Hezbollah Lights Lebanon Ablaze

[singern]

Hezbollah, Opposition Supporters Cripple Beirut in Rally Opposing Lebanese Government
Tuesday, January 23, 2007

BEIRUT, Lebanon — 34 people reported shot as by anti-government forces. Hezbollah-led opposition protesters paralyzed Lebanon Tuesday by burning tires and cars at major thoroughfares in and around the capital, sparking clashes with government supporters amid a general strike aimed at toppling U.S.-backed Prime Minister Fuad Saniora.

"Today, we escalated. Tomorrow we will escalate more. And we will continue until the fall of the government," Younes said, sitting in the middle of a road along with other Aoun followers in the northern Beirut suburb of Zalka.

The worst violence since the pro-Syrian Shiite Hezbollah movement and its allies launched its campaign two months ago to oust the government.

Black clouds billowed over parts of Beirut as opposition supporters set up burning roadblocks on main routes and at entrances to the capital, as well as in other major cities to enforce the strike. Commuters were stranded and business came to halt in many districts of the capital.



IMO:
Sleep with dogs, wake up with fleas.
What were they thinking allowing an extremist terrorist group to enter the political and social avenues of there country. I give them 1 year before they have a new Taliban like state.

I have no doubt our local terrorist supporters will claim this is a plan instigated by the "evil zionists"

[mcpeepants]

Hezbollah, Opposition Supporters Cripple Beirut in Rally Opposing Lebanese Government
Tuesday, January 23, 2007

BEIRUT, Lebanon — 34 people reported shot as by anti-government forces. Hezbollah-led opposition protesters paralyzed Lebanon Tuesday by burning tires and cars at major thoroughfares in and around the capital, sparking clashes with government supporters amid a general strike aimed at toppling U.S.-backed Prime Minister Fuad Saniora.

"Today, we escalated. Tomorrow we will escalate more. And we will continue until the fall of the government," Younes said, sitting in the middle of a road along with other Aoun followers in the northern Beirut suburb of Zalka.

The worst violence since the pro-Syrian Shiite Hezbollah movement and its allies launched its campaign two months ago to oust the government.

Black clouds billowed over parts of Beirut as opposition supporters set up burning roadblocks on main routes and at entrances to the capital, as well as in other major cities to enforce the strike. Commuters were stranded and business came to halt in many districts of the capital.



IMO:
Sleep with dogs, wake up with fleas.
What were they thinking allowing an extremist terrorist group to enter the political and social avenues of there country. I give them 1 year before they have a new Taliban like state.

I have no doubt our local terrorist supporters will claim this is a plan instigated by the "evil zionists"

local terrorist supporters?

[singern]

local terrorist supporters?

Yes we have several who frequently find the need to spin the truth and make excuses for terrorists.

[mcpeepants]

Yes we have several who frequently find the need to spin the truth and make excuses for terrorists.

do you consider me one? which members do you think are?

[juicedOUTbrain]

I HATE terrorists, thats why I dont like Israel...

You wanted democracy in the middle east. You got it...

[singern]

I HATE terrorists, thats why I dont like Israel...

You wanted democracy in the middle east. You got it...

It is your right to feel the way you do, and I respect that right.
I only recommend you do it for real reasons and not because some fantasy or hatful radical told you so.

I have to ask, just what terrible crime has an Israeli ever done to you, have you ever even met one.

I am obviously an Israeli, a jew, and thus by definition a Zionist. Regardless of what you have been told by your "sources" I can assure you I dont have horns on my head, drink Muslim blood, and am quite capable of friendly dialog with you.

Shalom.


Now back to the topic..........

[juicedOUTbrain]

It is your right to feel the way you do, and I respect that right.
I only recommend you do it for real reasons and not because some fantasy or hatful radical told you so.

I respect your right as well. And to be honest, if i lived in Israel, i'd probly feel as you do. But i live across the pond and TRY to look at all of this objectively. And to me, I see a biased in the west (especially israel + the US) against palestinians, and muslims in general.

And just for your information, the only people who forced beliefs in my head was the mainstream media in this country that brainwashed me until i was around 19, until i realized that they have an agenda of there own and i was only getting one side of the story...Thats when i went on a search for truth...

I have to ask, just what terrible crime has an Israeli ever done to you, have you ever even met one.

The Israeli gov't has helped get my country involved in an unwinnable war for oil and power...

And do I know anyone from Israel? I have family in israel, and my grandparents are russian jews and visit israel frequently. I love them dearly. In fact I love the Israeli people, and I am part jewish. I would love to visit Israel one day, its a beautiful country...

But the people who write policy, the people who control the media, and even the gov't officials in the US that are influenced by money and power, i consider to be evil at the worst, and just plain ignorant at the best.

I am obviously an Israeli, a jew, and thus by definition a Zionist. Regardless of what you have been told by your "sources" I can assure you I dont have horns on my head, drink Muslim blood, and am quite capable of friendly dialog with you.

I dont consider every israeli jew a zionist...only the ones who shape policy and believe the territories should be annexed one day. You seem like a nice guy and i never thought you had horns on your head or drink blood...

Just please dont dismiss my posts as "conspiracies"...If you dont believe them than just ask me to elaborate, i have no problem getting questioned on my beliefs, just not dismissed

In fact I blame the US, UK and the other countries for refusing to accept the jews after WWII, and the UN who created a jewish state in the center of the middle east...what a great idea!

no hard feelings bro, ill see ya around the board.

Shalom

[Kale]

I respect your right as well. And to be honest, if i lived in Israel, i'd probly feel as you do. But i live across the pond and TRY to look at all of this objectively. And to me, I see a biased in the west (especially israel + the US) against palestinians, and muslims in general.

And just for your information, the only people who forced beliefs in my head was the mainstream media in this country that brainwashed me until i was around 19, until i realized that they have an agenda of there own and i was only getting one side of the story...Thats when i went on a search for truth...



The Israeli gov't has helped get my country involved in an unwinnable war for oil and power...

And do I know anyone from Israel? I have family in israel, and my grandparents are russian jews and visit israel frequently. I love them dearly. In fact I love the Israeli people, and I am part jewish. I would love to visit Israel one day, its a beautiful country...

But the people who write policy, the people who control the media, and even the gov't officials in the US that are influenced by money and power, i consider to be evil at the worst, and just plain ignorant at the best.



I dont consider every israeli jew a zionist...only the ones who shape policy and believe the territories should be annexed one day. You seem like a nice guy and i never thought you had horns on your head or drink blood...

Just please dont dismiss my posts as "conspiracies"...If you dont believe them than just ask me to elaborate, i have no problem getting questioned on my beliefs, just not dismissed

In fact I blame the US, UK and the other countries for refusing to accept the jews after WWII, and the UN who created a jewish state in the center of the middle east...what a great idea!

no hard feelings bro, ill see ya around the board.

Shalom

And that righ there is the root cause of the problem, I tell you what if the UN had decided to anex one of the Australian states and make it a Jewish State I would make Osama look like a Pre-School kid in nappies !!!

[singern]

And that righ there is the root cause of the problem, I tell you what if the UN had decided to anex one of the Australian states and make it a Jewish State I would make Osama look like a Pre-School kid in nappies !!!

Your point would have some validity if Jews were not indigenous to the land of Israel.

A more acurate and historically correct analogy would be if you showed up at the front door of an aboriginal family and said "Hi folks Im home" .......Dont you agree?

[singern]

1 Dead, 17 Injured in Student Clashes at Beirut University


BEIRUT, Lebanon — Students for and against the government hurled rocks and furniture at each other Thursday as Lebanon's power struggle turned violent on a university campus and spilled onto nearby streets.

Hezbollah's Al-Manar television said one of the militant group's supporters was killed, but security officials could not immediately confirm the death. Security officials said at least 17 people were injured. Other TV stations reported that about 25 people were hurt.

Soldiers fired shots in the air to disperse the rioters at the Beirut Arab University in the Tarik el-Jadideh neighborhood, the officials said, speaking on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to speak to the media.

The trouble in the Sunni Muslim neighborhood spilled over to nearby streets, where people from outside the university joined in the fight. Young men carrying sticks and wearing hard hats arrived in the area and started throwing stones at each other. Some in the crowd smashed car windows before setting several on fire.

More troops arrived in armored vehicles as soldiers fired volleys in the air, and residents fled for cover. The army closed the road on the southern edge of the Lebanese capital.

[zodiac666]

I HATE terrorists, thats why I dont like Israel...

You wanted democracy in the middle east. You got it...

so in your opinion what exactly should happen between israel and lebanon to create some kind of peace? i think we can both agree that israel packing up their country and leaving is not a reasonable option, nor is them ceasing to exist a reasonable option. and if they give back land to the palestinians, that land is more than likely going to be used to launch rockets into israeli villages (we've seen it before). i was just curious what your idea of a peaceful solution would be?

[singern]

so in your opinion what exactly should happen between israel and lebanon to create some kind of peace? i think we can both agree that israel packing up their country and leaving is not a reasonable option, nor is them ceasing to exist a reasonable option. and if they give back land to the palestinians, that land is more than likely going to be used to launch rockets into israeli villages (we've seen it before). i was just curious what your idea of a peaceful solution would be?

Israel already withdrew to internationally recognized borders in June of 2000. And yet Hazbola still fires rockets, not to mention started a war last summer.

[chief_willie]

It is your right to feel the way you do, and I respect that right.
I only recommend you do it for real reasons and not because some fantasy or hatful radical told you so

Israel is a terrorist state. I thought everyone knew that. Just ask Teabagger....BUT, if ya want the definition of a terrorist, just go to the white House.


"W"

[juicedOUTbrain]

so in your opinion what exactly should happen between israel and lebanon to create some kind of peace?

First off, we must put the conflict in full context.

Despite what the US media reports Israel did not completely withdraw from Lebanon in 2000. It still occupied the Shebaa Farms region in south lebanon. And still does...

The UN had deemed this occupation illegal in 1981, citing resolution 497, in which Israel was forced to withdraw from the Golan Heights area (where the shebaa farms area risides).

Israel also held as many as 20 Lebanese prisoners in their dungeons, some of them being non violent offenders.

Hezbollah requested the release of 4 of the prisoners, 2 of which were totally innocent of any crime.

Now that we have a little context, I personally feel Israel should've completely withdrawn from lebanon, out of the shebaa farms area. They should've also released the 2 or more innocent lebanese prisoners, unconditionally.

Israel should've then entered into direct negotiations with lebanon over the other prisoners.

They should also work tirelessly in the palestinian peace process, which is the source of much of the tension between Lebanon and Israel, and has been at more or less of a stand still since 2000.

Now to be honest, I may not have all the answers, but i can tell you that killing close to a thousand lebanese civilians and dropping cluster bombs on that country does not increase Israels security. In fact the destruction of the lebanese infrastructure, and deaths of many civilians increased hatred against the nation.

Through life experience, movies, TV shows we are constantly shown that when attacked a given entity "must do something" to retaliate...but reality is much more complicated.

If the only thing that you can do, will lead to more violence, and do little or nothing to solve the present situation, than should you continue to do it?IMO, no

The main goal of the brutal attack on lebanon was to create a rift between the government elites in beirut, and hezzbollah. The only thing the war did was to unite these two groups even further.

To quote a good man, jesus, maybe sometimes you should turn the other cheek?

[ecivon]

Israel already withdrew to internationally recognized borders in June of 2000. And yet Hazbola still fires rockets, not to mention started a war last summer.

You're either delusional, or on hallucinogenics. Israel, as the Canadian politician subletly stated, "that shitty little state" has never withdrawn to any internationally recognized borders. What the hell are you talking about?

[zodiac666]

First off, we must put the conflict in full context.

Despite what the US media reports Israel did not completely withdraw from Lebanon in 2000. It still occupied the Shebaa Farms region in south lebanon. And still does...

The UN had deemed this occupation illegal in 1981, citing resolution 497, in which Israel was forced to withdraw from the Golan Heights area (where the shebaa farms area risides).

Israel also held as many as 20 Lebanese prisoners in their dungeons, some of them being non violent offenders.

Hezbollah requested the release of 4 of the prisoners, 2 of which were totally innocent of any crime.

Now that we have a little context, I personally feel Israel should've completely withdrawn from lebanon, out of the shebaa farms area. They should've also released the 2 or more innocent lebanese prisoners, unconditionally.

Israel should've then entered into direct negotiations with lebanon over the other prisoners.

They should also work tirelessly in the palestinian peace process, which is the source of much of the tension between Lebanon and Israel, and has been at more or less of a stand still since 2000.

Now to be honest, I may not have all the answers, but i can tell you that killing close to a thousand lebanese civilians and dropping cluster bombs on that country does not increase Israels security. In fact the destruction of the lebanese infrastructure, and deaths of many civilians increased hatred against the nation.

Through life experience, movies, TV shows we are constantly shown that when attacked a given entity "must do something" to retaliate...but reality is much more complicated.

If the only thing that you can do, will lead to more violence, and do little or nothing to solve the present situation, than should you continue to do it?IMO, no

The main goal of the brutal attack on lebanon was to create a rift between the government elites in beirut, and hezzbollah. The only thing the war did was to unite these two groups even further.

To quote a good man, jesus, maybe sometimes you should turn the other cheek?

how do you know who's innocent or guilty out of the prisoners israel has?

i think we both can agree that israel would probably continue to get attacked even if they did what you said. and if mexico was launching rockets into american villages, targeting and killing some of our civilians and our government was doing nothing about it, i dont think our citizens would stand for that for very long. im really not educated enough in the specifics to debate it very well, but as long as many lebanese continue to support groups like hezbollah who will only accept the complete destruction of israel there probably is no peaceful solution.

[juicedOUTbrain]

how do you know who's innocent or guilty out of the prisoners israel has?

From wikipedia:
Hezbollah has named four individuals who it says are Lebanese citizens currently held in Israeli jails.

Samir Kuntar is serving four life sentences for murder for a 1979 attack on a civilian apartment block in Nahariya, Israel.
Nissim Nasser is an Israeli of Lebanese descent who was arrested in 2002 for spying for Hezbollah.[1]
Yehia Skaff is accused of participating in the 1978 Coastal Road massacre.
Ali Faratan is a fisherman.[1] Hezbollah gave no reason for his alleged detention

In addition to these, Lebanon released the name of a dozen others who went "missing" in the 1982 war.

i think we both can agree that israel would probably continue to get attacked even if they did what you said.

Well, Id like to, but hezbollahs reasons for engaging Israel were the occupation of Shebaa Farms and the detainment of its prisoners.

As long as they occupy territory (Gazza, Shabaa Farms) There will be resentment towards them that will only increase the amount of attacks...

if mexico was launching rockets into american villages, targeting and killing some of our civilians and our government was doing nothing about it, i dont think our citizens would stand for that for very long.

That logic could also be used for Hezbollah...If a neighboring country remained on your occupied territory 20 years after they were asked to leave , as well as systematically denied the rights of your muslim brothers in palestine, wouldnt you do something...

Also, Hezbollah was not nessasarily targeting civilians. Katusha rockets are not missiles. Rockets are very inaccurate and while they were launching them into Israel, it was their only means of defence. Its important to note that these rockets killed around 40 Israelis, while Israel's "guided" missiles killed over 1000 people, only 1/2 of them Hezbollah fighters.

And citizens driven by anger, rage, and revenge dont always have the best insight on how to stop a conflict. ask Iraq

as long as many lebanese continue to support groups like hezbollah who will only accept the complete destruction of israel there probably is no peaceful solution

This is an exaggeration of the truth. Although most middle eastern countries want to bring an end to the zionist governement of israel, the only thing they want for peace is an independent palestian state. This is the main dispute driving all of these smaller conflicts.

The media wants you to believe that the conflict between Lebanon and Israel started in July. The truth is, its been going on since the creation of israel and specifically 1982 when the Israeli-Lebanon war broke out (which was started by Israel).

im really not educated enough in the specifics to debate it very well, but as long as many lebanese continue to support groups like hezbollah who will only accept the complete destruction of israel there probably is no peaceful solution.

Im not an expert either, but the more you realize the media in this country is feeding you a bunch of bullshit by showing you only half the story...the clearer the conflict becomes.

I agree that as long as groups like hezbollah exist there is no peaceful solution...My argument is that it is Israels policies that lead to the creation of these type of groups, but not the destruction of them.

And look Im not claiming I know exactly how to end this bullshit, but you have to understand this battle isnt black and white, good and evil. If you were living in the middle east, you would think Israel and the US are evil. The truth lies somewhere in the middle...
check this video out, its a good embodiment of my perspective on the conflict.

Galloway on Sky news

lemme kno what you think.

[zodiac666]

From wikipedia:
Hezbollah has named four individuals who it says are Lebanese citizens currently held in Israeli jails.

Samir Kuntar is serving four life sentences for murder for a 1979 attack on a civilian apartment block in Nahariya, Israel.
Nissim Nasser is an Israeli of Lebanese descent who was arrested in 2002 for spying for Hezbollah.[1]
Yehia Skaff is accused of participating in the 1978 Coastal Road massacre.
Ali Faratan is a fisherman.[1] Hezbollah gave no reason for his alleged detention

In addition to these, Lebanon released the name of a dozen others who went "missing" in the 1982 war.

hezbollah is definitely not a source i would trust

Agreed, as long as they occupy territory (Gazza, Shabaa Farms) There will be resentment towards them that will only increase the amount of attacks...

i need to look at a map, if these territory's would give hez a better/closer place to attack from then i wouldnt give them back.

Hezbollah was not nessasarily targeting civilians. Katusha rockets are not missiles. Rockets are very inaccurate and while they were launching them into Israel, it was their only means of defence. Its important to note that these rockets killed around 40 Israelis, while Israel's "guided" missiles killed over 1000 people, only 1/2 of them Hezbollah fighters.

And citizens driven by anger, rage, and revenge dont always have the best insight on how to stop a conflict.

hez is almost always targeting civilian villages, how do you possibly see that as a means of defence?

as you know israel has a very high tech military, their radar is just like ours. it can pinpoint the exact point of origin of where the rocket was launched, which is often in a civilian village, and of course israel is going to fire back and eliminate the threat to its civilians. whether you believe it or not, part of hez's mission is to make israel look bad to the world even if it means sacrificing lebanese civilians.

This is an exaggeration of the truth. Although most middle eastern countries want to bring an end to the zionist governement of israel, the only thing they want for peace is an independent palestian state. This is the main dispute driving all of these smaller conflicts.

hez made it clear that the only solution they will settle for is the complete destruction of israel.

[mcpeepants]

From wikipedia:
Hezbollah has named four individuals who it says are Lebanese citizens currently held in Israeli jails.

Samir Kuntar is serving four life sentences for murder for a 1979 attack on a civilian apartment block in Nahariya, Israel.
Nissim Nasser is an Israeli of Lebanese descent who was arrested in 2002 for spying for Hezbollah.[1]
Yehia Skaff is accused of participating in the 1978 Coastal Road massacre.
Ali Faratan is a fisherman.[1] Hezbollah gave no reason for his alleged detention

In addition to these, Lebanon released the name of a dozen others who went "missing" in the 1982 war.


Well, Id like to, but hezbollahs reasons for engaging Israel were the occupation of Shebaa Farms and the detainment of its prisoners.

As long as they occupy territory (Gazza, Shabaa Farms) There will be resentment towards them that will only increase the amount of attacks...



That logic could also be used for Hezbollah...If a neighboring country remained on your occupied territory 20 years after they were asked to leave , as well as systematically denied the rights of your muslim brothers in palestine, wouldnt you do something...

Also, Hezbollah was not nessasarily targeting civilians. Katusha rockets are not missiles. Rockets are very inaccurate and while they were launching them into Israel, it was their only means of defence. Its important to note that these rockets killed around 40 Israelis, while Israel's "guided" missiles killed over 1000 people, only 1/2 of them Hezbollah fighters.

And citizens driven by anger, rage, and revenge dont always have the best insight on how to stop a conflict. ask Iraq



This is an exaggeration of the truth. Although most middle eastern countries want to bring an end to the zionist governement of israel, the only thing they want for peace is an independent palestian state. This is the main dispute driving all of these smaller conflicts.

The media wants you to believe that the conflict between Lebanon and Israel started in July. The truth is, its been going on since the creation of israel and specifically 1982 when the Israeli-Lebanon war broke out (which was started by Israel).


Im not an expert either, but the more you realize the media in this country is feeding you a bunch of bullshit by showing you only half the story...the clearer the conflict becomes.

I agree that as long as groups like hezbollah exist there is no peaceful solution...My argument is that it is Israels policies that lead to the creation of these type of groups, but not the destruction of them.

And look Im not claiming I know exactly how to end this bullshit, but you have to understand this battle isnt black and white, good and evil. If you were living in the middle east, you would think Israel and the US are evil. The truth lies somewhere in the middle...
check this video out, its a good embodiment of my perspective on the conflict.

Galloway on Sky news

lemme kno what you think.

Galloway is ridiculous debator. Did you so see him tear apart several Senators in a Senate Committee hearing a couple years ago?

[juicedOUTbrain]

Zodiac, To answer some of your questions...Hez isnt the best source, but israel admits to holding 4 prisoners.

As for the occupied territory, why would you hold these? If they are the primary reason for muslim extremism, and you would admit we will never be able to kill every single muslim radical whats the point of holding them? This is war of ideas and holding those territories will only make the mission much more difficult, IMO.

They cant "target" civilians because the kaytusha rockets are extremly inaccurate. They do aim them into civilian areas, which is their only option at this point.

And If Israel has guided missiles and half the deaths were civilians, dont you see something wrong? when does collateral damage become genocide?

And while hezbolah may claim its radical goals...It doesnt even come close to having the means to carry out its threats...and the treatment of palestinians, neighbors will only build world, national, and regional support for these desires...

Im done, i cant keep typing about shit shit...im drained

Galloway is ridiculous debator. Did you so see him tear apart several Senators in a Senate Committee hearing a couple years ago?

They called him to the senate to discredit him for coming out against the war...Big Mistake

Galloway Testimony- MSNBC Clip and the Uncut Version
Galloway gives Coleman a second helping on Hardball


Rock on George!

[singern]

You're either delusional, or on hallucinogenics. Israel, as the Canadian politician subletly stated, "that shitty little state" has never withdrawn to any internationally recognized borders. What the hell are you talking about?

Im not sure where or why you are so disinformed, but I can assure you not one Israeli sits, stands, or sleeps in South Lebanon since the summer of 2000.

As to the disputed Sheba farms, it is exactly that.... A disputed territory to be returned to Syria along with the golan Heights upon reaching a peace agreement.

and by the way, you seem very angry, and insulant, perhaps forum discussions are not your cup of tea....

Shalom.

[juicedOUTbrain]

As to the disputed Sheba farms, it is exactly that.... A disputed territory to be returned to Syria along with the golan Heights upon reaching a peace agreement.

Yes, disputed between Syria, and Lebanon...not Israel...Syria has refused to claim it, until Israel completly withdraws...