Pre cycle progress

[OzBuilder]

hey all,

I hope i am posting this in the right section. I'd like to start a thread on my progress leading up to my cycle which i intend to start on the 3rd of January. I am going overseas in the week up until then and will be unable to train properly

i am 22 years old and 181cm tall and have been training steadily for 2.5 years. I would not consider my lifestyle the cleanest, but this has changed over the last 6 months. I have not done a cycle before and am really excited to give it a go.

these images below were taken on the 4/9/09. i was approximatly 89kgs (196lbs) @ 24%






following this i began a basic dietry cut, although nothing as complex as a keto diet i went basically on feel, maintaing a 6-7 meal per day considerabily cutting carbs after the second meal. I implemented low intensity cardio 3-4 times per week for 30 mins (usually a cycle)

after over 3 months i am currently 81kgs (178lbs) @ approximately 16-16.5% b.f. (images taken, 22/12/09)






my short term goal is to reach 85kgs (187lbs) at 12-13%

i have obtained some nandrolin (50mg/ml) (Aussie vet grade version of Deca) and intend on cycling this with clenbuterol (also vet grade) as follows:

Week Deca mg/week
1 200 4ml
2 200 4ml
3 300 6ml
4 400 8ml
5 400 8ml
6 300 6ml
7 300 6ml
8 200 4ml
9 200 4ml

Total 50ml

Clenbuterol mcg/daily
week
1 nil
2 nil
3 nil
4 nil
5 80mcgs (1st day) -> 100 (2nd day) -> 120 (3,4,5,6,7)
6 120mcg
7 nil
8 nil
9 120mcgs
10 120mcgs
11 nil
12 nil (2wks on then 2 weeks off until 18 weeks) up to 18


CLENBUTEROL: 2 weeks on, then 2 weeks off
DECA: shoot deca twice weekly

Q1: what do you think of my progress pics, and what areas should i be focus on defining or adding size, i realise my legs are a weak point.

Q2: should i split up the Deca dosages into Monday/Thursday. the graph in the steroid profile on this website shows it is good for 1 week. my research inidicates that "you need to shoot it at least twice weekly to keep blood levels up because of the phenylprop" (dosage split in 2)

Q3: are the break up of the charts decent?

Q4:do you get the full 25ml out of each vial? And is it bad to take e.g. 4ml out of 1 vial till its finished and the another 2ml out of the next vial or is that bad practice

Q5:with clen, do you have to build up to max dose at the start of the 2 weeks or can you start at the full dose at the subsequent 2 weeks
can go straight to max dose the second time

Q6:what times of day should the clen be split into and should more be portioned to morning opposed to night?

Q7: what is the best avenue i should go down for Post cycle therapy that my doctor would be able to provide through perscription.

i appreciate any and all advice, i have already done quite alot of research and feel i have answers to most of the above questions but am looking for confirmation.

Some more pics below......

[OzBuilder]

BEFORE FRONT

AFTER BACK


During and post cycle images will follow

im not sure if forum rules permit this second post? let me know if not an i will remove

[oak2429]

run a test only cycle. save the deca

[nonotone]

----

[Mooseman33]

do not run a deca only cycle.
with or without clen it is a horrible idea.

NO DECA CYCLE MAN

[OzBuilder]

thanks for the prompt replies..

especially konateh, thanks for taking the time.

the deca i have is nandralone decanoate

i am able to get test proprionate from my guy, and i have drafted up a table of what my cycle should look like, any thoughts on this?



in my readings i am having difficulty understanding why deca needs to be cycled with test. is is because it is a progestin or is it because its supressive on your natural test levels? or both?

also please let me know if you think those dosages are too high for a 1st timer

i am sure this topic has been over spoken about at some point but if anyone can summaries it for me, i'd greatly appreciate it

thanks again

[Monster87]

lol @ the leonidas pics.
lookin good, keep us posted.

[dieselz]

dude dont run a deca only cycle.. thats so odd.

youre way better off using test.. every juice salesmen has some cyp, go hard..

[Valac]

id just do deca 300mg straight the whole time

[99vorsi]

yea stay the same throughtout.

[ph34rsh4ck]

[GT2]

the last thing you need is a cycle...dear God

[OzBuilder]

yea i'm after constructive advice...

i didn't come on here to be ridiculed, I ask these questions because i want to learn and reduce risk of doing damage.

comments like "the last thing you need is a cycle...dear God" do not help me... the least you could do is elaborate...

this is the type of thing some arrogant prick feels the need to write every time a new person comes for advice. I've read it in other threads such as this and it really turns me off...

I appreaciate any and all CONSTRUCTIVE advice. can someone please answer my questions..........

[Rockin Z28]

dont listen to that douche, i bet he looked 10 times worse before he decided to cycle, not to mention you look pretty freakin solid for 178 pounds imo and you look more 14ish % BF..i would ditch the deca and clen alltogether and just run test E at 500mg a week for 10 weeks with a good PCT lined up

[Okinawa_Power]

dont listen to that douche, i bet he looked 10 times worse before he decided to cycle, not to mention you look pretty freakin solid for 178 pounds imo and you look more 14ish % BF..i would ditch the deca and clen alltogether and just run test E at 500mg a week for 10 weeks with a good PCT lined up

Good advice, however I would run the Test E for 12 weeks. You will not see results until after week 5-6. Just my .02

[OzBuilder]

thanks for the above advice. unfortunantly i am unable to obtain test E. I am going to start Deca + test Prop. my reading indicates that this will a proven cycle and generally safe.

please see my plan below.

[OzBuilder]

CURRENT STATS:
Age: 22
Height: 5’11
Weight: 178 lbs (81kgs)
Body fat Percentage: 17%
TDEE: 2987
BMR: 1927.04
Goal: 20+lbs in 8 weeks with deca + test propionate cycle as below

Week Deca mg/week Test Propionate mg/week
1.........200................................250
2.........300................................250
3.........300................................250
4.........400................................500
5.........400................................500
6.........300................................250
7.........300................................250
8.........200................................250
Deca-Durabolin split to Monday/Thursday
Testosterone Propionate split EOD

Diet Plan

Meal 1 (9:30)
6 whole eggs = 36g protein, 0g carbohydrates, 30g Fat, Cal 444
1 serve oats = 4g protein, 19g carbohydrates, 3g Fat, Cal 129
1 serve apple juice = 0g protein, 30g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 123
1 Banana = 1g protein, 27g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 105
Total macros = 41g protein, 77g carbohydrates, 30g Fat, Cal 801

1 magnesium tab, 1 fish oil tab, 1 zinc tab, vitamin c (1000mg)

Workout (11:00)
(see program below)
every 3rd day: 25 minute cycle prior to meal 1, with BCAA + G

PWO (12:00)
WPI Protein Shake = 40g protein, 40g carbohydrates, 9g Fat, Cal 415

Meal 2 (13:00)
390g chicken breast = 87g protein, 0g carbohydrates, 4g Fat, Cal 412
Half Avocado = 1g protein, 7g carbohydrates, 13g Fat, Cal 145
50g brown rice = 2g protein, 17g carbohydrates, 2g Fat, Cal 94
Total Macros = 90g protein, 19g carbohydrates, 19g Fat, Cal 651

Meal 3 (15:00)
WPC protein shake = 48g protein, 5g carbohydrates, 1g Fat, Cal 230 (1.5 scoops)
2 rice crackers = 1g protein, 10g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 44
Total Macros = 49g protein, 15g carbohydrates, 1g Fat, Cal 274

Meal 4 (17:00)
2 tins canned tuna = 34g protein, 0g carbohydrates, 10g Fat, Cal 226
150g cottage cheese = 8g protein, 5g carbohydrates, 2g Fat, Cal 64
1 tin mixed beans = 6g protein, 12g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 89
Total Macros = 48g protein, 17g carbohydrates, 12g Fat, Cal 379

Meal 5 (19:30)
200g mixed beef = 40g protein, 0g carbohydrates, 15g Fat, Cal 300 (estimate)
30g tomato pasta sauce = 3g protein, 3g carbohydrates, 3g Fat, Cal 35 (estimate)
50g pasta = 2g protein, 15g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 75
200g salad = 2g protein, 5g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 30
Total Macros = 47g protein, 23g carbohydrates, 18g Fat, Cal 440

Meal 6 (22:30)
150g cottage cheese = 8g protein, 5g carbohydrates, 2g Fat, Cal 64
150g sliced turkey breast = 29g protein, 2g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 135
Total Macros = 37g protein, 7g carbohydrates, 2g Fat, Cal 199

1 magnesium tab, 1 fish oil tab, 1 zinc tab

Total Macros for the Whole Day
352g protein, 198g carbohydrates, 91g Fat, TOTAL CALORIES 3159, TDEE 2987

IF POSSIBLE COULD SOMEONE TELL ME THE BEST AREAS WOULD BE TOO ADD SOME MORE CALORIES
I WAS THINKING OF ADDING ANOTHER WPC SHAKE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT

[OzBuilder]

MONDAY - SHOULDERS TRICEPS
Smith machine vertical press...............12 8 8 5
vertical flies.....................................12 12 10 6
Tricept push down............................10 8 6 6
over-head tricept extention................8 6 4
military press...................................10 8 5
Dumbell shrugs.................................12 12 12
skull crusher....................................10 8 6

TUESDAY - BACK + BICEPS
wide grip pull ups.............................max max max
lateral pull down...............................12 10 8 6
seated row......................................12 10 8 6
standing ez bar curls.........................10 10 8 8
seated machine curls.........................10 10 8 6
Bent over flies..................................12 10 8
bent over row...................................12 10 8
pinwheel curls (each arm)....................10 10 10

WEDNESDAY - REST

THURSDAY - CHEST + TRICEPS
Bench press....................................12 8 8 4
incline bench press...........................10 6 6 4
weighted dips..................................max max max
Tricept push down...........................10 8 6 6
over-head tricept extention.................8 6 4
Flies............................................. ..8 6 6
skull crusher....................................10 8 6

FRIDAY - LEGS + BICEPS
Squat ............................................12 8 8 6
hack squat.......................................10 10 6 6
preacher curl.....................................10 8 6 6
Leg curls..........................................10 10 8 8
leg extention.....................................10 8 6
seated machine curls........................10 10 8 6
Calf extention.................................12 8 6
pinwheel curls (each arm)..................10 10 10

SATURDAY - REST

SUNDAY - REST

[gbrice75]

IF POSSIBLE COULD SOMEONE TELL ME THE BEST AREAS WOULD BE TOO ADD SOME MORE CALORIES
I WAS THINKING OF ADDING ANOTHER WPC SHAKE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT

How about adding some Casein protein right before bed or in the middle of the night instead of the whey?

[Okinawa_Power]

CURRENT STATS:
Age: 22
Height: 5’11
Weight: 178 lbs (81kgs)
Body fat Percentage: 17%
TDEE: 2987
BMR: 1927.04
Goal: 20+lbs in 8 weeks with deca + test propionate cycle as below

Week Deca mg/week Test Propionate mg/week
1.........200................................250
2.........300................................250
3.........300................................250
4.........400................................500
5.........400................................500
6.........300................................250
7.........300................................250
8.........200................................250
Deca-Durabolin split to Monday/Thursday
Testosterone Propionate split EOD

Diet Plan

Meal 1 (9:30)
6 whole eggs = 36g protein, 0g carbohydrates, 30g Fat, Cal 444
1 serve oats = 4g protein, 19g carbohydrates, 3g Fat, Cal 129
1 serve apple juice = 0g protein, 30g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 123
1 Banana = 1g protein, 27g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 105
Total macros = 41g protein, 77g carbohydrates, 30g Fat, Cal 801

1 magnesium tab, 1 fish oil tab, 1 zinc tab, vitamin c (1000mg)

Workout (11:00)
(see program below)
every 3rd day: 25 minute cycle prior to meal 1, with BCAA + G

PWO (12:00)
WPI Protein Shake = 40g protein, 40g carbohydrates, 9g Fat, Cal 415

Meal 2 (13:00)
390g chicken breast = 87g protein, 0g carbohydrates, 4g Fat, Cal 412
Half Avocado = 1g protein, 7g carbohydrates, 13g Fat, Cal 145
50g brown rice = 2g protein, 17g carbohydrates, 2g Fat, Cal 94
Total Macros = 90g protein, 19g carbohydrates, 19g Fat, Cal 651

Meal 3 (15:00)
WPC protein shake = 48g protein, 5g carbohydrates, 1g Fat, Cal 230 (1.5 scoops)
2 rice crackers = 1g protein, 10g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 44
Total Macros = 49g protein, 15g carbohydrates, 1g Fat, Cal 274

Meal 4 (17:00)
2 tins canned tuna = 34g protein, 0g carbohydrates, 10g Fat, Cal 226
150g cottage cheese = 8g protein, 5g carbohydrates, 2g Fat, Cal 64
1 tin mixed beans = 6g protein, 12g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 89
Total Macros = 48g protein, 17g carbohydrates, 12g Fat, Cal 379

Meal 5 (19:30)
200g mixed beef = 40g protein, 0g carbohydrates, 15g Fat, Cal 300 (estimate)
30g tomato pasta sauce = 3g protein, 3g carbohydrates, 3g Fat, Cal 35 (estimate)
50g pasta = 2g protein, 15g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 75
200g salad = 2g protein, 5g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 30
Total Macros = 47g protein, 23g carbohydrates, 18g Fat, Cal 440

Meal 6 (22:30)
150g cottage cheese = 8g protein, 5g carbohydrates, 2g Fat, Cal 64
150g sliced turkey breast = 29g protein, 2g carbohydrates, 0g Fat, Cal 135
Total Macros = 37g protein, 7g carbohydrates, 2g Fat, Cal 199

1 magnesium tab, 1 fish oil tab, 1 zinc tab

Total Macros for the Whole Day
352g protein, 198g carbohydrates, 91g Fat, TOTAL CALORIES 3159, TDEE 2987

IF POSSIBLE COULD SOMEONE TELL ME THE BEST AREAS WOULD BE TOO ADD SOME MORE CALORIES
I WAS THINKING OF ADDING ANOTHER WPC SHAKE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT

Oz I would run the Test P at 500mg a week also and keep the Deca at 250mg a week throughout the cycle. Just my .02 You seem to have your diet in check however I would raise your Carbs to at least 300gms a day, remember when bulking you need to up your carbs and keep your protein at 1 1/2 grams per bodyweight. Don't worry about getting up in the middle of the night, just take a good casien protein before bed along with some Cottage Cheese. Remember your body needs all the sleep it can get. You seem to know what you are doing in the gym. Good luck with this cycle and I wish you all the best.

[OzBuilder]

sounds like a good idea, i will add the casein to the diet

Okinawa, thanks for taking the time. why do you suggest to run Test P at 500mg a week also and keep the Deca at 250mg a week throughout the cycle? many of the examples that i have found online suggest doing it the way i have it. see below

http://www.anabolicsteroidspharma.com/cycles.htm <-- shit link

EDIT: AFTER MORE RESEARCH I AGREE WITH YOU, THANKS FOR THAT!! When ever using any 19nor compounds, always make sure your test dosage is abit higher than the 19nor

BELOW IS MY INTENDED CYCLE LOG. I WILL BE MIXING THE TEST P AND DECA IN THE SAME SYRINGE EVERY 5TH DAY. DOSAGES ARE EQUIVALENT TO DECA (250ml/week) TEST P (500ml/week)

[OzBuilder]

[OzBuilder]

just swapped my nandrolone decanoate (deca) for nandrolone Phenylpropionate (NPP). the shorter easter is what i'm after with this shorter cycle. cycle is going to look like this

NPP = 75ml EOD (260ml/week)
Test P = 150ml EOD (525ml/week)

will run it for 8 weeks and continue the test P for an extra 7 days.

can someone put me in the right direction for PCT. will NPP require something other than clomid and novladex because its a progestin (such as dostinex)?

[Okinawa_Power]

just swapped my nandrolone decanoate (deca) for nandrolone Phenylpropionate (NPP). the shorter easter is what i'm after with this shorter cycle. cycle is going to look like this

NPP = 75ml EOD (260ml/week)
Test P = 150ml EOD (525ml/week)

will run it for 8 weeks and continue the test P for an extra 7 days.

can someone put me in the right direction for PCT. will NPP require something other than clomid and novladex because its a progestin (such as dostinex)?

Run the normal PCT and you can add HCG at 5,000iu ed starting in week 4.

Also for progestin you can use Caber.

[DeepDiver]

sounds like a good idea, i will add the casein to the diet

Okinawa, thanks for taking the time. why do you suggest to run Test P at 500mg a week also and keep the Deca at 250mg a week throughout the cycle? many of the examples that i have found online suggest doing it the way i have it. see below

http://www.anabolicsteroidspharma.com/cycles.htm <-- shit link

EDIT: AFTER MORE RESEARCH I AGREE WITH YOU, THANKS FOR THAT!! When ever using any 19nor compounds, always make sure your test dosage is abit higher than the 19nor

BELOW IS MY INTENDED CYCLE LOG. I WILL BE MIXING THE TEST P AND DECA IN THE SAME SYRINGE EVERY 5TH DAY. DOSAGES ARE EQUIVALENT TO DECA (250ml/week) TEST P (500ml/week)

Casein does wonders for me at night

[Little Herc]

Looking good bro but u got to do something about those calves. They are so out of proportion u look like ur standing on toothpicks lol. But besides that lookin good. GL

[OzBuilder]

Looking good bro but u got to do something about those calves. They are so out of proportion u look like ur standing on toothpicks lol. But besides that lookin good. GL

thanks, haha yea i have to agree with you, definitely a weak point and i am in the process of rectifying it, along with the rest of my ****en legs lol

thanks okinawa, picking up some novla soon, is this enough to cover my npp and test p assuming i dont get other progestin related sides? its just i don't know if my dealer can get other shit

just had my 3rd shot, my test p desnt hurt at all when im injecting it, should i be concerned? npp is slightly more painful but nothing OTT

havnt noticed much difference so far, definantly gained a kg or two but most likely a result of change in diet. i weigh myself on monday will update then

[Okinawa_Power]

thanks, haha yea i have to agree with you, definitely a weak point and i am in the process of rectifying it, along with the rest of my ****en legs lol

thanks okinawa, picking up some novla soon, is this enough to cover my npp and test p assuming i dont get other progestin related sides? its just i don't know if my dealer can get other shit

just had my 3rd shot, my test p desnt hurt at all when im injecting it, should i be concerned? npp is slightly more painful but nothing OTT

havnt noticed much difference so far, definantly gained a kg or two but most likely a result of change in diet. i weigh myself on monday will update then

Oz good to see things are going good. Does your test P look like an oil? As for weight gain and strength gains look for that around week 2.5-3. You will feel the difference. Remember you have to eat to gain!!!!

[OzBuilder]

yep its definitely oil. exactly the same as the product below, although no-one has been able to determine how legit it is. the person i bought off remains ademant that he,his bro, and friends have made gains through use of it. and i do trust him. its only after searching it on here it appears to be an UGL product

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread...light=testobol

weighed myself @ 180.7 (82kgs) 17.6 b.f. so 2lb increase with +0.6b.f. 1 week in.

look forward to week 2.5+++

[pjpogz]

u look great pre cycle mate, all the best on this cycle....im on 500mg test and 250mgs deca per week....be patient its quite gradual. i noticed my strength go up and gained some solid weight after week 2. and im doing a lot of cardio in form of mma/bjj training. the first thing i noticed was improved recovery though.

good luck mate and keep us posted.

[OzBuilder]

thanks pjpogz! i appreciate the positive comments. was making some fantastic progress until mid last week. i came down with a virus (probably from all the air conditioning in this ****en humidity) and havn't been able to eat as much as i'd like to. so currently focusing on getting better so i can hit it up double as hard!