Pros and cons of Longer cycle

[Mike Dura]

It's believed that the pros stay on (vs. cycle). Some on this board have talked about thier experience of staying on. In fact, that roberts guy (who wrote the steroid book heavily promoted on this forum) said in an interview that he "cruises on test" all year but gets periodical blood profiles. I guess if one were to cycle longer (say a year straight or more) it would have to be strictly injectables and probably test based. Do you think the effects of say, test E would have to be occasionally switched for one with a slightly different chemical structure (doesn't recepter sites eventually become spent?). The progress on this long term approach must be great. Can anyone give their experience with keeping on?

[Swifto]

It's believed that the pros stay on (vs. cycle). Some on this board have talked about that. In fact, that roberts guy (who wrote the steroid book heavily promoted on this forum) said in an interview that he "cruises on test" all year but gets periodical blood profiles. I guess if one were to cycle longer (say a year straight or more) it would have to be strictly injectables and probably test based. Do you think the effects of say, test E would have to be occasionally switched for one with a slightly different chemical structure (don't recepter sites eventually become spent?). The progress on this long term approach must be great.

Many "cruise" on a low dose of testosterone.

Thnings to considere are:

- Will your Pituitary ever recover and resume hormoner output after the cessation of the androgens your using?

- Increased sides, inclusing increases in cholesterol, blood pressure etc...

- Acne?

- Water retention

- Sexual side effects. This will change from compound to compound

- Physiological changes in mood?

- Will the gains be attained post cycle?

- Effectiveness of compounds. You may have to change doses and increase dosages regularly to gain effects in anabolism.

The truth is, you may never recover and may need HRT/TRT for the rest of your life or your "long" cycle may result in suppressed T levels, meaning, you may suffer from depression and other sexual effects.

Its something one really wants to consider before embarking on a cycle over 1 year.

I've seen some "claiming" to recover from 1-3 years "on" and others suffer irriversable sexual side effects from cycling 8 weeks of Test/Deca. You never can tell with this IMHO.

[Swifto]

Full of spelling mistakes but I wrote it fast. Sorry.

[Swifto]

I think, given you have the money, doing a shortish 6-8 week cycle, then "crusing" on HGH/IGF and a less suppressive andorgen is a better idea.

[Mike Dura]

That's really useful. Thanks.

Many "cruise" on a low dose of testosterone.

Thnings to considere are:

- Will your Pituitary ever recover and resume hormoner output after the cessation of the androgens your using?

- Increased sides, inclusing increases in cholesterol, blood pressure etc...

- Acne?

- Water retention

- Sexual side effects. This will change from compound to compound

- Physiological changes in mood?

- Will the gains be attained post cycle?

- Effectiveness of compounds. You may have to change doses and increase dosages regularly to gain effects in anabolism.

The truth is, you may never recover and may need HRT/TRT for the rest of your life or your "long" cycle may result in suppressed T levels, meaning, you may suffer from depression and other sexual effects.

Its something one really wants to consider before embarking on a cycle over 1 year.

I've seen some "claiming" to recover from 1-3 years "on" and others suffer irriversable sexual side effects from cycling 8 weeks of Test/Deca. You never can tell with this IMHO.

[stupidhippo]

yeah u gotta remember that cruising and cycling aer completely different... when ucruise with a low dose of testosterone u are essentially just trying to maintain the mass gained during a cycle.. and if the dose is low enough(physiological or close to it) it should be pretty safe if regular BW are taken to be sure.. one thing it doesnt do is normalize HPTA though...

[Mike Dura]

Hmmm. Can you site a source for this view on cruising? It sounds interesting if it's backed up.

yeah u gotta remember that cruising and cycling aer completely different... when ucruise with a low dose of testosterone u are essentially just trying to maintain the mass gained during a cycle.. and if the dose is low enough(physiological or close to it) it should be pretty safe if regular BW are taken to be sure.. one thing it doesnt do is normalize HPTA though...

[DEVLDOG]

first of all your receptors dont shut down,this is a myth,your receptors like every other cell die off and are regenerated every 30 days or so.
I personally have been on for 2 yrs straight now,been using off and on since 1987 and have now found this to be the best way for ME.I do 2 x 4 month heavy cycles and cruise on 1g of test in between,I have no issues as listed above,I have blood work done 4x yr,all is fine.I believe pct is the worst possible thing for your body,and why put it through it if you will be cycleing again,most go right back on right after pct..whats the logic in that??I have had children while on,all born without problems.Im no kid anymore im 36yo and ive never been in better health or condition,im pressing 550,weight is presently 285,waist is 36".but like I said,this is what I have found works best for me,everyone is different and im not saying this is for everyone.
goodluck bro

[DEVLDOG]

yeah u gotta remember that cruising and cycling aer completely different... when ucruise with a low dose of testosterone u are essentially just trying to maintain the mass gained during a cycle.. and if the dose is low enough(physiological or close to it) it should be pretty safe if regular BW are taken to be sure.. one thing it doesnt do is normalize HPTA though...

if you do cruise,you will need to experiment with doses to see what is needed to keep the mass you gain while on a cycle,it will be alot more then "close to physiological amounts" for me its btwn 750mg and 1g of test,depending on my training and diet.

[Mike Dura]

I'm still learning what is best for me. Last pct was tough - I got depressed and anxious. Yet, I'd need to do the blood work to determine the viability of staying on. That's probably what it comes down to, it's highly individualistic and a matter of trial and error. I do have this sense that it's possible that permanent damage to the testes and one's endogenous test is a possibility.

first of all your receptors dont shut down,this is a myth,your receptors like every other cell die off and are regenerated every 30 days or so.
I personally have been on for 2 yrs straight now,been using off and on since 1987 and have now found this to be the best way for ME.I do 2 x 4 month heavy cycles and cruise on 1g of test in between,I have no issues as listed above,I have blood work done 4x yr,all is fine.I believe pct is the worst possible thing for your body,and why put it through it if you will be cycleing again,most go right back on right after pct..whats the logic in that??I have had children while on,all born without problems.Im no kid anymore im 36yo and ive never been in better health or condition,im pressing 550,weight is presently 285,waist is 36".but like I said,this is what I have found works best for me,everyone is different and im not saying this is for everyone.
goodluck bro

[Mike Dura]

I'm still learning what is best for me. Last pct was tough - I got depressed and anxious. Yet, I'd need to do the blood work to determine the viability of staying on. That's probably what it comes down to, it's highly individualistic and a matter of trial and error. I do have this sense that it's possible that permanent damage to the testes and one's endogenous test is a possibility.

first of all your receptors dont shut down,this is a myth,your receptors like every other cell die off and are regenerated every 30 days or so.
I personally have been on for 2 yrs straight now,been using off and on since 1987 and have now found this to be the best way for ME.I do 2 x 4 month heavy cycles and cruise on 1g of test in between,I have no issues as listed above,I have blood work done 4x yr,all is fine.I believe pct is the worst possible thing for your body,and why put it through it if you will be cycleing again,most go right back on right after pct..whats the logic in that??I have had children while on,all born without problems.Im no kid anymore im 36yo and ive never been in better health or condition,im pressing 550,weight is presently 285,waist is 36".but like I said,this is what I have found works best for me,everyone is different and im not saying this is for everyone.
goodluck bro

[Mike Dura]

I'm still learning what is best for me. Last pct was tough - I got depressed and anxious. Yet, I'd need to do the blood work to determine the viability of staying on. That's probably what it comes down to, it's highly individualistic and a matter of trial and error. I do have this sense that it's possible that permanent damage to the testes and one's endogenous test is a possibility.

first of all your receptors dont shut down,this is a myth,your receptors like every other cell die off and are regenerated every 30 days or so.
I personally have been on for 2 yrs straight now,been using off and on since 1987 and have now found this to be the best way for ME.I do 2 x 4 month heavy cycles and cruise on 1g of test in between,I have no issues as listed above,I have blood work done 4x yr,all is fine.I believe pct is the worst possible thing for your body,and why put it through it if you will be cycleing again,most go right back on right after pct..whats the logic in that??I have had children while on,all born without problems.Im no kid anymore im 36yo and ive never been in better health or condition,im pressing 550,weight is presently 285,waist is 36".but like I said,this is what I have found works best for me,everyone is different and im not saying this is for everyone.
goodluck bro

[Mike Dura]

Can anyone say, echoe!

[stupidhippo]

there are some points in where I agree with u devl BUT a key to ur kind of cycling is regular BW!!!... ofcourse then there is the thing that if u are healthy and havent had any negative side-effects it doesnt mean it wont happen to other ppl.. some ppl have really high cholesterol all their lives and dont develop heart-disease.. its kinda like palying percantages in a way.. the way u are cruising sounds still a lil extreme but if it works for u y not.. would recommend doing the frequent BW's though.. To Dura: I base this opinion on my current knowledge on physiology and pharmacology.. That + many articles I have read on the subject (not all directly related to cruising) IMO give me a pretty confident feeling in saying what i did. The fact that I will be doctor in 2.5 years (will be able to work already next summer) doenst make an expert on steroids but it does give me a good base to evauate the information Ive stumbled upon..

[stupidhippo]

if you do cruise,you will need to experiment with doses to see what is needed to keep the mass you gain while on a cycle,it will be alot more then "close to physiological amounts" for me its btwn 750mg and 1g of test,depending on my training and diet.

True... but not all are at as advanced level as u are.. The way u are cruising I cant say that I feel it is safe.. it could be but I wouldnt recommend it to ppl.. those are pretty high doses.. I havent cruised myself but after my normal test has recovered I still cant keep the mass Ive aquired.. So definetly know that u big guys need more than just HRT dose to cruise. Im also pretty strong, not as strong as u though.. benching a lil over 400.

[stupidhippo]

I'm still learning what is best for me. Last pct was tough - I got depressed and anxious. Yet, I'd need to do the blood work to determine the viability of staying on. That's probably what it comes down to, it's highly individualistic and a matter of trial and error. I do have this sense that it's possible that permanent damage to the testes and one's endogenous test is a possibility.

what u need to think of is your goals and what u want from the future? Do u wanna run the (possible risk) of HRT for the rest of ur life.. Also I presonally would be a lil scared of not being able to have children if u are planning on them... Not saying that would happen but there is a lot of hear and say evidence about that. I mean I agree with devldog that when in PCT when test is low its definelty not a healthy state to be in..

[smiler]

very nice to finally see guys talking about it. i never come off "totally" switch up, cruise, whatever i feel is necesary and what bloodwork says. kinda gets old hearing everyone say
"i won't say doses to protect newbies" in fact i think that is worse.

[Swifto]

if you do cruise,you will need to experiment with doses to see what is needed to keep the mass you gain while on a cycle,it will be alot more then "close to physiological amounts" for me its btwn 750mg and 1g of test,depending on my training and diet.

What happens when you come "off"? Or, have you self precribed yourself a HRT/TRT dose of Testosterone for life?

[stupidhippo]

What happens when you come "off"? Or, have you self precribed yourself a HRT/TRT dose of Testosterone for life?

All reports with BB who have come off after years of AAS use the natty test levels haev eventually gotten back to normal limits. In some cases it took more than a year though... also dont know how extensively this has been studied and after heariong so much anecdotal evidence I wouldnt be on for years without being prepared for HRT... just in case. Also if was planning on to have kids I would prolly not do it (although havent seen a single case of permament infertility caused by AAS use)

[smiler]

All reports with BB who have come off after years of AAS use the natty test levels haev eventually gotten back to normal limits. In some cases it took more than a year though... also dont know how extensively this has been studied and after heariong so much anecdotal evidence I wouldnt be on for years without being prepared for HRT... just in case. Also if was planning on to have kids I would prolly not do it (although havent seen a single case of permament infertility caused by AAS use)

i agree, forgot to mention i'm already "fixed" and been on trt for years now

[vitor]

I woudnt even think about cruising unless I knew I had self-prescri** HRT when coming off.

Even if test levels come back after a year, how much muscle tissue would you be able to keep with low testosteron levels for a whole year? Not to mention libido issues and depresssion...

[Swifto]

I woudnt even think about cruising unless I knew I had self-prescri** HRT when coming off.

Even if test levels come back after a year, how much muscle tissue would you be able to keep with low testosteron levels for a whole year? Not to mention libido issues and depresssion...

Couldnt agree more. Unless your a Pro or close to being one. I wouldnt ever cycle like this.

[DEVLDOG]

the fact is no matter how you cycle or whatever,when the day finally comes for you to say no more.no matter how low your doses were or how high,you will look like a normal individual.there is no possible way to maintain the mass that you aquired naturally just look at K. levrone and other pro BB'rs.they go from looking like freak of natures that we would all love to look like to the average gym rat..so the way I see it,get as big as you can now before father time catches up to you and its no longer possible.

as to swiftos question,I have a 5yr plan,in 3 more yrs I will evaluate my health and goals and at that time decide what I will do.HRT?? nah..I will be fine and if not,then thats not so bad.I really dont see myself ever being fully "clean" it has become a life style for me now.like I said,Ive been at this since 1987, it all feels natural to me..no pun intended.

[Swifto]

the fact is no matter how you cycle or whatever,when the day finally comes for you to say no more.no matter how low your doses were or how high,you will look like a normal individual.there is no possible way to maintain the mass that you aquired naturally just look at K. levrone and other pro BB'rs.they go from looking like freak of natures that we would all love to look like to the average gym rat..so the way I see it,get as big as you can now before father time catches up to you and its no longer possible.

as to swiftos question,I have a 5yr plan,in 3 more yrs I will evaluate my health and goals and at that time decide what I will do.HRT?? nah..I will be fine and if not,then thats not so bad.I really dont see myself ever being fully "clean" it has become a life style for me now.like I said,Ive been at this since 1987, it all feels natural to me..no pun intended.

Seems like you got your shit together. Just be careful and make sure you dont regret any decissions you make as you may have to live with them.

Good Luck.

[vic99]

DevilDog-
If you cruise on 1g, I cannot imagine what your cycles are like? Do you just add other compounds when on cycle? Do you increase test and add other compounds? I have considered cruising. I am 34 and while on feel loads better than off. My only real issue is that I do get excess rbc while on which requires a trip to the blood bank.

[smiler]

DevilDog-
If you cruise on 1g, I cannot imagine what your cycles are like? Do you just add other compounds when on cycle? Do you increase test and add other compounds? I have considered cruising. I am 34 and while on feel loads better than off. My only real issue is that I do get excess rbc while on which requires a trip to the blood bank.

so you simply donate blood to lower you red blood count? i had no idea but have heard of this