Lets build this section up!

***system admin*** · 12-17-2008, 09:53 PM

SARMS are the drug of the future... lets talk about it

Bc

**Phate** · 12-17-2008, 09:54 PM

Originally Posted by system admin

SARMS are the drug of the future... lets talk about it

Bc

admin you are the man

MuscleScience, it's all you bro, show me the studies, lol

**Tesla** · 12-17-2008, 10:00 PM

The Wikipedia entry for SARM....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selecti...ptor_modulator

**AnimalGear** · 12-17-2008, 10:05 PM

hey MuscleScience, can you give some more insight into when these drugs would be released for medical use, and therefore underground use?

**Charger527** · 12-17-2008, 10:56 PM

cool lots if good info to come

**MuscleScience** · 12-17-2008, 11:15 PM

Originally Posted by AnimalGear

hey MuscleScience, can you give some more insight into when these drugs would be released for medical use, and therefore underground use?

I can in the next few weeks, I have a lot on my plate right now. These links will get us all started. I had the first one emailed to me by a buddy of mine a few years ago.

http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/en/wo.jsp?...DISPLAY=STATUS
http://www.drugs.com/clinical_trials...bone-2222.html

These are the best link I have on me at the moment and should be full text for everyone to enjoy.
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/art...?artid=2072879
http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/con...urcetype=HWCIT
http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/con...urcetype=HWCIT
Review article on SARMS from 2005
http://molinterv.aspetjournals.org/c...urcetype=HWCIT

Hirewire.org Data base on SARMS:
http://highwire.stanford.edu/cgi/sea..._element=false

**Amorphic** · 12-17-2008, 11:19 PM

i will see what i can dig up. i know of a lot of other treads on the net about these but i dont want to steal anyones info

**auslifta** · 12-17-2008, 11:28 PM

i want to trial some

**Phate** · 12-17-2008, 11:29 PM

Originally Posted by auslifta

i want to trial some

don't we all, lol

**jnewton86** · 12-17-2008, 11:29 PM

looking forward to researchin this

**nyjetsfan86** · 12-17-2008, 11:47 PM

this would be outragous i would love to get my hands on something like that after reading into it a little bit granted i would have to do tons of research on it but it sounds amazing cant wait to hear more about it

**hyperlite32** · 12-18-2008, 12:40 AM

bumo for more info. also is S-4 available to the public? is ia in the "research" category?

Great section to start admin!!!!!!!!!!!

**peachfuzz** · 12-18-2008, 01:41 AM

on another board one of the sponsors was carrying S-4. from the feedback people were giving they were comparing the gains to a mild prop cycle. nothing drastic at all. almost everyone was experiencing blurred vision as well that went away upon cessation of use.

My personal belief is that these drugs are not the future of bodybuilding. id like to believe they are but im just not convinced. Myostatin inhibitors have been in the works for a while now as well and look very promising.

**Dobie-BOY** · 12-18-2008, 01:46 AM

Sweet!!! A new section!!!

**Reed** · 12-18-2008, 02:12 AM

Little input: seems to being run and tested at around 50mg-300mg. Orally it has a half life for about 4 hours.

As Georgia Peach stated only sides have been vision issues (people's eyes having trouble adjusting going from light to dark, yellow tint??). Pulsing might help this with a 5/2 on protocol. Just an opinion

People are running it for 4 weeks or in there PCT's to help maintain strength and fullness

Results seem to be comparable to a cycle of prop. Good pumps, increased aggression and libido, helps with joints also

Studies: http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/art...?artid=2039881

Interesting parts:
Effects of S-4 on plasma levels of LH and FSH

The agonist activity of S-4 in the pituitary was also characterized by measuring the plasma concentrations of LH and FSH. Plasma LH and FSH concentrations increased dramatically in O** animals 20 wk after orchidectomy (Fig. 8). At the 3 mg/kg dose, S-4 significantly decreased LH level to 9.4 ng/ml, which was still higher than the control level in intact animals. With the higher dose of 10 mg/kg, S-4 restored LH to intact levels, similar to what was observed in DHT-treated O** animals.

^^ Weird the higher you go the more it keeps your LH to intact levels?? Hmm

In addition, DHT (3 mg/kg) fully returned FSH level in O** animals to the intact control level (Fig. 8B). S-4 significantly decreased FSH level in O** animals in a dose-dependent manner. However, even at the higher dose (10 mg/ kg), S-4 did not fully return the FSH level to the intact control level.

IGF-I is a growth factor that increases bone turnover rate by stimulating osteoblast proliferation and osteoclast differentiation, with a net increase in bone accumulation (48). The effects of IGF-I in bone are more related to the local concentration of IGF-I, which is related to both circulating IGF-I and tissue-specific expression of IGF-I and IGF binding proteins (48). Although circulating IGF-I is mainly released from liver (49), which may not reflect the tissue concentration of IGF-I in the bone, changes in plasma IGF-1 could still reflect the effects of S-4 and DHT on IGF-I and IGF binding protein expression. S-4 treatment tends to increase IGF-I expression in O** animals (Fig. 4A), whereas DHT significantly decreased IGF-I expression in these animals, providing another example for possible differential regulation of gene expression by S-4 and DHT, which could contribute to the tissue-specific pharmacological activities of these AR ligands.

Besides the strong anabolic activities in muscle and bone, S-4 also demonstrated agonist activity in the pituitary by suppressing LH and FSH levels in O** animals (Fig. 8). Furthermore, the LH level was suppressed more significantly than was the FSH level, suggesting that the observed decreases in LH and FSH levels were mediated through negative feedback effects of S-4 in both hypothalamus and pituitary. Partial repression of circulating LH and FSH levels to values similar to that observed in intact rats corroborates our prior findings in shorter-term (i.e. 9 d) studies that S-4 has minimal effects on endogenous testosterone production.

In summary, S-4 treatment greatly improved the muscle strength and body composition and restored or prevented lost bone in O** rats. The anabolic effects of S-4 in muscle, bone, and body composition were very similar to those observed in DHT-treated O** animals. However, at an equi-potent dose that induced similar changes in bone and muscle (3 mg/kg dose), S-4 only restored prostate weight to less than 10% of the level observed in DHT-treated animals, showing minimum stimulation of the prostate, compared with DHT treatment. Significant differences between S-4 and DHT treatments in regulating fat mass change and bone turnover rates in O** animals were also observed, suggesting that possible differences in the mechanism of action of S-4 and DHT could exist, even though they both work through AR-mediated pathways. Therefore, SARMs with different intrinsic activity provide a novel treatment option for osteoporosis, muscle wasting, and hypogonadism.

I know its not much but its a start. Any one that wants to try now as an idea how to go about it. I'd say from 100 - 200mg. I'd probably do 200mg

I'll look into it more....

**LATS60** · 12-18-2008, 05:34 AM

Originally Posted by MuscleScience

I can in the next few weeks, I have a lot on my plate right now. These links will get us all started. I had the first one emailed to me by a buddy of mine a few years ago.

http://www.wipo.int/pctdb/en/wo.jsp?...DISPLAY=STATUS
http://www.drugs.com/clinical_trials...bone-2222.html

These are the best link I have on me at the moment and should be full text for everyone to enjoy.
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/art...?artid=2072879
http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/con...urcetype=HWCIT
http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/con...urcetype=HWCIT
Review article on SARMS from 2005
http://molinterv.aspetjournals.org/c...urcetype=HWCIT

Hirewire.org Data base on SARMS:
http://highwire.stanford.edu/cgi/sea..._element=false

Some interesting article's there, but these are open to anyone with a search engine. Do you or anyone else use the medical subscription only sites where we can get a wealth of info.

Everything you ever wanted to know about SARMS , work in progress, release date jan 2009.

**hugovsilva** · 12-18-2008, 06:47 AM

I have been hearing about SARM's for a while now but never did much digging on the subject. From what I could urderstand it gives you the gains without the evil sides.

It was intersting to see that like finasteride, and despite being a completely diferent compund, it helps block DHT's effetcts on both prostate and hair.

**Phate** · 12-18-2008, 12:48 PM

Originally Posted by LATS60

Some interesting article's there, but these are open to anyone with a search engine. Do you or anyone else use the medical subscription only sites where we can get a wealth of info.

Everything you ever wanted to know about SARMS, work in progress, release date jan 2009.

i have a university subscription so i can get in about 100 medical databases, just need to get permission to do a mass search

**B.E.N.** · 12-18-2008, 03:06 PM

I found this shat...look at the author...amusing.

http://blog.********************.com...r-modulator-4/

Kudos ADMIN for beating him to anything about this SARM/S-4!!

**Deltasaurus** · 12-18-2008, 03:11 PM

This is awesome, maybe the media will come off of the Anti-steroid bit and realize they are more beneficial and helpful then their current roid rage and evil steroid views that they currently have

-AJ

**MuscleScience** · 12-18-2008, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by LATS60

Some interesting article's there, but these are open to anyone with a search engine. Do you or anyone else use the medical subscription only sites where we can get a wealth of info.

Everything you ever wanted to know about SARMS, work in progress, release date jan 2009.

Yeah I do, but I can only post abstracts for subscribed items. To be honest, Highwire.org is one of the better data bases out there free or not. I use to keep papers in a private database, but they get so many papers in them its impossible to find a specific paper.

**nyjetsfan86** · 12-18-2008, 09:26 PM

Originally Posted by peachfuzz

on another board one of the sponsors was carrying S-4. from the feedback people were giving they were comparing the gains to a mild prop cycle. nothing drastic at all. almost everyone was experiencing blurred vision as well that went away upon cessation of use.

My personal belief is that these drugs are not the future of bodybuilding. id like to believe they are but im just not convinced. Myostatin inhibitors have been in the works for a while now as well and look very promising.

myostatin inhibitors would be one of the best things to ever happen but will probably be extremly expensive and not very available

**Pac Man** · 12-20-2008, 02:37 PM

Originally Posted by nyjetsfan86

myostatin inhibitors would be one of the best things to ever happen but will probably be extremly expensive and not very available

It would turn people into monsters with very little effort. They say you would need gene therapy as well to increase tendon strength.
There have been prototypes tested on lab rats and humans.