Israel is going to war

[Beetlegeuse]

About 70% of Israel's soldiers are reservists, not full-timers, and they can't pull off an operation this large without taking a lot of citizens away from their day jobs. And they don't do that unless a national interest is at stake, which tells me they're about to open a large size can of Who-Pass on somebody.

[Hughinn]

It's not surprising.

It seems like the biden administration policies have emboldened the enemies of Israel and America all over the world. Israel will likely be left to fend for itself.

It's funny that the past four years all we heard were lunatics shrieking 'our allies don't respect us' 'orange man bad'.

You gotta wonder what those allies think now.

[flyinlow]

I read an interesting article how Rothschild's was crucial to Isreal being a State. And that is consistent to an interview I seen Rotheschild having one of the documents that legalized that hill that they finally got to occupy post WW1 .. I think it was 1917. Why Jews stab each other in the back isn't something I fully understand. Zionist Jew I keep hearing about and have no idea what that specifically means. Romans didn't kill the King of Jew aka Jesus. Pontius Pilot purposely washed his hands saying, I am clean of this man's blood. He knew it was a Jew on Jew thing. We still see it today. I'm not a Jew and don't care to know the full story to be honest. Orange man bad made Middle East so peaceful and now Isreal is a war zone. Super odd timing .....

[almostgone]

I read an interesting article how Rothschild's was crucial to Isreal being a State. And that is consistent to an interview I seen Rotheschild having one of the documents that legalized that hill that they finally got to occupy post WW1 .. I think it was 1917. Why Jews stab each other in the back isn't something I fully understand. Zionist Jew I keep hearing about and have no idea what that specifically means. Romans didn't kill the King of Jew aka Jesus. Pontius Pilot purposely washed his hands saying, I am clean of this man's blood. He knew it was a Jew on Jew thing. We still see it today. I'm not a Jew and don't care to know the full story to be honest. Orange man bad made Middle East so peaceful and now Isreal is a war zone. Super odd timing .....

There's a high propability that the "Jews" responsible for the crucifixion of Christ were Kenites (descendants of Cain) that were motivated by the Sadducees and Pharisees.

I know you don't care to know the full story so if you don't, skip over it.

[Hughinn]

There's a high propability that the "Jews" responsible for the crucifixion of Christ were Kenites (descendants of Cain) that were motivated by the Sadducees and Pharisees.

I know you don't care to know the full story so if you don't, skip over it.

Forgive my intrusion here.

But weren't the Pharisees the very people who manipulated the Romans into the crucifixion in the first place?

Obviously they seen Jesus as a threat to thier hold on institutions and power. But it's my understanding the Pharisees themselves were kenites.

[flyinlow]

There's a high propability that the "Jews" responsible for the crucifixion of Christ were Kenites (descendants of Cain) that were motivated by the Sadducees and Pharisees.

I know you don't care to know the full story so if you don't, skip over it.

Haha, trust me I don't care! I'm exhausted about anything about Jews. It's over my head and I am very glad I don't care and don't want to know!

[flyinlow]

Forgive my intrusion here.

But weren't the Pharisees the very people who manipulated the Romans into the crucifixion in the first place?

Obviously they seen Jesus as a threat to thier hold on institutions and power. But it's my understanding the Pharisees themselves were kenites.

All I know about the Pharisees is that Christ was bad for business. He was a trouble maker that performed miracles haha, again, I hate talking about Jews. I'm a gentile and Thank you God I am not Jew & I'm heterosexual. Life is much easier being both. No offense.

[almostgone]

Forgive my intrusion here.

But weren't the Pharisees the very people who manipulated the Romans into the crucifixion in the first place?

Obviously they seen Jesus as a threat to thier hold on institutions and power. But it's my understanding the Pharisees themselves were kenites.

The Kenites are embedded in every facet of Judaism band Christianity. They were even scribes back in 1st Chronicles 2:55. That's about like putting the foxes in charge of the henhouse.

[almostgone]

Haha, trust me I don't care! I'm exhausted about anything about Jews. It's over my head and I am very glad I don't care and don't want to know!

I know. I thought it would give you the opportunity to overlook material that you don't want to read like the rest of the forum has to do.

[wango]

With all due respect to the son of God . . . .

[Beetlegeuse]

Israel is at war. They're pounding hell out of Gaza.

IDF begins ground war in Gaza…

As Israel Strikes Hamas from Air, IDF Ground Troops Enter Gaza

Air and ground troops of the Israel Defense Forces began an attack of the Gaza Strip shortly after midnight Friday, the IDF Spokesperson’s Unit reported.

A massive bombardment is currently underway in the strip, representing a new stage in Israel’s defense against ongoing missile barrages that have killed six Israelis and injured scores. The scale of the bombing is beeing detailed in live videos from Gaza being circulated on Twitter and other social media.

The Israeli military has attacked more than 700 Hamas targets since Operation Guardians of the Walls began on Monday, including senior commanders, infrastructure and attack drones launched by the terror group.



Nuke 'em till their babies walk backwards.

[Hughinn]

Israel is at war. They're pounding hell out of Gaza.

IDF begins ground war in Gaza…

As Israel Strikes Hamas from Air, IDF Ground Troops Enter Gaza

Air and ground troops of the Israel Defense Forces began an attack of the Gaza Strip shortly after midnight Friday, the IDF Spokesperson’s Unit reported.

A massive bombardment is currently underway in the strip, representing a new stage in Israel’s defense against ongoing missile barrages that have killed six Israelis and injured scores. The scale of the bombing is beeing detailed in live videos from Gaza being circulated on Twitter and other social media.

The Israeli military has attacked more than 700 Hamas targets since Operation Guardians of the Walls began on Monday, including senior commanders, infrastructure and attack drones launched by the terror group.



Nuke 'em till their babies walk backwards.

It's going to be interesting to see how the democrat party wiggles through this.

The biden administration and it's limp wristed style of foreign policy has emboldened the enemies of Israel and America to the point that they don't fear cyber attacks or open terrorism. They know joe biden is senile, confused and not in charge. The biden administration is also preoccupied with waging its own kind of war against American citizens who disagree with thier policies. So it's prime opportunity for them to advance thier own agendas while the incompetence and preoccupation of the western leadership prohibits any meaningful action.

In addition to all of that, the rising amount of antisemitism among certain elements of the democrat party will make it difficult for the party as a whole to side completely with one side or the other. They've allowed antisemitic people to weild power and influence in the party itself. This will hinder any meaningful consensus on what actions may be taken. Nobody will be happy.

This could get interesting.

[The Deadlifting Dog]

#Jewishspacelasers
#veryfinepeople
#whitepowerretweet

Added this in to clarify:
If the “right” is going to attack parts of the “left” for being anti-semitic...
Then the “right” should at least acknowledge their own anti-semitic elements.

[Hughinn]

#Jewishspacelasers
#veryfinepeople
#whitepowerretweet

Added this in to clarify:
If the “right” is going to attack parts of the “left” for being anti-semitic...
Then the “right” should at least acknowledge their own anti-semitic elements.

That's like saying "I know you are but what am I?"

Okay then.

What's the solution? An American administration that openly supports antisemitism and condemns freedom of speech? Or one that condemns antisemitism, but supports freedom of speech?

You tell me.
other leftist members here feel free to chime in.

[wango]

There is no anti-semitism here, now, nor ever in the past! How could you utter something like that?

Speech seems free here . . .

[Hughinn]

#Jewishspacelasers
#veryfinepeople
#whitepowerretweet

Added this in to clarify:
If the “right” is going to attack parts of the “left” for being anti-semitic...
Then the “right” should at least acknowledge their own anti-semitic elements.

By the way. I dig the new avatar dog.

A little too lean for a typical powerlifter. But looking damn good for 50.

Good work bro

[Ernst]

There is no anti-semitism here, now, nor ever in the past! How could you utter something like that?

Speech seems free here . . .

Not Aramaic LOL

"The time is now!"
"We must exterminate the Jews!"

[Beetlegeuse]

Some accidental journalism from MSM.com.

Brad Cooper summed it up in a single word in his portrayal of US Navy SEAL Chris Kyle in the film, "American Sniper":

"Savages!"

Why Are They Fighting in the Middle East? Because Hamas Is Dedicated to Killing Jews

... Some have attempted to portray this escalation as being about several homes in the Jerusalem neighborhood of Sheikh Jarrah that have been the subject of a protracted legal battle between Israeli Jews and Palestinians stretching back nearly fifty years. It is not.

Others have attempted to portray it as being about a nefarious Israeli scheme to take control of the Al-Aqsa Mosque, which has been entrusted by Israel to Islamic custodianship since the Jewish state took control over the site in the 1967 Six-Day War. It is not.

Fundamentally, this is about Hamas and its dedication, in word and deed, to destroying the Jewish state and murdering Jews. And it is about basic morality. (emphasis added)

This round of violence did not start this week. Since the start of Ramadan, the nighttime air in Jerusalem had been pierced by sirens, helicopters, and the distant pops of riot dispersal means as Palestinian rioters clashed with Israeli police securing the Old City during the Muslim holy month.

At the same time, Arab young people had been swept up in an ugly new TikTok challenge, filming themselves assaulting religious Jews and uploading the videos to the popular social media platform; in response, Jewish youths associated with the racist Lehava organization have preyed on Arab youths in the city center.

As the end of Ramadan approached, tens of thousands of Muslim worshipers ascended to the Temple Mount to attend the final Friday prayers of the month. Upon the prayers' conclusion, hundreds of Palestinians started attacking Israeli police with rocks, firebombs, and other implements that had been stockpiled in the Al-Aqsa Mosque ahead of time. The police responded with riot dispersal means and hundreds of Palestinian rioters and scores of Israeli policemen were hurt in the clashes.

Lurking in the background has been Hamas, which has been maliciously fanning the flames throughout. Already a month ago, Hamas leaders had called for a "massive uprising" in response to nonexistent "racist plans that target Al-Aqsa." Seizing on this manufactured crisis, Hamas leaders urged Palestinian young people to come to Al-Aqsa en masse and confront Israeli police, hailing their "heroism" when they did.

Finally, this past weekend, Hamas television aired a speech by a senior Hamas official in which he called on Palestinians in Jerusalem to behead Jews in the city streets. "Buy a knife, sharpen it, put it there, and just cut off [their heads]," he said, gesturing to his neck. "It costs just five shekels. With those five shekels, you will humiliate the Jewish state."

Senior Hamas official Fathi Hammad tells Jerusalem residents to behead Jews:

“With your hand, cut their artery from here. A knife costs five shekels. Buy a knife, sharpen it, put it there, and just cut off [their heads]. It costs just five shekels.”pic.twitter.com/oEqh4PsHio

— Alex Salvi (@alexsalvinews) May 12, 2021

All of this is well-documented; there are countless photos, videos, and social media posts showing it all. Moreover, Hamas is not shy about its intentions, openly calling for the elimination of Israel and the murder of Jews. It does so, seemingly, at every opportunity, and these messages of hate are broadcast widely—and made tangible in the form of attacks targeting Israeli civilians.

And yet.

In recent days, as Israeli families have huddled in bomb shelters under a constant rain of deadly rockets, some have sought to point a finger, incredibly, at Israel.

"Israeli air strikes targeting civilians in Gaza is an act of terrorism," tweeted Representative Ilhan Omar of Minnesota.

Israeli air strikes killing civilians in Gaza is an act of terrorism.

Palestinians deserve protection.

Unlike Israel, missile defense programs, such as Iron Dome, don’t exist to protect Palestinian civilians.

It’s unconscionable to not condemn these attacks on the week of Eid.

— Ilhan Omar (@IlhanMN) May 10, 2021

"Personally, I cannot watch that footage and hear those numbers and see a fair fight," said Daily Show host Trevor Noah after discussing Palestinian and Israeli casualties in a special segment dedicated to the escalation. "Like, set aside motives and intentions and just look at technology, technology alone. Israel has one of the most advanced militaries in the world."

Several others—including senior Western officials—have called for "restraint" from "both sides," suggesting that Israel and Hamas bear equal responsibility for the situation.

While these statements differ in outrageousness and repugnance, they all display a basic inversion of morality.

Israel and Hamas are not equal. One is a liberal democracy that, however imperfect, is governed by the rule of law and conducts itself according to exacting ethical standards. The other is a terrorist organization that has murdered and maimed thousands in accordance with a charter that openly calls for genocide. One goes to unprecedented lengths not only to defend its own civilians but to protect those on the other side, as well, sacrificing military objectives to minimize casualties. The other will stop at nothing to kill as many civilians as possible, often sacrificing its own civilians in the process. One views any civilian casualties as a terrible operational failure. The other views civilian deaths—on either side—as a great operational success. One is fundamentally moral; the other utterly amoral.

So, no, Congresswoman. You seem to be confused. The terrorists are the ones intentionally firing rockets at civilians, not those targeting them to prevent further attacks.

And no, Trevor. You can't "set aside motives and intentions." Motives and intentions matter, particularly when one side is motivated by hatred and intends to commit murder.

And no, Western pontificators. The fireman and the arsonist are not equally to blame for the fire. If there were no rocket attacks, there would be no military response....



In other words, ... don't start nothing, won't be nothing.



But you start something and the Israelis will fuck you up. Aloha Snackbar!

[Ernst]

That's like saying "I know you are but what am I?"

Okay then.

What's the solution? An American administration that openly supports antisemitism and condemns freedom of speech? Or one that condemns antisemitism, but supports freedom of speech?

You tell me.
other leftist members here feel free to chime in.

You can support freedom of speech and condemn Anti-Semitism at the same time.

[Hughinn]

You can support freedom of speech and condemn Anti-Semitism at the same time.

Exactly Ernst. That was precisely my point

[wango]

The song is profane, not politically correct, yet was intended as sarcasm.

How much more f’n time, energy, money and American lives can we waste on that place? A question that I ponder every day personally, but that’s just me.

[The Deadlifting Dog]

If someone disagrees with Biden's handling of immigration, it doesn't make them anti-American.
Just as... if someone disagrees with Israel's handling of Palestinians, it doesn't make them anti-semitic.

I personally think Israel has mishandled the Palestinian people for far too long.
That doesn't mean I support Hamas' actions either.

Also...
If someone sees a bunch of white boys marching with tiki torches while chanting "Jews will not replace us" and calls these people "very fine people", it doesn't mean they are defending free speech.
If someone blames the California wildfires on "Jewish space lasers", it doesn't mean they are defending free speech.
If someone retweets people chanting "White power", it doesn't mean they are defending free speech.


Side note:
"From Beirut to Jerusalem" is a great book on the subject of the middle east.

[almostgone]

I've not read that book yet, but it is on my list!
A brief dissertation on some of the strategies and controversy during early 2010 to mid decade. It's a free read!

https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_briefs/RB9975.html

[Beetlegeuse]

Al Jazeera, which didn't seem to give a fig that Hamas rockets were killing Israeli citizens (and hapless Palestinians along with them), now is caterwauling that the death, destruction, mayhem, and pestilence resulting from Israel's reprisal.

Hunt it up for yourself if you feel the need, I'm not going to contribute to their traffic.

[Hughinn]

If someone disagrees with Biden's handling of immigration, it doesn't make them anti-American.
Just as... if someone disagrees with Israel's handling of Palestinians, it doesn't make them anti-semitic.

I personally think Israel has mishandled the Palestinian people for far too long.
That doesn't mean I support Hamas' actions either.

Also...
If someone sees a bunch of white boys marching with tiki torches while chanting "Jews will not replace us" and calls these people "very fine people", it doesn't mean they are defending free speech.
If someone blames the California wildfires on "Jewish space lasers", it doesn't mean they are defending free speech.
If someone retweets people chanting "White power", it doesn't mean they are defending free speech.


Side note:
"From Beirut to Jerusalem" is a great book on the subject of the middle east.

It's going to be interesting to see how the democrat party handles the isreal- Palestine issue.

They've got skin on both sides so to speak.

And mobs of BLM and ANTIFA activists burning, beating, harassing , looting and murdering is not "peaceful protesters exercising freedom of speech" either now is it?



Try to think past DNC propaganda talking points if you can. Look at shit objectively if you can. I know you're afraid of the boogeyman, and indoctrinated to a very high degree, But the sun is shining right now, amd boogeymen only come out in the dark.

https://leadstories.com/hoax-alert/2...ne-people.html
"Stop spreading lies and propaganda please" - your words sir.

[Beetlegeuse]

Israel has shared intelligence with the US showing that both the Associated Press and Al-Jazeera were fully aware that they were sharing an office building with Hamas, a building that the IDF for strategic reasons was compelled to destroy.

[Hughinn]

Israel has shared intelligence with the US showing that both the Associated Press and Al-Jazeera were fully aware that they were sharing an office building with Hamas, a building that the IDF for strategic reasons was compelled to destroy.

Haha.

The AP amd other DNC leftist propaganda organizations have taken a turn when it comes to the Israelis plight in the middle east.

It was bound to happen. You've got the democrat party in America chasing bizarre notions of "white supremacist" boogeyman behind every corner. Formally deeming it's own citizens as it's biggest threat, All the while antisemitism and anti-white bigotry has firmly gripped the party themselves. The limp wristed passive foreign policy of the Biden administration combined with it's priorities of waging war against it's own citizens instead of hostile foreign regimes has naturally emboldened those regime's and caused anti Semitic organizations and leaders to emerge both in America and abroad.

In the spirit of Sunday, Matthew 15:14 Disregard them! They are blind guides. If a blind man leads a blind man, both will fall into a pit.”

The democrat party and its liberal lemmings. In full self destruct mode. Paralyzed and confused while isreal is left to fend for itself.

[The Deadlifting Dog]

The AP amd other DNC leftist propaganda organizations

Are you saying that the AP is a leftist propaganda organization?
If yes...
Can you name any unbiased news organizations?

[Hughinn]

Are you saying that the AP is a leftist propaganda organization?
If yes...
Can you name any unbiased news organizations?

Surely you jest (although your own clear and obvious bias may not allow you to see it) that the AP is not biased.

https://www.allsides.com/blog/update...-ap-fact-check
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/associated-press/
https://nypost.com/2020/10/22/the-as...ut-of-control/

Sir, no reasonable person would claim the associated press to be unbiased.

Thats like calling CNN or MSDNC "fair and balanced news" . Clearly, they are not.

I am not claiming the AP is biased sir. I'm stating it as demonstrable fact.

[The Deadlifting Dog]

Surely you jest (although your own clear and obvious bias may not allow you to see it) that the AP is not biased.

https://www.allsides.com/blog/update...-ap-fact-check
https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/associated-press/
https://nypost.com/2020/10/22/the-as...ut-of-control/

Sir, no reasonable person would claim the associated press to be unbiased.

Thats like calling CNN or MSDNC "fair and balanced news" . Clearly, they are not.

I am not claiming the AP is biased sir. I'm stating it as demonstrable fact.

The 1st link gives it a center rating.
The 2nd link you provided says it is “least biased” and gives it the highest factual rating.
Seems like a very very high score to me.
The 3rd link gives it a horrible rating but it is the NY Post which is owned by the Murdochs. You know... Fox News.



Anyway...
What news organization do you recommend that is unbiased?

[Hughinn]

The 1st link gives it a center rating.
The 2nd link you provided says it is “least biased” and gives it the highest factual rating.
Seems like a very very high score to me.

Anyway...
What news organization do you recommend that is unbiased?

No sir. Both links state it as bias left. Degree being the only matter up for interpretation.

But, you ask a loaded question. In the sense that I don't think any mainstream news organization is without bias.

When it comes to mainstream media, a solid 70-80% leans toward corporate, big government leftist bias. This is demonstratable fact. Whatever is left, arguably leads right. The associated press being a large multinational corporation, obviously has its interest. It's bias reflects this.

Among the smaller, let's say, underground and non-conventional news sources, like independent stations, talk radio and independent podcasts, I'd say 70-80% arguably lean right. In observation, right wing news has been forced underground since the obama administration.

In other words, big money corporate news in America is controlled largely by the democrat party. The party controlled by billionaires and large multinational corporate interests. The leftovers are split between factions of the right. There's really only one single mainstream news organization that leans right. And despite the bullying and boycotting of sponsors they stay to the right. But they stand alone.

If you're asking me to help with news, I can't help you. I think all sources need to be researched and examined against logic to interpret what exactly is fact and what is spin.

[The Deadlifting Dog]

AllSides determined Center is still the best bias rating for AP News
and..
Overall, we rate the Associated Press borderline Left-Center Biased due to left-leaning editorializing, but Least Biased on the whole due to balanced story selection. We also rate them Very-High for factual reporting due to proper sourcing and a clean fact check record.

Attachment 181062

I personally don't think "center" and "borderline Left-Center" and "Least Biased" is propaganda.



Side note: Hughinn... I understand if you want to call CNN or MSNBC left wing propaganda... but AP news is pretty dry.

[Beetlegeuse]

Video of a motorcade of Arabs driving through London earlier today, broadcasting on a public address system, "KILL THE JEWS, RAPE THEIR DAUGHTERS, FUCK THEIR MOTHERS ...."

[Ernst]

I get most of my news from Reuters. That's my go-to. They're pretty in the middle. Every now and then you see a little bit of bias leak in, but they're among the best IMO.

This whole Israel thing is an absolute shitshow. Plenty of blame to go around.

As per usual most people just want peace and a better life for their children than they had and here come a bunch of assholes to fuck it all up.

A little perspective:

https://youtu.be/_Jj8vne0ca0

[Hughinn]

AllSides determined Center is still the best bias rating for AP News
and..
Overall, we rate the Associated Press borderline Left-Center Biased due to left-leaning editorializing, but Least Biased on the whole due to balanced story selection. We also rate them Very-High for factual reporting due to proper sourcing and a clean fact check record.

Attachment 181062

I personally don't think "center" and "borderline Left-Center" and "Least Biased" is propaganda.



Side note: Hughinn... I understand if you want to call CNN or MSNBC left wing propaganda... but AP news is pretty dry.

If you want to call "left leaning editorializing" and "left bias" neutral than go right ahead sir.

That fact stands, the AP has its bias, just like everywhere else. The only question is one of degree.

As you pointed out, the AP may have it's bias, but largely isn't just pure DNC propaganda, like CNN or MSDNC. I'll certainly concede that point.

But bias, is bias.

The real question to me, is how the democrat party navigates the Israel/Palestine issue. Considering the left has spent the better part of the last 3 decades preaching that "colonialism" and "capitalism" are evil "white supremacist" ideologies and therefore are to be defeated at all costs, how will they justify support of Israel, which from a certain perspective undeniably resembles colonialism and apartheid states. They taught all the college people for 20 years that such concepts are bad. The left supported open genocide and displacement of the Boer people in south Africa under similar pretexts, And it doesn't take an intelligent person to see certain parallels.

The democrat party is now trapped by it's own hypocrisy and ideology.

This could get interesting.

[Beetlegeuse]

...A little perspective:

https://youtu.be/_Jj8vne0ca0

That isn't perspective, that's emotional twaddle from a bunch of youngsters who have no perspective of how the world's tacit approval of 20th Century efforts to exterminate the Jews or the bad behavior of the Arabs who refuse to accept the existence of a Jewish state led them to this predicament. You might win an Emmy award broadcasting that on a segment of Oprah but what you won't win with those "ideas" is peace in the Middle East.

Israel is attacking Gaza in retaliation for Hamas rocket attacks on Israel. Hamas' charter as much as codifies its intentions to destroy Israel and exterminate the Jews. In 2017, Hamas claimed they diluted that somewhat, removing the plan to exterminate the Jews but still intending to destroy Israel. As if the one could be accomplished without the other.


It would be suicidally stupid of the Israelis to even make an effort to compromise with Hamas or any of their ilk until they clearly demonstrate that they genuinely and sincerely accept the right of Israel (and with it, the Jews) to exist. They asked -- nay, begged -- for what's coming their way now. It would be in both their best interests if Israel were to deliver unto them such a shellacking that they see the error of their ways and lay off fucking with the Jews for a spell.

[wango]

Heck, they don’t like the Jews. It’s their right. It seems they all can’t get along and kill each other as well. It seems it’s what they do out there, kill folks they don’t agree with, and sometimes with God’s blessing.

Then you plop down a nation of folks they don’t like right in the middle of them all and are surprised by the rhetoric? And of course they are backed by the USA (who incidentally doesn’t really totally love & embrace the Jews all that much ourselves) and then you wonder why it gets even more f’d up.

I’m just waiting for the Steven Spielberg movie. He’s got to move away from the Nazis as the bad guys, however they did make for damn fine cinema.

[wango]

Video of a motorcade of Arabs driving through London earlier today, broadcasting on a public address system, "KILL THE JEWS, RAPE THEIR DAUGHTERS, FUCK THEIR MOTHERS ...."

Those are nothing but words. Strong and offensive, but just words. Is it really all that different than having Neo-Nazis parade through Jewish neighborhoods in the USA. Or have Nazi party gatherings in Madison Square Garden prior to WW2? I believe the Nazi’s did far worse than what the motorcade suggested.

[Ernst]

Beetle, I think you make a mistake in lumping all Palestinians with Hamas. While they may enjoy a lot of popular support on that side of the fence they are not the voice of a whole people. Does Biden speak for you?

That video was people who actually grew up there and live there. I never claimed it was anything but perspective, and one that you and I clearly lack as Americans. I don't have a solution and ultimately they represent the ones that have to find a balance they can live with.

My ex-gf was a Jewish Zionist to the core and I got to hear some strong opinions come out of her mouth, and hear about a lot of stuff that simply doesn't land on our news radar here. Palestinian rocket attacks were apparently as normal as rain in some places, and they were all too happy to target civilan areas. They'd literally fire them off from their own schools and hospitals to invite reprisal!

Still, I admit I feel a certain empathy towards the Palestinian cause as someone of an Irish background. I was raised that the IRA were righteous heroes, contrary to what some others may think.

[Hughinn]

Beetle, I think you make a mistake in lumping all Palestinians with Hamas. While they may enjoy a lot of popular support on that side of the fence they are not the voice of a whole people. Does Biden speak for you?

That video was people who actually grew up there and live there. I never claimed it was anything but perspective, and one that you and I clearly lack as Americans. I don't have a solution and ultimately they represent the ones that have to find a balance they can live with.

My ex-gf was a Jewish Zionist to the core and I got to hear some strong opinions come out of her mouth, and hear about a lot of stuff that simply doesn't land on our news radar here. Palestinian rocket attacks were apparently as normal as rain in some places, and they were all too happy to target civilan areas. They'd literally fire them off from their own schools and hospitals to invite reprisal!

Still, I admit I feel a certain empathy towards the Palestinian cause as someone of an Irish background. I was raised that the IRA were righteous heroes, contrary to what some others may think.

That's a great comment there Ernst.

And I mean in the sense that it invites open and honest dialogue without being insulting or making accusations.

You're right.

There are always different perspectives. I remember as a kid watching news concerning the IRA and the Contras in Columbia. Back then, news used to tell both sides before being bought totally by the DNC.

I remember asking what the difference was between a "rebel terrorist" and the "freedom fighters" they mentioned when talking about the IRA.

He told me the only real difference is which side your on, and what you believe. Hero or villain works the same way.