UNoffical "How to Cut" thread and sample diet...

[gbrice75]

You can definitely cut while on cycle. I mean, a test only cycle is typically run to add mass, but if you cut the test can only help - you should maintain muscle mass while reducing bodyfat if nothing else.

[WEF2F]

You can definitely cut while on cycle. I mean, a test only cycle is typically run to add mass, but if you cut the test can only help - you should maintain muscle mass while reducing bodyfat if nothing else.

Thanks man, What do you think about the 6 weeks at 200 and then doing 10 at 450?

[sleepy33]

Great post, thanks for the info

[Daveman]

This thread is from 2003 and could use some serious updating...alot of the information is kinda bunk in my opinion...

Especially the fasted cardio stuff in my opinion.



While it will definitely still work I can't look at it and say everything is 100%

[jpal]

great post thanks

[Oregon]

Killer post! I'm getting ready to start cutting and this post is full of great info.

[Dufresne]

Curious, Why does cottage cheese give you a soft look?

[choker28]

why would you train on a empty stomach? carbohydrate metabolism provides a compound called oxaloacetate, which must combine with Acetyl Coenzyme A in the Krebs cycle to fully break down fat. so restricting carbs will not result in greater fat loss. If anything, it will inhibit fat metabolism and likely make your body burn muscle
If that is the point of training on a empty stomach ?

[choker28]

agreed 100%

[CommunityProperty]

I prefer my oats raw and uncooked, still a half cup or is this not recommended?

[Big hammer]

I prefer my oats raw and uncooked, still a half cup or is this not recommended?

So you just eat them dry?

[scottrotton]

Does balsamic vinegar have any adverse effects to this diet?

[Not Long Enough]

The links that are high lighted through your 'how to cut' thread, are they recommendations on what to take?

[Silenttone91]

I find This extremely useful. the structure of this diet is much better than the one i had planned originally for my cutdown.

[Ishallnocheatmyself]

uhhh say you've been workin out off an on for a few years and want to get into it very seriously. I have high bf but have a ton of muscle to gain left would i use this or what i mclose to the example size

[Bencher]

Great post Rambo

-Stay Dench!

[musclecarmayham]

Question:

The plan shows exercise mid-day with cardio in the morning. Any reasonable way for a 8-5 desk-jockey who hits the gym hard every night to actually cut down? I'm around 15% BF currently and want to loose my stubborn gut. I go for about 6 to sometimes 8 meals a day following a similar setup to this. But I can really only put in cardio at night; am I majorly screwing myself here for running at a time when the metabolism is slowing? The prospect of waking up at 4 am really doesn't excite me.

[jel2190]

The separation of Carbs and Fats- This is a hotly debated issue, but again, in my opinion, an important aspect nonetheless. Remember that it is often when you eat items and with what you eat them that is more important than what you are eating. A mouthful, I know, but stay with me. Remember that when you take in certain carbs, you can spike your insulin levels. If you are taking in fats when your insulin has been spiked, you are allowing the basic laws of physiology to act out, and you allow for a higher propensity for fat storage. Separation is key. The sample diet will give a good example of how to separate them

When you say, "spike your insulin levels" what if you can control this as I am a diabetic. I have always read where my insulin can help in my goals but still to this day do not know how to do that. I am an EXCELLENT diabetic. A1C 6.0 diet really good, so if my food combination is good I technically will not have any spike because I control the amount of insulin going into my body. Thanks for the post, great information..

[greekgodsarenothing]

Good deal. But having sweetner causes tumours and other bad shit. Eat it plain with cinnamon and nutmeg. Bodybuilding eat so unhealthy

[Metalject]

Q: Should I do a keto diet?
A: Unless you are morbidly obese, or would like to drag your wilted muscles behind you, stay away from keto. Again, that’s my opinion. You can see my previous posts for my anti-keto ranting.

I know this is an old thread but since it's a sticky I thought I'd add my thoughts. The OP says a lot of good things, but his Q&A about keto I'd tend to disagree with. I'd say most here understand the concept of keto diets, high protein, moderate fat and very low carb...low carb as in 50g per day and all from trace sources. That alone is enough to scare most people away, but it can actually be a very enjoyable diet. It normally takes 3-4 days to adjust and some women I've found it takes about a week. During this adjustment time, your energy levels will be low and you might have a headache. Then again, I've worked with plenty of people who coasted right in no problem. If you don't adjust to the diet during the initial phase, odds are strong your total daily fat intake is too low. Fat is an energy source, you no longer have the carbs to pull an ample amount of energy from and the fats need to be there. I've talked with plenty of guys who told me they were doing keto and hated it and then when asked what they were eating they'll state massive amounts of protein and normally around 20-40g of fats per day...and if they're lucky they're getting 10-15g of carbs. No wonder they hate the diet.

If you can find the right balance with your fats, I believe no diet on earth is as apt for preserving lean muscle tissue in a caloric deficit. Keep in mind, you always hear food is the most anabolic thing you can put in your body, and that's a pretty true statement, but fats are the most anabolic nutrient of all. The average 200lb man will need around 90-100+ fats in his diet per day minimum for a keto plan to work right. With the 50g of carbs you'll receive from trace sources, this will mostly come from nuts and peanut butter, this will give you enough energy for your daily weight training session. No, you won't be able to train for hours and you're not going to be able to do 27 sets with multiple drops sets like a wild animal. You'll have about an hour to attack a body part. You really need to know how to train properly in order to maximize this window. You need to have a firm understanding of full contractions in the targeted muscle and follow the stimulate don't annihilate rule. This doesn't mean you train like a wuss, and it doesn't mean you can't include any drop sets, but your first priority is to stimulate the muscle as efficiently as possible through strict controlled moves. Put more focus into your training. On days like chest, this might mean you have to go a little lighter so that you keep constant tension on the pecs the entire time. If you find your delts and triceps are taking on a lot of the work your wasting energy...save that energy for when you train shoulders and tri's.

Another key component to keto are the steroids you're using. Simply put, this diet can be used by a natural bodybuilder but naturals will often find other plans to meet their needs a little more. I will make an exception with women. I've seen a lot of figure and bikini competitors in my day who were natural and had a lot of success with keto...remember, they're not looking for full round muscle bellies like a guy.

As for the full factor, yes, a keto diet is going to flatten you out. Once you get several weeks into the diet, say half way in a 16wk contest plan, you're going to hit a bit of an awkward stage. This is where a lot of guys freakout and start adding in carbs like crazy. HUGE MISTAKE! When you've been on a keto diet for a decent amount of time, your carb sensitivity will be unlike anything its ever been before. Start gorging on these carbs at this point and time and you'll ruin the work you've put in so far. The key is patience, give it time. As the wks continue to progress, you'll begin to notice you don't look near as flat any more. When the body becomes accustomed to the high fats, it will start to have a positive impact on your fullness. Again, it won't be like you have 100's of grams of carbs in your body, but it will be noticeable. At this point in time, you are burning nothing but body fat. Your body has no glycogen to pull from abundantly, it has become accustomed to using fats for its energy source and as the fuel runs low this forces the body to look nowhere else but to body fat.

Then you get to the final stages, odds are you're leaner and harder than someone who's been following a traditional carb cycle. He's still a bit fuller than you but you're catching up. Then we reach a carb loading phase. You will not need as much time in a carb loading phase or nearly as much carbs as the other guy. Remember, you've forced your body to become carb sensitive and for every 100g of carbs the other guy needs, you'll probably only need 10g or so. A sample carb up for a competitor (assuming all things are perfect) would start with the week out depletion.

Sat: protein and vegetables
Sun: protein and vegetables
Mon: protein and vegetables
Tue: protein and vegetables
Wed: protein and fats
Thu: protein, fats and carbs
Fri: protein, fats and carbs
Sat: pre judging meal - small meal of protein and carbs
Sat: lunch - burger, fries and coffee
Sat: pre night show - small meal of protein and carbs

Best way to plan carb meals, pick one food from sweet, white or red potatoes, oatmeal or rice. Choose one and add it in to all six of your meals Thursday and Friday. If you pick one and feel that carb isn't responding like you'd hoped, switch to another. This makes controlling the carb load very easy. No, it's not exciting but it's the most efficient way to correct possible mistakes.

Cheat Meals: a very important part of a keto diet. Generally, you'll want to follow your set keto diet for a good two weeks without eating any cheat meals. Let your body fall into the keto state and settle there, let your body know this is the new normal. At this two week mark, if you've cheated start over again. If you didn't cheat start planning for cheat meals. 1 cheat meal per week is enough for most. It's best to place it on the same day every week, most like a weekend night and it should be your last meal of the day. If its a mid-day meal, most will fail to get in the rest of their meals. What to eat during the cheat meal? Eat whatever you want, no restrictions other than staying away from alcohol. Pizza, pasta, steakhouse, ice cream, doughnuts, etc. whatever you want. Don't eat until you can't move put pack it in and enjoy it. As your diet progresses and your metabolism really starts firing, you'll find when you have these cheat meals it's not uncommon to find yourself sweating through your shirt and your heart racing 100mph. Your metabolism is now on fire! It will pass within the hour, and when you're at the really lean state and this happens, once that hour passes you'll feel like you haven't eaten in years, you'll be starving! Sorry, you don't get to eat anymore. Grab a glass of water and call it a night...a diet soda is also an option as the carbonation can cure hunger. Another solid option is mixing some fiber powder in water and downing that to get the expanded feel in in your stomach. I should also say this...I have had a few competitors that needed two cheat meals per week. They'd have their standard dirty cheat on the weekend and if needed a clean cheat mid-week. A clean cheat would be something like a steak and a few potatoes and maybe a little bread. Sushi is also a great option, but stick to the cleaner sushi's...rice and fish and a lithe seaweed is fine too. For many keto guys, the final cheat meals will eventually turn into all clean cheat meals.

If you want to be the leanest, hardest guy on stage, keto is the way to go IMO. Sure, you might not be as full but you'll still be pretty full but being in shape is what wins on the amateur level. If you're not competing, you'll still have a very sleek hard physique. And again, on the fullness, there are things you can do with hormones at the end like adding in Anadrol for a couple of weeks that will maximize your carb up and give you a much fuller look.

Keto Notes:

1. Understand this diet takes a lot of patience. You must be willing to get through the awkward stages.

2. Understand there will be times when you really flatten out, but remember, that doesn't mater. What matters is the end result.

3. Keto diets have less room for cheating than probably any diet on earth. You cheat, you throw yourself out of keto and are back to stage one. Granted, the big weekly cheat meal will throw you out of keto, but only for about 24hrs...those carbs will be burned alive and gone in no time, but you should have a great day at the gym the next day. It's always a good idea to plan your post cheat meal workout on one of your body parts that you need to give extra attention to or that you need more umpnh in your butt to push through.

4. Keto diets require you drink more water than you normally would. With the absence of many carbs, it's easy to get dehydrated. Carbs carry a large amount of water with them that you're no longer getting.

5. Keto diets require you to purposely eat more sodium than you would otherwise. A keto diet is not going to be rush in foods that have a lot of sodium...you'll need to salt your eggs and use things like soy sauce on your meats. Some even have to take sodium pills. If you don't, your electrolytes will get way out of balance. This too can lead to dehydration, but low sodium is a prime condition for severe muscle cramps. No one is saying you need massive amounts of sodium, but you'll need to purposely apply the daily amounts your body needs.

6. Keto diets often require a good fiber supplement. It's easy to get bloated and constipated on this diet.

7. Keto diets are awesome...you just have to understand them and work them properly.

[DRdee]

This post is a little old but I am sure it is relevant. Going to give it a shot and tweak as necessary.

[BBJT200]

i think a good rule of thumb is: if there's more than 3-4 ingredients, and it comes in a package, you can probably find something healthier.

Absolute truth.

[Xtrakt0r]

Just read this, great post!

Just wanted to add, for the question regarding the Oatmeal being plain and boring, I just add my 30g scoop of vanilla protein powder in it. It tastes so good that I cant wait to have my second hit for the day!

[michael02]

Ok, I have a question, this diet is pretty much perfect for me, but, the cardio debate. Is it ideal to do ur cardio in the morning before ur first meal, still have ur workout in the afternoon, or should cardio be limited to so many times a week? There are so many opinions its hard to find the right one???

[Squats33]

Thanks dude!

[Squats33]

Whats an alternative to oatmeal... I absolutely hate oatmeal

[Peter32]

Starting my first cut cycle to drop bf% I'm 84kg @ aroun 17-18% bf atm (5'7 -33yr old), the aas I'm on for this cycle is 600mg per wk test e (1-8wks) and stanzanol/Winstrol .5ml every 2nd day (1-8 wks) -3rd overall cycle. I've read the original post that was extremely helpful I think my only issue is the fruit factor I do eat a lot of fruit and would find that the hardest to drop so what are the fruits I can an cant have (or should an shouldn't) I also do Kickboxing 2-3 times a week where I regularly get upto 180-190bpm quiet often so how would I counteract this in regards to catabolism or would the test e / stanzanol stop or limit catabolism and what calorie range should I work at aiming for ? Cheers in advance for advice and help given

[liftbig]

Thanks for the info....awesome post!

[bodyspa]

What is the best brand for R-ALA/ALA?

[twinz_13]

Nice post bro!!

[image613]

"ALA/R-ALA- Gets my supplement of the day award. R-ALA is effective in lowering the spike of insulin when certain carbs are consumed. I could give you a dissertation on the stereoentisomeric properties of the R, but all you need to know is that it has been found to shuttle carbohydrates away from adipose and into myocytes. Translation: Away from fat cells, into muscle cells. It’s a supplement, however, not a miracle worker. It’s not a crutch, and won’t do anything about fat intake. ALA and R-ALA can also aid in the expedition of the ketogenic state. Remember that if you buy R-ALA that you supplement it with Biotin. Glucorell-R is prepackaged with it. If you can afford it, go for it. As far as dosage, with the R, you are looking at 1-2 pills of Glucorell R for each 30-40grams of carb intake."

i really dont understand what thes supplements are.. "r-ala" "r"

please help me understand or where to look for more info thank you for your time

[Armdaddy]

Regarding Carbs you stated: " In a strict cutting diet the majority of your carbs should come in the form of PWO nutrition, and the remainder in breakfast."
Yet your sample died has carbs in pretty much all the meals. I was hoping you could clear that up for me?

Also, could you go into a little more detail about how the carbs/insulin spikes should be separate from the fat intake?

[joegunner]

great thread.

[Dwill36907]

I really liked that Keto post. Completely cleared that form of dieting up for me. Just find that to be an incredibly difficult diet to actually stay on lol.

[chefjmo]

simple. thanks for making it simple1

[Patryn]

It would have been nice if even the basic math in the OP was accurate. That's not 130g carbs.

[kawika]

Excellent read. Oddly enough it almost mirrors the diet I am currently on.

[e_gardner139]

what type of veggies would u recommend ?

[oldguy2895]

Can someone give me a sample diet. Im 45 6ft1 220. Body fat is 20%. Have gear to start first cycle ever which will be test only. Through other member I now know I need to lower my bf%. Before I start. Backround is .....I was 300 lbs. Lost it by doing 1000 cals a day and 6days a week in the gym. Strength trained every day and 45min of cardio. Lost 80lbs and 8 inches of my waist. Members said the diet I was on is awful. So I turn to the members on this thread for help. I thought it was simple........lol. burn more cals than you take in=fat loss. Didnt know how wrong I was . Would realky like a sample diet that will help me drop bf% the right and healthy way. Thank you for the help

[oldguy2895]

Can someone give me a sample diet. Im 45 6ft1 220. Body fat is 20%. Have gear to start first cycle ever which will be test only. Through other member I now know I need to lower my bf%. Before I start. Backround is .....I was 300 lbs. Lost it by doing 1000 cals a day and 6days a week in the gym. Strength trained every day and 45min of cardio. Lost 80lbs and 8 inches of my waist. Members said the diet I was on is awful. So I turn to the members on this thread for help. I thought it was simple........lol. burn more cals than you take in=fat loss. Didnt know how wrong I was . Would realky like a sample diet that will help me drop bf% the right and healthy way. Thank you for the help