A least muscular and a flabdominal shot...I think I have gyno :(

:1seeyah: which would be ironic since I've never actually used gear.

I'm a slob in these pics, but even when I was wicked lean, I had the "fat on the chest" thing going.

sucks balls, makes me mad mad mad.

I also have jacked up symmetry because, 5 years ago (remember that comment about "wicked lean"? That was then) I injured myself playing football, and ended up with some full shoulder reconstruction luvin'.

Anyway, this is a "here I am now, look at me, time to get into shape" type pic. At least it was, until a few knowledgeable people brought to my attention that I might have gyno. If I pinch the titties, it hurts a helluva lot more than if I pinch, say, my love handles just as hard. and like i said, had it since I was a teenager, even when I was lean and had striations on my upper chest, triceps and legs.

and before Nark (and others) ask, I'll have pics of the wheels up as soon as I get a new camera. The one I used to take these pics was only $35, and it is in the trash pile now after aggravating me a few too many times. :P

anyway, here are the pics

EDIT - added wheels pic. kinda blurry. added biceps and triceps pic. blurry as well. Starting to think maybe it's not just me.:rant:

I can tell you are very muscular...diets are fun!...of course there is the diet forum so no problem...

Im not sure if that is gyno...you may just have excess A2 receptors in your chest...I have the same problem...but if it hurts it could be gyno...

LOOKIN THICK BRO THICK!!!!!!!!!!!

Have to admit it does look like gyno..Try lossing some weight to get rid of your problem and if that doesnt work then somthings wrong

yeah, i'm going to try a combination of "lean bulking" and cardio.

in other words, I'll eat what I normally would eat, and it'll be wicked clean (brown rice, whole oats, chicken breast, lean steak, flax and ANPB, basically).

I'll be training all out for mass, especially in my lower chest (will prioritize decline DBs now), and I will also continue to force the cardio. I'll probably shift from a few HIIT workouts to all HIIT (5 x weekly) for the cardio.

We shall see.

Diet now (lifting days)

morning physical training (this is where I'll squeeze in abs and HIIT)
followed by:

Meal 1
1/4c brown rice
8oz lean steak
lil' bit of BBQ
51g Pro, 41g carb, 13g fat, 499 kcal

Meal 2 (preworkout)
1/4c oatmeal
1T ANPB
1 scoop chocolate whey
1c skim
37g Pro, 31g carb, 11g fat, 380 kcal

lunchtime - weights

PWO
1/8c dextrose
1/8c maltodextrin
2 scoops Isopure
50g protein, 50g carbs, 1g fat, 420 kcal

Meal 3
"Power pudding"
1/2c plain yogurt
1/2c cottage cheese
1 scoop choco whey
1T flax (Separate....ew)
44g pro, 17g CHO, 17g fat, 410kcal

Meal 4
6 oz chicken breast
yittle bittit of BBQ
1T flax
45g pro, 12g CHO, 23g fat, 450 kcal

Meal 5
1/4c oatmeal
1 scoop choco whey
1T ANPB
1c skim
37g Pro, 31g carb, 11g fat, 380 kcal

then about an hour later, I hit up the cardio for 30 minutes on the stepmill.

during the night, I'll finish off a big ole' container of icewater with 2 scoops of Isopure, adding another 50g of protein and 210ish kcal

daily totals on lifting days:
314g protein, 182g CHO, 77g fat, 2755 kcal/day

that is on lifting days (M-W-F). On non-lifting days, I dump the glucose and maltodextrin from the mid-day Isopure which lowers carbs by 50g down to 132g, and it lowers calories down to 2550ish.

On non-lifting days, I still do morning and evening cardio. Sundays, I take off entirely.

IMO you have a tad too many grams of fat...and I think a lot of it is sat fat...especially meal 3...I also think you need more protein and possibly more carbs pre workout...and I would cut out BBQ sauce entirely...

i'm sorry

all dairy is fat free/sugar free.

the only saturated fat I get is from my hunk of cow and my chicken breast.

skim milk, skim cottage cheese, skim yogurt.

out of my 77g fat, 28 of it is from high lignan flax, 16 is from ANPB, 21 is from chicken breast and lean steak, and the other 12 is from brown rice (1g per 1/4c), oatmeal(1g per 1/4c) and the protein powder (Each has 1g of fat per serving)

So 21g per day, approximately, is from animal sources, the rest is from straight up flax oil, ANPB or grain/oats. That should be okay, I'm thinking, especially considering

a) I'm 212 lbs
b) I do cardio 12x per week
c) I'm lifting pretty heavily

and I know about the dern BBQ sauce *Scuffs foot in the sand, ashamed*

But it sincerely helps with the pain of eating brown rice.

I'll dump it from the chicken breast, I can season that sucker. But dammit jim! Brown rice without SOME type of sauce is

SO
FRICKIN
DRY

thanks for reminding me about the BBQ. I'm all open to something that'll help me choke down the brown rice. I like the flavor, but it is just too dry without....something.

are you sure your cooking the rice long enough with enough water?...I never have dry brown rice...

This may be a stupid question but what is ANPB?...

hiit cardio may not be the best option if you want to maintain muscle mass. long duration moderate pace cardio makes controlling muscle loss while dieting much easier.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by timtim

hiit cardio may not be the best option if you want to maintain muscle mass. long duration moderate pace cardio makes controlling muscle loss while dieting much easier.

---

I can say from experience and research that the opposite is true...also depends on your definition of "long duration"...

i'm with Newkid.

HIIT maintains it much better, and in my case (thighs/quads) even helps build some separation

NewKid, ANPB is all-natural peanut butter

basically, it's peanut oil with fiber and protein ;)

so the fats are healthy

as for the brown rice, when it is initially cooked, it's great. but I gotta cook a week's worth and store it, and even when I add water for the reheat, it comes out dry.

meh. I'm just a baby. :P

I can say from experience and research that the opposite is true...also depends on your definition of "long duration"...


i can say from 8 months of experimenting with hiit that i was not impressed at all and had little to show in terms of results - i looked flat. i have much better results with long duration. everyone is different and i provided my personal real world experience as did you. guess he has to see what happens for himself.

Have a look...primarily under: "If You’re Consistently on the Track, You’re on Track; It’s Just That Simple…" Heading...

http://magazine.mindandmuscle.net/

i've seen articles like that supporting hiit. i just wanted to add my experience that it's not as great as many have said. good article though.

timtim, you hit on a point people frequently forget

everything works, nothing works forever, and not everything works as well for everybody

HIIT works great for me. If it doesn't work for you, then don't do it. If it works for another person, then good for them, etc.

Shame it doesn't work for you. It is a whole lot nicer finishing off a 30-minute HIIT session and being smoked, rather than having to trudge endlessly on for a full hour (or more)

I would, of course, have to ask....

Describe your high intensity and low intensity intervals, in detail.

I'll give you an example of my most recent HIIT workout

Stepmill, 5 minute warmup, then:

30 seconds on level 15, standing upright, hands not touching anything
60 seconds on level 6, leaning over on the supports

repeated that for 20 minutes, and finished off with 30 seconds on level 20, hands on the supports (to ensure I didn't go flying off the Stepmill!), then cooldown of 5 minutes.

From what I've seen, people don't take the "high intensity" part seriously. You don't run, you sprint. Then the low intensity part, you don't run slowly, you jog. That type of thing.

Personally...I sprint/run at 10mph for 30-45 sec...then walk at 3.5mph for about 5min...quite a bit different from yours...

why dont u try excessive decline presses and flys .. my friend had that problem .. i told him to try it out cuz he had nun to loose and WALA ! no more of that hangin titty thiing .. give it a try see what happends

thanks omni, but I "been there, done that", and unfortunately it didn't do much of anything.

i can't do flyes at all.

wow NewKid, that is interesting how you do yours. of course, I don't have a police officer friend to radar me while I'm sprinting

*chuckle*

:lol: I do it on the treadmill...I didnt say it was easy!...

ah, a treadmill, okay, duh.

why such a long break between high intensity times? You a skinny dude? I honestly don't think I could keep my heart rate up during the slow down time.

10 MPH and 3.5 MPH. interesting, gonna give that a try tomorrow morning, see how it feels, maybe I can answer my own question.

Damn bro, it looks like gyno. Plus if it hurts than that a tall tale sign of it. You have good hardness though, you just need to fix that problem.

Im cutting I weigh about 180 lean...not sure what my BF% is...You dont really want to keep your heart rate UP you want it to be slightly above normal and then all the sudden BAM you sprint...then slow down and let it go down again...

oh no, I agree with you. the slow time is *slow*, but...dayam...4 minutes? mebbe its a military thing with the fast recovery from cardio since we do

SO
DAMN
MUCH

of it

and thanks for the props big flex.

added a horribly blurry pic of the wheels

one of these days I'll learn how to take a picture

Whoa those are some huge legs...and theyre already cut!...wait till your BF% goes down...
Praise the lord

:thewave:

removed the wheels pic

gonna post one that isn't blurry. just had to learn to use "sport" mode on the camera for my wobbly hands

EDIT - hurm. just gonna go with the blurry one since the rest ended up blurry as well. I hate taking pictures.

bleh.

Man when you stick a diet and a fat burning routine, you will be more of a chiseled mess of mass than you already are!

dang man you are a freaking monster. Your legs and traps are insane, and you haven't done any gear at all? Makes me feel like a pussy.

nice traps bro.

wow, thanks guys.

no gear. 3 cycles of 1-AD post surgery to try to get myself back into shape.

Still not looking anywhere near as good from the front as I was prior to surgery, ESPECIALLY in the chest/delt area. My delts used to be my strong point *pout*. My back is better though.

and I truly like the "Chiseled Mess of Mass" title

I think that will be my goal. Thanks Novastep! :D

hurm.

arm pics....

okay, added a triceps and a biceps for future comparison

I honestly don't see my arms getting much better because

a) I don't really train them hard
b) Elbow tendonitis causes me to train them with less intensity and care then normal
c) I generally have never cared much about arms

Keith kebab,

All things considered you look pretty phenomenal, especially the legs.

Yep the chest things noticeable but dont let that stop you. One day you may be able to have it fixed surgically but for now play on...!

thick, thanks for the encouragement

sucks balls having a chest that doesn't suck but having boobies. kinda takes away from that whole "manliness" thing, y'know.

thx again.

*re-reads and begins laughing*

HA! "Keith-kebab"

I just realized that.

mmm....shish kebab.....mmm...now I'm hungry dammit.

you're waaaay too hard on yourself!! your legs look awesome, and you have a great base. your diet looks a lot better too. you're def on the right track...good luck!!

thank you for the compliments, ma'am.

now, please tell me...how the heck do you say your name?

Ex-tina-you-nasty?

haha! yep!