Associate Member
Well, blackwater is out in the open now getting shot at by politicians....
I say we let the politicians defend themselves...anyone who has been in the shit knows to shoot first and let God sort the bodies... (at least over there)
The Iraqi people have brought this on themselves...damn kids and women running around with shit strapped to them...
Any thoughts?
Senior Member
i agree.
Anabolic Member
Um, when did the Iraqi people attack the US? And whatever happened to Bin Laden?Originally Posted by zipster_dude
Just curious . . .
CHEMICALLY ENGINEERED
lol lil bush wants to finish his daddies fight.
Its all about money and power
The original plan was to seek out weapons of mass destruction....which turned out, they didnt have any. yet we stay there causing more havoc.
Yet, freakn' Korea is over here demonstrating their bombs to use and threatening to use them, yet we dont dare go over there.
Associate Member
They attack the US everyday...do you consider placing ied's, land mines, c4, etc... off on our troops no sign of aggression?
As far as North Korea, the day is coming...we can't fight everyone all at once...
CHEMICALLY ENGINEERED
If someone came into your house attacking you, would you not fight back?
Anabolic Member
Well, now they do. But that's because US forces invaded their country.
What I meant was, before the US invaded their country, when did the Iraqi people attack the US?
And for extra credit: Why isn't the US putting as much effort into finding Bin Laden (who is responsible for the 9/11 attack) as the US put into getting Saddam Hussain of Iraq (who didn't have anything to do with the 9/11 attack)?
Senior Member
ok now, for yall who dont know, blackwater is a contracting company(Mercs, US VETS) hired by the DOD to protect every person in Iraq(for this situation) thats in the DOD. so what ZIPSTER is trying to say is that Blackwater is getting flamed for doing their jobs.
Anabolic Member
in before the lock
Senior Member
and for the rest of you, you guys never saw 9/10 people waving, smiling, and saying thank you. all you see is the what the media wants you to see. ive been all over that country and most people appreciate us being there.
AR-Hall of Famer
If you did your research you would know a large percentage of the "insurgents" are not even Iraqi's. The other large percentage are extremists and former Baath party members who were also forced out of power after the fall of Saddam.
And why do you think that the hunt for Bin Laden is no longer going on?? So many people put so much stock in what the news media reports it amazes me. The hunt for Bin Laden has dropped off the radar because it is no longer a hot news topic. Do you think the US doesn't have several task forces established and working 24/7 trying to hunt him down and his second in command, Al-Zawahiri??
As for weapons of mass destruction- always a funny topic for me and others who were around and involved in the Operation Desert Shield/Storm. He had NBC weapons, which he launched on the Kurds, and nuclear weaponry. Anyone that believes all of the stuff just disappeared is blind to the obvious. Saddam has to be given a little credit in him knowing eventually someone would be calling his card on those weapons. He certainly carried them over the border into Syria and had them buried.
Anyway, I normally don't chime in on political issues as I am not a politician. Just keep in mind that politicians will say and do just about anything to push their agendas, and yes, that does include lying to the general American public- just in case anyone didn't know.
Doc M
Dulce bellum inexpertis
I saw the press on this, believe it was on CNN...The issue was that a Blackwater member ILLEDGEDLY shot the President of Iraqs bodyguard when he was drunk. For whatever reason, some stupid ass Congressmen decided he needed to ask the spokesperson for Blackwater how much he made last year, which was to the tune of over 1million+ dollars. Then, they tried to point out that a General (his name isnt coming to me at the moment) only gets payed $180,000/yr to be in Iraq. I really dont see what kind of relevance this has to the issue that was at hand, which was simply the death of the bodyguard. But surely, the actions of one member of Blackwater does not reflect the entire company. If that were the case, then the US Army would be in a world of shit if you take a look at all the scandals that have gone on with them in the passed 3-5 years... Abusing prisoners of war, raping women&children in Iraq, etc, etc...
It seems like Congresses axe to grind has to do with the fact that a PRIVATE company has been established which is licensed to kill people. Everything in the USA is a business, including killing. Plain and simple. Call it security, protection, whatever the **** you want, but killing is a business. And you know what? Thats fine with me.
Banned- Scammer!
Iraq is a total mess with no near end in sight.
WMD's?! More like OIL!
If you know what the Petra-Dollar Cycle is, it would give you an indication of why the US invaded Iraq.
Banned
bro most europeans think the US is the biggest threat to world security after 911 everyone was behind us. Then Bush used this to sell us on invading Iraq what a f*cking joke. Screw the terrorist's lets get some oil and piss everyone off.
Senior Member
I was in Iraq on two combat tours in the Marines. I honestly don't think if they called me back id even go, id rather go to jail. I was all for it originally but the way its been twisted and the lies, and the retarted way that everything has happened. IMO get out now, and save the remaining american lives you can, if this offends people in the Military or that fought, sorry I know what its like to believe, but I stopped believing awhile ago. I still respect the Military and everything its about, just think we F'd this one up!
CHEMICALLY ENGINEERED
ditto
i support our troops, but Bush...I will see in hell
Ron Paul Nuthugger
If someone invaded your country I bet you would fight and try to kill them. Yes, some of them are not even Iraqi's but they believe in the same cause.
The whole "War" is a farce, but believe what you wanna believe.
***No source checks!!!***
VET
Regardless of the stuation in Iraq...
I think that a mercenary force that isn't bound by the Geneva convention while ina war zone, that is protected from US law and doesn't care about about Iraq and International law is a very dangerous thing.
Red
Productive Member
How many non British, non American and non NATO countries have fought according to the Geneva Convention in recent years? Serbs? Croats? Muslims? Arabs? .... I think none.
Why do our forces get taken through the mill for acts that are nowhere near as barbaric as those they are fighting against?
VET
Because we're supposed to be the "GOOD GUYS" and are supposed to be the civilized ones... we came up with the rules of engagement and most of the Geneva convention.Why do our forces get taken through the mill for acts that are nowhere near as barbaric as those they are fighting against?
There is nothing new about this situation... during WW2 the nazis and japanese used many of our soldiers taken prisonner as slave labour. Many were executed outright. We generally treated their soldiers POW a LOT better.
After WW2 who had the moral high ground when it came to treatment of prisoners of war? A lot of people still care about "doing the right thing".
The problem with blackwater is that they are a mercenary force that obeys to NO rules and laws. Thats scary.
Red
AR's Cunning Linguist
I gotta laugh every time someone starts saying "Geneva Convention" and "Rules of War." It's like someone running out with their "Marquis of Queensbury Rules Handbook" everytime there's a brawl on the street. When you're actually in the shit, you'll do what you need to do in order to survive.
This drunken Blackwater employee who shot and killed some Iraqi was immediately fired (as he should have been). Blackwater does not have any legal right to prosecute him. That's up to the US Gov't, DOD, or whoever the hell else is in control of these private military contrators (PMCs).
I have my doubts about the legitimacy of the war in Iraq as do a lot of other people. But I'd rather have our boys f#@! those insurgents up than come home in a bodybag (and that goes for PMCs who are shot at as well).
Pat Dollard is about as real as it gets for showing what's going on (not a member of the armed forces, but a former Hollywood producer). For every raghead chanting "Death to America" & "Allah hu Akbar" with a C4 vest strapped on, there's a lot more Iraqis who are happy Uncle Sam's Misguided Children (USMC & others) are there.
Something I'm still curious about...if the war was about oil, then why is gas so damned expensive?
CHEMICALLY ENGINEERED
Cuz everything is about money. And as long as we are willing to pay, prices aint going nowhere but up.
Its business...If i was selling a product at 100, and making a nice profit. which people either had to buy or is more than likly gonna buy, its either staying at 100, or going up lol
sad but true
Last edited by xlxBigSexyxlx; 10-10-2007 at 06:37 AM.
CHEMICALLY ENGINEERED
lol these threads always get locked.
boo the war, boo bush....money hungry war-monger
Associate Member
Wow, this really turned for the worse.....
I just meant that blackwater is getting a bad rap. I ensure SF operations in the region are doing the exact same thing as blackwater, maybe just a little smarter and perhaps with a little less exposure.....
Blackwater is like the movie lord of war,,,remember at the end when he gets caught and tells the cop exactly what would happen next? The US gov't was his biggest client. He was a "necessary evil".
Why do you think the private firm has "immunity"? This was not by accident....
Member
Are you sure that Blackwater does not have to abide by the Geneva convention??? It doesn't make sense that the U.S. would hire them and then let them run completely free.....and if that did then that is just one more f-ck up on the politicians part.
Anabolic Member
Check this out -- Everything is not quite as it looks . . .
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/10/...er.contractor/
Contractor involved in Iraq shooting got job in Kuwait
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- A Blackwater USA employee who was fired after he allegedly shot and killed an Iraqi security guard on Christmas Eve last year was hired by another private contractor to work in the region less than two months later.
Congress has been taking a closer look at the government's use of private security contractors.
Andrew J. Moonen returned to the United States within a few days of the incident, his attorney said, but in February he returned to Kuwait, working for Defense Department contractor Combat Support Associates (CSA), a company spokesman said.
Mooney worked for CSA from February to August of this year, spokesman Paul Gennaro said.
Because the State Department and Blackwater kept the incident quiet and out of Moonen's personnel records, CSA was unaware of the December incident when it hired Moonen.
According to Moonen's personnel record, the U.S. Army tried to call him back to service in April 2007, but canceled the request when they were notified he was overseas.
Moonen, 27, had served in the Army's 82nd Airborne Division from April 2002 to April 2005 before joining Blackwater.
Moonen is accused of fatally shooting an Iraqi guard who was on duty near the Iraqi prime minister's compound, according to a Congressional memo describing the investigation report. The guard was struck three times and Moonen fled the scene, according to the memo.
Moonen had been at a Christmas Eve party in Baghdad's Green Zone, the memo said. Witnesses said he was drunk.
According to the report, Moonen went to the guard post of another contracting firm, Triple Canopy, and said he'd been in a gunfight with Iraqis. He said they were chasing him and firing at him, but a report by Triple Canopy says its guards had not heard gunfire.
Moonen's attorney did not dispute the version of events as laid out in the Congressional memo.
Moonen's case was discussed at length at a hearing on Capitol Hill this week, during which State Department officials conceded the Justice Department was still trying to determine whether they had jurisdiction to prosecute Moonen.
Moonen was fined, fired and flown home from Iraq, and the company later paid $20,000 in compensation to the victim's family.
(there's more at the weblink given above)
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