New to anabolics - first cycle 34 yo M

[Albedo121]

Hey all, new to forums and I’ve been researching gear/cycles for a while now. I’ve spoken in person to a few people that have a lot of experience with it but are definitely a little “loose” with their science and although I can tell they have good results I’d rather consult some more strict minds and see what you all think.

A little background:
- 34 year old male pharmacist (yes I have a breadth of drug knowledge but I’ve been in the medical field long enough to know that we have limited QUALITY studies actually understanding how to do this and if that’s not bad enough genetics throws a huge wrench into things)
- Been lifting for about 16 years now, I feel like I finally have a good understanding of form (really understand what you all are talking about when you say it’s a bad idea to start gear without a foundation – I have a herniated disc and can’t imagine doing this without a lot of lifting experience)
- Plenty of sports my whole life but mainly basketball, played some D2 and knew some that used gear

Stats:
- 6’1”
- 195 or so pounds
- Last time I had it checked I was about 14.5% body fat (I’ll post some pics when I can here soon)
- I don’t barbell bench anymore due to shoulder issues but dumbbell bench x10 is about 90-100lbs, squatting ~235-240lbs x10, deadlifts I’m careful with (herniated disc/sciatica) so I’m typically not traditionally deadlifting more than about ~300lbs x10 (sorry I don’t do 1maxrep anymore after injuries)
- I’m going to edit and add blood work here as well once I get it, for now I’m going to get just my free test/test levels for baseline before the cycle as I’ve already been through basic lab testing and all is well. I’ll get other things post cycle to see where it’s all at.

Goals:
- Honestly I’m hoping to reach just around 10% body fat and maybe reach around 205-210lbs or so. I’m not looking to be “ripped” out of my mind but going for a very athletic or beach friendly body look. I’m hoping to achieve this with some slight diet mods and a simple test + maybe stanol(?) cycle.

Workouts:
- I’ve tried so many damn things over the years but truly believe in the generic progressive overload being by far the best results. I’ve recognized over the years that my body has responded best by doing “bro splits”, I think it responds better specifically because my body seems to appreciate more rest and recovery with muscle groups. I’ve also noticed that I’ve bulked SIGNIFCANTLY better as I’ve aged and I think this really came down to metabolism/diet changes.
- I’m actually very open to some ideas on different types of training though if anyone has some links to a good program

Diet:
- I know people want really specific breakdowns here and I’d be lying if I told you I’m a counter because I’m not. I just generally eat pretty healthy and make sure that I’m getting in anywhere from 150-200gms protein each day, my numbers suggest I need to be considerably higher than this during cycle which I’m gonna have to dedicate time to (this is an area of improvement I know, but I don’t want to lie and tell you all I’m going hardcore in this area because I know myself and I’m likely not to). I’ve tried some super strict intakes for 3 months in the past with a nutritionist and I saw almost 0 results vs my standard diet. In general I eat fairly low carb because my body seems to respond best to it but I’ve attempted keto and my body truly does not appreciate it.
o Main carbs I eat: White rice, whole grain noodles, tortillas and I use tortilla chips with my cottage cheese
o Proteins: Variety but mostly chicken, ground turkey (lean), some steak (body really seems to respond well to fatty beef periodically, especially after leg/back days), fish, and I tend to eat a decent amount of 2% cottage cheese before bed, Kirkland protein bars (low carb)
o Fats: Tons of nuts, nut butters, some from the periodic steak, I also eat regular eggs occasionally
- As an authentic question, I understand that the recommendation would be to get REAL serious about counting macros but has anyone tried not being as intense and just generally eating healthy w/ an excess in protein to make sure they have enough for synthesis. Would like to hear any stories in this area bad or good

AAS cycle 1:
- Test E 250mg twice a week x 12 weeks (bought 4 vials 250mg/ml, 10 ml)
o I would REALLY like some thoughts on not doing 500mg and attempting to see how my body responds to lower doses and continuing to check my test levels to see where I’m at (about 4 weeks into cycle) to see results/etc to keep doses at a min
- Nolvadex 20mg for PCT 14 days after last test shot (bought 100tabs 20mg/tab)
- Aromasin PRN (gyno, water weight, etc)
- Stanzol 50mg (50 tabs, NOT part of my cycle…yet, but was considering, and figured I would buy to try in second cycle either way)

I think that’s about it, sorry for the crazy long post but wanted to be thorough and show that I’ve actually read a bunch of these threads. Not just coming in with “Hey, new to steroids how do I look like Chris Pratt in Jurassic Park?”. If I did miss anything though please let me know and I promise to add as soon as I can.

[Albedo121]

[Chark]

You’re going to do very well.

[Chark]

- As an authentic question, I understand that the recommendation would be to get REAL serious about counting macros but has anyone tried not being as intense and just generally eating healthy w/ an excess in protein to make sure they have enough for synthesis. Would like to hear any stories in this area bad or good

Check out my 1st cycle thread in members cycle results. I did just that. We are similar in age and lifting experience. I will say I ate low carbs for years but once I started eating carbs again I blew up. Found out that’s what my body likes. Great 1st thread by the way. You’re the kind of guy people like to help.

As far as the cycle, I’d run 400 or 500 mg of test with 4-5 weeks of that winstrol at the end (if you want) assuming all goes well the first 8 weeks. Keep the Aromasin on hand, I wouldn’t start out taking it. I would also use HCG on cycle (ending after 14 weeks) and then start PCT with Clomid alongside Nolvadex .

[kelkel]

Definitly a solid physique with a lot of potential.
Regarding doing less, sure you could run a bit less but to be honest, 500 mgs really is just fine for a first cycle. If your shutting your HPTA down at least make it worthwhile. 3-400 will shut you down the same as 500 will.
Only you can figure out whether you can achieve your goals without counting macros.
This is your first cycle brother so it's time to grow. Eat enough to make gains and evaluate as you go.

Best of luck!

[Albedo121]

Thanks to both of you guys for the reply! And thanks for the PM chark. Sounds like I should stick with the 500/week then - just figured it might help to not over do it first round. I’ll also make sure to invest in some clomid and HCG but was hoping to not use too many things at once.

[Chark]

Thanks to both of you guys for the reply! And thanks for the PM chark. Sounds like I should stick with the 500/week then - just figured it might help to not over do it first round. I’ll also make sure to invest in some clomid and HCG but was hoping to not use too many things at once.

500 test has been suggested as thee newbie cycle for a long time. From what I’ve gathered you really don’t need that much. Sure, you want to take enough to make shutting yourself down worth it for you and you want to use enough that’ll give you a net gain after PCT period steals back some of the mass but natural test gives you roughly 50mg/week so 500 is TEN TIMES what you produce naturally. It’s not bad, I started with 500 test, 500 test works, has been a staple for a long time, and there may be other factors I haven’t considered...but I do think I could’ve gone a tad lower my first time and still made solid progress.

Just food for thought

[Albedo121]

500 test has been suggested as thee newbie cycle for a long time. From what I’ve gathered you really don’t need that much. Sure, you want to take enough to make shutting yourself down worth it for you and you want to use enough that’ll give you a net gain after PCT period steals back some of the mass but natural test gives you roughly 50mg/week so 500 is TEN TIMES what you produce naturally. It’s not bad, I started with 500 test, 500 test works, has been a staple for a long time, and there may be other factors I haven’t considered...but I do think I could’ve gone a tad lower my first time and still made solid progress.

Just food for thought

This was exactly my thought process initially! But I do think it makes sense that if you're going to shut down the system that you might as well get solid gains out of it. I might do a smidge more research as well before but it doesn't seem unreasonable to use that much test. I'm just seeing some pretty large test numbers from even 150-200mg weekly which is interesting but I'm sure SHBG and general genetics probably play a large part.

[Albedo121]

Hey everyone! I wanted to update with my labs since I've gotten them back.

Everything is within normal limits outside of the hormone stuff. Everything was through Sonora Quest:

Estrdiol: 29 pg/ml
PSA = 0.2ng/ml
SHBG = 33 nmol/L
Test total = 548 ng/dL
Test free = 93.1 pg/mL

I just started the cycle 1 day ago. My plan is a titration technique w/ more frequent pinning. Currently going to take 300mg/week split 4 days a week. If after 2 weeks I don't encounter any sides I'm gonna start titrating up each week by about 50mg to see what I can tolerate, if for some reason I tolerate more than 500mg w/o any sides I'll likely go up slightly at lower intervals. I may finish off with the winny but I'll let you all know! Hoping to take pictures just about every other week or every week.

I also wanted to add, I bought a supply of MK 677 after some more research as well. I may or may not include this midway through the cycle pending recovery needs and if I feel like I understand what's happening with my body on the test alone, but I'll also update on that as I go

- Albedo

[Albedo121]

Also - special shout out to Chark for being awesome and helping me a ton via PMs!

[Hughinn]

Hey all, new to forums and I’ve been researching gear/cycles for a while now. I’ve spoken in person to a few people that have a lot of experience with it but are definitely a little “loose” with their science and although I can tell they have good results I’d rather consult some more strict minds and see what you all think.

A little background:
- 34 year old male pharmacist (yes I have a breadth of drug knowledge but I’ve been in the medical field long enough to know that we have limited QUALITY studies actually understanding how to do this and if that’s not bad enough genetics throws a huge wrench into things)
- Been lifting for about 16 years now, I feel like I finally have a good understanding of form (really understand what you all are talking about when you say it’s a bad idea to start gear without a foundation – I have a herniated disc and can’t imagine doing this without a lot of lifting experience)
- Plenty of sports my whole life but mainly basketball, played some D2 and knew some that used gear

Stats:
- 6’1”
- 195 or so pounds
- Last time I had it checked I was about 14.5% body fat (I’ll post some pics when I can here soon)
- I don’t barbell bench anymore due to shoulder issues but dumbbell bench x10 is about 90-100lbs, squatting ~235-240lbs x10, deadlifts I’m careful with (herniated disc/sciatica) so I’m typically not traditionally deadlifting more than about ~300lbs x10 (sorry I don’t do 1maxrep anymore after injuries)
- I’m going to edit and add blood work here as well once I get it, for now I’m going to get just my free test/test levels for baseline before the cycle as I’ve already been through basic lab testing and all is well. I’ll get other things post cycle to see where it’s all at.

Goals:
- Honestly I’m hoping to reach just around 10% body fat and maybe reach around 205-210lbs or so. I’m not looking to be “ripped” out of my mind but going for a very athletic or beach friendly body look. I’m hoping to achieve this with some slight diet mods and a simple test + maybe stanol(?) cycle.

Workouts:
- I’ve tried so many damn things over the years but truly believe in the generic progressive overload being by far the best results. I’ve recognized over the years that my body has responded best by doing “bro splits”, I think it responds better specifically because my body seems to appreciate more rest and recovery with muscle groups. I’ve also noticed that I’ve bulked SIGNIFCANTLY better as I’ve aged and I think this really came down to metabolism/diet changes.
- I’m actually very open to some ideas on different types of training though if anyone has some links to a good program

Diet:
- I know people want really specific breakdowns here and I’d be lying if I told you I’m a counter because I’m not. I just generally eat pretty healthy and make sure that I’m getting in anywhere from 150-200gms protein each day, my numbers suggest I need to be considerably higher than this during cycle which I’m gonna have to dedicate time to (this is an area of improvement I know, but I don’t want to lie and tell you all I’m going hardcore in this area because I know myself and I’m likely not to). I’ve tried some super strict intakes for 3 months in the past with a nutritionist and I saw almost 0 results vs my standard diet. In general I eat fairly low carb because my body seems to respond best to it but I’ve attempted keto and my body truly does not appreciate it.
o Main carbs I eat: White rice, whole grain noodles, tortillas and I use tortilla chips with my cottage cheese
o Proteins: Variety but mostly chicken, ground turkey (lean), some steak (body really seems to respond well to fatty beef periodically, especially after leg/back days), fish, and I tend to eat a decent amount of 2% cottage cheese before bed, Kirkland protein bars (low carb)
o Fats: Tons of nuts, nut butters, some from the periodic steak, I also eat regular eggs occasionally
- As an authentic question, I understand that the recommendation would be to get REAL serious about counting macros but has anyone tried not being as intense and just generally eating healthy w/ an excess in protein to make sure they have enough for synthesis. Would like to hear any stories in this area bad or good

AAS cycle 1:
- Test E 250mg twice a week x 12 weeks (bought 4 vials 250mg/ml, 10 ml)
o I would REALLY like some thoughts on not doing 500mg and attempting to see how my body responds to lower doses and continuing to check my test levels to see where I’m at (about 4 weeks into cycle) to see results/etc to keep doses at a min
- Nolvadex 20mg for PCT 14 days after last test shot (bought 100tabs 20mg/tab)
- Aromasin PRN (gyno, water weight, etc)
- Stanzol 50mg (50 tabs, NOT part of my cycle…yet, but was considering, and figured I would buy to try in second cycle either way)

I think that’s about it, sorry for the crazy long post but wanted to be thorough and show that I’ve actually read a bunch of these threads. Not just coming in with “Hey, new to steroids how do I look like Chris Pratt in Jurassic Park?”. If I did miss anything though please let me know and I promise to add as soon as I can.

I did that same cycle for my first and only cycle.

I was 5-11 245lbs when I started. And ended at 5-11 235lbs. I was hoping for 210 or 205lbs.

But I'm happy with the results.

My advice is to remember that the gear will help, but it's still 90% diet and workouts.

I'd also say that I learned that working out like a bodybuilder is way different than an athlete. Tailoring your workouts to your goals will mean more than the gear your using. So I'd personally lay off the stanz for now. I never needed an AI at the dose your taking, but b everyone is different. I wouldn't take it unless you need it personally.

[Hughinn]

Thanks to both of you guys for the reply! And thanks for the PM chark. Sounds like I should stick with the 500/week then - just figured it might help to not over do it first round. I’ll also make sure to invest in some clomid and HCG but was hoping to not use too many things at once.

I would use as little as possible to get decent results.

You're still a young man, there's no reason to go all in yet.

[Chark]

I would use as little as possible to get decent results.

You're still a young man, there's no reason to go all in yet.

Hughinn you look amazing man!

[Albedo121]

Appreciate the vote of confidence in the final cycle product Hugh!

[Hughinn]

Hughinn you look amazing man!

Appreciate the vote of confidence in the final cycle product Hugh!

Thanks guys.
It was just one cycle so far.

But I'm happy for being 43 and being able to see stomach muscles and stuff.

And the ol lady likes it.

[Hughinn]

Appreciate the vote of confidence in the final cycle product Hugh!

Yes sir.

I'm sure you'll be happy with what you can do.

The gear can't put in the work for you, but it will guarantee the work you put in counts. Just work hard, eat right and don't rush the process, trust the process.

Putting in the work is 60% of the fun. The rest is feeling it, and last but not least, getting to show it off.

Good luck brother. Enjoy yourself.

[Albedo121]

Thanks for the all warm wishes from everyone, this has honestly been an invaluable resource for me. Coupled with some other recs from Chark and my medical background I've definitely been able to get a good grasp of how to approach this all. Now it's just a matter of listening to my body.

Of note - I've also hired a personal trainer who's a physique competitor twice a week, he's definitely training me in a way I've never worked out before so I'm hoping the body shock w/ the gear really gives me a boost. The volume he's putting me through with so little rest time feels somewhat like HITT training so far, he tells me he's wanting me to focus on my muscle endurance the first few weeks and understanding what my real "failure" is instead of pounding out 10 reps at 80% he wants me to know I can do more, especially once the gear gets going. On non training days with him I'm trying to focus on his techniques and push through failure as much as I can. It's making my gym time feel less "efficient" but I think he's onto something so I'm gonna focus on figuring it out for a bit.

I've gotten pretty serious about protein intake. I consulted w/ another hardcore physique competitor that I work with (he's absurd at like 225, 5'9" and like 10% body fat haha), sponsored and used to compete in lifts when he was younger. He's a straight shooter and told me not to go insane with the drugs but that while I'm on them to sincerely push the calories up hard for the first cycle and to get BCAAs in at least 3x a day to help with recovery and to ensure I'm getting appropriate nitrogen if for some reason I can't sneak another meal in to AT LEAST make sure those BCAAs are around the clock. No one told me that the price of the gear was going to pale in comparison to the food/supps! Haha. I find myself scavenging protein from the girlfriends house leftovers. Get it done amirite? But seriously just trying to take the nutrition/actual training as seriously and as hard as I can possibly go to see what the limits are. Will update next week with pics (even though I'm sure there will be next to no change given timeline haha)

- Albedo

[Albedo121]

Life's been a bit hectic but wanted to get these uploaded at some point either way. These were taken 1 week into cycle. Essentially no difference and my weight hadn't really moved by then. This was also without any MK677 on board. Some more fullness from my diet changes, I realized my body actually handle carbs a LOT better than originally thought. Will be taking photos from close to 3 weeks here soon so sorry for the non-weekly promised updates.

[Albedo121]

Sorry no leg shots and I didn't have an update for week 3! Currently on week 4! Also I've realized I'm a terrible poser haha. Maybe one day!

Stat updates:
BF% down to 12.5%
Lean mass up ~10lbs
Total body weight currently 204lbs

[Albedo121]

Been posting consistent pictures in a spot with consistent lighting but figured I’d post some actual gym pics with some pumps as well.

[Albedo121]

I've been terribblleeeee about the weekly updates so I apologize! But here are some photo updates. Measurements still moving up, pretty sure I've kept the same body fat and have only adjusted up maybe 2 lbs or so. I'm around 207 give or take. Legs have made the largest size adjustments according to measurements. Over the last 2 weeks I adjusted up from 300mg test/week to 400mg test/week and still no sides. If so I'll end up finishing on 500mg/week. Today I started my winny at 25mg/day and will titrate up next week if I feel like I'm tolerating it fine.

[Hughinn]

I've been terribblleeeee about the weekly updates so I apologize! But here are some photo updates. Measurements still moving up, pretty sure I've kept the same body fat and have only adjusted up maybe 2 lbs or so. I'm around 207 give or take. Legs have made the largest size adjustments according to measurements. Over the last 2 weeks I adjusted up from 300mg test/week to 400mg test/week and still no sides. If so I'll end up finishing on 500mg/week. Today I started my winny at 25mg/day and will titrate up next week if I feel like I'm tolerating it fine.

Looking good bro.

Nothing like being your 30s. Gaining mass gets more difficult as you get older. Enjoy it while you can and keep up the good work.

[Albedo121]

Thanks Hugh! Appreciate the support brother!

[Chark]

Looking good Albedo. It looks like you've done a bit of a recomp, I see more muscle and leanness than in your OP.

[Chark]

Update?

[Nerdandertall]

Update bump! Would be cool to see more results

[Afreak]

He died