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Gents;
Hello to all. Im 47 and have cycled before. Now Im considering a very low T cycle (50 - 100 mg PW). My last BW results showed T levels in the 600's, would like to bump that to the 1000's for a while. I feel worn out in the gym/lagging. Want to improve on lifts n recovery as well. Planning on running this for about 6 months and coming off. Split shots into 2 to avoid higher than necessary E.
Any of you guys running something like this? Comments.
Thank you all.
Anyone?
I think you need to include some additional details so people can understand better. You mentioned taking 50 or 100 mg post work out. But how many times do you work out in a week?
Wow, that's your answer????? Yeah, I will wait for some one else to reply.
Good luck! Without posting more details no one is going to know what the hell you are asking. People take things, like Arimidex to lower their E, they don't split their shots up. Your comment about splitting shots is as stupid as saying I am going to pour my beer in two glasses to avoid getting so drunk. I was trying to offer a reason why no one is wasting their time with your goofy post. How is splitting your shots going to do anything? Are you going to split them from day to day? Or are you going to take them back to back in different spots. Both have different implications; duh. Good luck trying to find someone else willing to waste their time. I hope they do, because you need all the help you can get. You asked for help and I felt bad that no one bothered to respond to your confusing post. I thought if you offered some additional details at least more knowledgeable people could chime in without having to ask you the obvious information that would be needed to help you. No one knows how much you work out so to say that you want to take some shots between this or that on an unknown number of days, and split the shots up to avoid increasing E is so confusing that no one could possibly steer you in the right direction. Just read the stickies on this site, learn something then try again. I also am in my 40's and don't look too bad for my age so you might not want to be such a jerk to those who have already overcome the challenges you are obviously facing in life. Bye
I just noticed more than 220 people read your post and no one, other than me, bothered to explain why no one answered. Hmmmm. Yeah, keep waiting for the response you want with the information you provided.
Since you didn't like my first answer; let me be more direct and try to answer your exact question instead of offering help on how to get the advice you are looking for.
No, I doubt anyone on this site, out of tens of thousands of people, are doing what you asked. I doubt anyone is just giving themselves injections post workout (however often that might be), for a six month period; while splitting up shots (whatever that means) to control E. No one. Not one person. Not even the noobs that have no idea what they are doing.
LoL! Try reposting your question and, this time, *try* and be *more* vague! I doubt you could do it....! It's evident that you haven't done much research on this "6 month cycle" you are considering!
"Very Low T" for what? Why did you arbitrarily decide on 50-100mg? What science are you following with that?
"...Last BW showed T levels in the 600's" when? When was your last BW? Exactly when?
Why a 6 month cycle? Why not 2? or 10? What lead you to that?
And why, oh WHY, would you "split" the shots? You still get X mg of whatever....
Seriously...read more, post less.
Wow, guess doctors don't know shit then.... you guys are the shit here!!!! Yeah why would docs have PROOf that splitting your shots do not cause a spike on E, but again what do they know right. I mean, why would they even bother to have medical proof on this lol they should just come here to learn!
That's it , I am gonna fire by doc/not talk to Dr. Scally anymore or others and just gonna listen to this group of extreme gurus!!!!!! Found my heaven!!!!!!!!! WOO HOO!!!!!
Let's start over. There actually are gurus on this site, unfortunately none of them chimed in because I was unable to draw any information out of you offering them the information that would have been needed to offer you any advice. First of all, of course you should listen to whatever your doctor tells you. But, your post was misleading as most TRT doctors are not going to put anyone on a six month program and then stop your TRT therapy. If you go on TRT, you are going to most likely do it for the rest of your life; providing financial burdens do not get in the way.
Secondly, because you said you wanted to take injections PW, it insinuated this was your plan and not advised by a doctor. Certainly your doctor did not prescribe a plan based on your workout routine or a six month then quit plan. This is because you dictate how often you workout. A doctor is going to prescribe a medication based on a very specific amount, that is measured in a very specific way; based on an amount not a workout routine.
When you stated you wanted to split the shots up, that was even more misleading because you claimed you wanted to take shots PW. So how could you split shots up, PW, if working out a few times a week? This does not make sense. Of course at TRT level injections, E is really not a big concern for most people. But, a doctor could use this as an excuse to get you to come in twice as often if they were performing the injections to double up on what they will charge you for visits. This was not something I thought of before, because you said you wanted to take an injection PW, which would have nothing to do with injections based on a doctors advice. Based on what you stated, you would be giving yourself injections whenever you wanted; which is why I simply asked how often you work out.
There is no reason to argue here. People come here who want to learn something and who may not have a doctor advising them on a routine. I would always suggest, as would many, to of course do whatever your doc says. But if you want advice you at least have to offer enough factors in your situation to offer advice, which is what was lacking in your first post. You can include your doc in your argument but it does not change the fact that more information would be needed for anyone on this site to offer their opinion. There is no reason to insult anyone here based on what we said, because you did not give anyone enough information for anyone to say anything to you. It was my mistake to even offer you an explanation of why no one has written to you, because you obviously have it all figured out and do not want to offer any more info; which is fine. I just hope you understand that all that was asked of you was some more information and instead of giving it you insulted my inquiry to more information; which of course seemed offensive.
Haha..the *same* doctors who said for years that Steroids do NOT enhance sports performance or build big muscle? *Those* doctors? Who now prescribe it to every old yuppie with health insurance and a limp noodle? I don't know about you but...if I were looking for LEGIT info about juice, the very LAST place I would go is to a doctor! Unless he was a user himself....But hey....good luck either way!
And BTW: What is this "proof" your doctor has about splitting the doses preventing E spikes? Would really like to see that....
Oki-Des, sumimasen. Let's take this 1 step at a time, shall we?...
1. I never stated I was on TRT, not I would be on TRT, etc. But, you are able to talk to doctors (at least I am) and get their professional point of view. If you have never try this, I suggest you do.
2. I never stated taking a shot PW!, please re-read. But it has been proven that a Testosterone shot itself has the same effect if taken in the am or pm (not talking about work out period, etc.) but the time you take the shot. Plenty of people who do not work out take Testosterone as replacement therapy. Their shots are on the AM or could be PM. Testosterone knows no clock...
3. Your statement "E is really not a big concern for most people"??? Really? Estrogen on the high or low should be a concern for anyone, taking T or not. Estrogen plays a very important part on men's health (sexual and other wise). Why do you think a doc will prescribe Adex, etc? Just for the heck of it? No due to conversion of T. Do this, lower your E levels way beyond what it should be and let us know how your sex life is. Or get your E 2 times higher than it should be and let me know how you feel....
4. Testosterone shots if split (example: Bro science #1 "You should use 500mg per week otherwise you're wasting your time".... yeah my ass) do not spike estrogen conversion, proven fact. Trailboss; Do some research on your own like I did bro, you're falling behind.....
As well, you could take a shot of anything before or after workout. Reason why people chose to take Tren before bet time, Winstrol 3 times per day, etc. Same results...
5. Last but not least. Anyone (working out or not) could take Test, etc with the aim of increasing their Total T levels. Although I understand the kind of Forum this is, I would believe the question still remains well.... a question.
But let's say for the sake of making a statement that I would work out 4 days a week. Would there be a difference or such a BIG difference if I worked out 6 times a week? I say NO. A person can have shitty eating habits, poor workout ethics and look/feel like shit no matter what they take. It is all relevant.
I do not doubt the level of knowledge of people here nor do I want to get into a battle of this and that. But I must wonder why there is such a requirement of what it could be irrelevant questions to have some feedback. The basic question was, Has any over 40 y/o done a light cycle.
Trailboss: I suggest you contact Dr. Scally or Dr. Justin Saya at Defy Medical, Dave Palumbo, Toney Freeman or even Nelson Vergel. Or pick up books/reports by some of these people. Perhaps you can expand your knowledge base.
Thank you gentleman. I will now go play else where.
Domo arigato, Oki sama.
Hey bro: You are the one with the vague, dumb questions and the blind assertions indicating you know very little about what you intend to do. I did not mean to offend, nor did anyone else, I'm sure, but your first post in the thread was a bit "I don't know what I am doing but this is how I am going to go about it, waddya think? Anybody else doing stupid shit like this too?" And you continue being silly, after Oki tried to assist you, with the "Wow: you guys didn't blindly validate my unfounded intentions so I'm going to insult you and name drop a couple of random doctors who may, or may not, understand what it is you guys do on this website!! So there"!!
Methinks *you* are the one with the problem here. Your initial query was ill thought out and poorly conceived.
As far as your last post, and your "advice" to me: from what you have posted it is obvious you have never heard the adage "Physician: heal thyself". My motto is: Read more-Post less. There is a reason for this. You cannot learn while you are posting stupid shit.
I have been a visitor here, reading constantly, since '03. I read this and many other sites. I never *stop* reading bro! And I have had several successful cycles based specifically on the info I get here. I don't need to go to the aforementioned doctors because they are not going to advocate or support the kind of things we do here. Very few doctors ever would. My doctor monitors my blood and offers suggestions, but he ends up asking more questions then answering! And I refer him here.
I can tell you that there is no medical evidence anywhere that your E levels would be reduced by splitting your shots, that I can find. YOU are the one who asserts that "Testosterone shots, if split, do NOT spike E conversion"and "That is a proven fact"...Please post a link to the proof of this. Real medical/scientic evidence. Preferrably Peer Reviewed.
Even if there were, I doubt deviating beyond the standard steroid cycling methodology, which has proven itself time and again over the past 4-5 decades, is going to make a difference in the outcome for a novice. Besides, you take very specific, medically and scientifically PROVEN meds to control the E! But hey: Why don't you do a Before & After photo layout, keep a diary of your dosages and workouts and come back at the end of your pincushion cycle and let us know? Good luck with the abscesses.
Read more-Post less and put your money where your mouth is....all I'm sayin!
A side note, 50mg to 100mg pw (per week i assume? ) is a trt dose. It will only shut your natural production down and put you right back to your natural levels or maybe a little higher.
A better plan would be something like 300mg a week. That would give you levels more in the 1300 range probably.
You have missed your calling, politics, there you just keep asking questions till you get the one answer you like! Good LuckQuote:
Originally Posted by Caribeman
that's what im thinking...50 to 100mg a week is less than a standard trt protocol so im not shure you will even notice a difference...good luck and understand that people are taking the time to help you for free here so maybe get off your pedestal and realize there are more knowledgable/experienced people here than yourself...just saying...Quote:
Originally Posted by hawk14dl
Yay, I was finally able to pull some information out of you. When you stated in your first post (PW) I made the mistake of asking how many times per week you workout; because you discussed such a tiny amount of testosterone I thought you were talking (pre or post workout); not per week! If you would have simply answered my questions we could have gotten past all this without the frustration.
Of course E spikes are important when taking testosterone, but everyone is different and will notice gyno symptoms at different levels. I personally can handle 1000mg of testosterone per week without seeing gyno symptoms but have an AI on hand just in case. If you take 50mg per week, you will be taking a little more over the course of your six month plan than I do every freaking week on cycle. So, no, I would hope that your body could handle that without having too many problems with E. Sorry if that concerns you, but to me it is a freaking joke. Therefore splitting up 50mg per week into two shots to avoid spikes in E when using enthanate seems so ridiculous it never entered my mind.
As to your point 4, as I stated I thought you were talking about doing some real test and thought you meant pre or post workout, not per week. I simply misunderstood and asked for more information. I never said it matters when you take a test shot. What I said was it matters how much you take. Obviously per week answers that question and as you now know if you meant pre or post workout it would be determinant on how often you work out. Honestly if you are taking that tiny amount per week I dont think any of this matters; at all. You can take it once per week, split it up, dont take it at all or double up. But none of it is really going to do shit in my opinion.
Of course you are right on the next tidbit of information you offered. If you take a tiny amount of steroids it will not matter whatsoever if you work out four times per week, six times per week or not at all in my opinion. Its like taking a tiny sip of beer and wondering how messed up you will get. In many peoples honest opinion, not at all.
If you ask the question has anyone tried trt, then yes, many of us have. But trt is not considered a cycle. It is an ongoing process that does not stop and should not stop. If you have low t, you need t. If you need t a doctor will prescribe it to raise it a little bit. But, when I am not on what you call a lite cycle, I am on a heavy cycle, so I dont think this is what you meant. I use tiny amounts as trt therapy. Then I use a lot for cycles.
Go to other beginners posts and you will see that we always ask a ton of questions to offer the best advice possible. We ask age, height, weight, body fat percentage, lifting experience, food intake just for starters. We didnt even get that far.
We are not a bad group here and sometimes get off on the wrong foot. But we obviously are trying to offer some advice even if it does not seem that way. We can get a bit testy here. : )
Great post and excellent follow ups on the info plus helpful advice. I hope he finds his answers and get's his T up!
This post was a year old man. . No need to bump it
wtf I read all that just to get to this. LolQuote:
Originally Posted by hawk14dl
Me too. Don't feel bad hahaha
Yikes! I thought this post was gone forever! It was another one of my many novels I have written on this site in frustrated anger that led to nothing and meant nothing to everyone. Lol.
Been there, done that ^^^^^ your not the Lone Ranger OKI, LOL..... The real question here is I wonder if the OP followed thru on his game plan? and how long it took to realize his T levels were probably LOWER than his Natty...
If he would of simply answered your immediate questions, probably would of saved him alot of "live and learn"!
I can't believe you had any response after your attitude to real people, real users, that know wtf they are doing. You basically said no one on this site knows wtf they are talking about and Dr.s know EVERYTHING. Well Dr.s call it "practice" for a reason. I am guessing you haven't been back on here is the past 4 years.