20 Week Cycle Test E/Tren E

[Dedicated Lifter]

This will be my 5th cycle. Past cycles as follows.

1 - Test E 300mg 10 weeks

2 - Test E 400mg 12 weeks

3 - Test E 500mg 12 Weeks Dbol Kicker

4 - Test E 400mg 14 week/Deca200mg 10 week Dbol Kicker


Proposed Cycle

Week 1-4 Dbol 40mg
Week 1-10 Tren E 250mg
Week 1-10 Test E 400mg

Week 11-18 Tren E 300mg
Week 11-20 Test E 500mg

Week 1-20 Adex .25mg ED

PCT
Clomid 100/100/50/50
Nolva 60/40/40/20




Age - 31
Height/weight - 5'11, 218 lbs 10/11% BF
Years training - Sense late teens, solid 5-6 years straight though.

Cycle notes - I like the idea of a longer cycle and I am eager to try this. So far I have responded very well to low doses. I figure it would be a good idea to bump the Test and Tren dose around week 10 or 12.

Bring on the advice/opinions. Im hoping to hear from BIG or Marcus on this one.

Edit - Ill say this before somebody else brings it up. Yes its my first time with tren and yes I know Tren A is easier to get off of then Tren E. I will be fine, my starting dose is 250 and my ending is 300 that isnt much at all. I was considering even bumping the ending dose to 350.

Goals - Winter Bulk

[Necrosaro]

Can we get some pics first. I just have trouble believing someone that has one post. If pictures are provided then that would help me at lease a ton.

[Noles12]

No way i would run tren for 20 weeks. I would go out of my mind

[Noles12]

Not to mention you are running long estered tren for a first go around and have it planned for that long. Have you heard of possible sides from tren?

[Dedicated Lifter]

Can we get some pics first. I just have trouble believing someone that has one post. If pictures are provided then that would help me at lease a ton.

I dont have a digital. I was planning on having a friend take some before and after pictures for me. Ill see if I can get her over tomorrow to take a few pics.

No way i would run tren for 20 weeks. I would go out of my mind

18 weeks. Lower side as far as doses.

Not to mention you are running long estered tren for a first go around and have it planned for that long. Have you heard of possible sides from tren?

Tren cough, sweats, insomia and libido loss. Prolactin issues as well.

Im fully aware of Tren sides. The dose I am starting at will be 250 a week or 300 at most. That is what is considered a low dose of Tren. I can handle the sides, esp at those doses. Worst comes to worst I decide to cut the cycle short at week 10-12 instead of bumping the Test and Tren.

[Dedicated Lifter]

Hmm I thought there would be alot of opinions on this.

[Vullfromsc]

man 20 weeks... considered running HCG with your cycle to prevent you from completely getting shut down?

also, why not just keep a constant dose the whole cycle? i read what you said about responding well to low doses, so you must really respond to normal doses then right?

[Dedicated Lifter]

man 20 weeks... considered running HCG with your cycle to prevent you from completely getting shut down?

also, why not just keep a constant dose the whole cycle? i read what you said about responding well to low doses, so you must really respond to normal doses then right?

Yes, I definatly respond well to normal doses. In my 3rd cycle I bumped to 500mg Test E and in my 4th came back to 400mg because currently thats all I need.

My reasoning behind not keeping the dose constant the whole cycle is because people have said gains start to die off around week 10-12 and the only way to keep gaining ( aside from adjusting diet ) is to bump doses or add a new compound.

[Always Learning]

That doesnt seem like a significant enough bump in dose?

if your at 400mg test and 250 Tren youd probly want to bump to atleast 600 test and 350 Tren in week 12ish.

[dec11]

i would go for tren A at 350mg pw for 8wks, then if it doesnt agree with you its outa your system in a few days, tren e will be there for weeks..............

agreed that 250 tren is very low

[Vitruvian-Man]

I would highly recommend doing a tad higher doses for a shorter duration. 14 - 16 weeks max. Just do test @ 500mg/wk & tren @ 350-400mg/wk for shorter, it will be much better.

Trust me man, staying on tren for 20 weeks is going to blow. It's like punishment after the 8th week for myself.

In any case, add some HCG in @ 250iu x 2/wk for the cycle.

Good luck...

-VM

[Dedicated Lifter]

I would highly recommend doing a tad higher doses for a shorter duration. 14 - 16 weeks max. Just do test @ 500mg/wk & tren @ 350-400mg/wk for shorter, it will be much better.

Trust me man, staying on tren for 20 weeks is going to blow. It's like punishment after the 8th week for myself.

In any case, add some HCG in @ 250iu x 2/wk for the cycle.

Good luck...

-VM

Hmm. I agree I am debating if I will be able to handle 18 Weeks of Tren. However, if I am willing to endure the sides for the additional time, is there any reason why this cycle wouldnt be effective?

My starting dose may be low to others but I still respond well at that Test dosage and tren will be an added compound so there will not be a need to run it too high at first.

Upon week 12 I would imagine bumping the doses ( however little it may be ) would be just the trick I would need to continue gaining and seeing results ( with adequate diet of course ).

[Vitruvian-Man]

Do whatever works for you. Like I said, I just wouldn't want to ever be on tren for 4+ months. That's not my idea of a fun cycle.

If you're going to stay on the cycle for 20 weeks then I would suggest bumping up the dose after the 10-12th week to help keep gains coming. Good luck with that.

-VM

[Noles12]

Yea i was just speaking from personal experience. I get tired of the tren sides after 8 weeks. If you are running tren E even at a low dose and have sides you cant handle, then your in for that ride for a lot longer than tren a. The longer the ester the longer the sides. Now with tren E i could see maybe 14 weeks max

[marcus300]

Your cycle wants re-designing and the length cutting in half IMHO, from my experience that cycle will only create more sides without further gains after week 8, ive never been into long cycles when you can get better gains with less sides with short ones.

[HawaiianPride.]

I'd be in for a lengthy PCT protocol running a 19nor that long.

Agree with cutting duration and adjusting dosages if needed.

[Dedicated Lifter]

Your cycle wants re-designing and the length cutting in half IMHO, from my experience that cycle will only create more sides without further gains after week 8, ive never been into long cycles when you can get better gains with less sides with short ones.

Was hoping you or Big would hit up this post haha. I am eager to try a longer cycle to see how I react to it but at the same time I have never tried a 6-8 weeker either so maybe thats an option as well.

You say gains will slow around week 8 or rather they wont be furthered by increasing cycle duration. Does upping the dose of the compounds you are running do anything to stop that from happening? Obviously I would have to up my calories as well.

I am reconsidering droping it to a 16 week cycle. I dont like the sounds of a hard time recovering.

1-9 Test E 400mg
1-9 Tren E 250mg
10-16 Test E 500mg
10-14 Tren E 300mg

The idea behind the bump ( however small it may be ) is to keep the gains coming. Or would I be better off just running 500mg Test and 300mg Tren for 14/16 weeks?

[marcus300]

Was hoping you or Big would hit up this post haha. I am eager to try a longer cycle to see how I react to it but at the same time I have never tried a 6-8 weeker either so maybe thats an option as well.

You say gains will slow around week 8 or rather they wont be furthered by increasing cycle duration. Does upping the dose of the compounds you are running do anything to stop that from happening? Obviously I would have to up my calories as well.

I am reconsidering droping it to a 16 week cycle. I dont like the sounds of a hard time recovering.

1-9 Test E 400mg
1-9 Tren E 250mg
10-16 Test E 500mg
10-14 Tren E 300mg

The idea behind the bump ( however small it may be ) is to keep the gains coming. Or would I be better off just running 500mg Test and 300mg Tren for 14/16 weeks?

I just dont like your cycle plan at all, I think its to long and unstable to be honest. The longer the cycle doesnt mean bigger or better gains if that was the case we would all be 500lbs+, normally what comes with longer cycles is more sides. If your content of running a long cycle why dont you just leave the cycle open ended and go by gains and sides? start off with 500mgs Test and 300mgs tren E and see how you go, no need to run more wks if you stop growing at wk 8,9,10.

[Vitruvian-Man]

This is not a Q&A post. He doesn't want any advice.

Let him learn. Just do the 20 week cycle. Trust me, you aren't the first to try this though.

Gains always diminish. Remember that OP.

Peace.

[Dedicated Lifter]

This is not a Q&A post. He doesn't want any advice.

Let him learn. Just do the 20 week cycle. Trust me, you aren't the first to try this though.

Gains always diminish. Remember that OP.

Peace.

No, please dont misunderstand. I am here for advice. Its just hard to alter something when you were so sure of it. However, I am changing my proposed cycle and that is why I continue to ask questions.

Marcus - Ill do what you said. Ill run the Test E 500mg/Tren E 300mg a week for 10+ weeks until I notice gains diminish or the tren takes its toll on me.

Question: Would adding 4-6 weeks of Winny around week 10 or when I drop the Tren keep the gains coming? Instead of bumping the dose of the compounds I will be adding a compound for the last few weeks to milk the end of the cycle for what its worth. Or would this be a waste of winny considering Tren strength blows Winny strength out of the water ( or so ive read ).

I will not run this cycle past 16 weeks. I will stop when the gains stop.

[Dedicated Lifter]

No, please dont misunderstand. I am here for advice. Its just hard to alter something when you were so sure of it. However, I am changing my proposed cycle and that is why I continue to ask questions.

Marcus - Ill do what you said. Ill run the Test E 500mg/Tren E 300mg a week for 10+ weeks until I notice gains diminish or the tren takes its toll on me.

Question: Would adding 4-6 weeks of Winny around week 10 or when I drop the Tren keep the gains coming? Instead of bumping the dose of the compounds I will be adding a compound for the last few weeks to milk the end of the cycle for what its worth. Or would this be a waste of winny considering Tren strength blows Winny strength out of the water ( or so ive read ).

I will not run this cycle past 16 weeks. I will stop when the gains stop.

[marcus300]

No, please dont misunderstand. I am here for advice. Its just hard to alter something when you were so sure of it. However, I am changing my proposed cycle and that is why I continue to ask questions.

Marcus - Ill do what you said. Ill run the Test E 500mg/Tren E 300mg a week for 10+ weeks until I notice gains diminish or the tren takes its toll on me.

Question: Would adding 4-6 weeks of Winny around week 10 or when I drop the Tren keep the gains coming? Instead of bumping the dose of the compounds I will be adding a compound for the last few weeks to milk the end of the cycle for what its worth. Or would this be a waste of winny considering Tren strength blows Winny strength out of the water ( or so ive read ).

I will not run this cycle past 16 weeks. I will stop when the gains stop.

Persoanlly I think you need to get out of your head trying to add more gains at the end of the cycle, if you havent reached your goals with test and tren by week 10 then adding winny isnt going to give you more gains, it may well add condition but as far as gains go it wont do much IMHO!

I dont like long cycles i much prefer shorter one's linked to a prime, less sides,better gains and no recovery issues.
Best of luck

[Dedicated Lifter]

Persoanlly I think you need to get out of your head trying to add more gains at the end of the cycle, if you havent reached your goals with test and tren by week 10 then adding winny isnt going to give you more gains, it may well add condition but as far as gains go it wont do much IMHO!

I dont like long cycles i much prefer shorter one's linked to a prime, less sides,better gains and no recovery issues.
Best of luck

Ahhh fine. I know your right haha. I will run it until the gains stop ( most likely 10 or so weeks ). I have read alot of your posts about short cycles and am also eager to try that as well. I am still getting strong gains off low doses though.

Question for you...As far as the Winny. ( Im sure I could research this so no sweat if you dont make it back to answer this ) Why do people tend to add it in the last few weeks of cycle? I know theres the 2 weeks inbetween the last shot of Test E and PCT that people like fill with winny ( usually the last 4 weeks before PCT from what I have seen ). What specifically does it due? Add a bit of strength at the end? Keep you anabolic right before pct? Solidfy gains?

2nd Question and last question - I see that you are all for having Test dose at an equal or higher dose then Tren. Aside from the benefits of keeping sex drive up why is it that you feel that way? From what I have read when you run Tren it basically overshadows Test and you aquire most of your gains through Tren and not the Test. However, thats what ive "read" and you have actually experienced these things so I would love to hear your opinion on this.

Thanks for your help Marcus, this is why I posted, I wanted opinions and I got them and its apparent a 20 weeker let alone a 16 weeker is not what I want. Sorry I am asking so many questions, its one thing to read up and a compeltely different thing to pick an experienced users brain :P

[Dedicated Lifter]

marcus is right.....110%, if ne thing take the tren for 8 weeks and then test for 20 to keep gains.....

You agree with marcus 110% then tell me to run the Test for 20 weeks?

Ill stick to what he is telling me.

[marcus300]

Ahhh fine. I know your right haha. I will run it until the gains stop ( most likely 10 or so weeks ). I have read alot of your posts about short cycles and am also eager to try that as well. I am still getting strong gains off low doses though.

Question for you...As far as the Winny. ( Im sure I could research this so no sweat if you dont make it back to answer this ) Why do people tend to add it in the last few weeks of cycle? I know theres the 2 weeks inbetween the last shot of Test E and PCT that people like fill with winny ( usually the last 4 weeks before PCT from what I have seen ). What specifically does it due? Add a bit of strength at the end? Keep you anabolic right before pct? Solidfy gains?

2nd Question and last question - I see that you are all for having Test dose at an equal or higher dose then Tren. Aside from the benefits of keeping sex drive up why is it that you feel that way? From what I have read when you run Tren it basically overshadows Test and you aquire most of your gains through Tren and not the Test. However, thats what ive "read" and you have actually experienced these things so I would love to hear your opinion on this.

Thanks for your help Marcus, this is why I posted, I wanted opinions and I got them and its apparent a 20 weeker let alone a 16 weeker is not what I want. Sorry I am asking so many questions, its one thing to read up and a compeltely different thing to pick an experienced users brain :P

You can add winny up to pct start time but I doubt your going to get more gains from adding the winny to a test and tren cycle, you may experience more condition,hardness and more of a dryer look if that's what your after by all means add it, winny can also be useful at lowering SHBG which will raise the amount of free test floating around so this can be an advantage for many. If you after adding something what will solidfy gains and fill the gap between the test to pct then winny would be a good option but remember it can give your joints a rough time.

So long as you have test along side your tren you will be fine, there is no need to run test higher than the tren to keep your sex drive, so long as you have a good amount of test to uphold your drive you will be fine, for me test builds tissue so that's why I have it at a reasonable amount but if you don't respond good to test then all you need is a replacement dose and you will be fine.

[Dedicated Lifter]

Thanks marcus.

I think im set.

Cycle

1-4 30mg dbol
1-10+ Test E 400 or 500mgs
1-10+ Tren E 300mgs

Winny 50mgs - Last 4 weeks after ending Tren

Adex .25mg ED


Only thing left undecided is whether I want to do 400 or 500 mgs of Test. Sense im introducing Tren to my arsenal I would think that would be substantial for great gains throughout cycle. However, id be willing to bet that 100mgs extra test will make a positive difference in gains. Maybe small difference but a difference all the same.


Cycle wont go over 12-14 weeks, I will judge it by gains slowing. Thanks for your help Marcus. Now to be patient until cycle time

Edit - will run the Test 2 weeks past Tren. Also considering kick starting with Winny seeing as how I bloat like a mad man and notice signs of Gyno after the first time I used Dbol.

[marcus300]

Id run your test alittle longer than your Tren E IMHO, 12 wks test- 10 weeks tren e

[Dedicated Lifter]

Id run your test alittle longer than your Tren E IMHO, 12 wks test- 10 weeks tren e

Yea, beat me to the edit haha. Ill stop it 2 weeks before the test so its out of my system before the test is.

[Forever Dedicated]

Thanks marcus.

I think im set.

Cycle

1-4 30mg dbol
1-10+ Test E 400 or 500mgs
1-10+ Tren E 300mgs


Only thing left undecided is whether I want to do 400 or 500 mgs of Test. Sense im introducing Tren to my arsenal I would think that would be substantial for great gains throughout cycle. However, id be willing to bet that 100mgs extra test will make a positive difference in gains. Maybe small difference but a difference all the same.


.

No. 100-200mg of extra test will not matter when your running Tren. In fact all your going to get is extra sides.

Running 250mg test with 300 tren will yield the same results as 500mg test with 300 tren.

250mg of Test will give NO more gains compared to the Tren.

[CanYouDigIt]

No. 100-200mg of extra test will not matter when your running Tren. In fact all your going to get is extra sides.

Running 250mg test with 300 tren will yield the same results as 500mg test with 300 tren.

250mg of Test will give NO more gains compared to the Tren.

this is rubbish, running 500mg/300tren will not yeild more results then 250mg of test with 300mg of tren?

and I don't get sides at 250mg of test and no difference at 500mg of test, ~

[c-Z]

this is rubbish, running 500mg/300tren will not yeild more results then 250mg of test with 300mg of tren?

and I don't get sides at 250mg of test and no difference at 500mg of test, ~

Technically speaking if you think about it. It isn't rubbish. Someone running just 250mg of test which is basically a trt dose. Will not yield the gains as someone running 500mgs. However with the tren added in. I know it is quite common for some to run there test dose lower due to sides... me personally. I would run test at 500mgs.

[Forever Dedicated]

Technically speaking if you think about it. It isn't rubbish. Someone running just 250mg of test which is basically a trt dose. Will not yield the gains as someone running 500mgs. However with the tren added in. I know it is quite common for some to run there test dose lower due to sides... me personally. I would run test at 500mgs.

The amount of gains that an additonal 200-300mg Test will yield when running Tren is miniscule.

Think about it... Tren is commonly said to be 5x as strong as Test. the 300mg of Tren will blow any gains you would get from the additional test out of the water. In fact, some could even argue you would get more gains from 250mg Test and 300mg Tren simply because your sides will be lowered.

Ill say it again. When running Tren all you need is a small base dose of 200-300 Test to keep you happy and horny. No point running more then that because it is wasted while running Tren ( a compound far far far stronger then Test ).

[Archangel.]

This will be my 5th cycle. Past cycles as follows.

1 - Test E 300mg 10 weeks

2 - Test E 400mg 12 weeks

3 - Test E 500mg 12 Weeks Dbol Kicker

4 - Test E 400mg 14 week/Deca200mg 10 week Dbol Kicker


Proposed Cycle

Week 1-4 Dbol 40mg
Week 1-10 Tren E 250mg
Week 1-10 Test E 400mg

Week 11-18 Tren E 300mg
Week 11-20 Test E 500mg

Week 1-20 Adex .25mg ED

PCT
Clomid 100/100/50/50
Nolva 60/40/40/20




Age - 31
Height/weight - 5'11, 218 lbs 10/11% BF
Years training - Sense late teens, solid 5-6 years straight though.

Cycle notes - I like the idea of a longer cycle and I am eager to try this. So far I have responded very well to low doses. I figure it would be a good idea to bump the Test and Tren dose around week 10 or 12.

Bring on the advice/opinions. Im hoping to hear from BIG or Marcus on this one.

Edit - Ill say this before somebody else brings it up. Yes its my first time with tren and yes I know Tren A is easier to get off of then Tren E. I will be fine, my starting dose is 250 and my ending is 300 that isnt much at all. I was considering even bumping the ending dose to 350.

Goals - Winter Bulk

Word of advice but, and LISTEN TO THIS. You saying yu want to run a 20 week cycle caught my eye. GO READ THE THREAD "You'll WANT TO READ THIS FIRST" by Ronnie Rowland. He's one of the smatest guys on here, if not the smartest. His whole thread/theory is running a certain type of 20 week cycle, he calls it a "blast". Read the WHOLE thread, you won't regret it, he's very helpful if you have any questions too. I'm currently in week 14 of my 20 week blast, and only getting bigger, stronger and more jacked. To give you an example of this guy's wisdom, at the beginning of my "blast" I started to develop mild gyno symptoms. I posted the issue on the Q&A section and EVERYBODY said up my AI dosage (I was running an ai as a precautionary because I was paranoid about bitch tits) I talked it through with Ronnie and his advice was to WAIT IT OUT. Anyway, to make a long story short, I'm 14 weeks in with ZERO gyno. If I had of listened to everyone else I would be running a high dose of AI, probably cutting into my gains. Check him out.

[Mar-Vell]

I see homeostasis

[Dedicated Lifter]

[QUOTE=Archangel.;****209] GO READ THE THREAD "You'll WANT TO READ THIS FIRST" by Ronnie Rowland. QUOTE]

Hmm very interesting. I originally decided to cut the cycle down to 12-14 weeks depending on gains but after reading that article it has given me something to think about. Possibly slingshot cycle below if I understood that article correctly.

Week 1-8 Test E 400mg
Week 1-8 Tren E 300mg

Week 9-10 Test E 250mg
Week 9-10 Tren E 150mg

Week 11-18 Test E 500mg
Week 11-16 Tren E 400mg

Week 20-24 PCT

Ill have to give it some thought and if it grows on me ill make a thread in regards to it.

[Archangel.]

[QUOTE=Dedicated Lifter;****266]

GO READ THE THREAD "You'll WANT TO READ THIS FIRST" by Ronnie Rowland. QUOTE]

Hmm very interesting. I originally decided to cut the cycle down to 12-14 weeks depending on gains but after reading that article it has given me something to think about. Possibly slingshot cycle below if I understood that article correctly.

Week 1-8 Test E 400mg
Week 1-8 Tren E 300mg

Week 9-10 Test E 250mg
Week 9-10 Tren E 150mg (No Tren here)

Week 11-18 Test E 500mg
Week 11-16 Tren E 400mg (Run Tren weeks 11-18 if sides are OK)

Week 20-24 PCT

Ill have to give it some thought and if it grows on me ill make a thread in regards to it.

Hey bud. I hope you actually read the whole thing.
Above is my critique of your possible slingshot cycle.
Here are a couple of before/after pics of me at week 10 of my 20 week slingshot. Just so you know this theory works