Liquid RALOX not working?

**Machdiesel** · 08-21-2014, 07:38 PM

A while ago I tried to lower my AI Dose on TRT and got some sore nips. I immediately went back to my previous dose and ordere some tamoxifen , within a week all was good. Tried Lowering it ahgain(less then before) and same thing happened. I decided to use arr RALOX and after a week I still feel some tingling/tenderness. Curious is anyone has used arr RALOX before, experimences? Mine is neon green and needs to be shaken. Gonna give it a few more days then try some Wockhardt tamoxifen I have

**austinite** · 08-21-2014, 07:57 PM

Raloxifene is not a cure for sore nipples. It is useful in the event you develop gynecomastia . If gynecomastia is present, it takes many weeks to reverse the development. A mere week is not going to do much of anything. In cases of gynecomastia, it can show improvements after 4 weeks, but may need to be taken for several months. It's the best method, however.

Keep in mind, sore nipples, tenderness, tingling and/or puffiness are not a diagnoses for gynecomastia. Many different hormones can cause these symptoms when imbalanced. If you do not have a hardened lump, you do not have gynecomastia. Consider blood work if you're attempting to control E2.

**Machdiesel** · 08-21-2014, 08:24 PM

As far as E2 goes I know my current protocol puts my E2 at 15-20, and it's US pharma so no concerns there. It was my understanding a serm will help alleviate symptoms of high estrogen such as breast tenderness. This is why gyno prone peopel take nolva during a cycle. Is this wrong? So for gYno reversal yes it wil take weeks/months, but shouldn't it help with the symptoms also? I will admit I'm using gyno very loosely. My main symptom is breat tenderness, tingling. I decided to hop on RALOX as a precaution. I've been back in my protocol that I know keeps me in range for over 10 days now, along with RALOX. In the past when I used tamoxifen the symptoms went away much faster

**Docd187123** · 08-21-2014, 08:33 PM

Originally Posted by Machdiesel

As far as E2 goes I know my current protocol puts my E2 at 15-20, and it's US pharma so no concerns there. It was my understanding a serm will help alleviate symptoms of high estrogen such as breast tenderness. This is why gyno prone peopel take nolva during a cycle. Is this wrong? So for gYno reversal yes it wil take weeks/months, but shouldn't it help with the symptoms also? I will admit I'm using gyno very loosely. My main symptom is breat tenderness, tingling. I decided to hop on RALOX as a precaution. I've been back in my protocol that I know keeps me in range for over 10 days now, along with RALOX. In the past when I used tamoxifen the symptoms went away much faster

What Austin is saying is that feast tenderness can be one symptom of gyno BUT breast tenderness doesn't mean you have gyno or gyno is beginning. There's hundreds of causes of breast tenderness besides gyno.

**austinite** · 08-21-2014, 08:36 PM

Yes, that is wrong. It's a wide-spread and very old (mis)understanding that sore nipples, tenderness, etc... is alleviated by SERM therapy. This would only work if you have or are developing gynecomastia and gynecomastia development is the cause. However, as mentioned earlier, there are far more possibilities than E2, several of which are more likely than E2, most of which are more likely than gynecomastia.

If you're confident that your protocol places you at 15-20, then I'm not sure why you would seek SERM therapy for high estrogen. Either your protocol does not in fact place you in range, or your E2 is not high, and you're looking in the wrong place.

There are many factors that could impact your protocol; including but not limited to body fat and diet changes. Furthermore, it's advised to obtain blood results periodically, regardless of your experience level with controlling E2. Cycling steroids is very different from TRT, where you'd maintain a protocol for years. Especially when cycling, blood work should be a staple. At least it is for me.

My advice, Mach, would be to get blood work. Speculating will not resolve anything unless you're a lucky person. Either way, there aren't many drugs that are impactful in a mere week. If you choose to continue with SERM therapy, then I would give it plenty more time. If you choose to know what your body is asking for, get blood work.

Best of luck to you.

**Machdiesel** · 08-21-2014, 08:59 PM

Ok let me explain. Got BW a couple weeks ago. E2 was at 16, previous readings at same protocol were 19 and 20. Decided to try and lower my AI to get E2 25-30. My Ai was exemestane at 12.5 mg a day. After a week I started getting itchy nips And tingling. Took 25mg of exemestane then back to 12.5 ED. Decided to add ralox at 60mg a day because I had it and thought it would be a good precaution. 10 days later still feel some discomfort. Earlier in my trt while still dialing in the same ting happened but unused tamox. Within days I was feeling better. My ralox has been at room temp for a few months, is this ok?

**Machdiesel** · 08-21-2014, 09:02 PM

Also interesting about serms not helping symptoms. Why do people reccomend tamox on cycle when you start feeling itchy nips at 40mg a day, then down to 20mg once symptoms are gone. I assumed this meant tamox alleviated symptoms

**austinite** · 08-21-2014, 09:07 PM

Originally Posted by Machdiesel

Also interesting about serms not helping symptoms. Why do people reccomend tamox on cycle when you start feeling itchy nips at 40mg a day, then down to 20mg once symptoms are gone. I assumed this meant tamox alleviated symptoms

Because they haven't done enough research and are merely repeating what they've heard. There's nothing wrong with Tamox on cycle, but there's something wrong with taking something on a wild guess. Tamox can work for some folks and it can work fairly quickly. If E2 in breast tissue is the cause, it will help, if not, it wont.

Ralox should be stored in a dry cool place. I don't know if yours lost any potency, but it's possible.

For the record, I have used Ralox from AR-R and it worked well in comparison with Evista.

Do I have Gynecomastia? If you're asking this question, read this thread.

**Machdiesel** · 08-21-2014, 09:16 PM

Thanks. So you think because my E2 was only elevated for a week , and I'm back on my protocol and know 100% e2 is in check it should just work itself out?tendeness and tingling will subside ?

**austinite** · 08-21-2014, 09:22 PM

Originally Posted by Machdiesel

Thanks. So you think because my E2 was only elevated for a week , and I'm back on my protocol and know 100% e2 is in check it should just work itself out?tendeness and tingling will subside ?

Yes. Most likely.

**ghosttt360** · 09-13-2014, 11:41 AM

Hey Austinite great stuff man.

In PCT have 2 weeks left, off a Test Only Cycle 16 weeks. Did not run an AI as I never in 15 years had a flare up. This time I did, the moment I did I jumped on Aromasin , and bridged it for a few weeks and cut off the cycle right into PCT.

Now Did 40/40/20/20/20/20 for Nolva PCT. No Clomid. I feel pretty recovered already strength up, libido good.

Waiting on bloods.

But I still have a small lump on the right side that went from hard to soft in these 3 weeks on just the Nolva. It's almost gone. I have Ralox on hand too.

My question is:

1) Finish the PCT with the nolva and just cruise at 20mg for a few months?

OR

2) Finish the PCT and immediately switch Tamox with Ralox? And if so, do I need to do the 60mg's of Ralox or just go right into the cruise 30mg dosage?

I am confident both will work since Tamox is working as we speak. Not sure if I even need to change it if it isn't broken. All are RUI.

Thanks in advance, reading these forums you are a huge help to a lot of us.