Short burst cycling- explained

[bigracso]

To Pinnacle:

can you make an example of your cycle carb diet? Thanks

Do the calories must always be the self in all three days (high, low, no carb)?

(so when you have high carb, self pro then you decrease the fat, when you have no carb, self pro then you increase the fat)

[realjo1000]

....

[BJJ]

Interesting read.

I am about to start my first burst cycle in a couple of weeks.

I knew I could find some info on your threads, I just needed to look them up...

Grazie

[fig]

Dosages- The dose for a short burst cycle is alot more than you would normally use in a standard length cycle, because of the prime and the body being in a very anabolic environment it can take on board alot more than usual and over loading androgens will fully push the body to grow, it also takes time for the body to adjust to the high level of hormones in relation to sides so before you are experiencing them your off cycle.

Marcus...

I interpret the last part there as...if you start Prop lets say the first of the month, but don't feel it until the 14th of the month, then for the first 14 days you weren't on cycle. Meaning the 30 days would be from the 14th of this month to the 14th of the next. Is that correct?

Reason I ask is b/c I was under the impression that even if you didn't "feel" the compound, it still starts to create a negative loop and shutdown from day 1.

Also, if I were to run a 30 day burst, I feel a full 4 week PCT would be necessary for me personally (could probably do less but why not). How long would you recommend I stay off after a 4 week PCT assuming I was on for 30 days? I'm thinking very little or none.

Thanks for any help you can offer!

[marcus300]

I was referring to sides, the body takes its time to throw out sides so being on for a short period of time can help with sides and recovery.The negative feedback loop will still shut your body down from the increased androgens but your far better shutting it down for 4 weeks than 12-14weeks, the longer your on the more sides and harder shut down.

If your prime the body correctly you will feel the compound from day 1, the whole idea about priming is to create an anabolic environment for tissue to grow so when you hit a burst cycle coupled with the increased nutrition you start growing from day 1.

Looking back over how you recover will help with designing your pct on a burst cycle, if you require 4 wks pct then that's what you need to implement. After the pct you start to prime again and repeat the process, obviously you dont need to run a 8wks prime on your 2nd prime but 4-6 weeks should do great, some do shorter some do longer depends on how you feel.

[fig]

I was referring to sides, the body takes its time to throw out sides so being on for a short period of time can help with sides and recovery.The negative feedback loop will still shut your body down from the increased androgens but your far better shutting it down for 4 weeks than 12-14weeks, the longer your on the more sides and harder shut down.

If your prime the body correctly you will feel the compound from day 1, the whole idea about priming is to create an anabolic environment for tissue to grow so when you hit a burst cycle coupled with the increased nutrition you start growing from day 1.

Looking back over how you recover will help with designing your pct on a burst cycle, if you require 4 wks pct then that's what you need to implement. After the pct you start to prime again and repeat the process, obviously you dont need to run a 8wks prime on your 2nd prime but 4-6 weeks should do great, some do shorter some do longer depends on how you feel.

I see...I totally misread. Thanks again. I'm going to run a burst starting Dec. 1st. I'll let you all know how it goes.

[baseline_9]

Gr8 thread marcus

I am going to be adopting shorter cycles

My nxt cycle will be 8 weeks long with short esters (longer than your blast style cycles)

I am priming right now, since reading your "priming thread" i think this is the way forward

Quicker recover sound like a good idea and i think that everyone should take this approach

[marcus300]

Gr8 thread marcus

I am going to be adopting shorter cycles

My nxt cycle will be 8 weeks long with short esters (longer than your blast style cycles)

I am priming right now, since reading your "priming thread" i think this is the way forward

Quicker recover sound like a good idea and i think that everyone should take this approach

All you can do is try it and see for yourself, many of the pro's springboard out of a competition diet into a blast type cycle to take advantage of the highly anabolic environment there in, this window doesnt stay open for long so when you feel the gains slow or stop come off the cycle and recover.

Ive tried the longer cycles and ive tried the short cycles linked with a bridge which in turn is a long cycle!! and I've never responded like I have when ive implemented a prime linked to a short/burst cycle.

Best of luck

[baseline_9]

All you can do is try it and see for yourself, many of the pro's springboard out of a competition diet into a blast type cycle to take advantage of the highly anabolic environment there in, this window doesnt stay open for long so when you feel the gains slow or stop come off the cycle and recover.

Ive tried the longer cycles and ive tried the short cycles linked with a bridge which in turn is a long cycle!! and I've never responded like I have when ive implemented a prime linked to a short/burst cycle.

Best of luck

My main concerns are HPTA recovery

Thats why i looked into the priming and the shorter cycles

Im taking as many precautions as possible so that i can recover as best possible (HCG will be run on cycle, i will incorporate a Swifto style PCT,meaning it will be 6 weeks long at a lower dose)

BW is all good ATM so we will see post cycle

[marcus300]

My main concerns are HPTA recovery

Thats why i looked into the priming and the shorter cycles

Im taking as many precautions as possible so that i can recover as best possible (HCG will be run on cycle, i will incorporate a Swifto style PCT,meaning it will be 6 weeks long at a lower dose)

BW is all good ATM so we will see post cycle

You probably wont need a 6 wks pct with a short cycle but that depends how short your going to be on and compounds used, if you prime correctly you wont need to be on cycle for 8 wks that will be way to much, just leave it open ended and stop the cycle when gains slow, i would think you will start seeing slower gains around the 4 wk mark so by the 6th you will be done IMHO.

[baseline_9]

You probably wont need a 6 wks pct with a short cycle but that depends how short your going to be on and compounds used, if you prime correctly you wont need to be on cycle for 8 wks that will be way to much, just leave it open ended and stop the cycle when gains slow, i would think you will start seeing slower gains around the 4 wk mark so by the 6th you will be done IMHO.

Id agree that ur probably rite about the PCT duration

I would rather be over cautious than under recovered if u kno what i mean

I am at the start of my AAS journey and want to make a good start

Anyway this is hijacking ur thread!!

[The_Bezerker]

i like short cycles but it is my beleif that half the people on here asking questions about short cycling shouldnt even be botherin. blast cycles and regular cycles are usally run incorrectly. Massive eating and digestion is all that matters along with a solid workout. Without that you could be blast cycling or running long cycles and it really wouldnt matter. Short cycles imo are for vertrans only not because their better or more scientifically "sophisticated" just every pound we pack on requires alot more energy and work. Id say for most screw the short cycle even tho it may sound badass just do wat ur comfortorbale with and triple your caloric intake. And btw marcus blast cycles dont need to be done w extreme doses i know your big into pb and dan d but i def do not beleive in neeeding large amounts of gear for big results.


i mean jeez no offense but if these picture avatars of you guys are up to date you shouldnt be wasting your time even thinking about this stuff, you should be re evaluating your diets workouts and general cycling

[marcus300]

i like short cycles but it is my beleif that half the people on here asking questions about short cycling shouldnt even be botherin. blast cycles and regular cycles are usally run incorrectly. Massive eating and digestion is all that matters along with a solid workout. Without that you could be blast cycling or running long cycles and it really wouldnt matter. Short cycles imo are for vertrans only not because their better or more scientifically "sophisticated" just every pound we pack on requires alot more energy and work. Id say for most screw the short cycle even tho it may sound badass just do wat ur comfortorbale with and triple your caloric intake. And btw marcus blast cycles dont need to be done w extreme doses i know your big into pb and dan d but i def do not beleive in neeeding large amounts of gear for big results.


i mean jeez no offense but if these picture avatars of you guys are up to date you shouldnt be wasting your time even thinking about this stuff, you should be re evaluating your diets workouts and general cycling

I said that blast cycles or short cycles can be used by anyone at any level, all you have to do is adjust the dose.The more advance bodybuilder will do more blast cycles with higher than normal dose but this isnt everyone, each to their own. This thread is called short burst cycles so thats why I talked about short burst cycles. But you can put this theory with any short cycle at any dose and at any level.

Drugs are a small part of bodybuilding.

[fig]

i like short cycles but it is my beleif that half the people on here asking questions about short cycling shouldnt even be botherin. blast cycles and regular cycles are usally run incorrectly. Massive eating and digestion is all that matters along with a solid workout. Without that you could be blast cycling or running long cycles and it really wouldnt matter. Short cycles imo are for vertrans only not because their better or more scientifically "sophisticated" just every pound we pack on requires alot more energy and work. Id say for most screw the short cycle even tho it may sound badass just do wat ur comfortorbale with and triple your caloric intake. And btw marcus blast cycles dont need to be done w extreme doses i know your big into pb and dan d but i def do not beleive in neeeding large amounts of gear for big results.


i mean jeez no offense but if these picture avatars of you guys are up to date you shouldnt be wasting your time even thinking about this stuff, you should be re evaluating your diets workouts and general cycling

The claim is shorter bursts are easier to recover from and less risky in terms of side effects. This is what interests me...looks like Baseline as well.

[oker]

Marcus - you mention GH during prime. If I couldn’t get a hold of it, would a TRT/HRT dose of test suffice during prime? I presume so since it is merely preparation for the hard burst cycle. My cycles are TRT/Cycle/TRT anyway, so burst cycles of 30 days at a time will fit nicely into my regimen.

[Stiffmeister]

I said that blast cycles or short cycles can be used by anyone at any level, all you have to do is adjust the dose.The more advance bodybuilder will do more blast cycles with higher than normal dose but this isnt everyone, each to their own. This thread is called short burst cycles so thats why I talked about short burst cycles. But you can put this theory with any short cycle at any dose and at any level.

Drugs are a small part of bodybuilding.

Marcus, do you believe in short cycles longer than 4 weeks, let's say 6-8 if the gains just keep on coming? I definitely agree that anything longer than 8 though is a waste of money in terms of the sides to gains ratio and leads to a more poor recovery. I'd say 4-8 is pretty optimal and gives enough leeway if you continue to gain past the fourth week. -Stiff

[marcus300]

Marcus - you mention GH during prime. If I couldn’t get a hold of it, would a TRT/HRT dose of test suffice during prime? I presume so since it is merely preparation for the hard burst cycle. My cycles are TRT/Cycle/TRT anyway, so burst cycles of 30 days at a time will fit nicely into my regimen.

Gh in the prime,cycle or pct is of great benefit when your using this method, if you can get as many growth factors as possible into your system when your in this environment it will help the growing process and maintenance.

Are you on HRT because you have low test or are your cruising between cycles by your own means?

[marcus300]

Marcus, do you believe in short cycles longer than 4 weeks, let's say 6-8 if the gains just keep on coming? I definitely agree that anything longer than 8 though is a waste of money in terms of the sides to gains ratio and leads to a more poor recovery. I'd say 4-8 is pretty optimal and gives enough leeway if you continue to gain past the fourth week. -Stiff

Short cycles aren't set at a certain length, the 30 day short burst cycle was an example of what I find to work for me to produce amazing gains when I was using the short burst theory.

You have to remember you can just run a short cycle it doesnt have to be a burst short cycle, running a short cycle after a prime can achieve great gains and the length of cycle can be anything up to 8wks but many use around 4-6wks as a guideline, because your using short ester you can cut the cycle length down and achieve the same results in a shorter peroid, you can run it open ended and stop the cycle when gains slow or stop if you see fit.

[Stiffmeister]

Short cycles aren't set at a certain length, the 30 day short burst cycle was an example of what I find to work for me to produce amazing gains when I was using the short burst theory.

You have to remember you can just run a short cycle it doesnt have to be a burst short cycle, running a short cycle after a prime can achieve great gains and the length of cycle can be anything up to 8wks but many use around 4-6wks as a guideline, because your using short ester you can cut the cycle length down and achieve the same results in a shorter peroid, you can run it open ended and stop the cycle when gains slow or stop if you see fit.

Alright awesome, thanks for the info. I finally see why those who use test prop in that way will never go back to long esters. Also, great thread on priming, more people need to read that and understand it's just a more efficient way to cycle. You save money, lessen sides, and gain more muscle in a shorter period of time. Why wouldn't you cycle that way? It still amazes me people want to run long cycles and gain less when the whole point of using AAS in the first place is to gain faster.

[oker]

Gh in the prime,cycle or pct is of great benefit when your using this method, if you can get as many growth factors as possible into your system when your in this environment it will help the growing process and maintenance.

Are you on HRT because you have low test or are your cruising between cycles by your own means?

Bro, I'm 43 so lets just say it's TRT/cruising - I've done a few cycles in the past with PCT, but decided not to do PCT anymore as I recover very well and don't get sides even on high doses. I planned on cruising/primming on about 125mg of test e a week - for around 30 days then do a 30 day blast cycle, and then repeat the process and so on. However, the HGH may be a better option (rather than test) considering your primming theories, i.e. the HGH being a tool to prepare the body for the blast.

Could you give me an idea of dose for the HGH during prime? I know you don't like to discuss dose due to n00bs so would you prefer that PM you on this?

Cheers Marcus - great post btw!

[The_Bezerker]

not trying to knock this thread but there some mis information floating around first off if your trying to avoid a hpta shut down and a negative feed back loop which is the whole point of short cycles do not go longer than 4 weeks by 6 weeks ur just as shut down as a 12 weeker.

Also you dont have to use short esters in blast cycles thats a common misconception u can use any ester length.

blast cycles shud be kept to 4 weeks with bridging in between


and marcus lol drugs make bodybuilding they are the number 1 peaice.


and orkel do not trade ur testesterone for GH and for god sakes run a pct and dont do trt. trt sucks imo. GH sucks also btw if u wanna bridge orkel (or w/e ur sn is) just stay on ur trt and maybe throw in sum growth factors

[marcus300]

Bro, I'm 43 so lets just say it's TRT/cruising - I've done a few cycles in the past with PCT, but decided not to do PCT anymore as I recover very well and don't get sides even on high doses. I planned on cruising/primming on about 125mg of test e a week - for around 30 days then do a 30 day blast cycle, and then repeat the process and so on. However, the HGH may be a better option (rather than test) considering your primming theories, i.e. the HGH being a tool to prepare the body for the blast.

Could you give me an idea of dose for the HGH during prime? I know you don't like to discuss dose due to n00bs so would you prefer that PM you on this?

Cheers Marcus - great post btw!

If your on trt then you would run your trt dose while not on cycle and in your prime.

You dont prime the body for 30 days you need to run a prime for around 6-8 wks then hit your cycle,

HGH is just additional growth factor you can use while priming/cycling or even recovering, you dont supplement it for your trt dose while in the prime, if your on gh you run it at low dose during the prime and up the dose while on cycle.

[marcus300]

not trying to knock this thread but there some mis information floating around first off if your trying to avoid a hpta shut down and a negative feed back loop which is the whole point of short cycles do not go longer than 4 weeks by 6 weeks ur just as shut down as a 12 weeker.

Also you dont have to use short esters in blast cycles thats a common misconception u can use any ester length.

blast cycles shud be kept to 4 weeks with bridging in between


and marcus lol drugs make bodybuilding they are the number 1 peaice.


and orkel do not trade ur testesterone for GH and for god sakes run a pct and dont do trt. trt sucks imo. GH sucks also btw if u wanna bridge orkel (or w/e ur sn is) just stay on ur trt and maybe throw in sum growth factors

Your getting confused because some people are talking about blast cycles in this thread and some are talking about standard short cycles, so some are very short cycles and other are slightly longer.

Again if you read the whole thread you will see that I do mention you can use long ester in a short cycle if the dose is high enough, but a lot of people are talking about short cycles not burst short cycle so in this case and in most short ester would be a better option.

You can run blast cycles for 4 wks linked to a bridge and you can also implement PCT and recover, nothing is set in stone with regards to bridging or recovering, that would depend on the individual not the concept.

If you think drugs make bodybuilding fair enough, i personally dont! i feel nutrition,being consistent and dedication does.

[oker]

not trying to knock this thread but there some mis information floating around first off if your trying to avoid a hpta shut down and a negative feed back loop which is the whole point of short cycles do not go longer than 4 weeks by 6 weeks ur just as shut down as a 12 weeker.

Also you dont have to use short esters in blast cycles thats a common misconception u can use any ester length.

blast cycles shud be kept to 4 weeks with bridging in between


and marcus lol drugs make bodybuilding they are the number 1 peaice.


and orkel do not trade ur testesterone for GH and for god sakes run a pct and dont do trt. trt sucks imo. GH sucks also btw if u wanna bridge orkel (or w/e ur sn is) just stay on ur trt and maybe throw in sum growth factors

[oker]

If your on trt then you would run your trt dose while not on cycle and in your prime.

You dont prime the body for 30 days you need to run a prime for around 6-8 wks then hit your cycle,

HGH is just additional growth factor you can use while priming/cycling or even recovering, you dont supplement it for your trt dose while in the prime, if your on gh you run it at low dose during the prime and up the dose while on cycle.

Anyway.....

Cheers Marcus for the info and got ya re the gh. After quite a few cycles, experimenting with different esters (long and short) I'm going to heed your advice and try the prime then blast as you suggested....including introducing the GH it makes perfect sense in terms of preparing your body for an anabolic blast. The prime/blast/prime idea works in well with my regimen and it won’t take much adjustment in terms of what I’m already doing, more or less, I.e. now I'm doing cruise/blast/cruise but will simply change to prime/blast/prime.

I've pretty much already started the prime (I've already been carbing-up this past week and put on 6kg), but will now change to the 3 to 1 carb ratio as outlined in your prime thread. This is another reason why this idea suits me as carbs don't agree with me and tend to make me look soft so I usually keep them at a minimum anyway. Wish me luck and will keep you posted - looking forward to the blast in about 6 weeks!!

[dan5568]

deffinetly a good read, i'll keep this approach in mind for future cycles. but i remember reading somewhere that high doses of test/androgens early in a cycle cause a huge increase in SHBG. it was written in responce to loading at the beggining of a cycle. ie- test prop/susp the first week or two of a cypionate cycle..or just taking a higher dose the first couple weeks of whatever your taking, it was said that SHBG would rise dramaticaly and slow any further gains..you seem to know your shit about this and clearly it works for you.. but whats your opinion on this?

[nevergymless]

If I was too do a 6 - 8 week Test E cycle, would I frontload the test 1000 mg first 2 weeks then go back down to 750 mg till I stop seeing gains ?



I can afford only Test E for cycles .

[marcus300]

Anyway.....

Cheers Marcus for the info and got ya re the gh. After quite a few cycles, experimenting with different esters (long and short) I'm going to heed your advice and try the prime then blast as you suggested....including introducing the GH it makes perfect sense in terms of preparing your body for an anabolic blast. The prime/blast/prime idea works in well with my regimen and it won’t take much adjustment in terms of what I’m already doing, more or less, I.e. now I'm doing cruise/blast/cruise but will simply change to prime/blast/prime.

I've pretty much already started the prime (I've already been carbing-up this past week and put on 6kg), but will now change to the 3 to 1 carb ratio as outlined in your prime thread. This is another reason why this idea suits me as carbs don't agree with me and tend to make me look soft so I usually keep them at a minimum anyway. Wish me luck and will keep you posted - looking forward to the blast in about 6 weeks!!

Best of luck to you and let us know how you get on, I'm not to clear exactly what your doing but if you have read the priming thread and this thread you should have all the tools to implement a good cycle for growth,

[marcus300]

deffinetly a good read, i'll keep this approach in mind for future cycles. but i remember reading somewhere that high doses of test/androgens early in a cycle cause a huge increase in SHBG. it was written in responce to loading at the beggining of a cycle. ie- test prop/susp the first week or two of a cypionate cycle..or just taking a higher dose the first couple weeks of whatever your taking, it was said that SHBG would rise dramaticaly and slow any further gains..you seem to know your shit about this and clearly it works for you.. but whats your opinion on this?

Ive never experienced gains stopping as soon as ive started a cycle but I have experienced gains stop or slow down after weeks of being on cycle. Normally the body will slow the gorwth process down after being on cycle and it does this in many ways, SHBG is one of them. Basically SHBG is the body's way at maintaining homeostasis. I once read a study yrs ago on some athletes who had Bloodwrok done before and during a cycle and its clearly showed the build up of SHBG after being on testosterone for weeks this would be our own bodies defence fighting back to maintain homeostasis.

Burst cycles dont have to be extreme dosages infact I wouldn't recommend extreme dosages more of a slight increase to what your use to. Burst cycles is just one method of short cycling you can implement short cycles at moderate dosages along side a prime. Burst cycles should only be considerd by the advanced Bodybuilder but the short cycle theory can be used by any level at any stage all what needs to be done is the dose to be designed to your cycle history.

[marcus300]

If I was too do a 6 - 8 week Test E cycle, would I frontload the test 1000 mg first 2 weeks then go back down to 750 mg till I stop seeing gains ?



I can afford only Test E for cycles .

No, just do a standard cycle if you havent cycled before, frontloading is a different thing.

[oker]

Best of luck to you and let us know how you get on, I'm not to clear exactly what your doing but if you have read the priming thread and this thread you should have all the tools to implement a good cycle for growth,

I thought it was clear what I plan to do bro - I'm going to be doing your prime for the next 4-6 weeks which would normally be my cruise period, except in my cruise I usually carb up for mass, but will now closely follow your system with the 3 to 1 carb ratio as it is outlined in your priming thread. More specifically, 3 days low carbs 1 day high. To prepare myself for the blast. “… this will create a very anabolic environment for muscle tissue to grow…”.

This is what you say in your post on priming so thought it would be clear that I've read it.

Anyway....thanks again and will keep you posted. More so during the blast in 4-6 weeks.

[marcus300]

I thought it was clear what I plan to do bro - I'm going to be doing your prime for the next 4-6 weeks which would normally be my cruise period, except in my cruise I usually carb up for mass, but will now closely follow your system with the 3 to 1 carb ratio as it is outlined in your priming thread. More specifically, 3 days low carbs 1 day high. To prepare myself for the blast. “… this will create a very anabolic environment for muscle tissue to grow…”.

This is what you say in your post on priming so thought it would be clear that I've read it.

Anyway....thanks again and will keep you posted. More so during the blast in 4-6 weeks.

If its your first time carb cycling (priming) try and aim for 6-8 weeks, the slower you do it the better it will be for retaining muscle tissue. Best of luck

[songdog]

Good job man.Very informative.

[oker]

If its your first time carb cycling (priming) try and aim for 6-8 weeks, the slower you do it the better it will be for retaining muscle tissue. Best of luck

Cheers Marcus - will aim for the 6-8 week period as you suggested. Will start the blast then around mid november, give or take. Looking forward to the 30 day blast!!!

[marcus300]

Cheers Marcus - will aim for the 6-8 week period as you suggested. Will start the blast then around mid november, give or take. Looking forward to the 30 day blast!!!

sounds good

PM me your cycle and previous cycles, let me have a look at it,

[oker]

sounds good

PM me your cycle and previous cycles, let me have a look at it,

You have a pm sir :-)

[The_Bezerker]

[QUOTE=oker;5364740]I thought it was clear what I plan to do bro - I'm going to be doing your prime for the next 4-6 weeks which would normally be my cruise period, except in my cruise I usually carb up for mass, but will now closely follow your system with the 3 to 1 carb ratio as it is outlined in your priming thread. More specifically, 3 days low carbs 1 day high. To prepare myself for the blast. “… this will create a very anabolic environment for muscle tissue to grow…”.

This is what you say in your post on priming so thought it would be clear that I've read it.


Oker not trying to bash you here. As you are just following advice given to you. But this is not how you prime at all and 4-6 weeks of priming is ridiculous.

The purpose of a prime is to get your body into a type of "survival mode". This is called controlled Catabolism. The purpose of Controlled catabolism is to consume more calories then you take in. This causes your body to go into survival mode and in response it starts upregulating all different kinds of receptor sites, enzymes, hormones etc etc in an attempt to use and store every single nutrient that comes its way to prevent starvation. Pretty much "priming" is when we take advantage of our body's own survival mechinisms and create a controlled starvation so our body gets ready to absorb any nutrients digested. This if done right can equate to signifgant muscle gain.

when priming you dont run Growth hormone you dont cycle carbs, basically all you have to do is reduce your calorie intake by half train and do cardio everyday for 14 days until your body is well overtrained. Now after this two weeks of starvation and overtraining you have created a awsome environment for muscle growth as the body in response will have up regulated anabolic receptors sites and nutrient storage sites.

This is it this is all you have to do for your prime no 4-6 weeks no carb cycling and no need for growth hormone


i think i may right a thread on the correct way to do blast cycles

[marcus300]

Please no one listen to the above advice, he has no idea what he is on about^^^

Check the priming thread out for details on priming,

[The_Bezerker]

marcus edit how i am wrong

[marcus300]

marcus edit how i am wrong

Go and read my primimng thread and learn how to prime correctly, you dont push your body into starvation mode thats what you dont want to happend because you dont want your metabolism to adpat and change you need to work the prime of your maintenance diet.
If you have found a way to prime what works for you stay with it but my opinion its rubbish, but each to their own.

Please no flamming its against the rules.

Also your other posts in this thread are so contridicting its hard to believe your being serious.One minute you say food and extreme eating is the key to growth not the amount of drugs and then you say drugs makes bodybuilding!, then you say your suppose to run a bridge with blast cycles then in the same post you say dont run trt come off and recover. Ive tried various times to explain to you but you either want to argue or you dont understand and just like giving out false information, but either way best of luck to you I dont have time to play your games