first time on deca

[stevedom]

just had first shot of deca yesterday and can't feel anything today is this normal. I'm also on sus 250 and prop and i feel both the next day. I did taste the deca and it had a terrible taste so I HOPE its real .

[Big]

Welcome.
I'll move this to the correct section.
I usually notice deca in week 4 or 5.
What are your stats and cycle history?

[stevedom]

just started a week and a half ago i'm doing 1ml of sus,1ml of prop twice a week and now 1ml of deca. What i meant to say was i feel the caulking efeck of the sus & prop but i'm not feeling anything from the deca.

[Big]

weird cycle. prop should be shot every day, at the most every other day.
could you list the cycle out in typical fashion showing dosages and durations?
also,
age?
height?
weight?
body fat%?
years training?
pct?

[stevedom]

age 37
weight 83.5 kg
hieght 177 cm
first year training weights
body fat is approx 16.5%
my cycle duration is 10 weeks
my cycle is as follows Mon 1ml of sus 250 Wed 1ml of deca & .5ml of prop & fri .5ml of prop
I've been told to use the prop just as a top up in between the sus.

[Big]

someone gave you awful cycle advise, your blood levels will be very unstable and unwanted side effects will likely be much worse cycling like that.
do you have a planned pct?

[stallion_1]

i dont wanna be a bully, lol but somebody needs to flame this newbie.

[Big]

i dont wanna be a bully, lol but somebody needs to flame this newbie.

on the contrary, he did the right thing by coming here for advice, so we need to point him in the right direction.

[Phate]

on the contrary, he did the right thing by coming here for advice, so we need to point him in the right direction.

agreed, though don't you think it would be best for him to stop now and pct, it's his first year of weight training and his bf% is a little high

[Big]

agreed, though don't you think it would be best for him to stop now and pct, it's his first year of weight training and his bf% is a little high

probably, but I'm not even sure if he knows what pct is yet.

[stallion_1]

allright newbie here goes:
ur doing sus on mon and prop on wed and fri
sus has 30 mg of prop so ur doing 30 mg of prop on mon plus half a mil on wed and fri, ur test levels shall not be stable as prop should be done eod at the same dose. now when the other esters of test start acting this will be an even worse balance. deca takes a while to kick in. im sure u could get away as follows

mon and friday 30 mg prop
wed deca and sus

be sure to have proper pct

[Phate]

allright newbie here goes:
ur doing sus on mon and prop on wed and fri
sus has 30 mg of prop so ur doing 30 mg of prop on mon plus half a mil on wed and fri, ur test levels shall not be stable as prop should be done eod at the same dose. now when the other esters of test start acting this will be an even worse balance. deca takes a while to kick in. im sure u could get away as follows

mon and friday 30 mg prop
wed deca and sus

be sure to have proper pct

anyone else confused by this? cause i'm lost, anyway, IMO he doesn't need to be able to "get away" with his cycle, he needs to stop it, research properly, and give himself time to get his diet, which probably isn't very good, (no offense to the thread starter but diet is the most crucial and most neglected part of life) and get his body used to weight lifting

here's my reasoning at least

1. this is your first year of lifting and your joints, tendons, etc are not used to the strain of weightlifting, add in steroids and you can seriously hurt yourself

2. your diet is probably not very good, post it so we can help you with it, diet is 90% of gains on and off cycle

3. you need a much better knowledge of the stuff you are using, first off using prop and sust is redundant and your first cycle shouldn't have deca . because of gyno and estrogen related sides. Deca is a bad choice for a first cycle as it is a progestrine, let me elaborate a bit on this. Testosterone gets converted to estrogen via the aromatase enzyme, but deca doesn't aromatize to estrogen at all, instead it stimulates progestrone, which can cause the same sides as estrogen, but here's the kicker
Since test stimulates sides via estrogen and deca stimulates sides via progestrone if you get sides which do you treat the gyno, acne, whatever... things like nolva actually can make sides caused by deca worse by making the progesterone receptors more sensitive

4. your bf is a little high for a cycle, some AS, like deca, cause water retention which raises blood pressure, so i'd wait and cut till i was at 14 minimum before starting a cycle, also, estrogen receptors are housed in fat, so the more fat you have while on cycle the more chance of estrogen related sides and the more intensity those sides will have.

anyway, thats just my opinion, not trying to flame you just giving you a heads up

[stallion_1]

anyone else confused by this? cause i'm lost, anyway, IMO he doesn't need to be able to "get away" with his cycle, he needs to stop it, research properly, and give himself time to get his diet, which probably isn't very good, (no offense to the thread starter but diet is the most crucial and most neglected part of life) and get his body used to weight lifting

here's my reasoning at least

1. this is your first year of lifting and your joints, tendons, etc are not used to the strain of weightlifting, add in steroids and you can seriously hurt yourself

2. your diet is probably not very good, post it so we can help you with it, diet is 90% of gains on and off cycle

3. you need a much better knowledge of the stuff you are using, first off using prop and sust is redundant and your first cycle shouldn't have deca . because of gyno and estrogen related sides. Deca is a bad choice for a first cycle as it is a progestrine, let me elaborate a bit on this. Testosterone gets converted to estrogen via the aromatase enzyme, but deca doesn't aromatize to estrogen at all, instead it stimulates progestrone, which can cause the same sides as estrogen, but here's the kicker
Since test stimulates sides via estrogen and deca stimulates sides via progestrone if you get sides which do you treat the gyno, acne, whatever... things like nolva actually can make sides caused by deca worse by making the progesterone receptors more sensitive

4. your bf is a little high for a cycle, some AS, like deca, cause water retention which raises blood pressure, so i'd wait and cut till i was at 14 minimum before starting a cycle, also, estrogen receptors are housed in fat, so the more fat you have while on cycle the more chance of estrogen related sides and the more intensity those sides will have.

anyway, thats just my opinion, not trying to flame you just giving you a heads up

ya well to bad he aint gonna listen, im sure hell continue so instead of going down a bad path, he can try to improve it.

[Big]

anyone else confused by this?

I thought it was just me, that really wasn't much better than the initial "cycle" the poster proposed.

[stallion_1]

allright lads ill try to be more clear.

this dude is doing sus on mon and .5 mil on wed and fri.
suppose his prop is 100mg/ml now since sus has 30 mg/mil with some other esters, then hes doing 30mg of prop on mon and 50 of prop on wed and fri. not very good, since this will cause unstable test levels. now when the other esters of test found in the sus start kicking in this will cause an even more unstable balance.prop can be done ed, but it can also be done eod. now this dude needs to drop either the prop and just do the sus, or drop the sus and just do the prop eod. now if the user insists on doing sus and prop, one must take a look at all the test esters in the sus to try to find a balance with the additional test prop, which is what i was trying to do.

then this cycle would be the best

day 1 sust (30 mg prop+plus other test esters) and deca
day 2 skip
day 3 30 mg prop
day 4 skip
day 5 30 mg prop
day 6 skip
day 7 30 mg of prop
day 8 skip
day 9 sust and deca
........................and repeats again.

that way the prop will be stable, and when the other esters of the sus start kickin in, there wont be an imbalance of test to begin with.

[stevedom]

the reason for me sending this post is to get the right advice not egnore the replies. As for my diet i have 3009 calories 297g protien 146g carbs &137g good fat eg almonds flax oil etc. When i say its my first year i mean to say i'VE always done weights and training of different kinds such as MMA fighting so muscle and joints ar'nt an issue and bf started at 13% before stopping MMA and doing straight weight training so any advice given is taken not shrugged off i want to do it right and your help is much appreciated. If my diet needs changing and my cycle then please give me something to work with. PS u r right i don't know what pct is.

[Big]

PCT is post-cycle therapy, it is what you run after a cycle to restore your natural levels and try to keep gains. When you use steroids your natural testosterone production is suppressed, deca suppresses it completely from the very first shot. Once the steroid cycle is stopped, your body is functioning with no testosterone production, which leads to very unpleasant conditions in most cases. PCT is taken at the right time after a cycle to help your body restore it's natural testosterone production, among other things.
There is an entire section of the board dedicated to pct, take some time to study a bit.

[MercyDog]

just started a week and a half ago i'm doing 1ml of sus,1ml of prop twice a week and now 1ml of deca. What i meant to say was i feel the caulking efeck of the sus & prop but i'm not feeling anything from the deca.

Lets cut this guy some slack and help him out, and I couldn't really see how his dosing was sooo bad in the first place. As far as I can read it its.....

Mon. prop. 30mg
wed. prop. either 100mg. or 50mg. (if anyone bothered asking)
Fri. prop. 100 or 50

So why suggest EOD when he's arlready there? He's making up the shorts seperately and pining once a week on the longs which is no sin. And the deca is prob. right about where it needs to be with the test dosage, although we still don't know the mgs./ml of deca either. His test levels are not WAY off balance as far as I can see unless I'm missing something reading.

Stevedom, whats the mgs./mL of your prop? And the Deca?

[MercyDog]

stallion, I'm really not trying to be rude, just here to help, but the first schedule he was on looks better than the one you suggested unless I'm missing something. Sorry bro. A 20mg. diff. in prop is nothing, no big deal at all, and even thats not correct because prop isn't the only short in sust. This stuff isn't that scientific. And your suggesting that he switches from 7 days to 9 on the sust. shoots, wheres the logic in that? Should be more like every EOD or every 3.5 but in his case he's subin with prop

If you need to refresh here's what sust


testosterone propionate, 30 mg
testosterone phenylpropionate 60 mg
testosterone isocaproate 60mg
testosterone decanoate 100 mg

[DSM4Life]

agreed, though don't you think it would be best for him to stop now and pct, it's his first year of weight training and his bf% is a little high

+2. Think you jumped on the cycle train little to early.

[stevedom]

thanks for taking time out to help . My prop is 100mgs/ml and deca is 300mgs/mls if these need adjusting then so be it as i said i want to do it right hence the reason for using this forum.

[MercyDog]

well I'm not going to tell you to stop using, we'll just make some adjustments, and like I posted earlier your not off by that much.

So we have prop 100mgs.......................and how much?
deca 300mgs.............................how much?
Sustanon 250...........................how much?
and what are you trying to accomplish on this cycle? What week are you in?

Had to convert but got you at 183lbs. right? 5-7tall? 37 is a good age, you'll love it.

short and sweat answers, I'll keep checking and well get this thing done!

[MercyDog]

lookin at around 165lbs. for a tight cut on your frame, so your BF isn't to high, just need a few adjustments with cycle & pct. thats not a very bad base of muscle for your hieght

[stevedom]

prop 100 is wed .5ml &fri .5ml = 1ml total
deca 300 is wed 1ml
sus 250 is mon 1ml

[MercyDog]

Sorry had to eat......still don't know how much you have but we'll say an endless supply for kicks.
.................................................1/2 lifes......................................
testosterone propionate 30mg = 2 days
testosterone phenylpropionate 60mg = 3days
testosterone isocaproate 60mg = 4days
testosterone decanoate 100mg = 7days
.................................................. .................................................. .............

so in a since your getting 90 short and 160 long.

Monday.............sust and deca mixed 1mL. each, so 2ml. shot (glute)
Tuesday............prop. 1mL or 100mgs. (shoulder)
Wednesday........prop. 1mL or 100mgs. (other shoulder)
Thursday...........same as Monday (other glute)
Friday...............prop. 1mL or 100mgs. (Leg)
Saturday...........prop. 1ml or 100mgs. (other Leg)
Sunday.............Same as Monday above (other glute)
Monday............prop. 1mL or 100mgs. (shoulder, diff site)
Tuesday...........prop. 1ml or 100mgs. (other shoulder, diff site)
Wednes............back to 1st monday again hince sust. and deca 1 each
keep this pattern going like this for 8 weeks Max, then pregnyl and nolva/clomid.

Yields:
testosterone 1150 mgs. per week
Deca 900mgs. per week

Everythings steady and you should have no problems growing

[stevedom]

i currently have 10ml of each of the prop,sus & deca 30ml in total ,would this be enough for my first cycle or will i need more,is 3ml per week enough for any reasonable gains or not.Only started my cycle 1 week & ahalf ago

[MercyDog]

sure, cut everything in 1/2 above and run it for 12 weeks instead of 8, should be a close gustimate, very tired now,take care

[stevedom]

what about my diet is 3009 calories 297g of protein 146g carbs & 137g of good fats enough for this cycle or should i adjust it

[stallion_1]

it depends i usually do 4000 cals a day.
it depends on how many u burn? if u burn 2500, then u need more than 3000

[stevedom]

i still seem to be gaining size and muscle on this diet which i've been on for about 13 months now. I started this diet whilst i was doing MMA and seemed to work well so i have just kept to it and found it working to gain muscle with just wieghts . Just wasn't sure if it would be enough with AS involved.

[stallion_1]

im sure ull be fine, but while on aas id try to do a bit more.

[stevedom]

thanks for your help and advice,will let u know how i go over the next couple of months.

[papas]

nothing wrong with sus and prop in the same cycle if sus has 30 mg of prop per meal and u add another 70 mg of prop with every sus shot you have a total of 100mg of prop in that shot..so u can do that shot every 3 days that will be fine..dont know what all the stress is about with sus just have to add sum prop with it and its fine..once every 3 days is enough..as far as deca goes u can add that anywere during the week since is long lasting

[one8nine]

100mg of prop every three days?
dont give anyone anymore terrible advice

injection frequency
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=355493

ester weight and active lives
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?p=4131783