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Thread: Tips for Clomid use.

  1. #1
    manveer1's Avatar
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    Tips for Clomid use.

    Hi All, so i have just been prescribed Clomid by a TRT specialist.

    - Is there any supplements I should take with it to optimise or help my body during clomid use? Or any I should avoid?

    -Is it better to take during the morning/night/empty stomach?

    Thanks

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    Is this for fertility, hrt, or (as this forum would indicate) pct?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cylon357 View Post
    Is this for fertility, hrt, or (as this forum would indicate) pct?
    PCT mate. Well my last cycle was a few years ago but I have low testosterone levels and low fsh and lh. So the specialist has prescribed clomid.

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    So, what are the doses and protocol the doc is recommending? 50mg per day every day or what? Are they including HCG or HMG by chance?

    As far as dosing morning or night, I haven't found that to matter to me. But keep in mind that I'm using clomid as HRT so it's a long term thing. 25mg every other day works well for me in this regard.

    You might layer in some herbals, I think we discussed on another thread.

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    case of tissue..

    clomid makes me cry watching war movies.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cylon357 View Post
    So, what are the doses and protocol the doc is recommending? 50mg per day every day or what? Are they including HCG or HMG by chance?

    As far as dosing morning or night, I haven't found that to matter to me. But keep in mind that I'm using clomid as HRT so it's a long term thing. 25mg every other day works well for me in this regard.

    You might layer in some herbals, I think we discussed on another thread.
    25mg every other day. Just clomid nothing else.

    Cool, thanks for your help . Can Calcium D glucorate in large doses bring down my Oestrogen?

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    Quote Originally Posted by manveer1 View Post
    25mg every other day. Just clomid nothing else.

    Cool, thanks for your help . Can Calcium D glucorate in large doses bring down my Oestrogen?
    25mg every other day is basically what I run as HRT. PCT doses are usually higher and thus can bring about more of the sides typically associated with Clomid use. How long does the doc want you to run these doses?

    RE: Calcium Glucorate, it does seem like Dr John Crisler had that in his list of OTC sups for controlling E, but I don't remember for sure. I'm pretty sure he had Zinc Orotate as one of the OTC drugs he liked, but I'm not 100% sure about that anymore, either. You might be able to google Crisler's protocols to confirm.

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    Duplicate
    Last edited by cylon357; 07-08-2020 at 07:12 AM. Reason: Duplicate posting.

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    He hasnt actually stated how long yet, he said he will keep monitoring the results. How you finding long term use of clomid?

    https://www.peaktestosterone.com/for...?topic=11826.0 - here he insists on using Calcium Glucorate to lower Oestrogen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by manveer1 View Post
    He hasnt actually stated how long yet, he said he will keep monitoring the results. How you finding long term use of clomid?

    https://www.peaktestosterone.com/for...?topic=11826.0 - here he insists on using Calcium Glucorate to lower Oestrogen.
    I've been using Clomid as HRT for a little over a year and a half. It has done well for me for HRT. It keeps my numbers up, but it won't get you to cycle levels or anything. Still, 50mg 3 x per week got me over range with Total T, Free T, DHT, and LH. Estrogen was under control.

    All that said, I'm likely to go on Test for TRT in the next year or so. While I do find it handy to maintain natural production, going to a suppressive compound like Test opens up options to use other suppressive compounds to address other issues, like high SHBG etc.
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    Quote Originally Posted by manveer1 View Post
    PCT mate. Well my last cycle was a few years ago but I have low testosterone levels and low fsh and lh. So the specialist has prescribed clomid.
    so after a few years after cycle you plan PCT ��
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    Vitamin E is suppose to increase the effectiveness of Clomid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gjoney_b View Post
    so after a few years after cycle you plan PCT ��
    No sir.

    He is running clomid as TRT.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Deadlifting Dog View Post
    No sir.

    He is running clomid as TRT.
    I'm not sure that is the case. It sounds like some odd PCT

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    Quote Originally Posted by cylon357 View Post
    I'm not sure that is the case. It sounds like some odd PCT
    I stand corrected.
    Just saw post#3 above.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Deadlifting Dog View Post
    I stand corrected.
    Just saw post#3 above.
    Oh, I agree this is definitely a confusing case. The stated purpose is PCT but the doses are HRT.

    OP, is the doc really looking to try to restart the HPTA here? There are much better protocols for that, but the doc may be thinking start with the minimum viable dose.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cylon357 View Post
    Oh, I agree this is definitely a confusing case. The stated purpose is PCT but the doses are HRT.

    OP, is the doc really looking to try to restart the HPTA here? There are much better protocols for that, but the doc may be thinking start with the minimum viable dose.
    Sorry guys for the confusion.
    Basically he is a really well known trt and erectile dysfunction specialist.. so i showed him my stats and asked what shall I do as I want to have kids next year. So we ruled out trt. I did do PCT a few years ago.

    He recommended to start clomid and we monitor over the upcoming few months. So im not sure how long his plan is i will ask him next time. He said 70% of his patients will see increases in testosterone and lh from taking clomid, but the other 30% it didn't work in.

    I have bought some Arginine and Citruline .. can I have this with Cialis (i will be taking 5mg a day) ? I've read conflicting reports due to the nitric oxide.
    Now also taking Ashwagandha, zma, vitamin d, and just bought Maca, Korean Red Ginseng and Tribulus.

    And thank you so much for the replies really appreciate it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by manveer1 View Post
    Sorry guys for the confusion.
    Basically he is a really well known trt and erectile dysfunction specialist.. so i showed him my stats and asked what shall I do as I want to have kids next year. So we ruled out trt. I did do PCT a few years ago.

    He recommended to start clomid and we monitor over the upcoming few months. So im not sure how long his plan is i will ask him next time. He said 70% of his patients will see increases in testosterone and lh from taking clomid, but the other 30% it didn't work in.

    I have bought some Arginine and Citruline .. can I have this with Cialis (i will be taking 5mg a day) ? I've read conflicting reports due to the nitric oxide.
    Now also taking Ashwagandha, zma, vitamin d, and just bought Maca, Korean Red Ginseng and Tribulus.

    And thank you so much for the replies really appreciate it.
    It sounds like the doc is thinking HRT without calling it that. That's probably not a bad call in this case, given that I think you were interested in preserving fertility.

    Personally, I like those particular herbals / vitamins. I've run arginine with cialis 5mg per day without issue. To be honest, I'm not a fan of trib, I prefer DAA or longjack instead. I've also found that ginseng can wire me up a little, so if I take it, and I usually don't, it will be in the morning.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cylon357 View Post
    It sounds like the doc is thinking HRT without calling it that. That's probably not a bad call in this case, given that I think you were interested in preserving fertility.

    Personally, I like those particular herbals / vitamins. I've run arginine with cialis 5mg per day without issue. To be honest, I'm not a fan of trib, I prefer DAA or longjack instead. I've also found that ginseng can wire me up a little, so if I take it, and I usually don't, it will be in the morning.
    Cool, thanks. What do you mean by wired? We have that phrase here in England but think it means something else.

    Other poster mentioned Vitamin E with Clomid.

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    Also, what do you think of this (the max performer one looks the best as it has high doses of the key ingredients we have mentioned) ? Would save money buying them separately, seems to have great reviews too.

    https://www.maleenhancementwolf.com/pills/

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    Quote Originally Posted by manveer1 View Post
    Cool, thanks. What do you mean by wired? We have that phrase here in England but think it means something else.

    Other poster mentioned Vitamin E with Clomid.
    Ha, didn't think about cultural differences! By 'wired', I mean sped up or a little hyperactive. Like with caffeine.

    I've heard the vitamin E thing before, but don't have any data on it myself.

    Quote Originally Posted by manveer1 View Post
    Also, what do you think of this (the max performer one looks the best as it has high doses of the key ingredients we have mentioned) ? Would save money buying them separately, seems to have great reviews too.

    https://www.maleenhancementwolf.com/pills/
    Those are likely overpriced vs buying the most effective ingredients themselves.
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    So after 1 month of Clomiphene 25mg every other day my results are as follows:

    Below are the results I received today, which I did after exactly 1 month of Clomiphene:
    Lutenising Hormone (LH) = 6 iu/L (4 weeks ago this was 3iu/L)
    Serum oestradiol level = 224pmol/L (4 weeks ago this was 165 pmol/L)
    Serum Testosterone = 21.4nmol/L (4 weeks ago this was 11.5nmol/L)

    Erections are a lot worse and weaker (however I am finally getting morning erections once or twice a week which I have not experienced in a very long time). I have emailed my specialist and will see what he recommends, im guessing some Arimidex .

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    DON'T FEED THE TROLL....

    on 6/11th you said....
    "However I always wake up with rock solid hard ons..."
    https://forums.steroid.com/hormone-r...ease-help.html
    post#1

    now you say...
    "however I am finally getting morning erections once or twice a week which I have not experienced in a very long time"
    post#22 in this thread

    I have no advice for you.

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    Please can you delete your reply it does not help me or this topic, I have just explained this to you on the other post "Chill brother thank you for the help so far and yes thats right I did edit but I am not a Troll I will explain - basically my specialist and I worked out that i was only getting morning erections when i was sleeping with my partner. He told me to monitor this and he was proved correct. Sleeping next to her (she is damn hot lol) I get them every morning as she tends to jump on me ha (but due to my issues we cant have sex). However when I am not sleeping with her I never get morning erections and have not for a long time (until now 4 weeks into Clomiphene I am starting to get them when sleeping on my own once or twice a week on average)."

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    Quote Originally Posted by manveer1 View Post
    So after 1 month of Clomiphene 25mg every other day my results are as follows:

    Below are the results I received today, which I did after exactly 1 month of Clomiphene:
    Lutenising Hormone (LH) = 6 iu/L (4 weeks ago this was 3iu/L)
    Serum oestradiol level = 224pmol/L (4 weeks ago this was 165 pmol/L)
    Serum Testosterone = 21.4nmol/L (4 weeks ago this was 11.5nmol/L)

    Erections are a lot worse and weaker (however I am finally getting morning erections once or twice a week which I have not experienced in a very long time). I have emailed my specialist and will see what he recommends, im guessing some Arimidex.
    These numbers definitely show improvement!

    Whats the range on the estrogen? I might think about giving the clomid a little more time to work without adding another pharmaceutical.

    I would recommend boron at 10mg per day to reduce SHBG and thus increase dht and t.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cylon357 View Post
    These numbers definitely show improvement!

    Whats the range on the estrogen? I might think about giving the clomid a little more time to work without adding another pharmaceutical.

    I would recommend boron at 10mg per day to reduce SHBG and thus increase dht and t.

    Thank you mate, your advice and feedback has helped me a lot so far (and your supplements advice which I have taken up!). I guess my mind (feeling more emotional) and body were always going to get worse before they get better, but atleast the Clomiphene is working.

    Sex Hormone Binding Glob. (SHB)
    14.8 nmol/L (14.0-48.0) - However this was before Clomid, my specialist didn't ask for it to be checked for this first blood test. So if we are looking at my SHBG reading from 4 weeks ago then Boron would not be necessary right?

    Serum oestradiol level range = 50.00 - 218.oopmol/L so mine is higher than the range, however that range is a NHS lab interpretation of normal (I know it can vary from country to country etc).

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    My gut says that SHBG may have increased as well. I would probably add the boron anyhow to see if it helps bring down the E just a bit. Boron is not a harsh pharmaceutical so it should do way less harm, if any, than something like adex. Worst case, it does nothing for you, best case, it increases dht and free t and brings e down a hair.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cylon357 View Post
    My gut says that SHBG may have increased as well. I would probably add the boron anyhow to see if it helps bring down the E just a bit. Boron is not a harsh pharmaceutical so it should do way less harm, if any, than something like adex. Worst case, it does nothing for you, best case, it increases dht and free t and brings e down a hair.
    I will try and get him to add SHBG next time then. I will buy some Boron, thanks. I saw on other posts you bought some diindolylmethane dim? How was it for you? Is there a dosage you would recommend for me here?

    My specialist has seen my bloods and wants to start me on Arimidex so I will go for it and see what happens. Annoying as my cholestrol is already high, so I will look at taking some natural Cholestrol supplements as well (already taking Garlic tabs).

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    Quote Originally Posted by manveer1 View Post
    I will try and get him to add SHBG next time then. I will buy some Boron, thanks. I saw on other posts you bought some diindolylmethane dim? How was it for you? Is there a dosage you would recommend for me here?

    My specialist has seen my bloods and wants to start me on Arimidex so I will go for it and see what happens. Annoying as my cholestrol is already high, so I will look at taking some natural Cholestrol supplements as well (already taking Garlic tabs).
    I take 100mg of DIIM daily, but I'm not 100% sure it does a lot for me on my current protocol. Still, it is supposed to be good for a few points off of E so it might be worth taking in your case. I have seen conflicting studies on DIIM, one of which implied that at higher doses (don't remember EXACTLY but 500mg / day comes to mind) it can actually increase E. That said, IIRC, lower doses are generally considered safe and effective. I just can't say concretely how effective.

    The arimidex .... You are just SLIGHTLY over range on E and keep in mind that your T DOUBLED in a short time. I would try to manage the E with Boron and DIIM before hopping on another pharmaceutical, especially if you aren't having any high E negative sides.

    To be honest, I'm not one to say 'never ever take an AI' because if you need it, you need it. I do however prefer to dial in my treatment to get to the point where I need fewer drugs rather than more. In my case, that has meant tweaking my clomid dose until I get the best combination of numbers (this is ongoing).

    For instance, I would rather have a lower Total T with a higher Free T with my DHT in the upper 75% or so of range, with E somewhere in that same range, too. I like how I feel with those numbers and it avoids the use of secondary drugs (like finasteride and arimidex) that can bring more negative side effects. A lot of people (me included, when I first started HRT) think 'Low E, High T' but as we learn more, we come to realize it is all about balance.

    And of course, all this is in the context of TRT. Cycling would be an entirely different story.

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    Cylon is giving sound advice, as usual. I would be VERY cautious of adding Arimidex so soon. It is a very strong AI and can dramatically reduce E2 causing more issues and negative sides based on my experience and others on this forum. Im sure you know this already but Estrogen is extremely important for overall health, sexual function and well being. What dose is he prescribing? I crashed my E2 on cycle administering Arimidex at only 0.5mg 2x a week. It was horrible and took over a month to subside. Most doctors, including my own, don't want to see high estradiol and largely aren't as knowledgeable on HRT as some of these forum members, so when they see high E they throw AI at it, but truth of the matter is many men report feeling better with elevated E2. Use caution, make sure he is testing blood work for everything you want to see, and I hope you get to feeling better soon! Cheers
    Last edited by ShredBundy; 09-26-2020 at 11:57 AM. Reason: Wrong dose of ai quoted

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    Hi both..thanks so much for the advice again, im implementing a lot of it.

    - DIM doesn't sound ideal does it, I've read on some other sites as well that it may have the opposite effects. Will leave it i think. I've got the Boron now cheers.
    The sides i am getting from the high E are absolutely awful, honestly they are horrendous. So today he told me he wants me on 0.25mg a day 3 times a week then will check bloods next month. I really feel like I need it, however seems like I need to urge on side of caution with it. How did you get your E back up?
    Was your E as high as mine/did you also get really bad sides from E being at my levels?

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    Quote Originally Posted by manveer1 View Post
    Hi both..thanks so much for the advice again, im implementing a lot of it.

    - DIM doesn't sound ideal does it, I've read on some other sites as well that it may have the opposite effects. Will leave it i think. I've got the Boron now cheers.
    The sides i am getting from the high E are absolutely awful, honestly they are horrendous. So today he told me he wants me on 0.25mg a day 3 times a week then will check bloods next month. I really feel like I need it, however seems like I need to urge on side of caution with it. How did you get your E back up?
    Was your E as high as mine/did you also get really bad sides from E being at my levels?
    .25 mg 3 x week is going to bring it down, maybe too far. That said, you could try it and see how you feel as it is all about how YOU feel. If you feel bad with E lower, then cut back. If you feel good, ride it out till next bloods and re-evaluate.

    My E is higher end of range, and the few times it got slightly over range (like 34 with top of range being 32), I really didn't notice any negatives. A bit of puffiness but I'm fat atm so that is to be expected. But, in general, running your E slightly over range (with your T at or over top of range) for a little while shouldn't cause any problems for most people. Still, it's good your doc is looking to get you dialed in. That part just takes a little while.

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    Oh and to answer the question about how long it takes E to get back up, once you cut out the AI it wont take long, just a few weeks to maybe a month at your Clomid dose.

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    Yeah 2-4 weeks is about right for E to climb again (for me while completely off AI). I remember feeling better emotionally and physically after the 2 weeks mark. Also something extremely important I want to mention that hasn't been discussed as much on the forum is that the Arimidex dehydrated the crap out of me. This is why some bb use it for contest prep. I had joint pain, my strength and gains stalled completely, and it was awful (BUT I had a six pack lol). I was constantly cramping and I partially tore a pec AND hamstring at the gym which was very scary and ill never forget the sound it made. This was the first time I ever tore something in my 20+ years of training and first time using Arimidex. Thankfully they were minor with no bruising or deformity in symmetry. A year later my injuries are just now seeing improvement, the hamstring is a lingering issue but I can still squat and press heavy.
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShredBundy View Post
    Yeah 2-4 weeks is about right for E to climb again (for me while completely off AI). I remember feeling better emotionally and physically after the 2 weeks mark. Also something extremely important I want to mention that hasn't been discussed as much on the forum is that the Arimidex dehydrated the crap out of me. This is why some bb use it for contest prep. I had joint pain, my strength and gains stalled completely, and it was awful (BUT I had a six pack lol). I was constantly cramping and I partially tore a pec AND hamstring at the gym which was very scary and ill never forget the sound it made. This was the first time I ever tore something in my 20+ years of training and first time using Arimidex. Thankfully they were minor with no bruising or deformity in symmetry. A year later my injuries are just now seeing improvement, the hamstring is a lingering issue but I can still squat and press heavy.
    Holy enlightenment, @ShredBundy, you may have answered a question I've had in my head for a few weeks. I have a torn meniscus that was hurting bad for a while. I used some peps to help with it, cut back my routine some, etc, but about 3 weeks ago I kicked the training into high gear. BUT, I haven't had significant knee pain, even after squat day.

    And it has been about 6 weeks ago that I took my last AI. I had either forgotten or never knew or just didn't put 2 and 2 together on the joint pain possibility from the arimidex. No adex, less pain. Adex, more pain. At least that seems to be the case for me as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cylon357 View Post
    Holy enlightenment, @ShredBundy, you may have answered a question I've had in my head for a few weeks. I have a torn meniscus that was hurting bad for a while. I used some peps to help with it, cut back my routine some, etc, but about 3 weeks ago I kicked the training into high gear. BUT, I haven't had significant knee pain, even after squat day.

    And it has been about 6 weeks ago that I took my last AI. I had either forgotten or never knew or just didn't put 2 and 2 together on the joint pain possibility from the arimidex. No adex, less pain. Adex, more pain. At least that seems to be the case for me as well.

    Hey sorry for the delay, been busy w moving to a new home. Not to hijack the OP thread but I’m glad to hear you and hopefully others will find that info useful! I too didn’t realize that the AI was causing it until a few weeks later when looking into sides of Arimidex and another forum member mentioned it as well. I appreciated Gearheaded for his hatred for AI. I firmly believe they are sketchy, and to be taken and administered seriously, or preferably, not at all! Joint pain is the worst, I have nagging forearm tendon issues as well and the adex always exaggerated it!

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