Do extremely low carbs = muscle loss?

[scriptfactory]

I have always heard ketogenic and other extremely low carbohydrate diets "eat your muscle." I was reading an article on Mind and Muscle and was really, really shocked by what it said...

A number of well-controlled scientific studies have demonstrated that a very low carbohydrate diet promotes fat loss while maintaining or even increasing muscle mass. For example, Dr. Young and co-workers compared three diets containing the same amounts of calories (1,800 kcal/day) and protein (115 grams/day) but differing in carbohydrate content. After nine weeks on the 30-g, 60-g and 104-g carbohydrate diets, weight loss was 16.2, 12.8 and 11.9 kg and fat accounted for 95, 84, and 75% of the weight loss, respectively. So, the authors concluded, "Weight loss, fat loss, and percent of weight loss as fat appeared to be inversely related to the level of carbohydrate in the isocaloric, isoprotein diets.” In layman’s terms, the more carbohydrates these test subjects consumed, the less body fat they lost. This study was published in the well-respected American Journal of Clinical in 1971, but was evidently ignored by obesity ‘authorities’ (don’t confuse me with the facts, a calorie is always a calorie).

http://www.mindandmuscle.net/mindand...D=32&pageNum=2

So, in an essence, higher carbohydrates (which still weren't that high) resulted in less fat and more MUSCLE lost! Am I missing something here?

[1buffsob]

First off, the study was performed on "healthy normal-weight men", not bodybuilders. Secondly, only 115g of protein were consumed for each group, far less than even the women on this board. And lastly, the type of carbs consumed, what macros were consumed in each meal, and when the meals were consumed was not taken into account. At the very best, the study can be determined 'inconclusive'. But IMHO, the study was initially flawed.

1buffsob

[SwoleCat]

Extremely low/no carb approaches (mainly those that don't address post-workout nutrition needs) do lead to a loss of lean mass over time, yes.
This is assuming one is weight training and trying to better his/her look.
Carbs do serve a purpose for the body and are beneficial in building a physique no matter if one is bulking/cutting. The key is to use them in the correct amounts, correct type, pair w/certain foods only, and the correct time.

~SC~

[1buffsob]

Extremely low/no carb approaches (mainly those that don't address post-workout nutrition needs) do lead to a loss of lean mass over time, yes.
This is assuming one is weight training and trying to better his/her look.
Carbs do serve a purpose for the body and are beneficial in building a physique no matter if one is bulking/cutting. The key is to use them in the correct amounts, correct type, pair w/certain foods only, and the correct time.

~SC~

Exactly.

The manipulation of your carb type/placement/amount isn't considered in most studies. And for that reason, I don't put much faith into said studies.

1buffsob

[Giants11]

Yup and the author Anssi Manninen, does nothing but promote low carb diets. That's all I've ever seen from him. IMO I would take whatever he says with a grain of salt and I for one would never take diet advice from him.

[1buffsob]

Yup and the author Anssi Manninen, does nothing but promote low carb diets. That's all I've ever seen from him. IMO I would take whatever he says with a grain of salt and I for one would never take diet advice from him.

Ditto. I don't like Manninen.

1buffsob

[SPIKE]

The manipulation of your carb type/placement/amount isn't considered in most studies. And for that reason, I don't put much faith into said studies.

This is something that is very true that most dont realize. One can consume the same amount of macros as another and have them utilized differentely. It's all based on how they are administered and used.

[Warrior]

There is no way low carb everyday would be good for muscle gain/retention. Atkins-type diets are good for fat, lazy people - but active athletes need the occasional carb refeeds or properly timed carbs during the day. Anaerobic training primarily feeds off stored glycogen and glucose - not fats...

[tretch187]

Although I haven't made a complete decision yet... I am starting to wonder if the TYPE of carb is really that important. I think it is much more important that the amount of carbs are controlled/timing/etc... but as to the type, I remain undecided.


Not saying you should try to get ripped off table sugar, I just think much of the reason certain carbs are choosen is for the amount of food you get to eat to hit a certain amount of carbs.

Then again... WTF do I know?

EDIT: and yes, I am not a fan of Ansi either.

[Jakt]

use quality carbs, all ya gotta do

[sonar1234]

I lost a tone of weight in no time but i lost a lot of mass has well, i am not a bodybuilder and my goals are not to get bigger anymore.

But for someone that wants to hang on to is muscles its not the way to go.

[scriptfactory]

Great thread. Thanks for the info everyone.

[TADOLFI]

Bump for more thoughts on this.