Is there hope for Europe?

**Panzerfaust** · 01-23-2009, 05:59 PM

I have been saying it quite alot lately that Europe, and mainly the UK are simply laying down and allowing Muslims to flock to their countries and take over. All the while doing it without the consent of Europeans. Funny how the news is not covering it alot.

Well apparently there are some Europeans with balls left, I agree with this guy that we better hope Europe is able to fight of this scum and not leave America as the last continent standing to fight this filth. Is it not obvious these extremist filth want to take over? They openly say they intend to do so.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x6v...res-geert_news

**MuscleScience** · 01-23-2009, 06:07 PM

What can the citizens do, their government openly lets any one in because they want to be Super PC. If you oppose unrestricted immigration then your labeled a racist. As we all know in western society that is the worst thing someone can be called.

**BgMc31** · 01-23-2009, 06:09 PM

Boy I can't wait 'til BuffedGuy gets a look at this!!! The whole notion this guy says that there is only one Islam and it's all fanatic is gonna throw him through the roof. I look forward to the response!! lol!!!

**MuscleScience** · 01-23-2009, 06:18 PM

Originally Posted by BgMc31

Boy I can't wait 'til BuffedGuy gets a look at this!!! The whole notion this guy says that there is only one Islam and it's all fanatic is gonna throw him through the roof. I look forward to the response!! lol!!!

Yeah he will be pissed....LOL

Just to clarify I was not specifically talking about muslims, I was referring to general lack of control of immigration of all non-europeans including billionaire bastard Americans that skip country to avoid taxes...

**Flagg** · 01-23-2009, 06:20 PM

Normally I agree with a lot of what you say Murilo, more people DO need to be unplugged so they can see the truth, but this sounds like paranoia.

I mean, I thought The Elite were taking over the world? Now it's Muslims?

Edit: those nuts were also talking of taking over the USA, not just us and Europe.

**Dinosaur** · 01-23-2009, 08:17 PM

THIS GUY THEY INTERVIEWED IS RACIST ANTI-HUMANITY GUY HIS PROBABLY ONE OF THE FALTHIEST POLOTICAINS IN DUTCH THAT TRY TO WIN THE VOTE OF THOSE CONSERVTIVES HIS VIDEO IS A SCATHING ATTACKS ON ALL IMMIGRANTS THAT DESERVE 2ND CHANCE. NOT ONLY IT STOPS THERE, WITH HIS STUPID VIDEO THAT DELIVERED NOTHING EXCEPT HATE HE'S CREATING WHAT HE CALLED "FITNAH" WHICH MEANS *schism* or *secession* this delivers a good message to win hearts or build bridges between CONTRIES AND PEOPLE. NO WOUNDER WHY SOME POLOTICIAN IN HIS CONTRY WHAT TO HAVE HIM PROSECUTED.

now i am raising a question, by promoting and producing his video what good has it done for him? who benefited from this video?. look at his sorry **** he's got security even in the camera room, what life he has to leave "under fear", truly what a life.
truly, manners make the man.

**Ernst** · 01-24-2009, 02:03 AM

There is a very real backlash in Europe against the muslim immigrants. They were let in in droves by liberal minded, well meaning people who now are faced with the fact that these people have their own culture and beliefs that don't necessarily coincide with their own! Duh!

The road to hell is paved with good intention.

**gst528i** · 01-24-2009, 02:47 AM

WOW that dude is one ballsy guy for being an elected politician .....

**BuffedGuy** · 01-24-2009, 03:02 AM

Originally Posted by muriloninja

I have been saying it quite alot lately that Europe, and mainly the UK are simply laying down and allowing Muslims to flock to their countries and take over. All the while doing it without the consent of Europeans. Funny how the news is not covering it alot.

Well apparently there are some Europeans with balls left, I agree with this guy that we better hope Europe is able to fight of this scum and not leave America as the last continent standing to fight this filth. Is it not obvious these extremist filth want to take over? They openly say they intend to do so.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x6v...res-geert_news

I'm very surprised that a Ron Paul supporter would be saying these things. I'm just going to cut to the chase and bring up a point that is irrefutable: Gallup Poll has done a survey of what the 1 billion Muslims in the world think. And the vast majority are moderates, according to the survey. They do not want to destroy Western society; rather, they respect a lot of things about Western society and want to be a healthy part of that society.

As for Geert Wilders, he is an Islamophobic clown, a bigot, and fear-monger.

What I want to caution you all is that history repeats itself. When we read the history books, we are always surprised at the actions of the whites towards the black slaves, the American pioneers towards the Native Americans, and the European attitude towards the Jews. We think to ourselves: how could they really have been so bigoted? This is exactly how they did it. All the same arguments, and fear-mongering tactics.

Can you imagine if I said: "Judaism is an evil ideology" like Geert said "Islam is an evil ideology". Bring me any quote from the Quran, and I will bring you a more damning quote from the Old Testament. This is a dare, a challenge to you. Do your worst, and I will return fire with fire. The so-called 'troublesome' verses and whatever from Islamic texts can be trumped by the 'troublesome' verses from the Talmud.

Don't get me wrong: I do *not* think that Judaism is this or that. Rather, I am trying to prove to you that this thinking of yours is false. A person can bastardize *ANY* religion on earth, if he so chooses.

Yes, there are some extremists within the ranks of the Muslims, a very small minority. But what we should all realize is that these people are becoming extremists because of the foreign policy of America, which involves invading and occupying Muslim lands. Westerners are getting so angry that the Muslims are coming to their countries, even though these Muslims come with proper VISAs and with the permission of the Western governments. Can you then imagine the anger the Muslims in the East must feel when Americans invade their countries without anyone's approval or permission?

We need to work towards peace; we need to build bridges, not blow them up. Hate-mongering and bigotry have no place in a civilized society. Let us stay away from them. Before the Holocaust, the Nazis were spreading propaganda about how evil the Jews were, and how evil Judaism itself was. They would take passages of the Talmud and use them to spread fear. Let's not repeat history.

May God unite our hearts on the Straight Path.

**BuffedGuy** · 01-24-2009, 03:06 AM

"The Protocols of the Elders of Zion" was a book used by the Nazis to hate-monger against the Jews. The book claimed that there was a Jewish conspiracy and plot to achieve world domination. It is the exact same tactic being used today by the Islamophobes. Unfortunately people won't realize their folly until history has already included their bigotry in the hall of shame.

**gst528i** · 01-24-2009, 03:07 AM

Bufffedguy you do atleast agree that islam had the most extremists compared to any other religion?
While every religion has it's " black sheep "

I think the problem is to many people fear the general stereotype of islam therefore will jump on the band wagon.

**BuffedGuy** · 01-24-2009, 03:14 AM

Originally Posted by gst528i

Bufffedguy you do atleast agree that islam had the most extremists compared to any other religion?
While every religion has it's " black sheep "

I would disagree with this 100%. The KKK were Christians. The Spanish Inquisition was done by Christians. The Crusaders who ravaged Muslim lands with their extremism and terrorist tactics were Christians. Study the Crusades and see who were the extremists. The actions of the Muslim extremists today pale to the actions of the Crusaders then. Do any Muslim extremists today eat the bodies of Christians? Radulph of Caen, an eyewitness to events at Ma'arra in 1098, wrote, "In Ma'arra our troops boiled pagan [i.e. Muslim] adults in cooking-pots; they impaled children on spits and devoured them grilled." And the Crusaders had a great tactic where they would tell all the Muslims to take safety in a mosque; then when all the women and children had gathered in that mosque, the Crusaders would burn it down. And how did Saladin treat them when he liberated Jerusalem? Just compare the way Saladin treated the conquered peoples and how the Crusaders did. So the matter was not always as it is today.

Was it not the Christian pope who issued a decree for the Christians of the world to conquer the pagans of the world for Christ? To subjugate them? Was it not the Christians who took this to heart and annihilated entire populations, decimating the Native American pagans?

And there are countless other examples.

I am not claiming that Christians are more extremist than Muslims. I am saying that these comparisons are useless and simplistic. People become extremists due to their circumstances, not because of some intrinsic defect in their religion.

**gst528i** · 01-24-2009, 03:19 AM

Originally Posted by BuffedGuy

I would disagree with this 100%. The KKK were Christians. The Spanish Inquisition was done by Christians. The Crusaders who ravaged Muslim lands with their extremism and terrorist tactics were Christians. Study the Crusades and see who were the extremists. The actions of the Muslim extremists today pale to the actions of the Crusaders then. Do any Muslim extremists today eat the bodies of Christians? Radulph of Caen, an eyewitness to events at Ma'arra in 1098, wrote, "In Ma'arra our troops boiled pagan [i.e. Muslim] adults in cooking-pots; they impaled children on spits and devoured them grilled."

And there are countless other examples.

I am not claiming that Christians are more extremist than Muslims. I am saying that these comparisons are useless and simplistic.

No what i meant was the amount as in the amount of people that are currently in to the extremist's .. i mean yea the KKk were there but as time and evolution catches up i think there are less and less extremeists in other religions while islamic extemesists seem to keep growing.
Ofcourse this is my view and by no means am i trying to offend you, infact i have learned a great deal from your other thread.
I for one thought islam was as a whole violent and a religion that required the most out of the people that practice it. BUt there is alot of good ideology that can be seen as very logical yet divine.

**BuffedGuy** · 01-24-2009, 03:31 AM

Originally Posted by gst528i

No what i meant was the amount as in the amount of people that are currently in to the extremist's .. i mean yea the KKk were there but as time and evolution catches up i think there are less and less extremeists in other religions while islamic extemesists seem to keep growing.
Ofcourse this is my view and by no means am i trying to offend you, infact i have learned a great deal from your other thread.
I for one thought islam was as a whole violent and a religion that required the most out of the people that practice it

My dearest colleague, I do not disagree with you if you say that currently there are more Islamic extremists than Christian extremists. Extremists are a result of the circumstances. Christians rule the world right now; they are the first world. Extremists always come from oppressed nations. For example, the Native Americans were occupied and destroyed; it gave birth to a wave of young Native Americans with extremism in their blood. Ireland was occupied, and so the Irish became extremists. The Tamil-speaking people were occupied, so they became extremists. Wherever you have occupation and oppression, extremism will necessarily follow.

In the last ten years, the Western nations have killed MILLIONS of Muslims. So of course there is going to be extremism in the ranks of the Muslims. It is important to understand *why* extremism exists, because the fault has less to do with the religion itself but rather the oppressors themselves, who happen to be the same ones who hatemonger in the first place. If the Western nations just kept to themselves, there would be no terrorism. If they just stayed in their own lands, then there wouldn't be this problem. I remember Usama bin Ladin himself denied the claim that he attacked America because he hated their freedoms; he mentioned some neutral European country (forgot which one), and asked "if that was the case, then why don't we attack this country instead of America?"

Don't get me wrong: I oppose extremists. And it is my religious duty to refute them, and I spend a great deal of my time and energy doing that. God-Willing one day I plan on working in the rehab clinics where they try to "de-brainwash" extremists. So I am not saying that we Muslims do nothing but blame the West. But I *am* saying that to lay all the blame on the feet of our religion is wrong. When you point at someone, four fingers point right back at you.

**BuffedGuy** · 01-24-2009, 03:34 AM

What I want to ask the OP is: the Muslims came to the UK with proper VISAs, and this angers you. Can you then imagine the anger the Muslims feel when the British (and Americans) invaded and destroyed Iraq? You say that the Muslims metaphorically are destroying the UK; I am telling you that the West *literally* destroyed Iraq. So who then has more of a right to be angry? You are angry that some sign was removed in a European country; what about entire buildings and all the infrastructure being decimated? How would that make you feel?

**gst528i** · 01-24-2009, 03:42 AM

YEA YOUR point is taken. I'll agree with you there. Also watching a documentary on iraq... i mean it was a horrible place to begin with under sadam reign. You would think they would have thanked us for that.
I think the problem was that we did not leave immediatly after he was over thrown.

**BuffedGuy** · 01-24-2009, 03:55 AM

Originally Posted by gst528i

YEA YOUR point is taken. I'll agree with you there. Also watching a documentary on iraq... i mean it was a horrible place to begin with under sadam reign. You would think they would have thanked us for that.
I think the problem was that we did not leave immediatly after he was over thrown.

I made a post about Iraq in the Ask a Muslim thread. We have America to "thank" for putting Saddam in power in the first place.

**BuffedGuy** · 01-24-2009, 03:59 AM

We must all become students of history. It really gives a lot of perspective on things.

***RAGE*** · 01-24-2009, 09:22 PM

Originally Posted by BuffedGuy

We must all become students of history. It really gives a lot of perspective on things.

It one thing to read about it because we all know what is written and said is true...or is it better to live it buffedguy? you have no clue on Iraq and what is going on over there except what you read and get off the web...grow up dude.

**BuffedGuy** · 01-24-2009, 10:03 PM

Originally Posted by prone2rage

It one thing to read about it because we all know what is written and said is true...or is it better to live it buffedguy? you have no clue on Iraq and what is going on over there except what you read and get off the web...grow up dude.

Peace be unto you.

What exactly do you mean by "what is going on over there"?

***RAGE*** · 01-24-2009, 10:21 PM

Originally Posted by BuffedGuy

Peace be unto you.

What exactly do you mean by "what is going on over there"?

On what is going on in Iraq...

**BuffedGuy** · 01-24-2009, 10:23 PM

Originally Posted by prone2rage

On what is going on in Iraq...

I know that, but what I am asking is: what exactly do I not get about what is going on over there?

**BgMc31** · 01-25-2009, 02:59 PM

Originally Posted by prone2rage

It one thing to read about it because we all know what is written and said is true...or is it better to live it buffedguy? you have no clue on Iraq and what is going on over there except what you read and get off the web...grow up dude.

Could it be that what you've been told/sold is inaccurate Prone? My father (a 30yr army vet) always told me that soldiers shouldn't get into political discussions because they are kept in the dark more than the general public. For you to tell BuffedGuy to grow up without siting any real info regarding the current conflict shows a certain level of childishness. There is no reason to make this personal or insulting. Everyone debating this topic has sited qualified arguments.

For every soldier who is gung ho supporting the Iraq conflict, I can produce an equal amount if not more who don't buy into the propaganda from either side and just "do their job". And I'm talking about SpecOps guys and marines.

**BuffedGuy** · 01-25-2009, 06:20 PM

Originally Posted by BgMc31

For every soldier who is gung ho supporting the Iraq conflict, I can produce an equal amount if not more who don't buy into the propaganda from either side and just "do their job". And I'm talking about SpecOps guys and marines.

Thank you for your post.

I also want to point out that there are many brave soldiers who have refused to serve and spoken out.

I spent four days in the hospital with a veteran who served in three different wars. He and I became friends, and he said that it took him a long time to realize that it's just horse poop what they were selling him. He even suffered the effects of Agent Orange...but let's just say that not all veterans or those who are a part of the military are gung-ho.

What I think we need is for people to work towards mutual understanding, peace, and cooperation. On both sides--the American side and the Muslim world--we have people calling towards war. Let us call to peace!

Bombing the entire Muslim world to pieces won't stop terrorism. It will only increase it. Conversely, Muslim extremists bombing different civilian areas is not going to help their own situation; it will only worsen it when the American side reacts with full force.

In the Care of the Lord,
-Saladin.

***RAGE*** · 01-26-2009, 03:00 PM

Originally Posted by BgMc31

Could it be that what you've been told/sold is inaccurate Prone? My father (a 30yr army vet) always told me that soldiers shouldn't get into political discussions because they are kept in the dark more than the general public. One I am not a kid I am 43 years old and think for myself and talk about what I have seen not what I read and what I have been told.For you to tell BuffedGuy to grow up without siting any real info regarding the current conflict shows a certain level of childishness. I am telling buffedguy to grow up because it is a fact of war that innocent people die on bothsides and not to just talk about what he told and reads. There is no reason to make this personal or insulting. I am not trying to make it personal or insulting at times I dont get a little upset I will admit that Everyone debating this topic has sited qualified arguments.Thanks I think[/B]

For every soldier who is gung ho supporting the Iraq conflict, I can produce an equal amount if not more who don't buy into the propaganda from either side and just "do their job". And I'm talking about SpecOps guys and marines.

I would like to close with I am proud of what your dad did and want to thank him for that. I am also talking about specops and contractors and as one I got to know them first hand and even spent days months and years with the Iraqis and others.