Low Test at age 24

[kwacker]

Height: 6’ 0’’
Weight: 278lbs
Age: 24

Total Test: 288 Reference range: 241-827 NG/DL
Estradiol: 14 Reference range: 0-54 PG/ML

Since my test is low for my age my doc said when I get my weight down below 270 he is going to put me on test injections (100mg/week). After 10 weeks he is going to switch me to HCG for 3 weeks to try to get my natural test levels up. Then we will evaluate after that.

What do you think of this program?

I thank you all in advance for your replies.

*I have never done steroids…Doc checked my prolactin levels and they came back normal…I would be the last person you would guess to have low test…not quite sure why my test levels were so low.

[TranscriptionFactor]

IMO he/she should have checked Free Test level too, which is more important.
Strange - at your age, esp considering your last line. Did you have any suspicion at all level might be low?

I once suggested to my Primary care doc that I would like to know my levels, actually because truly for a long period of time I had low energy, was depressed and periodically felt physically weak (I could still get it up but never had morning wood anymore) and he just looked me over and said he didn't think that was necessary, I suppose b/c my nads were good size.

In other words, the docs I know (and I am actually a doc in a different specialty) were loathe to do any testing they didn't feel was necessary. Guess I should have pushed hard for an endo spec. or trumped up the symptoms.

Prolactin is normal so I'm assuming you dont have Gyno? Or do you have a lot of fat on the chest?

Anyway let us know how you are doing with the Test inj. Good idea to get your weight down...good advice here on the diet forums.

[smokeyd]

you real overweight?

[kwacker]

I am actually going to this doctor for weight loss… The doc, I believe, tested my testosterone because I carry most of my fat in my mid section (stomach). He said he can almost look at a male and tell if they have low test.

I have had these symptoms: lethargic, low energy, lower test scores compared to high school (not as sharp minded), libido has slowed some. But I never knew that they were related to test until my levels came back low and I did some research. I think my test levels are low because I was stressed all the time (due to college/just graduated), which raises cortisol (catabolic). I’m not sure if I am correct on this.

I do have some fat on my chest but it’s not like gyno. My estrogen levels were low normal.

I’m a big framed guy. According to my last doc visit I have 58lbs of fat to lose. FAT% 39 I started at 303lbs and now I am down to 278 lbs.

[zaggahamma]

is he going to test for abnormalities of the pituitary or prostate b4 injecting you with testosterone, i hope?

[Pac Man]

Being overweight can lead to low testosterone and vice versa.
The cycle idea sounds about right, the testosterone will put you back into the normal range and cause you to lose bf and gain lbm, if it's your weight that's causing the problem than it may clear up when your in better shape.
Good luck.
btw jpk, do you know how long it takes to get results on pituitary test?
I haven't done one yet and I'm hoping I can finish everything up with my Uro tomorrow since I leave out of town for 2 weeks sunday.

[kwacker]

If you have a tumor on your pituitary gland your prolactin levels will be off. Everything checked out there. The blood test takes about 24 hours depending on how busy the lab is.

He also said that he is not going to worry about my prostate because I was too young to have cancer.

The doc is going to give me a prescription for test and let me do the injections myself.

The whole goal is weight loss…therefore what would be the best way to gain lean muscle mass while on my cycle? (heavy weight lifting and some cardio or lots of cardio and some weight lifting) *I have not lifted since my football days in high school (5 years ago), so I am kind of lost when it comes to working out.

[Pac Man]

Little bit of both, you don't want to lose too much fat without gaining some LBM, otherwise you'll have some excess skin. Depending on how many days a week you plan on exercising I would try to get at least 2-3 days of cardio in as well as 2-3 days of resistance training.
If you all of a sudden realize you have tons of energy (Which is not unheard of when starting test) than you could do your resistance training routine and end with 20-30 minutes of light cardio.
Good luck on your weight loss, make sure you take pics now so you can go back and see the change.

[zaggahamma]

Being overweight can lead to low testosterone and vice versa.
The cycle idea sounds about right, the testosterone will put you back into the normal range and cause you to lose bf and gain lbm, if it's your weight that's causing the problem than it may clear up when your in better shape.
Good luck.
btw jpk, do you know how long it takes to get results on pituitary test?
I haven't done one yet and I'm hoping I can finish everything up with my Uro tomorrow since I leave out of town for 2 weeks sunday.

they gave me a script to take to the hospital for and mri within the same week and the appointment takes under an hour....the procedure is only 10-20minutes

[zaggahamma]

If you have a tumor on your pituitary gland your prolactin levels will be off. Everything checked out there. The blood test takes about 24 hours depending on how busy the lab is.

He also said that he is not going to worry about my prostate because I was too young to have cancer.

The doc is going to give me a prescription for test and let me do the injections myself.

The whole goal is weight loss…therefore what would be the best way to gain lean muscle mass while on my cycle? (heavy weight lifting and some cardio or lots of cardio and some weight lifting) *I have not lifted since my football days in high school (5 years ago), so I am kind of lost when it comes to working out.

I never heard that b4 wish i didnt have to do the mri...not real big deal but wasnt fun either

and my uro had a 30 year old patient with prostate cancer and it scared the hell out of me cuz he said he felt something during the finger check and i had a biopsy....well, it came out negative...thank goodness...i had like a 3 page thread on it....if you ever want to check it out....i'm sure he'll do a psa on the bloodwork at least?

good luck to you

and agree with iron....absolutely do both....how's the diet....i had similar stats a few years ago....and lost 70lbs...so i know you can do it....add some healthy choices to your diet and take a few of the bad away and SLOWLY improve it.....after time you will crave the nutrient dense food MORE than the junk, imo.....i love watermelon, fresh strawberries, pretty much all fruit now...dont be way too restrictive at first....taper down the calories so you wont even notice....i never went hungry and lost 70lbs...just my .02

hope it helps

[kwacker]

Yeah I was kind of freaked out when the doc said that I was too young for prostate cancer. There was someone my age that died recently from prostate cancer (read this in the school newspaper). But he said he is not worried about it.

The doc put me on some meds to reduce my appetite which cut my daily food intake by half. My metabolic rate is just over 3000. So I have been eating better but not great. I recently read some of the diet posts and I am going to start a stricter diet. Many people recommended eating 1-1.5 g of protein/lb of body weight and my doctor recommended 1g/kilogram of body weight, which equals out to around 123 grams of protein. Is that enough? *Remember, weight loss is the goal for now.

Thank you all for your wisdom and encouragement. I’m sure I will have many more questions once I start the testosterone injections.

[zaggahamma]

are you saying that you were consuming around 5,000 calories a day? At 270, I dont see how you would need meds to control appetite or think you would need them...if you need 3,000 to maintain your 270...I would cut 300-400 cals off the first week or 2 then a few weeks at 2,500....then maybe 2200...i wouldnt dip below 2000 and my favorite motto is not tp eat less its exercise more and never be hungry
were glad to help bro...keep us posted

[kwacker]

My metabolic rate was 3010 kcal/day at 303 lbs (I was maintaining that weight). This was taken on 6/17/08 when I started seeing this doc. After prescribing me meds to control my appetite I have dropped to 278 lbs on 7/29/08. I probably eat between 1500-2000 calories a day now.

[Pac Man]

Slow motabolism or completely sedentary lifestyle. Have you had your thyroid checked?

[***xxx***]

I d drop the weight before I d start hrt at your age. I could bet your test levels will recover when u r at 200lbs...

[zaggahamma]

My metabolic rate was 3010 kcal/day at 303 lbs (I was maintaining that weight). This was taken on 6/17/08 when I started seeing this doc. After prescribing me meds to control my appetite I have dropped to 278 lbs on 7/29/08. I probably eat between 1500-2000 calories a day now.

glad its working for you....so you lost 25 lbs in month and a half....little too fast imho....would be nice if you can continue to check your metabolic rate because you dont want that to decrease too much and i fear with consuming only 1500 calories that it will....
i dont want to end this on a negative thought....maybe i'm wrong...but in all my reading and actual life experience, slow is better....has this thought process been discussed with your doc or do you want to lose the weight for an event?

[kwacker]

Slow motabolism or completely sedentary lifestyle. Have you had your thyroid checked?

This is my Basal metabolic rate. I did have my thyroid checked and it was normal.

[kwacker]

I d drop the weight before I d start hrt at your age. I could bet your test levels will recover when u r at 200lbs...

That is what I am hoping. I really do not want to be on hrt for the rest of my life.

[kwacker]

glad its working for you....so you lost 25 lbs in month and a half....little too fast imho....would be nice if you can continue to check your metabolic rate because you dont want that to decrease too much and i fear with consuming only 1500 calories that it will....
i dont want to end this on a negative thought....maybe i'm wrong...but in all my reading and actual life experience, slow is better....has this thought process been discussed with your doc or do you want to lose the weight for an event?

I checked my weight this morning and I am now down to 273 lbs. That means in 7 weeks I have lost 30 lbs at approx 4.3 lbs a week. I realize that is a little too fast, but it is hard not to lose weight that quick. I have not even worked out yet. The doc said to only do 10-15 min of cardio/day because if I do more it would be counterproductive, meaning I would eat more. (He specializes in weight loss/trt)

[kwacker]

One problem I did have with my labs was my insulin. It was high, and I had fasted for over 12 hours before getting by labs drawn.

[zaggahamma]

Peddle your snake oil somewhere else, we didn't give you permission to spam our board.

wtf?

[kwacker]

Peddle your snake oil somewhere else, we didn't give you permission to spam our board.

What is going on??

[zaggahamma]

What is going on??

dont know if he posted here by mistake or what

[kwacker]

When I get weighed at the docs they give you a print out that shows your FFM or Fat Free Mass and according to that it seems like I have only lost a half of a pound of muscle. Do you think this is bad for losing 30 lbs. I’m sure there will be some muscle loss during weight loss, because it is a fine balance. This may be a dumb question, can you gain muscle mass and still lose weight at the same time. I have read that the more weight you lose the harder it is to gain muscle. *keep in mind I am eating to lose weight not gain muscle (not as much protein, etc.

[natureboy]

Yes if you get a good diet and a good workout plan you can put on Lbm while dropping fat. Once you go on you meds it will be even easier to put on Lbm while losing fat. Good luck.

[zaggahamma]

When I get weighed at the docs they give you a print out that shows your FFM or Fat Free Mass and according to that it seems like I have only lost a half of a pound of muscle. Do you think this is bad for losing 30 lbs. I’m sure there will be some muscle loss during weight loss, because it is a fine balance. This may be a dumb question, can you gain muscle mass and still lose weight at the same time. I have read that the more weight you lose the harder it is to gain muscle. *keep in mind I am eating to lose weight not gain muscle (not as much protein, etc.

agree with above that you can lose fat while gaining lbm....but don't believe you can lose weight while adding lbm....just my .02
but if you've only lost that little muscle for 30lbs...i think you're doing good...how long are you going to be on that low calories?

[kwacker]

agree with above that you can lose fat while gaining lbm....but don't believe you can lose weight while adding lbm....just my .02
but if you've only lost that little muscle for 30lbs...i think you're doing good...how long are you going to be on that low calories?

Yeah I mean body fat when I said weight…I would not care if I stayed the same weight and kept losing body fat and gaining muscle. 270 lbs and lean would be awesome. Since I am a big framed guy, my doc recommended dropping down to 220 lbs and reevaluate from there.

As long as I keep losing body fat and not muscle then I will keep up the low cal.

[kwacker]

Started testosterone yesterday…doc gave me my first shot to show me how to do it…and now I’m on my own. Cannot wait for the benefits.

[kwacker]

Well like I said I started test on 8/12. Doc gave me my first shot and ordered my test to have it sent to my house. As of today I still have not received the test. I really didn’t think I could feel a difference when I got my first shot, but Monday I started coming down and was supposed to take my next injection on Tuesday, and now everyday gets worse and worse… I hope it comes soon, nothing like teasing me with some hormones. I cannot believe how much better I feel after one injection…can’t wait until it really kicks in.

I’ll keep you all posted on my dosage when I get my test, but I think I am on 160mg/week.

[zaggahamma]

Well like I said I started test on 8/12. Doc gave me my first shot and ordered my test to have it sent to my house. As of today I still have not received the test. I really didn’t think I could feel a difference when I got my first shot, but Monday I started coming down and was supposed to take my next injection on Tuesday, and now everyday gets worse and worse… I hope it comes soon, nothing like teasing me with some hormones. I cannot believe how much better I feel after one injection…can’t wait until it really kicks in.

I’ll keep you all posted on my dosage when I get my test, but I think I am on 160mg/week.

i'd be calling and checking on that....dont wait by idle...you're paying for this shiat and the service....its not charity where you take what you get and dont throw a fit
maybe theres somewhere you can pick it up since it hasnt come then maybe it will come ta boot and you'll have some reserves

good luck bro

[kwacker]

I finally got it this afternoon…I’m glad the ride down is over. It was the first time I have ever given myself an injection. I was pretty nervous, but I got it done. I have 10ml of Test C at 200mg/ml therefore I am on 160mg/week.

[zaggahamma]

glad it came bro ...no more worries keep working hard....i know you know the med doesnt replace the hardwork
best of luck
keep us posted

[FullMoonHowlingWolf]

First off I'm glad to hear that you are feeling better and congratulations on your weight loss thus far. I wish that I had seen this post earlier b/c as ***xxx*** mentioned above I believe that you could have recovered your natural test levels without TRT. You mentioned high stress and cortisol which both can have a huge impact on your body, plus being overweight, not having a good diet and not working out all lead to lower test levels. Also, what would concern me are your docs comments "He said he can almost look at a male and tell if they have low test." and that you are too young for prostate cancer. No one is too young for cancer, so maybe you want to have him check, especially if you’ve got insurance and it’s covered. I had a friend die at 21 from cancer and he was extremely healthy and athletic. You mentioned “One problem I did have with my labs was my insulin” Have you been tested for diabetes? Maybe you should go see another doc and get a second opinion. It sounds like things are going much better for you, which is great, but keep in mind that you are a paying customer and it's important to have everything checked to root out the problem.

[kwacker]

Yeah I totally agree with you. There have been a few things this doctor has said that I do not agree with (especially the prostate cancer thing). Yeah prostate cancer in younger people is rare, but there have been cases of younger people getting prostate cancer. The TRT program the doc discussed with me is: Test C for six months then HCG to kick my testicles back into gear. In six months I will have dropped all my weight. Then the doc was going to evaluate to see if my test levels are normal after I lose all my weight. The doc did say that I am not diabetic, but if I kept up my bad eating habits and weight, then I would be on my way for diabetes. Right now I just graduated college and I am in the search for a career, therefore unfortunately I do not have insurance. Yes…ouch…it has been expensive.

[kwacker]

Also in the past year I have noticed my hair thinning. It is not too bad, but I do not want it to get worse. I have read that test can cause male pattern baldness. My question is should I take a product that blocks DHT? Or should I just say screw it and whatever happens…happens?

Another question I have: Could test mess up my chances of having kids later on in life?

[FullMoonHowlingWolf]

The likely hood of you having prostate cancer is low, but still he could check and you can ask him to do so. If you are on Test Cyp for 6 months at a dose of 160 mgs a week your natural test production will be shut down. The longer you are on the harder it is to restart your natural test production. IMO I think you should get a second opinion and see an Endo, who will probably be more thorough with blood testing, info, etc., but it's up to you. You can probably be on for 8-10 weeks and then take the HCG or clomid to kick back in your natural test. Then get retested after PCT and see where your natural levels are. You are young, not older. How much are you currently weighing? 270? Below is some info I copied from Test Cyp profile regarding hair loss, which if you are already losing your hair, it's probably going to speed up the process. What I’ve always noticed with people using gear is if they had acne to begin with and they used gear they got a lot more, if they had high blood pressure and they used gear, their blood pressure raised, if their hair was thinning, it started falling out, etc.

"Since testosterone is the primary male androgen, we should also expect to see pronounced androgenic side effects with this drug. Much intensity is related to the rate in which the body converts testosterone into dihydrotestosterone (DHT). This, as you know, is the devious metabolite responsible for the high prominence of androgenic side effects associated with testosterone use. This includes the development of oily skin, acne, body/facial hair growth and male pattern balding. Those worried that they may have a genetic predisposition toward male pattern baldness may wish to avoid testosterone altogether. Others opt to add the ancillary drug Propecia®, which is a relatively new compound that prevents the conversion of testosterone to dihydrotestosterone (see: Proscar®). This can greatly reduce the chance for running into a hair loss problem, and will probably lower the intensity of other androgenic side effects."

[FullMoonHowlingWolf]

You also asked "Another question I have: Could test mess up my chances of having kids later on in life? Probably not. You should checkout various profiles for Test Cyp and gain all the knowledge you can as this is going in your body. It's good to know what you are taking and how it can effect you, good and bad.

[FullMoonHowlingWolf]

Personally I don't think you need TRT, just a lot of change in your life. School is over, so you shouldn't have that stress anymore. Continue losing weight through diet and exercise and this will do wonders for you. I had a friend a little older than you who weighed 290. He gained weight b/c he was stressed (his cortisol levels were high) and he began eating and drinking way too much. He jumped from 220 to 290 in approximately seven months. He complained that he was tired, had no energy, no sex drive, etc. I trained him and it took several months, but he dropped to 212 and was in the best shape of his life. He did this all without gear or clen. Read up on cortisol, you'll find some interesting info. You are doing great, so always stay positive as your brain is your biggest asset.

[zaggahamma]

great advice wolf....about the proscar....doesnt that have a bad side effect as well, though?

[FullMoonHowlingWolf]

great advice wolf....about the proscar....doesnt that have a bad side effect as well, though?

Thank you jpkman, I don't know about the sides as I don't know anyone that's used it and I have no experience with it myself. I copied that info just so that he could read it and have an understanding.