. Obviously put on fat but added mass naturally with low t.

Definetly think you jumped the gun a wee tad

100% mate. Not even in question.

At least the Test will have helped with fat

[Jangles1]

this is really hard to tell. it depends on natty test levels as well. if you naturally have low T then it is much more difficult to put on size. If your natty T levels were 700+ range, then I think you could of put on 20 pounds in about 6-8 moths naturally. If your natty T levels were less then 300, then it may take a year or two just to gain 10.

When I was diagnosed with Low T and got that fixed and got my levels to 900-1200 (instead of the 160s it was), I put on about 30 pounds in 6 months. thats how important T levels are to growth. and that was all keepable muscle gains, as I have since that time added another 30-40+ pounds to that original 30 (all while still maintaining abs).. of course that additional 30-40 came through years and years of hard training, nutrition, dozens of steroid cycles, HGH, insulin etc.. but my point is having optimal Test levels can easily sustain you at a 30 pound or so heavier body weight in as little as 6 months .

get blood work done 8 weeks after PCT and make sure you've recovered good natty Test levels if you want to continue to grow

Natty test was 400ish. Quite low.

I will 100 % be checking post PCT bloods as per the protocol in the stickies!

[1moreset024]

You could have done this Natty in the same time frame, maybe extra 4 weeks, do about 18 weeks.

Id have liked to see you at 200 lbs. Cuzz I'm positive that was only extra fat getting you that weight.

Just cuzz you were a fat 200, doesn't m mean you were a 200pound muscle man, send that won't print your bodies muscle memory and such.

But I digress,

[The Deadlifting Dog]

Can anyone give me a NONE biast opinion on how long this transformation would have taken if I did the exact same thing but removed the Test ?

Impossible to answer for now.
You will not know how much you have gained from this cycle until at least 8 weeks after you end PCT.
Much of your gains are water weight from higher androgen and estrogen levels.
You will most likely lose half of your gains once you go back to normal hormone levels.

[Jangles1]

You could have done this Natty in the same time frame, maybe extra 4 weeks, do about 18 weeks.

Id have liked to see you at 200 lbs. Cuzz I'm positive that was only extra fat getting you that weight.

Just cuzz you were a fat 200, doesn't m mean you were a 200pound muscle man, send that won't print your bodies muscle memory and such.

But I digress,

Agreed man. Def a lot of fat at 200lbs Prob 20 - 22% body fat.

I must be pushing close to 200lbs now. I started at 179 and was 189 2 weeks ago. Xmas holidays has maybe messed things up hence me not weighing myself till Monday coming. That way ive had 1 week of 4000 cals a day and 6 gym sessions.

18 weeks, hmmmm I dont personally think I could gave bulked up as much as have with pretty much no fat gain without AAS. we wont ever know and i'm not saving I am right, but the AAS most have help a fair chunk here.

[Jangles1]

Impossible to answer for now.
You will not know how much you have gained from this cycle until at least 8 weeks after you end PCT.
Much of your gains are water weight from higher androgen and estrogen levels.
You will most likely lose half of your gains once you go back to normal hormone levels.

Half seems a little high man. I don't see why I would loose half my gains with my diet and training regime. Im not saying I am right, but half seems excessive.

I shall see you in 20ish weeks for an update on the true gains from this cycle, 8 weeks after my 6 week PCT.

BTW, If you're correct in your assumption, If I get to 30lbs gained from this cycle, which I am fully confident I will, then half is 15lbs, which aint bad fucking going. Science says you can only really gain 0,5lbs of muscle a week naturally, which is 6lbs in 12 weeks. So AAS Would have given me more than double the gains. And thats IF I loose half my gains!

[Jangles1]

Food update

Todays diet


Breakfast

Milk
Oats
Honey

Milk
Cassien Why Protein

1191 cals

Lunch

Chicken
Olive Oil
Lemon (fresh)
Potatoes

1147 cals

Dinner

Rump Steak
Olive Oil
Cheery Tomatos
Avocado
Potatoes

1004 cals

Snacks

Organic Yogurt
Chocolate Milk
Almonds

327 cals


-----


4009 cals
268 P
381 C
149 F

[1moreset024]

Dude, your 20%-22% now.

If you were 200 lbs I would safely assume based on starting pics, and your most recent cycle pics, that at 200lbs you were 30-33% or so

As far as keeping what you gained, if you added 20, expect to keep 5-6 lbs of muscle.

But your not going to keep jack without a extreme caloric surplus during PCT and you'll have to continue training in a very unstable hormone status.

This is why we say get a good base, and I'm not parroting the cookie cutter "reach your Natty limit" stuff, but just a basic general base a little definition and arms at least fatter than a penis.

You started at Auschwitz refugee status. And with this cycle you moved to "what a natural average Joe" could do with a month of clean high protein eating and 40 minutes gym sessions 3x a week

[The Deadlifting Dog]

Half seems a little high man. I don't see why I would loose half my gains with my diet and training regime. Im not saying I am right, but half seems excessive.

I shall see you in 20ish weeks for an update on the true gains from this cycle, 8 weeks after my 6 week PCT.

BTW, If you're correct in your assumption, If I get to 30lbs gained from this cycle, which I am fully confident I will, then half is 15lbs, which aint bad fucking going. Science says you can only really gain 0,5lbs of muscle a week naturally, which is 6lbs in 12 weeks. So AAS Would have given me more than double the gains. And thats IF I loose half my gains!

you really are bone headed...

if you keep 15lbs it will not be 15lbs of muscle.
You will have gained some fat along the way...
AND...
you will easily gain 2-3 lbs of muscle that you lost from being on a diet before you started....
so....
15lb gain
minus 2lbs to muscle gained from going off diet....
minus 3lbs off from fat gained...
leaves you with about 10lbs of muscle gained...
which you could've probably gained half of that natty

so yes the steroids did help.
of course the steroids helped..
but maybe it helped you put on 5 extra pounds of muscle.

[Jangles1]

Dude, your 20%-22% now.

If you were 200 lbs I would safely assume based on starting pics, and your most recent cycle pics, that at 200lbs you were 30-33% or so

As far as keeping what you gained, if you added 20, expect to keep 5-6 lbs of muscle.

But your not going to keep jack without a extreme caloric surplus during PCT and you'll have to continue training in a very unstable hormone status.

This is why we say get a good base, and I'm not parroting the cookie cutter "reach your Natty limit" stuff, but just a basic general base a little definition and arms at least fatter than a penis.

You started at Auschwitz refugee status. And with this cycle you moved to "what a natural average Joe" could do with a month of clean high protein eating and 40 minutes gym sessions 3x a week

No way am I 20+ % body fat. I was 14% when I started and ive hardly put on any fat. Christmas period has seen maybe a little added, but hoping that will level out.


'But your not going to keep jack without a extreme caloric surplus during PCT and you'll have to continue training in a very unstable hormone status.'


Everyone has to have a surplus in PCT and has to train with unbalanced hormones, so that whole assumption is totally flawed.

I will go up to 4250 - 4500 in PCT no probs, if I need to, so I am confident on keeping a good amount of gains. Unsure why you think I wouldn't keep them just because I started the cycle light. Seems a short sited opinion imo and I'm clearly no expert, but im almost certain you're totally wrong. I will train and eat just as hard as I do now and alloy my body to acclimatise to my new weight.

Just because I didn't have the 'base' doesn't mean I wont keep a decent amount of gains IF I approach PCT correctly, which I will. Time will tell anyway. Sure, having a better base would have been better, but even so, your body is still going to fight to get down to the weight you was before you cycled, so again, I just dont see why starting this cycle light makes as much as a difference as some people are making out., I am not doubting I would have beeb better of starting at 185/200lbs, but to say I will not keep any gains because of this is shortsighted.

[Jangles1]

you really are bone headed...

if you keep 15lbs it will not be 15lbs of muscle.
You will have gained some fat along the way...
AND...
you will easily gain 2-3 lbs of muscle that you lost from being on a diet before you started....
so....
15lb gain
minus 2lbs to muscle gained from going off diet....
minus 3lbs off from fat gained...
leaves you with about 10lbs of muscle gained...
which you could've probably gained half of that natty

so yes the steroids did help.
of course the steroids helped..
but maybe it helped you put on 5 extra pounds of muscle.

Personal insults just show your true character man

5lbs is 10 weeks in the gym. So il take that all day long. Wheter the 15lbs is not all muscle or not, everyone goes by HOW MUCH YOU KEPT.

NO one is going and dividing what they kept and telling exact muscle and fat gains.

'How'd your cycle go? Put on 30, kept 25' .... Thats how it goes... You seem to find issue with everything I say or do. Cracks me up.


Proving everyone wrong from day 1 and will continue to do so!

[hollowedzeus]

Personal insults just show your true character man

5lbs is 10 weeks in the gym. So il take that all day long. Wheter the 15lbs is not all muscle or not, everyone goes by HOW MUCH YOU KEPT. NO one is going and dividing what they kept and telling exact muscle and fat gains. Put on 30, kept 25..... Thats how it goes... You seem to find issue with everything I say or do. Cracks me up.


Proving everyone wrong from day 1 and will continue to do so!

Whats the point in keeping 20lbs if its all fat? Of course all that matters is muscle kept...

[The Deadlifting Dog]

Personal insults just show your true character man

5lbs is 10 weeks in the gym. So il take that all day long. Wheter the 15lbs is not all muscle or not, everyone goes by HOW MUCH YOU KEPT.

NO one is going and dividing what they kept and telling exact muscle and fat gains.

'How'd your cycle go? Put on 30, kept 25' .... Thats how it goes... You seem to find issue with everything I say or do. Cracks me up.


Proving everyone wrong from day 1 and will continue to do so!

listen....
I am trying to help you learn.

You disagree with with most everything that anyone says.
Whatever.
Keep damaging your HPTA doing what you should've done naturally.

[Jangles1]

listen....
I am trying to help you learn.

You disagree with with most everything that anyone says.
Whatever.
Keep damaging your HPTA doing what you should've done naturally.

You disagree with with most everything that anyone says.

I appreciate your learning and I disagree with silly comments such as ' you def wont keep ANY gains cause you did your cycle at 170 instead of 185'

Moronic. (I know that wasnt you btw)

I will stick up for what I believe. I have taken plenty of feedback on board throughout this process but I wont sit here and agree with stupid assumptions.

'Keep damaging your HPTA doing what you should've done naturally'

Anyone doing AAS damages their HPTA. If I got to 185/200 then jumped on, id damage it. Again, another argument flawed.

[Jangles1]

Whats the point in keeping 20lbs if its all fat? Of course all that matters is muscle kept...

In principle I absolutely agree. But when you see a cycle report you see '20 gained, 12 kept' ect.. No one goes in and states exactly how much muscle and or fat was gained. Ideally you want it all to be muscle, clearly.

[GearHeaded]

its highly unlikely Jangles would put on 20 pounds of fat from this one cycle with clean eating in a surplus and consistent training.. I probably couldn't put on 20 pounds of fat eating clean even if I was getting paid to put on fat . water and glycogen yes, but 20 pounds of solid adipose tissue is harder to put on then you think especially with someone with an ectomorphic frame

[Jangles1]

its highly unlikely Jangles would put on 20 pounds of fat from this one cycle with clean eating in a surplus and consistent training.. I probably couldn't put on 20 pounds of fat eating clean even if I was getting paid to put on fat . water and glycogen yes, but 20 pounds of solid adipose tissue is harder to put on then you think especially with someone with an ectomorphic frame

Honestly, people just love to hate on this thread due to me breaking the cardinal sin of not been at a certain weight before starting. In hindsight I 100% would have gotten to 185 before starting, but I didn't and it is what it is. Some people make out like I will put on no muscle and just fat and water because I didn't get my ;base; ha

Every few weeks this shit argument gets brought up again.

- yes I started my cycle 15lbs to early
- yes I could have got to where I have now naturally


Im not here to argue about the same shit over and over again. This is a detailed cycle report for others to learn from (for christ sake make sure you get to 185lbs before cycling) and for me to keep track and ask questions. Im so bored of silly comments such as

'you wont keep any gains cause you dint get to 185lbs before cycling'

To anyone with this opinion.... STOP with these shit, uneducated comments. Its driving me mad.


Anyway thats me done for the night, im off to have a 78,000 calorie protein shake to make sure I keep 0.5lbs of my gains after this cycle

[GearHeaded]

Jangles , Lance Armstrong has taken a shit ton more steroids then you have , and he only weighed 135 pounds . don't stress it. its a personal choice you make for yourself

[Jangles1]

Isn't he clean ;0 haha


Anyway yeah, this shit doesn't phase me. I love proving people wrong and if anything the doubts make me more determined. This thread has been challenging but I don't regret making it as it truly has spurred me on and taught me a lot.

As I have always said, if in 6 months time i've lost all my gains, il come back here, post a pic, tell the truth, say 'you guys were right' and will accept every single negative comment that comes my way.

But that wont happen as im gonna carry on working my fucking arse off through PCT, after PCT and leading up to cycle number 2.

I cant wait to get there. Il prob be 195lb ish and people will say I 'dont have a base' lmao

[songdog]

Personal insults just show your true character man

5lbs is 10 weeks in the gym. So il take that all day long. Wheter the 15lbs is not all muscle or not, everyone goes by HOW MUCH YOU KEPT.

NO one is going and dividing what they kept and telling exact muscle and fat gains.

'How'd your cycle go? Put on 30, kept 25' .... Thats how it goes... You seem to find issue with everything I say or do. Cracks me up.


Proving everyone wrong from day 1 and will continue to do so!

True character come on Jangles the guys here been pretty polite if you ask me it's more than being light in your case.You show no signs of ever training in your life and you wonder why guys are on you.Yes we heard your injury excuse but you would still have something and you don't.Now this isn't a slam on you for being skinny it's about you not telling the truth.And you are not the 1st guy too try this and I never seen it end well.Because if a guy wants something bad enough he will work for it and the guys here don't see it.You are dealing with guys all around the world who see guys like you in the gym thinking aas is their big ticket too getting big but as you found out it isn't it's HARD FUCKING WORK WITH NO SHORT CUTS! You the least you could do is show these guys some respect because they earned it the hard way through diet and hard training.

[Jangles1]

True character come on Jangles the guys here been pretty polite if you ask me it's more than being light in your case.You show no signs of ever training in your life and you wonder why guys are on you.Yes we heard your injury excuse but you would still have something and you don't.Now this isn't a slam on you for being skinny it's about you not telling the truth.And you are not the 1st guy too try this and I never seen it end well.Because if a guy wants something bad enough he will work for it and the guys here don't see it.You are dealing with guys all around the world who see guys like you in the gym thinking aas is their big ticket too getting big but as you found out it isn't it's HARD FUCKING WORK WITH NO SHORT CUTS! You the least you could do is show these guys some respect because they earned it the hard way through diet and hard training.

No training is just simply not true, at all. I have been training on and off (due to injury) since 2014. I have a great deal of knowledge when it comes to nutrition and training. I have just not been able to implement my knowledge to the fullest due to shit we have been over time and time again,

A lot of peoples feedback and opinions are severely altered due to the fact I started light on my cycle and admittedly didn't build the base I should have. People saying I wont keep any gains at all and all that shit just show me that their opinions are clearly affected by my starting point... I dont know why people are so butt hurt about this.

Ive done EVERYTHING right other than starting my cycle 3 - 6 months too early. Big deal.


I admit I fucked up starting light, but even after all the hate and negativity, im still here with this log. It would be cool for people to just say 'ok, yeah he knows he messed up, maybe il just get behind him and see what happens now'

I dont get the all the. negativity, still. It baffles me. Sure, have a negative yet constructive opinion, but dont start spouting silly uneducated shit like (for the 10th time in a few posts) 'you wont keep any gains from this cycle because you started at 170 and not 185)'

About to smash 150g of oats. With milk its a solid 800 cal meal

[hollowedzeus]

what people are saying and you are continually missing is the fact that you don't have a clue how to eat like a 185lb man despite your claims that you used to be massive but got injured.

i hope you recover your hpta and continue to get bigger healthily.

i do think however, as long as you are happy it shouldnt matter what we think. its your life, knock yourself out with whatever you want.

its clear that you wanted a quick fix and you got it (or so you keep telling us). its understandable why guys jump on your ass.

[Jangles1]

what people are saying and you are continually missing is the fact that you don't have a clue how to eat like a 185lb man despite your claims that you used to be massive but got injured.

i hope you recover your hpta and continue to get bigger healthily.

i do think however, as long as you are happy it shouldnt matter what we think. its your life, knock yourself out with whatever you want.

its clear that you wanted a quick fix and you got it (or so you keep telling us). its understandable why guys jump on your ass.

'what people are saying and you are continually missing is the fact that you don't have a clue how to eat like a 185lb man despite your claims that you used to be massive but got injured.
'


lol, Where have you got this from haha. For the 100th time, diet is not an issue. My diet is absolutely on point. I am eating 4000 calories a day and counting every single calorie with 'my fitness pal'


And claiming I used to be massive ??? LOL, you're literally making stuff up man. No disrespect, you seem like a nice guy that doesn't flame, just puts across his negative, yet constructive opinion (which is fine), but this is the shit I am talking about. You have literally made that last sentence up. Because you can go and check all 6 pages of this thread and see I never ever claimed that I used to be massive. I said 'I got to 200lbs'


Check out my diet inserts in this log in the last 3 - 4 weeks man. I understand that my pre AAS appearance makes it look like I have not been eating right, but nutrition is not an issue. If It was I would have put on 20 + lbs in this cycle, AAS or not. I also wouldn't have gotten down to 170lbs by loosing 0.5lbs a week. That kind of dieting takes a lot of time and effort. Anyone can loose 2lbs a week by smashing an insane amount of cardio and eating 500 / 750 cals less than their maintenance, yet I tuned my diet in and lost 0.5lbs a week for the final 6 weeks to try and preserve what little muscle mass I had left. I know how to diet be it cut or bulk.

'its clear that you wanted a quick fix and you got it (or so you keep telling us). its understandable why guys jump on your ass.'

To some extent this is true. But it honestly is only true due to constant injury. Im looking the best I ever have and being on AAS has given me that extra motivation to fight through nagging injures that have ultimately led me to stopping once getting worse in the past...

People have a right to their own opinion but being lazy is not in my vocabulary and I jumped on AAS as I wanted a helping hand to achieve something more than I have gotten in the past (even though I was just as dedicated) due to injury.

I dont care about people hating on me for this. What I care about is people just making dam right lies up and people saying 'oh yeah, your cycle is going to be a fail and you wont get anything from it in the end because you jumped on too early'

This attitude and opinion is pathetic. So what if I jumped on too early. I have my reasons and dont give 1 flying fuck what anyone on this board thinks. I am however happy to explain myself to people though as its important for this log and anyone in the future who reads it.

Im bored of all this shit anyway. Off to the gym. Legs day 2 today.

Full update, week 11 coming on Monday. Looking forward to seeing my weight !!

[songdog]

No training is just simply not true, at all. I have been training on and off (due to injury) since 2014. I have a great deal of knowledge when it comes to nutrition and training. I have just not been able to implement my knowledge to the fullest due to shit we have been over time and time again,

A lot of peoples feedback and opinions are severely altered due to the fact I started light on my cycle and admittedly didn't build the base I should have. People saying I wont keep any gains at all and all that shit just show me that their opinions are clearly affected by my starting point... I dont know why people are so butt hurt about this.

Ive done EVERYTHING right other than starting my cycle 3 - 6 months too early. Big deal.


I admit I fucked up starting light, but even after all the hate and negativity, im still here with this log. It would be cool for people to just say 'ok, yeah he knows he messed up, maybe il just get behind him and see what happens now'

I dont get the all the. negativity, still. It baffles me. Sure, have a negative yet constructive opinion, but dont start spouting silly uneducated shit like (for the 10th time in a few posts) 'you wont keep any gains from this cycle because you started at 170 and not 185)'

About to smash 150g of oats. With milk its a solid 800 cal meal

No Jangles not 3 to 6 months more like 3 to 6 years you don't build a solid foundation in a couple months this is just part of wat people been trying too tell you.

[ghettoboyd]

Isn't he clean ;0 haha


Anyway yeah, this shit doesn't phase me. I love proving people wrong and if anything the doubts make me more determined. This thread has been challenging but I don't regret making it as it truly has spurred me on and taught me a lot.

As I have always said, if in 6 months time i've lost all my gains, il come back here, post a pic, tell the truth, say 'you guys were right' and will accept every single negative comment that comes my way.

But that wont happen as im gonna carry on working my fucking arse off through PCT, after PCT and leading up to cycle number 2.

I cant wait to get there. Il prob be 195lb ish and people will say I 'dont have a base' lmao

here's some perspective, I weigh 195lbs and I look like a bodybuilder you look like you just started training at whatever you weigh..here is the difference, I waited till i had a good base with 7 years of solid natty training before I started aas and that enabled me to put on quality muscle that has matured over time with lots of vascularity...that's the difference in people who did it right the first time...im glad you thrilled with you new found mass but I would ease up on the cockiness and maybe more people would be more receptive to you...

[TRTdrew]

I just found this thread. . . and it is super entertaining and educational.

Props to you Jangles for putting yourself out there and exposing yourself to criticism. Good on you. Please keep posting. I want to see how this turns out!

[Jangles1]

here's some perspective, I weigh 195lbs and I look like a bodybuilder you look like you just started training at whatever you weigh..here is the difference, I waited till i had a good base with 7 years of solid natty training before I started aas and that enabled me to put on quality muscle that has matured over time with lots of vascularity...that's the difference in people who did it right the first time...im glad you thrilled with you new found mass but I would ease up on the cockiness and maybe more people would be more receptive to you...

Nothing but respect for your and doing it that way mate. If it was not for my body and past mistakes in training when starting out, which led to injury, I would be well on my way to an amazing physical appearance and probably wouldn’t have ever considered AAS. Injury is the only reason I looked into AAS because I’m so injury prone that I need alll the help I can get. Is that the right thing to do?? Well I don’t know, but I’m glad I did it now with the results I’m having.

People have this opinion that I am lazy and just wanted to get into AAS with no real training, but like I’ve said many many many times, that’s just not the case. I’ve been training for 5 years but injury has held me back time and time again. I never gave up though and this time I wanted to maximise results with AAS. The psychology benefits alone have made this cycle massively worth it.

No one believes me, but I know inside that I have been 100 % honest in everything I say.

This is not lazyness or lack of patience. This is a last resort to make significant changes due to constant injury holding back my progress. Some people will say me resorting to this is wrong. To those people, i would say “you’re entitled to your opinion but I don’t regret this journey”

PS - I may jump the gun now and again but it’s onlt because I’m passionate and wear my heart on my sleeve. No cockiness here.

[Jangles1]

No Jangles not 3 to 6 months more like 3 to 6 years you don't build a solid foundation in a couple months this is just part of wat people been trying too tell you.

I take that on board, agree and admit I jumped in too early, but as you know now, I have my own reasons for this and I need not explain myself any longer to anyone.

If anyone has an issue, so be it. Have a pop at me. I’m use to it now

[Jangles1]

I just found this thread. . . and it is super entertaining and educational.

Props to you Jangles for putting yourself out there and exposing yourself to criticism. Good on you. Please keep posting. I want to see how this turns out!

From the “no base” to the “you lied about your age” to the “under dosed test” and the constant repeating disputes about my diet and training, yep, it’s been one hell of a ride.

Il prob do a log for cycle number 2 16 weeks after my PCT ends. Hopefully by then my base will be cool and I won’t get as much stick. I’m sure it will still have it’s fair share of drama though, so stick around !!

[David LoPan]

From the “no base” to the “you lied about your age” to the “under dosed test” and the constant repeating disputes about my diet and training, yep, it’s been one hell of a ride.

Il prob do a log for cycle number 2 16 weeks after my PCT ends. Hopefully by then my base will be cool and I won’t get as much stick. I’m sure it will still have it’s fair share of drama though, so stick around !!

I knew you were going to be coming to the dark side and doing cycle after cycle. Guess you will be drinking a lot of just tonic water with your mates and the pub and picking up the ladies. Bar tab will be low and picking up the women will get easier.

[MACKATTACK]

I can't believe people are supporting for him to take a cycle.......you are super injury prone if you have no muscle mass and what seems to be limited lifting experience and then jump on a cycle and lift above and beyond your true strength point. ALA Tendonitis, your tendons won't catch up to the muscle strength nearly as fast.....I wish you the best, but I think this is bad overall, you can tell that you don't even know how to functionally eat which is a bare necessity.....

This is just bad, I don't care if you are "working hard" in your mind or not.......I would try naturally for at least a year.

I apologize for my extreme honest and blunt comment, but I wouldn't want someone to ruin themselves. There are plenty of guys out there that have done a cycle, got injured and never really made it back to the gym.......consistency is key at the end of the day.

[Jangles1]

I can't believe people are supporting for him to take a cycle.......you are super injury prone if you have no muscle mass and what seems to be limited lifting experience and then jump on a cycle and lift above and beyond your true strength point. ALA Tendonitis, your tendons won't catch up to the muscle strength nearly as fast.....I wish you the best, but I think this is bad overall, you can tell that you don't even know how to functionally eat which is a bare necessity.....

This is just bad, I don't care if you are "working hard" in your mind or not.......I would try naturally for at least a year.

I apologize for my extreme honest and blunt comment, but I wouldn't want someone to ruin themselves. There are plenty of guys out there that have done a cycle, got injured and never really made it back to the gym.......consistency is key at the end of the day.

You’re opinion is valid and I appreciate that you laid it out in a constructive way.

With all due respect, I lift with lots of reps (12 - 14) and a weight that is good for me. I used to go for 5-8 reps heavy and this turned out to be an issue for my body.

Before starting AAS, due to my extensive research, one thing I was aware of was huge strength gain and that affecting tendons due to over lifting weight wise. This has never happened though. I’ve never got super man strength and I’ve continued to follow a very strict progressive overload system.

Hell I only deadlift 80kg atm as when I started back at the gym for the god knows how many times back at the start of 2017, I worked my way up from zero. Just a bar, to allow my body to get used to it.

Starting at 6 reps and going to 12 reps. 1 rep more each week. Once I built up to 12 reps I increase the weight 2.5kg.

Lifting big weights and ego lifting in general is not something I do. After working with a personal trainer for a week to perfect form, I’ve realised that it’s much much better for me to lift a reasonable amount of weight that allows me to focus on form and promotes muscle hypertrophy.

AAS will play no part what so ever in me being injured due to my approach and understanding that it approached wrong, it would play a part.

[cousinmuscles]

You’re opinion is valid and I appreciate that you laid it out in a constructive way.

With all due respect, I lift with lots of reps (12 - 14) and a weight that is good for me. I used to go for 5-8 reps heavy and this turned out to be an issue for my body.

Before starting AAS, due to my extensive research, one thing I was aware of was huge strength gain and that affecting tendons due to over lifting weight wise. This has never happened though. I’ve never got super man strength and I’ve continued to follow a very strict progressive overload system.

Hell I only deadlift 80kg atm as when I started back at the gym for the god knows how many times back at the start of 2017, I worked my way up from zero. Just a bar, to allow my body to get used to it.

Starting at 6 reps and going to 12 reps. 1 rep more each week. Once I built up to 12 reps I increase the weight 2.5kg.

Lifting big weights and ego lifting in general is not something I do. After working with a personal trainer for a week to perfect form, I’ve realised that it’s much much better for me to lift a reasonable amount of weight that allows me to focus on form and promotes muscle hypertrophy.

AAS will play no part what so ever in me being injured due to my approach and understanding that it approached wrong, it would play a part.

Hehehe

Perfecting form takes years.

Your joints get stronger through years and years of training.

If you are not seeing dramatic increases in a progressive overload training system when on AAS then you are living proof that you aren't gaining any faster than if you just trained.

I bet you like all this attention and that I replied though

[Jangles1]

It’s a big learning curve man. We know ive made mistakes with this cycle and starting too soon. Thats in the past and I am solely focused on finishing this journey. Looking to the future and finishing this cycle and seeing the results once PCT is over.

If anything this whole process will be a great learning tool for others. So I am happy about that silver lining in all the negativity that has come with it.


Back to your comment...


I’m obviously seeing steady increase each week, but you’re most probably right. I’ve not gained any superman type strength from this cycle.

I am aware of my body being injury prone and taking it steady. Don’t move up weight until I can perform 3 sets + a warm up of my desired rep range perfectly. Lower weight lifted correctly will promote a much better muscle building environment than heayy weights lifted with 70% correct form and lessen the likelyhood of injury.

I’m not hear for attention and although to appreciate your input, in the nicest possible way, I could not give a flying f if you commented or not. Very weird of you to even mention that tbh.