Started first cycle today at 46

Hi to all
started first cycle today of test e only
46 years old- been training for approx 15 years then took 10 years off - have been back for 2 years
first pin in shoulder went great- a little nervous (took 5 minutes to get courage) but all good and easy
Love some experienced ones to follow if you can

what i have is teste (2 x vials)
Clomid for PCT
Nolvadex for PCT
Arimidex in case any gyro issues occur

Schedule:
Week 1-12 500mg of Teste (250mg Monday, 250mg Thursday)
Arimidex .25 only if any side effects occur and take for 1 x week if have to
Weeks 14-16 Clomid 50mg/day and Nolvadex 10mg/day

Work out schedule 5-6 days per week split
Will upload some before photos shortly



Before photo attached
look forward to hearing from you all
Attachment 180306

How big are the vials? Doesn’t look like you ha e enough for 12 weeks.

Hi Redz,
i have 2 x bottles
300mg/ml
also redz i have Arimidex tabs in case gastro breakout only (1mg tabs)- my question is can i break these down if needed or take as 1mg?
your thoughts would be great
cheers
update- just ordered another (10ml vials) cheers

Yes, you can cut your Adex tabs. Get a pill cutter and try to cut them into four equal .25 pieces.... but know that I could never do that successfully :) ... I usually ended up just crushing the silly thing. Or ending up with chunks of about .2, .4, .33, and then a pile of leftover powder that I just licked off the cutter.

If that happens, don't stress. IF you need it, just shoot for about half a pill a week or whatever. It'll still work.

Charlie

Hi Charlie,
thanks for the advice-great to know
just incase side effects take place - just want to be ready

ok initial pic- will take progress pics in same light etc
next week expecting the teste to kick in at some stage- will update pics every couple of weeks and let you know of any side effects
hmm photos are hard to take when holding phone- my son took some before gym photos about a month ago which i have added
[ATTACH=CONFIG]180305Attachment 180308Attachment 180307Attachment 180309Attachment 180310

Second Pin today
Second Pin today- went smoother than first
Went again into other arm - Delts (using 23G)
First injection still a little sore and more blood after pulling needle(that was on Monday)
Today sweet as with next injection
Ordered piles more alcohol swabs, needles etc (just want to make sure i have enough without compromising)
no side effects yet, no extra strength yet, no hulk size muscles as yet (haha my kids are checking every day)
Sure something will start kicking in next week
Still going to gym 5-6 days a week

Routine:
Day 1 = Shoulders/Lats/Core
Day 2 = Biceps/Triceps/Core
Day 3 = Chest/Core
Day 4 = Legs/Core
Day 5 Rest
Back to start

Started taking Mass Protein Powder shake at around lunchtime
and Whey protein shake straight after workouts
I have to be careful however because i do hold some fat around the middle which i have done since i was in my twenties- even when i was in the military fit as ever
I know the teste will also make me bloat to some extent
So really focusing on eating good and drinking heaps of water

However, in saying that my beautiful wife cooks the meals and even makes me lunch so good luck trying to tell her she needs to change the way she cooks lol.
However; she is conscious i am on this cycle and helping out where she can

any advice from you pros is all good
cheers and will update on Monday (next Pin)

Following! Good luck Gaza! You must be excited!! I think after 4 weeks you’ll start seeing a big change.

I’m not sure what mass protein powder you’re using but many of them are complete garbage that are just filled with sugar. I’d stick with your other whey. If you want to make it a “mass” shake you’re better off dropping a glob of peanut butter and/or oats into your traditional whey. That way you’re getting good calories vs. calories-for-calories sake. Those mass shakes are for real skinny guys who can’t put on weight to save their life (and even then...). That doesn’t apply to you and me. I’d go as far to say you’re better off eating a cheeseburger or something you like.

Hi Chark,
thanks for your advice- totally noted
will stop the mass and just stick to the whey - great advice
Also thanks so much for following
As previously mentioned second injection yesterday and today definitely feeling the gains already at the gym.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gaza1974

Hi Chark,
thanks for your advice- totally noted
will stop the mass and just stick to the whey - great advice
Also thanks so much for following
As previously mentioned second injection yesterday and today definitely feeling the gains already at the gym.

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Of course, ask away if you need anything. I’d like to give help back to the community that helped me. If you get bored, check out my journey threads in this sub detailing w/pics my first and second runs. They have my name in the thread title.

2nd Week, 4th Pin Update

Firstly Clark- did read both your cycles posts from start to finish- totally amazing and some good tips and notes to take away from that- wow really disciplined

Monday pin was quad for first time and yes like so many others was limping for 3 days or so
So Thursday today and decided to go back in glutes as no problem there.


Gaining weight through increasing calories every day (have gained 2 kgs so far- too fast weight gain?)
Still pumping hard at the gym 6 days a week.

Side Effects/Changes:(none totally outstanding) apart from the few following
1/ Slight but noticeable gains with strength at the gym- some days a few more noticeable than others (between 5kg-10kg gains)
2/ Definitely starting to sweat more- always did sweat but now like a tap at the gym

Also 1 x question- Adex some seem to say to take .25 throughout whole cycle and some only when signs of gastro occur-- the gastro part i suppose is my only concern at this part and really needing sound advice for this
Will get bloodworks done in week 5 to ensure everything good and gear is legit.

Will update as time goes on

Hey Gaza,

Thank you for the kind comments.

I’d avoid pinning quads entirely or at least until you reallllly know what you’re doing. There’s a lot of nerve endings and if you get a problem there it’s supposedly quite worse than other areas. Some guys say it’s fine and no problem but I’ve listened to a few very experienced guys advise never pin your quads (check out youtube ‘Dave palumbo pin quads).

I know you’re just logging what changes you’ve experienced thus far but I want to remind you to stay patient, you likely won’t see marked changes in the mirror until the 4-5 week mark.

I’m not the best to advise you on AI usage but since you’re getting BW in a few weeks I imagine one strategy could be to hold off using adex until you get your BW back to see just how much estrogen you’ve aromatized without using an AI. The problem is, we can’t tell you how your body will react. Will you have high estrogen? Will you even have side effects to high estrogen? Remember estrogen is neuro-protective, responsible for male libido, and very anabolic. If you think you might do more than one cycle it would be good to know if 500 test = any estrogenic side effects, otherwise you’ll never know and will be using adex from here on out. When you say gastro do you mean gyno? Did you get BW before your cycle?

This is food for thought and not related to your situation: the thoughts toward AIs have shifted over the years. MOST compounds don’t aromatize into estrogen. If you don’t want estrogen, simply don’t use too much of compounds that aromatize. It doesn’t make sense to use a large amount of an estrogenic steroid, to where you you get side effects, then have to take another drug to lower the amount of estrogen caused by taking an amount of a steroid that you already can’t handle.

Hi Clark,
thanks for your reply
yes haha good advice with the quads- absolutely no problem pinning the delts again- hardly any soreness the next day
Yes your right- i need to be patient just real excited to see something kick in
I will post blood results when i do get them
hmm yes i am little silly not getting BW prior to cycle but will midway and at end
yeah i will hold off on adex etc unless signs of gyno show themselves
3rd Vial turned up today to take me through to the whole 12 week cycle
cheers again Clark and will update in couple of weeks

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gaza1974

Hi Clark,
thanks for your reply
yes haha good advice with the quads- absolutely no problem pinning the delts again- hardly any soreness the next day
Yes your right- i need to be patient just real excited to see something kick in
I will post blood results when i do get them
hmm yes i am little silly not getting BW prior to cycle but will midway and at end
yeah i will hold off on adex etc unless signs of gyno show themselves
3rd Vial turned up today to take me through to the whole 12 week cycle
cheers again Clark and will update in couple of weeks

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Hey Gaza, just wanted to add. If you encounter gyno problems with gyno adding nolvadex while on cycle may be your most effective move. See, adding adex when gyno encountered will help halt future test aromatization into estrogen, but won’t do anything with the high estrogen already present. Nolvadex blocks estrogen at breast tissue by occupying the receptor site. It’s even been found to reduce gyno. Some experienced users who’ve found they’re sensitive to estrogen will run 10mg the length of their cycle. We don’t yet know how you respond to estrogen but people with higher body fat typically have higher estrogen levels than people with low body fat. This is why it’s often recommended to wait to cycle until weight is down.

Keep up the good work! Excited to see where you take this! Best of luck

Hi Clark,
thanks for your advice again-
Oh ok sounds like Nolvadex if signs occur rather than Adex
Yeah the weight thing- my BMI should be around 70kg for my height etc however most of my gym days ive always been trying to bulk up as naturally i am very skinny prior to gymming
Have a great Christmas

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gaza1974

Hi Clark,
thanks for your advice again-
Oh ok sounds like Nolvadex if signs occur rather than Adex
Yeah the weight thing- my BMI should be around 70kg for my height etc however most of my gym days ive always been trying to bulk up as naturally i am very skinny prior to gymming
Have a great Christmas

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You’d definitely want to begin nolva should you experience symptoms since that estrogen that’s present isn’t going anywhere regardless of what you do, you can only try to block it. I believe you’d either want to add and continue nolva throughout cycle or add low dose adex at the same time as nolva planning to discontinue nolva in a couple weeks (and run adex throughout). Look around though as I am only one guy’s (and not a veteran at that) opinion. I’m not sure what dose nolva to advise you to add, that probably would depend on the severity of your issue, but I’ve seen several guys run 10mg throughout cycle as a preventive measure. I may be mistaken, so look it up, but I think I read 20mg/day is what is given to breast cancer patients...so you shouldn’t need more than that to prevent gyno. Split up dose and take 2x/day should you implement.

To be clear I definitely wasn’t dogging on your weight or decision to cycle at a higher BF percentage, only wanted to point out that you should suspect your estrogen may be elevated compared to what it would be were you leaner. Can help you make more accurate assumptions. The more you know...

Merry Christmas!

Hey Gaza, hows it going?

Hi Chark and everyone
thanks for your message
yes totally about being leaner prior to doing cycle
ok a lot has gone on since last post
I am now on week 6 of my cycle (12 week cycle)
was going great guns

in week 5 i had gained 13 pounds and feeling amazing
then did lower back in at gym- however still tried to go to gym and do what i could but it just irritated the back
So have had to rest the best for several days but will be back into it within a couple of days
In saying this have not stopped anything with the cycle and diet- just waiting for back to be a little better to go back to the gym- a real let down
Only been pinning the delts- heaps easier as suggested

So week 6 now
Side effects:
No side effects (a little clammy skin) a little harder to sleep at night and horny all the time haha

Got blood work done last week (week 5) to ensure gear is not rubbish so please anyone check these out and let us know what you think
Attachment 180547Attachment 180548

Sounds like things are going quite well. Your testosterone is significantly above the reference range as it should be and sounds like you’ve put on the weight my friend. Unfortunately those labs don’t include sensitive estradiol so we can’t gather much for our earlier question. Next time make sure a sensitive e2 assay is included, that’s the one you need.

Totally understand taking a few days off with the back. Be tough but definitely go by instinct. You’re not 20 anymore and if you end up totally fucking up your back that isn’t going to help your gains. How are you looking in the mirror? Where do see the biggest change?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gaza1974

Hi Chark and everyone
thanks for your message
yes totally about being leaner prior to doing cycle
ok a lot has gone on since last post
I am now on week 6 of my cycle (12 week cycle)
was going great guns

in week 5 i had gained 13 pounds and feeling amazing
then did lower back in at gym- however still tried to go to gym and do what i could but it just irritated the back
So have had to rest the best for several days but will be back into it within a couple of days
In saying this have not stopped anything with the cycle and diet- just waiting for back to be a little better to go back to the gym- a real let down
Only been pinning the delts- heaps easier as suggested

So week 6 now
Side effects:
No side effects (a little clammy skin) a little harder to sleep at night and horny all the time haha

Got blood work done last week (week 5) to ensure gear is not rubbish so please anyone check these out and let us know what you think
Attachment 180547Attachment 180548

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If you convert your levels to NG/DL your just barely over 1100. which means your either a horrible responder or your test is dosed at about 50%. even for a split dose your levels should be much higher.

Hi Jstone,
thanks for your reply
hmm whats your thoughts? gear any good
Injecting more like 600 per week(as it is 300/)
Got email also from test lab with the following:
attached

Just really want to know if you think the test results are normal for this cycle? or is this gear rubbish?
your thoughts would be great
Attachment 180629
also i also attached calculation- please let us know your thoughts?
thanks heapsAttachment 180631

Hi Chark,
thanks for your message
yeah back at the gym now- had about 2 1/2 weeks off
yes definitely put on weight - a little bloated but i boil this down to not going to gym
haha yeah the back thing - literally pain in my butt
but all good now
definitely arms are a bigger now but in next couple of weeks hoping for more changes
Because of the low side effects i was worried about the gear but i guess a little older the sides are not as extreme?
yeah the lab
it damn cost me $250 for this test- real expensive here- i think next time i probably dont need all the tests- just the main ones(it will reduce cost)
going to gym every day now (trying to catchup)
will keep you updated
i will also post you the last email from lab (test results)
let us know what you think also
cheers CharkAttachment 180630

Ok Latest News

Looking at other posts and what my test levels should be

6 weeks in lab results say my testostorone is
1730 ng/dl (taking 600 per week)

After doing alot of research my levels should be around 7000-8000 ( so i am thinking this is way under dosed)
so this has confirmed many things for me

So jstone prompted myself to investigate further - thanks for this
I have been in touch with my supplier and they are sending their top branded teste to me as we speak.

Ok so i have an important question
by the time this new batch (12 weeks worth) arrives it will be 7 weeks into my cycle
1/Can i go straight onto this new batch carrying on from 7 weeks (it would only give me an extra 5 weeks left with quality teste)
2/Or can i go onto this new batch starting from week 1 again (which means total would be 19 weeks)?

Your advice would be great

Ok Latest News

Looking at other posts and what my test levels should be

6 weeks in lab results say my testostorone is
1730 ng/dl (taking 600 per week)

After doing alot of research my levels should be around 7000-8000 ( so i am thinking this is way under dosed)
so this has confirmed many things for me

So jstone prompted myself to investigate further - thanks for this
I have been in touch with my supplier and they are sending their top branded teste to me as we speak.

Ok so i have an important question
by the time this new batch (12 weeks worth) arrives it will be 7 weeks into my cycle
1/Can i go straight onto this new batch carrying on from 7 weeks (it would only give me an extra 5 weeks left with quality teste)
2/Or can i go onto this new batch starting from week 1 again (which means total would be 19 weeks)?

Your advice would be great

the new test result looks much better, because its over 60. the test you took tops out at 60. you need to make sure the next test you take uses lc/ms for testing. this will give you the real number. coming in at 1700 on a split dose is closer to what i would want to see. the conversion on the first number was way low. 1700 is still low to me for 600mg split dose. without seeing what you score using pharm grade its hard to say, but that number should be at least over 2k for a split dose.

lots of people like to shit on the 10 times number, but when test is dosed properly the 10 times numbers is pretty standard. this is also coming from doctors who have hundreds of patients. trough numbers will never be near the 10 times number. peak levels should be right at 10 times the injected dose. so with a split dose injecting 300mg twice a week i would expect to see 2500+. if you do bloodwork around 30 hours after injection i would expect to see closer to 3k.

the best way to really know what to expect is by using pharm grade or sending some of the test you have for testing so you can know what your truly injecting. then do bloodwork, and that would show you how you respond. also the testing method they used your levels could be over 3k, but the method used tops out at 60.

Hey buddy, following this because your intro is almost exactly as mine would have been had I posted here just over a year ago - 46 years old then, off and on training over the previous fifteen years, first cycle a straightforward 2x 250mg test e per week, AI as needed, clomid/nolva PCT!

If your experience goes as mine did you’ll have a great cycle and make some nice gains. Some general notes from my experience that may or may not be useful (I hope they are!).

Gains. My cycle was intended to be a recomp, so diet was set to that goal with slight kcal excess on training days and slight deficit on rest days. I trained four days per week with a three way split. I didn’t do any separate aggressive cardio but did take a brisk walk for about three miles 4-5 days per week. After my ten week cycle I’d gained around 8lbs but also definitely lost some body fat. I know calipers are inaccurate for absolute body fat values but they do measure the change well if used consistently, and mine suggested a 4% body fat loss going from 15% to 11%. Of the weight gained there was definitely a good lean mass gain but also also definitely some fluid from the test. I waited the suggested two weeks after my last injection to start the PCT and felt fine during those two weeks but training volume became more difficult to sustain. Strength gained on the cycle stayed with me. By the end of the two week wait I’d dropped around 4lbs but actually looked more muscular which appeared to confirm my impression that some of the total weight gained and then lost was indeed extra water weight which then left my system.

Skip to the end of the 4 week PCT and my body weight remained static despite a slight increase in calories (activity remained the same). This suggested a slight further loss of mass from the cycle which was countered by the extra kcals. All in all I was pretty happy. I had no major sides at all on cycle, and PCT was pretty kind too. The only things I did notice were sky high libido on cycle, which dropped off between being on and the PCT phase but actually came back to a lesser degree on the PCT. I think it was the nolva rather than the clomid that helped there because I did two weeks of clomid and four of nolva, and it lasted the duration of the nolva. Other sides, increased acne on back and shoulders (always had some acne since being a teenager) which normalized gradually only after the PCT phase. Oddly, my usual annoying facial acne vanished completely whilst on cycle and hasn’t been back a year since! Also noted very very slight hair thinning/receding hair line, but that might have just been paranoia and just me being more aware of my natural age related thinning.

About a month post PCT bloods were normal range (I didn’t do pre cycle values), lipids very good too. I did have a slight jump in blood pressure on cycle, systolic going up about 10 points, but since I usually sit with low end BP anyway it was still healthy range.

At five months post cycle I’d still retained and added a couple of lbs to the gains I’d made and jumped into my second cycle.

So if your cycle goes as mine did you’ll be happy indeed, and your next task will be trying to curb the desire to not end the cycle and just jump onto a lifelong lower dose cruise!

Hi There to all

Finished my 12 week cycle(600 per week split)
good gains all round
even though last injection was 2 weeks ago still pumping the 50kg dumbbells flat bench and 145kg bench press so have not lost any strength gains
Gained a good 8kgs but have lost about one and half kgs since last injection
Weighing in at approx 100kg now
Side effects during cycle - minimal to none
I injected glutes most of cycle but week 12 glutes became very hard to inject into - next time i think i need to find a secondary location also

My general thoughts about teste cycle
Great cycle- was hoping for more strength gains and muscle size gains but for first cycle i cannot complain too much
Really surprised in regards to minimal side effects
Really keen to do next cycle with Dbol and teste next time to push things a little further

Any thought would be great
thanks everyone also for all your advice- it has been priceless throughout my cycle

Hi to all again
as previously mentioned finished 12 weeks cycle
its been 2 weeks since last injection
i have the clomid and nolvadex for PCT
im feeling great (46 years old)
everything fine- do i really need to go on PCT?
please can someone give advise on this please
thanks heaps

Yes you need to pct, the crash is about to come. This part sucks which is why I generally cruise now between cycles at 250mg test e instead of pct.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gaza1974

Second Pin today
Second Pin today- went smoother than first
Went again into other arm - Delts (using 23G)
First injection still a little sore and more blood after pulling needle(that was on Monday)
Today sweet as with next injection
Ordered piles more alcohol swabs, needles etc (just want to make sure i have enough without compromising)
no side effects yet, no extra strength yet, no hulk size muscles as yet (haha my kids are checking every day)
Sure something will start kicking in next week
Still going to gym 5-6 days a week

Routine:
Day 1 = Shoulders/Lats/Core
Day 2 = Biceps/Triceps/Core
Day 3 = Chest/Core
Day 4 = Legs/Core
Day 5 Rest
Back to start

Started taking Mass Protein Powder shake at around lunchtime
and Whey protein shake straight after workouts
I have to be careful however because i do hold some fat around the middle which i have done since i was in my twenties- even when i was in the military fit as ever
I know the teste will also make me bloat to some extent
So really focusing on eating good and drinking heaps of water

However, in saying that my beautiful wife cooks the meals and even makes me lunch so good luck trying to tell her she needs to change the way she cooks lol.
However; she is conscious i am on this cycle and helping out where she can

any advice from you pros is all good
cheers and will update on Monday (next Pin)

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That's a pretty big guage for your delt , I used 25g 1inch for awhile and it seemed okay but with even the 25 it built up scar tissue pretty quick and after awhile blood and oil would spill out after taking the needle out.
Smaller guage = less scarring.